Thinking about a 996 as second P-car; help appreciated:

I'm thinkng about a second car for Atl. as occassional and possibly track driver. Can anyone set me straight on the RMS issue in terms of how real a problem it is (or can be) and if it can be detected and cured during a PPI? Any other major concerns in an early 996 I should factor in? TIA

Uh ohhh...

Oh! Oh! Can I try this one? Is the RMS issue real? Yes, it happens all the time. There is no solid evidence on which to predict whether you're a candidate. Is it a problem? If it's just the RMS, then you're just looking at spots in your driveway. If the car has enough miles on it that the clutch might be near the end of its life, do the seal now and the clutch while you're there. I think in the US, the RMS is like an $800 job or so. That shouldn't scare a trackie 993 pilot. Will it show up in a PPI? Yup. It's a leak in one particular spot under there. Hard to miss. Any other major concerns? For a 7 or 8 year old sports car, I'd have to say no, not really. Except for maybe the odd catastrophic engine failure, the odds of which supposedly decrease as the car's original engine piles on miles. If a '99 - '01 is still on its original motor, then you're probably at no greater or lesser risk of it than with any 7 or 8 year old sports car. So, how'd I do, guys?

Ritter isn't really interested in buying a 996. He's just over here trying to stir up a little dust. The 993 guys love to hear stories of failed RMSs.

Kudo's for asking the question over here after all of the BS that got thrown around in your current thread on the 993 board. The RMS issue is just a leaky seal where the engine mates to the transmission. There is a lot of disagreement on what percentage of cars are affected. However a few things are very clear. a) You have a chance of having this problem on any M96 car (even the 997). b) Porsche has improved the problem over time. In other words Mk I 996's seem to have the problem more than Mk II's, and 997's experience it even less. c) It's just a seal. If it leaks you can usually wait until you replace the clutch to fix the problem. It is not super expensive to fix (around $1,000 from what I have seen). Finally, there does seem to be a low (but present) incidence of engine failures in the early cars. I personally think the risk is very small, others think it is larger (and if it happens to you it's 100%). As with the RMS issue this seems to affect early cars much more than later cars. Read the links below for more info. http://www.renntech.org/forums/index...e=post&id=3223 http://www.renntech.org/forums/index...e=post&id=3224 From a maintenance standpoint these engines are far less needy that the 993 motors and it's less expensive to replace a seal or even the entire motor in a 996 than fix an SAI problem or rebuilt the top end on a 993. Bottom line if you are concerned about the thunk you door makes when you close it and think that a cupholder is the end of Porsche, stick with the 993. However, if you want a great track car/daily driver that's a lot faster, more comfortable, and safer that a 993 get the 996.....

Thanks all of you for a straight forward answer. The engine failures one hears of, were they linked to anything in particular or after a certain mileage- or just random? I know that blown turbos on the Audi S4 seemed to defy any pattern- old or new, turbo timers or not etc.. You could hold $5k in reserve and wait (and wait) and it might never happen. I actually bought a spare set in case but ended up selling them. Someone suggested it was linked to chipped cylinder liners- is that fact or fiction, or can anyone really say? Did Porschee ever admit a problem?

$800-$1000 to fix the RMS problem is not crazy money so don't see why any 993er would be gloating - fixing the SAI prob is a lot more than that. Hell, $800 is almost 12 sparkplugs and wires on a 993.

Part of what made people insane about the RMS was that early on Porsche would do some measurements when they replaced the RMS under warranty and if the case around the seal (I think) was out of spec they replaced the engine. In retrospect it was probably overkill but I think Porsche was trying to do the right thing. It created an atmosphere where everyone equated the replacement of an RMS with the replacement of the engine. It was further fueled by the factory rebuild program which gave the M96 the reputation of being a throwaway. The engine isn't disposable. Porsche just developed a great program where they do rebuilds rather than having them done by indys all over the world. They make sure the work is done right and they get to see first hand how the engines are wearing. Pretty ingenious actually.

996s are an insanely good deal right now. Get a ppi and go slow - there are plenty of deals to be had.

"It created an atmosphere where everyone equated the replacement of an RMS with the replacement of the engine." You make a good point JimB. Insofar as the RMS issue goes, really guys....$800 for a seal replacement isn't that bad....but it's the lurking and nagging intermix issue that has me spooked. The instances I've read on this forum wherein the "event" happens seemingly without warning or provocation....no advanced hiccups to alert you before you make an oil/water cocktail for your engine...that's the one that bothers me because it seems that no amount of care or maintenance can deter it. Does anyone know, or have your heard if the intermix issue occurs more frequently with cars that are tracked or not? Is there a production date that seems to be a cutoff for the frequency of this occurrence? Chuck

Hmmm. "Intermix" search . . . interesting.

This brings up a point. I was quoted $8,000-$10,000 the other day for a TOP END rebuild only on my '88 since I've got worn valve guides. I can't complain though since the car has 167,000 miles, BUT, can't I get a whole engine for $10,000 in a 996. What is the cost, ballpark, to install it? And finally, with all the RMS, exploding engine talk, I never hear anyone talk about rebuilding 996 engines due to valve guides, SAI issues, pulled head studs, collapsing chain ramps, etc. Other than those 2 well known 996 issues (albeit not minimal problems) do 996 engines ever get top end rebuilds or overhauls? Are there any other "issues" that are getting glossed over? If not, 996's are looking like a heck of a deal, even if you budget in a new engine or two...just kidding, sort of. Thanks

i have a 996 cab. and i am in the market for a coupe. i looked HARD at my options, SC, G50, 993, even 944 and 928, but i have to see 996 is the deal right now.

RMS rule of thumb, get it fixed at the dealership to get the 2 year warranty on the work and parts. The cost for repair is $1100-$1200. That's $50 per month for 2 years or less than $2 a day..

Agreed. A no-brainer. The CEF issue on the otherhand; 1. buy a cheap 996, 2. drop 3.4 and sell on Ebay, 3. put in a new engine (3.6 or 4.0!) now and 4. enjoy

I believe on another forum (or maybe it was here, sorry, my memory is affected by alcohol last night, haha) I saw you could get an engine for a little less than $8,000 from a site sponsored dealership. Installation cost I dont know.

What's RMS mean? Can someone explain?