Chance to get back into the game

So I've been a member of the forum since 2002, I had a 1991 964 Turbo that I ended up selling around 2006? I bought it for 37, sold it for 40. Now I'm looking at prices of 964 Turbo's and they are going for over 100k! I was blown away. I was an idiot kid back when I owned the 911 Turbo. I could afford to purchase it but I really couldn't afford to "own" it. I felt like I was ALWAYS checking for oil under the car or checking to make sure everything was ok. I probably spent 5-10k in service while I owned it. Fast forward 15 years, married, kids, career .... I was looking for a new car that was "fun" with a budget of 40k max. I looked at the WRX STI, Focus ST, Golf R, etc. All of them were ok, but nothing gave me the feeling of driving the 911 Turbo. (Yeah I know it's not even fair to compare them, but for me it was all relative). I'm looking for a 911 to use for my very short commute daily driver and weekend touring. I expect to put about 4k miles per year on the car. There are some 997's in my price range but I think I could get a better serviced, lower miles, 996. I am aware of the IMS issue and have been doing a lot of research on the 996. My local, and very reputable Porsche dealer has a 2003 C4S 90k miles for sale. All service completed, new tires, full PPI, completely gone through. The car is in great condition. Even the interior is good. I've seen 50k mile cars look worse. When I first saw it online I completely dismissed it. Now I'm starting to consider it due to the low price (29k) So my question. Given that I plan to put 4k miles on per year and given that the dealer has gone through it completely and shown me all that's been done. They've told me what services are coming up,etc. I feel like they have been extremely upfront. 1) Should I be afraid of the miles? At 4k per year, I could own it for 4 years and only put on 16k miles. Leaving it approaching 110 miles 2) I feel more comfortable buying from a dealership than a private party or "used car" dealer. I know there are some very reputable high end used car dealers, but then again, a lot of them are not. 3) I could probably get a lower millage example for a similar cost, but I feel like I'm buying some peace of mind, knowing and trusting that it's been gone over really well. Any feedback would be appreciated

At $29k for a 90k mile C4S, it's overpriced unless there's a bag with at least $7,000 cash in it in the trunk. Disagree that buying from a Porsche dealer is the best option on a 13 year old car. I'd strongly recommend buying from a private seller who can give you detailed history on the car plus receipts plus you can get an idea of how it was treated. Plus, it will save you probably $4,000 at least over buying from a franchised dealer. I wouldn't be afraid of the miles as long as you have good service history. And that you understand that when it comes time to sell, it will be much, much more difficult to do so with a high mileage car. Hence the advice that the car is significantly overpriced at $29k. You can get a very nice low mileage C4S for that. At $29,000 for 90,000 miles, you are getting into the bottom end of the 996 Turbo price range.

I think you could do much better on the price. Do you actually like the car? If not, keep looking. The early generation 1 996s will be more like your 964 in terms of mechanical feel. I bought my 2000 cab for $23k and it needed nothing and had only 46k miles. I bought it from an indie dealer who specialized in Porsches and had his own service department. Have you driven lots of 996s? If not, do so before thinking of buying one because it will give you a wider sense of the cars and their conditions.

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Since you've done a lot of research, you know that the pre-2000 cars are the most reliable vis-a-vis the IMS, right? 90K miles isn't necessarily a lot - it would matter to me how much track time it's seen and where the car has been located. A higher-mileage California car with 0 track miles would be preferable to me over a lower-mileage rust-belt car or one that has done substantial track time. Since "OMG bore scoring" became a thing, warm-weather cars may be preferable to cars from places where winter is actually a thing. I won't say you're wrong, since only you know what you're comfortable with. However, a dollar says nobody at that dealership has been working for Porsche since that 996 was new...I doubt they have any 996 "experts." If I was trying to find a good 996, I would call the indie mechanics in my area to ask if any customer 996's are for sale, and if so, what they can tell me about the car... A dealership is going to be concerned with one thing when it comes to a car that old: getting it off the lot, preferably making a few bucks in the process. If it came in as a trade, there was NO money to be made at wholesale on that car; selling it at (in my opinion) a price appreciably higher than what the market supports and spending as little money as possible is their only hope for a profit. Expecting an honest pre-purchase inspection from the dealership selling the car just isn't realistic. Unless it's CPO - which it won't be - I don't see the benefit of purchasing it from a Porsche dealership.

Your Budget = T U R B O

Test drive a '99, you might be surprised. From there, the newer the car, the more of the driving it does for you. And with the left over money you can do some really cool mods or just enjoy it how it is. Or even buy a second one to track. Ha!

get the turbo. much more reliable motor and a hell of alot of fun to drive.

'99 aero coupe is a fantastic car. Here's Neto's car, which I think is one of the best looking 911's of any year that I've ever seen:

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Do this, or buy a less expensive car (like a '99) and bank the rest if you're worried about repair costs.

Due to my BMW Airhead motorcycle addiction returning and my desire to by some older vintage bikes, i might be persuaded to sell my beloved 2002 996 C4S. Will take many dancing girls and really good vodka. Silver/full supple black leather, 6 speed, 110K miles, Brombacher level 2 kit with sport mufflers.($8,000). Clean CarFax. Clean Title free & clear in my name. Excellent condition(1 very tiny match head sized mark on front bumper). Newer Michelin tires. 60% brakes. Previous owner replaced windshield due to rock chips 5K miles ago - $1200 OEM original glass w/receipts. Many service records. No BS, no stories car like my others PPI done 7 months ago prior to my purchase - slight seepage in steering rack. i have replacement and didn't get around to doing it yet. (no drips, no sign of anything so it still puzzles me why this came up on PPI) new IMS with serial number sticker, new clutch & flywheel done at 107K miles which is 3K miles ago. - all service receipts for this work totaling $5,000 $25,950 Firm

Ian, Gonna make this as simple and easy as possible: BUY GROOVZILLA's car.

^^thx Krom but i'm not 100% sure i'd sell just yet - have some short trips planned and i got to say it is a nice/tight example

Buy it, fly out to Seattle, bring a friend/family member, pick it up, spend the night in Seattle after an evening of heavy drinking with Groov, epic drive cross country back home. Easy peasy. It's a better car than what you'd buy at the local dealer plus the money you save will more than pay for the road trip. Memories to last a lifetime (except for the ones of Seattle - those will be quite hazy, no doubt).

I would honestly consider it (if he wanted to sell) but we couldn't really live any father apart in the continental US. I just talked to another guy. 2005 C4S 60,156 miles, $33,991. 60k service done. Same dealer has a 2005 Carrera S Coupe with 80k miles for 34k. I'm going to drive both when I go.

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ill repeat myself just in case you glanced over my post. Since you got 40k or so to spend, get the turbo. There are a million reasons why.

Unless you prefer a naturally aspirated engine. Then you are headed down the right path.

@RngTrtl I don't see many examples at 40k without high miles (>60). A few scattered across the country in the low 40's. Any suggestions on where to look or what site to use?

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x2

Miles don't matter as much in a turbo. There's a guy on here quickly approaching 500k miles! Yeah. a half a million miles. He put 350k on it before tearing into the engine for a couple leaking seals, only to find out the internals were literally as good as new. If you don't get a turbo you'll wish you had. Nobody buys a turbo and then wishes for less power or a car that doesn't look as bitchin.

I guess my only hesitation is that my last Turbo was so expensive to maintain. I had to replace the turbo and it was huge money. I purchased the 1991 in 2003 with 37k miles, so that's .... ~12 years old If I bought a 2002 Turbo now, it would be ~14 years old Is the 996 turbo going to be more reliable than the 964? I know that's a loaded question but that is my main concern.

sorry to disappoint but i'm not really ready to sell my car just yet, maybe after the summer - who knows to answer your question regarding the turbo, i was shopping for a turbo a few years ago when nice examples could be had for mid-upper $30's those days are over - got to spend mid $40's to get a nice example with lower miles. if you're a 2K mile a year driver like me(weekends/short trips occasionally)the turbo will not really depreciate. the key if to find a very well serviced example and not be trigger happy. BUT, during my turbo search i made the mistake of driving the C4S. i was sold. they are a sweet car, drive and handle great at about 40% less money. my car has added HP with the Brombacher kit and is a nice addition - as long as you find a C4S that is really well serviced you will be most happy. i've also been turned off by the rear fender air duct on the turbo - i much prefer the clean look of the C4S body. of course this is all subjective. and remember, west coast cars are much more desirable especially to east coast buyers when it comes time to sell - i grew up in NY and was amazed how nice our west coast cars age. - have it shipped and just factor in the $2K IF the drive is too much - well worth it in the end. enjoy the hunt!

This is the best Turbo I could find for the money. (Nationwide search) https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...1893/overview/ As groovzilla stated, I can get a low miles, properly services C4S for ~35k

for turbo - i would rather see you spend $42-$43K for a 60K miles example - you want less than 80K miles when you sell - thats the ticket with the turbo to retain value you'd have 85-90K on that turbo in no time - the closer the odometer gets to 90K the scarier it is for someone to throw down +$35-$40K on a car purchase. spending $20-$25K on a higher mileage C4S happens all day and no fear factor on well serviced example.

and ignore that 99 garbage. better IMS, but other issues that still add up to the newer cars have much better interiors etc. get the newest car you can find.

Is your dealer in Stratham Ian964? Just curious since I was there this am looking for some Porsche parts.

Turbos are nice cars but can be expensive to maintain and they cost more to fix. In my opinion, if your priority is going fast in a straight line, a turbo is the ticket. For track use, the NA p-cars are the most fun. The power is more linear and predictable plus they are rear wheel drive. If you do get a turbo, might as well budget for a tune and exhaust. That will give you the "torquey" feeling most people are looking for. But realize on city streets, you accelerate so quickly that unless you drive like a teenage punk (which unfortunately I did)the ride is over way too fast to really enjoy. I mean you can only blast up to 70 or 80 so many times before you have to start looking elsewhere for the rush.

so slakker you are insinuating turbo owners will eventually become heroin addicts in search of that rush?? i like it - we can use this scare tactic to turn away turbo buyers thus increasing 996 NB and C4S market good job

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Hey, I'm trying my damnedest! Of course it's pretty stupid since it will just make my next '99 that much more expensive. Oh well, gotta fight for what you love.

@Barn996 Going to Porsche dealer in Nashua and a used car dealer in Lowell (Highline Motor)

ian. i see you have an ICQ #. Thats something ive not seen in a long time. long time.

Ian, I'm not far from you and have a car that may be of interest. Shoot me a PM if you are interested.

I bought this car a year ago for the exact purpose you mention.

C4S. Groovzilla's is very appealing. Distance? There's an airline for that. Fly; Buy; Drive.

Time4, where did you get the stone guards on your C4S? I've wrestled back and forth over getting a set: looks great on your car. Thanks!

They are magnets - love them (I did wait 3 months to get them) https://magnagrafik.com/Products.aspx

With a $40K budget and some time you could be in a CPO 2009. Not many options, but has a warranty. I saw a white one in Houston for about that. If you are worried about resale - get a turbo

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Some great stuff there - love it!

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My fall-on-the-floor amusement overwhelms my revulsion. You win the Interwebs, sir. Well done. Quote: Originally Posted by groovzilla View Post i got to say it is a nice/tight example Click the image to open in full size.(picture won't load: dammit!)

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Holy crap that is funny!

i'll take donut on right - dozen please

There is a very reputable dealer I've dealt with numerous times with a 2003 C2 Cabriolet (think it comes with a hardtop) with only 33k miles asking $28,900. They are in Massachusetts. PM me if you're interested and I can link you to them. These guys have been in the business since the early eighties.