Sway bars...GT3 vs Eibach Pro?

I have decided the next mod for the car will be sway bars. I was all set to go with the GT3 bars until a VERY reputable installer says they dont to GT3 bars on 996's because of the drop links. Which I have also heard can bend or break. So I asked what they do and they said Eibach Pro's are a direct bolt on, and I wouldnt be able to tell the difference between the two. Just less money and less to break...sounds like a win/win scenario, but just wanted to put it out there...anyone wanna comment? Dell? lol....

Are they adjustable?

Rears are, the fronts I am not sure about, I THINK they are, the shop said yes, the website was not that clear, it did say rear adjustable....

If they're adjustable and have fewer problems, I'd go with the Eibachs.

I am leaning that way....but there are so many that have the GT3 bars, I am wondering is it only because thay are "GT3" bars? I had never heard of the Eibach Pro's and was just putting it out there....I completely trust this shop, on of teh best on SoCal so I know in their experience, they have fewer problems. I'll ask more questions this week and sort it all out.

According to Eibach's catalog, their bars are not adjustable. GT3 sway bars required shorter drop links. It is best to get a good set of spherical ends. You can get by with modified stock ones if you are not tracking a lot. Other/better options are H&R or TRG. Only the rear bar is adjustable with H&R's. TRG's are adjustable like GT3's. I seem to remember this topic on the mod forum recently.

rear is adjustable...3 position.

oddly enough this is one of the suspension mods I have NOT done. I think it is because I know there is another car coming soon to my garage that I get to start modding!

I just ordered a set of H&R's and didn't go with the gt3's for that exact reason - no need for drop links.

Just recently I went with the GT3 sway bars and TRG drop links. Total cost came out to about $600. I like the adjustability front & rear.

I have had sway bars on other cars & they came with urethane bushings which will squeak really loudly after awhile, so you have to uninstall/ lube/ reinstall. The H&R bushings seem to have addressed this issue by adding a strip of teflon on the inside of their bushings... so I would think H&R would be a good choice given that the performance is the same as the Eibach... and H&R dont need special links right?

what porsche shop is this? hergesheimer? gmg?

Newport: I'm guessing the Eibach's are just like the H&R's having adjustability in the rear but none in the front. My take on it...yes it would be nice to have adjustability on both ends but look at the guys on the GT3 board and the posts about them adjusting their sway bars. 95% of them are still running the front bar in the location it came in stock (1 hole from full stiff). If anything they're going a bit softer on the rear bars and I think that I've see one post where NJ-GT went to full hard on both front and rear but it's rare that you see anyone go full stiff on the front bar or make any changes at all for that matter. What I'm getting at here...GT3 bar is 26.8mm...H&R is 26mm (don't know the size of the Eibach)....I'm guessing the H&R bar is right at or just slightly stiffer than the GT3 bar in it's stock location which is where all of the GT3 guys have their bars set anyhow so why not go that route if you can get away from the hasles of the drop links.? Just my $.02

An update to my previous post - I ended up going with GMG drop links because my car couldn't be corner balanced without them. The H&R sways with the stock drop links had preload, so I had to go with the adjustable drop links in order to eliminate that and then they could corner balance the car. In retrospect, I would go with the GT3 sways.

You don't need drop links for the rear GT-3 bar (which is 5 postition adjustable by the way).

With Eibach, the rear is adjustable but the front is not. The problems with GT3 sway bars is the drop links are completely different. You don't have enough length in the stock front links for them to work properly. The rear stock links can work depending on adjustment. Some like Carnewel modify stock end links and lengthen them. The only problem with this is they are not that strong and can break under stress. If you search the boards here, you will find out the Agency Power links are subject to snapping under heavy stress. Personally if I were to get sway bars, I would go with either GT3 bars with TRG (not Agency Power) links are go or the full TRG setup. Keep in mind that the reason for going to sway bars is to adjust a problem in the cars handling, which is typically understeer or oversteer. Do not look at sway bar (anti-roll bars) just from the aspect of reducing body roll. I am running a ROW M030 with GT3 control arms and a very aggressive alignment. With the car in its current form, it is perfectly neutral around the skidpad on MPSCs with good turn-in. Going with stiffer bars is now necessarily better in my case as it could hurt the turn-in.

I took a Porsche Master Mechanics advice on this one and went with the GT3 bars with custom links. Total cost was $1000Can installed. Result was all the adjustability required to eliminate body roll while balancing the car...no more nasty understeer. Nothing but stock to compare too, but I feel it was a great investment.

What kind of suspension did you add your GT3 sway bars to? ROW 030? what kind of pcar do you have?

What does it mean if the swaybars have preload? I thought that H&R advertises that you can use the facotry drop links?

delirium - my understanding of preload is that there is tension placed on the sway bar because the stock drop links are not adjustable. I don't know if this is the case with the stock suspension or whether my JIC coilover setup has something to do with it, but the tech at GMG said he couldn't properly corner balance the car without the adjustable drop links. They basically allow the sway bar to be set up in a "neutral" position. Hope this helps...

I'm no expert, but this might help explain further. Preload is any tension or twisting on the bar due to variance in ride height from side to side. With stock bars and stock suspension Porsche has already figured out what static length the droplinks need to be and though there could be very small differences in ride height side to side there shouldn't be excessive preload either way. The H&R because it's not adjustable in the front *could* be used without the adjustable drop links and again have very little preload like the stock unit however when you start changing ride height and corner weighting the car (as is the case with every day since he has coilovers) all of this gets thrown out the window. In corner weighting the car you're not going to have equal heights at all of the corners of the car. You disconnect the sway bars in order to corner weight and then if heights are not equal and you re-connect the sways without having the adjustable links to you'll preload the bar which will then change corner weights on the car again making the whole process useless in the first place. Also with bars like GT3 bars where you don't have a fixed position sway bar you'll again need the drop links to adjust out any preload you get from the different adjustment positions on the bar. The handling characteristics of a car with a preloaded sway bar is that it will turn one way quicker than the other. Say the sway bar is preloaded to the drivers side. Since there's already tension on that side of the suspension when you turn right the drivers side suspension already has some tension on it so it will react quickly as you turn to the right. However when you turn to the left the suspension will have to first unload this preload on the drivers side before applying it to the other side of the car making the transitions in left hand turning slower....basically in this scenerio the car turns quicker to the right than the left. Stock car racers sometimes use this in setting up their cars as they're only concerned with turning left. Andy

Thanks for the explanations guys, makes sense... how much the adj drop links? I see that the ones from TRG are $$$! Also, is it necessary to corner balance your car after lowering it or getting sway bars? I dont think I have ever done this to my previous cars... but i dont go to the track, so maybe its not a huge deal?

What suspension are you running? If you don't have coilovers with adjustable ride height you can't corner balance the car. TRG links are expensive but many have had issues with breaking the less expensive Agency Power units. Tarett makes a set that look pretty good too. http://www.tarett.com/items/996-prod...lnk-detail.htm

currently I have a stock suspension, but I have PSS9's waiting to be installed, and I wanted to go with H&R sways until I read this post... if I have to buy new adj. drop links w/ the H&R's then might as well just go with the GT3 bars right? I dont go to the track, but I just want a more stable/responsive ride for street, so I thought H&R would be a good choice, but not if it causes complications.

Yes to have a Properly corner balanced setup even with the H&R bar you should have the adjustable links installed. BUT you have to ask youself if this is really necessary for a street car. For instance as soon as you add a passenger you change the balance (cross weights) of the car slightly and will be re-adding a bit of preload on the sway bar again. This is my take and others may argue with my stance...but for a street car you could probably run the H&R front bar with stock links and PSS9's and as long as your ride heights are close left to right you're not going to have excessive preload on the front sway bar. With the GT3 bar you HAVE to run the adjustable links because it's an adjustable bar which will effect the length of link required to attach it back to the suspension. I'm running the H&R bar on my 996 with H&R springs currently and while I'm sure there's a touch of preload it's nothing that's noticable with my current setup. When I install my JIC's that are on the way I'm going to be moving to the adjustable links because I intend on corner balancing the car for the track. Andy