Headers

Anyone have any info on who makes headers listed on EBAY for $250? The photo is taken on a red background. From the pics the product looks pretty good, especially for the $. Thanks. JW

I was wondering the same thing. They also have a header and muffler package for around $1200.

for the $ might just try. JW

don't go cheap unless you're willing to replace other things due to the wear or the aftermath of the cheap....

oh i hear miltec are pretty good headers.... don't have it myself but heard some good stuff about it..... does anyone know anything about miltec?

The company with the headers for $250 is different than the one selling headers and exhaust. Take a very close look at the headers and you will see some flaws in the design. They use very small primary tubes. Unlike all the other headers on the market, they cone down from the flanges to the smaller size of the primary tubes. They also that they don't have a cone-type merge collector. They cut the tubes and weld them together to form a collector. If you look carefully, not all the primary tubes are single piece. The short tubes are 2 pieces welded together. I suspect these are the reasons why these headers are so cheaper and would question the performance gains from them. If you look at the Fabspeed, BB and Zerotek headers; you will notice that all use single piece tubes that are oval to match the port at the flange. They all use good coned collectors for a smooth merge. The Zerotek headers, despite costing substantually less, appear to be very good headers. They have advertised them as low as $699 making them probably the best bang for the buck. I haven't seen the Miltec's, so I can't comment on them. The only other headers to be weary of are the Agency Power headers. They basically took a shorty header for a turbo and put a long secondary pipe on it. they still use the short, tight turned tubes and short collector from a turbo header. This will defintiely hurt low end torque and not make the high end power a good long tube header will make. This is very similar to what Porsche did with the non-X51 997S header.

Anyone have any information on the Schnell headers for a 99c2?

But how long will this stuff last before it falls apart? Along with the cheap pricing you also get substandard welds, metal alloys chosen solely for cost or (even more likely) substituted by the supplier without informing the manufacturer, zero testing and/or design. If you ever have a chance check out some of the China B2B internet sites (Alibaba, etc.) to see where all the latest cheap (and not so cheap) porsche products are coming from. What's really shameful is that this stuff is starting to show up for the earlier models and I don't think they've learned you can't put a welded exhaust header connection inside a heat exchanger.

I run the Schnell headers and mufflers in my 99 C2 along with the EVO CAI and GIAC flash, and I'm very happy with the setup and the performance, plus they were less expensive than most of the other manufacturers. Schnell gives you a money back guarantee...although I've never known anyone who applied for the money back satisfaction guarantee. I did not have a before and after dyno....so I can't tell you about any definitive performance gains, but I would submit the usual "it feels much faster" and fall back on the GIAC and EVO claims of HP gains. I would think that with the combination of all four mods, I am enjoying better performance than stock.

Headers need to be properly designed...the tubing lengths must equal lenghts...also must be smooth...the collector needs to be properly smoothed inside for best air flow...etc etc etc. Headers are all about the design. Oh yeah...bad quality headers are also prone to cracking. My key concern with the $250 headers would be whether they even get you more power or not. thanks, Amir

The headers shown on ebay pictured on the porsche flag with mufflers can be purchased seperately for $600. This product appears to have alot better construction similar in design to more costly headers. Anyone know anything about them?

FWIW, the Suncoast Carrera Sport Headers look to be the only headers that show a dyno improvement with a header change only. There was a previous thread posted by someone that got them for their car. If they aren't developed on a dyno (and have the data to back it up) it's a total crap shoot that's just as likely to lose power (especially total area under the curve).

I had just purchased a set of those Ebay headers, figured if anything, it is cheap enough to do some research. I plan on doing a base dyno run on my '01 C4, followed by header replacement and map flash. It will not happen anytime soon , but when I do I will post results.

It's all made in the same place, even the beloved Fabspeed...................... Made in China is no big deal but sometimes it's nice to support the US economy vs contributing to the growth of the next super power. hmmmmmmmmm, political point of view, sorry.

My friend bought a set after we thought it is cheap enough if it was junk. So far, 1200 miles and still doing OK. Sound better than stock, actually it has a GHL's sound to it. He's happy with it for now.

Which did you buy, $250 headers or $1200 headers & mufflers?

i hear miltec are pretty good......

I had purchased the $250 headers from ebay. I allready have fabspeed mufflers and K&N filter.

Pics of the headers of ebay. Insallation no-problem. Sounds great, more response in acceleration. Heavier than originals. 2000 Porsche 996 C2 Cab Eibach springs. Short shifter Fabspeed Exhaust Adj. rear Control Arms Headers.

Any decrease in low end torque? Thanks. JW

It is running great, noticeable increase in torque at high and low rpm... also at 75mph the 996 is not as loud as when I only had fab mufflers and stock headers.

If I bought headers, I would send them off to have "Jet Hot" coating placed on the INSIDE of the headers. This keeps exhaust temps high, and since it's on the inside of the headers, the high temps inside won't affect the outside of them- in fact, it would protect the outside and they would last longer, since the outside would be cooler.

Thanks for the pics Chris. I am less impressed with the design, but they are only $250. Look at how much smaller the primary tubes are than the stock headers. You can also see the exposed tack welds and uneven line up of the tubes at the welds. Looking at where the primaries meet the collector pipes, they swag out the pipes to make a slip joint. I don't see how you are going to see performance gains with these headers.

Any one know of a cheep place to dyno and reset cpu in Washington DC area?

i hear that if you port polish your OEM headers that will play a better increase in performance then buying some of these aftermarket ones...... anyone with these experiences....?

I would tend to agree with this in a lot of cases. In my case, I would hate the fact that the headers are taking torque away from the lower end of the rpm spectrum. The larger the diameter, the more this is the case. I just don't see the everyday benefit besides perhaps more sound. I would like to keep my torque band where it is. You will never see headers that expand the torque band, they simply shift it upwards in the rpms. No thanks - unless I had a screaming turbo race car or something.

This is correct. If you look at the aftermarket headers posted in here they are LONGER then stock. Contrary to what some women may have told you, you really do not want to add length...to the headers!

This depends on several factors. You have 2 factors: volume and velocity. At the port, you want the flange to provide at least as much airflow as the port on the head. The heads on hte engines have pretty high flow and as a result have a decent sized port. If you put flange that is smaller than the head port, you will always lose HP. From here, the primary has to be large enough it does not restrict the volume exhausted from the head. Almost always the most ideal is the cross-section of the primary with the same area as teh corss section of the port. You can change the shape, like going from square, regtagular or oval to circular, as long as it is transition is smooth. Abrupt transitions cause the exhaust flow to tumble, create restrictions and kill flow. This is typical of what happens when you just cone-down a primary. This was my first concern of the E-bay headers. Going with a larger primary can have a different effect. The exhaust starts to tumble and loses flow, particularly at lower rpms. This does in fact kill some of the low end torque. Newer headers like the JBA Firecones are designed to step to the volume of the exhaust gases as the cool after loobing the port. They put a slight flare right at the port and then cone smoothly back to the volume of the port. This trick depending upon exhasut volume and temp can make a very minor improvement. The primary needs to smooth bends and consistant shape all the way to the collector. Tight bends become restrictions and again kill the flow. This is also where good welding comes in. Welding flash or uneven tube alignment, even minor ones, can cause the exhaust to tumble and cause some major losses in power. These are my second and third concerns with the E-bay headers. Providing the primaries were tuned or equalized for length (equal length headers only work if the degrees between the cylinders of that bank are evenly spaced). If you look carefully at the OEM 3.6l/X51 header from Porsche, you will notice that the change the lengths on some of the tubes rather than just taking the shortest path to create a tuned-header. I don't know how well the OEM collectors really are. It depends on how much tunign they did to the merge points. So are long or short headers better? Depends on what you are looking to do. On an NA car where you want good low-end torque and strong high-end power, a long-tube header is always best. It will have the best velocity and at leasrt equal flow to a short header. With turbos it is a different story. Since the turbo is driven by exhaust gas and there is a greater volume of exhaust gases the hotter they are, they want as short of a header as possible while still having smooth flow and transitions. So, yes for turbos owners having their....short is good.