Considering a 996, just sold 88 911. The age old q-996 vs 993

I LOVE the look of the 993, whether it's a Targa or a C4S, they are gorgeous. The 996 never did anything for me visually, but my friend keeps telling me all the problems he's had on his 97 Cab with the top breaking twice, the seat cables breaking 3X, the window switches twice... He calls the interior "primitive". He keeps telling me that the 18inch wheels fit better and look better on the 996, and the interior is worlds better and more comfortable. It took him a while to get over the looks thing, but now he loves the look. Lastly, he said I should get the newer car, a 2000 year model as it might still be under some kind of warranty, and the prices are similar to the 96-97 C4S's I've looked at. With my bad back, I've actually considered the Tip in either car (97 C2S w/the Tip or 2000 911 w/Tip, as our traffic here in Wash DC is pretty bad all the time. I don't track my cars, I just drive them to work and on sales calls in the Rockville, Md area - mucho traffic! Occasionally I'll take a blast up I-95 but no autocross or racing. I don't want a Cab, I don't think?! We already have one (her's) and I like the lines of the coupe better. Any tip owners out there to share how they feel about owning a 996 Tip, and if they are ribbed by their friends and family about owning an ... automatic Porsche? I know, you're thinking, "go drive one and see for yourself". I am, today. My back is really bad today so it's the perfect opportunity to check a tip out if they have one. I WILL see for myself, but I'm curious about what you think of the MY2000's looks. I think they look like a Boxster, as do most people. I can't afford more than $52,500 for a new/used car plus the taxes and tags; I've been capped at that amount by my thrifty, lovely wife. The Polar Silver/Black leather (the only color I'd consider in a 993) 96 C4S I've been eyeing and did a PPI on is going to be $45k or maybe $2000 less due to some problems that came up in the PPI. It's got 54k miles, and my friend said I'd be crazy to spend that much on a car with those miles when I could get a newer, more reliable car, MY2000 car at auction at Manheim, Pa. with him on Jan 2. He claimed my money would travel furthur. I told him I don't know if I'd be comfortable buying a car at auction as you can't really inspect it too much like a mechanic could. He said the prices are so good, and his friend could look at it for me with a quick once over, and it's so new a warranty might cover anything that would go wrong (other than previous body damage!), so I would be safe. My wife wasn't hot on the idea of me buying a car at auction without having a Porsche mechanic check it out first. Thoughts? Do you LOVE the look of the 2000 911 coupes? I can't afford a 2002, which I like alot more looks-wise. I was originally very interested in a 993 Targa and he has a friend that's had problems with it from day 1 as it leaks, and the sun shines in on hot sunny days so much so that it's like an oven to him. Hmmmmm. I know this question get's beaten to death here, 993 vs 996, and yes I DID read some old posts, but I'm in a certain price range and was hoping to reopen this threadworn topic briefly again. What's the NICEST color for a 2000 911? Was seal grey available that year? I need something that stays clean a long time! ) I would only buy one with a black interior, so that's the easy part. Grateful to you all in advance, Happy Holidays. Steve A bit confused... 88 911 Coupe went bye bye 1 week ago 95 740i BMW 109k mi! 99 XK8 Jag her's <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />

Steve, I was/am in a similar position that you are in. I was looking for a 993 and couldn't find "the right on" for me. I searched all over for months. I drove many of them and there was always something that prevented me from buying one. The big thing for me was the fact that I was about to throw down 50+k for a 5-6 year old car with no warranty. I ended up looking at the 996 even though I thought they were ugly. The interior is much much nicer than the archaic(sp?) 993. I felt like I was steping into the 70s every time I drove a 993. Sexy outside, old inside. Anyway I ended up taking the plung on a 99 coupe and have fallen in love with it. The more I drive it the more I like to it. The lines have definatley grown on me to the point that I catch myself looking in the side mirror just to get a peek at her ***. The car performs effortlessly and is quite comfortable. I traded my 02 M3 for it and could not be happier with this daily driver. All that said I am still actively searching for the perfect 993. I just cannot get her out of my head. I cannot deny that they are by far the best looking porsche. I know this may not help much but I know where your coming from so I thought I'd share. Kerry

Re the '993/'996 targa--my '996 targa doesn't leak. It was designed completely differently than the '993 targa. So, if it is a choice between '993 or '996 targa, I take the '996. Lease it if you can't afford it. Get a good discount, and a good money factor, and finance only the leased portion of it.

Thanks for the responses. I finally drove a 2000 996 today, after first driving my friend's 993 triple blk cab down to the HBL Porsche in Tysons Corner Va. What a trip! I loved my friend's car, so much easier to drive than my 88 911. We got there and were quickly shown a black 996 and silver 996, both 2000 model year cars. The silver car looked so drab, so common compared to the filthy dirty, bird-poop stained black car! The black car had 13k miles, carbon fiber everything, grey interior (not my favorite, but nice) and upgrade wheels that MADE the car. I drove it not expecting much, with my preconceived notions about the car from everything I read about them on the 993 board, and was wowed to say the least. All the things people said they didn't like about the car, I LOVED! The great A/C and vents, the sumptuous seats, the gauges, the quickness, the shifter, everything but that spungy, squeaky clutch. They originally had a $61k price on the car but it was on "sale" for $57,900 and they told me their non-negotiable bottom line price was $55,800. I had to leave as I was late to get back, so we walked. I had a budget of $52,500 I'm "allowed" to spend on a used car from my wife, and this car wasn't in the cards at that price. As were leaving my friend called a wholesaler friend of his and he said he could get me a 2000 996 for $10,000 less at the Manheim auction on Jan 2,02. I told my wife this, excited about paying so much less, as I couldn't afford the car I drove today anyway and she got upset and asked me how can I be certain the car is OK if I can't have our mechanic do a PPI on it before we buy? I tried to explain that it was under warranty, and that if anything went wrong, it would be covered, and that the wholesaler guy was very knowledgeable and would detect paintwork a mile away. She just didn't agree this would be a good move, as we could be buying a lemon or a car with underlying problems that only a PPI would detect. Any comments on this? The only downside of the 996 to me is that it's nowhere near as beautiful as the 993 coupe IMHO. I thought the 996 looked best in black, the hardest to keep clean color, with those upgrade wheels, though they didn't have many used cars to choose from or see. I REALLY loved the white 2003 Turbo they had on the showroom floor there, but I'll have to wait till it's 8 years old to buy that! So - getting a car at the Manheim hi-line auction - anyone have any experience with this, good, bad? Steve <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

A 2000 should be selling closer to your target price range considering you can get a mint 99 for the mid 40s. Good luck, I don't thing you will be unhappy with a 996 but I agree that the 993 is the absolute best looking.

Steve, I wonder if you're the guy I spoke to at HBL yesterday (Saturday). I just just taken the Silver 996 for a brief test drive and when I returned you asked me about the silver vs the black. That ring a bell? Well, either way, I also ran across a silver 996 w/aerokit at a shop near HBL (right across the street basically) on Spring Hill road. It was nicely optioned/drove well and looked stunning (aerokit, yum). Unfortunately it had 45K miles on it but it is still under warranty. It was listed for $49K, but I'd guess that's negotiable. It's at a shop called Intersport Performance. I'm not affiliated with the shop, nor do I know much about the shop so if you're interested do your research. Luckily I've found what will hopefully be the car for me. I only went and saw the car at Intersport because I'd made the appointment a while ago and hadn't had time to cancel. Good luck in your search. -KJ

KJ- Yes that was me! Small world, huh? Weren't you the one driving off in a Black 996 Turbo? Now that's a yummy ride. What did you end up finding to buy? Didn't you say you already had 2 black "ones" in the garage? Do you have ANOTHER black 911? You have great taste in cars! How come you are looking for another if you already have 2, if you don't mind me asking? Just curious. I kjnow these cars are addictive, but if you already have the 996 Turbo, what possible interest in a regular 996 could you have? ) I LOVE those turbos! Is yours tip or 6 speed? If you're NOT that guy, sorry! Hope you are having a swell day. Steve still searching for the right car. <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Steve, Offer them 52k on the black 996 and walk away. I'm sure you'll get a call in a few days.

Thanks Doug- The guy was ridiculously firm on his price of $55,800, but I will call them in a week and see if it's still there, and remind them of my lower price bid. Apparantly, the prices I saw from the Manheim auction from last week were as follows: $47,200 for a Blue 996 C2 w/ 4,715 mi! $48,000 for a Black 996 C4 w/ 31k mi $38,700 for a 996 C2 w/ 38k mi $49,700 for a Black 996 C2 w/ 24k mi $43,250 for a Silver 996 C2 w/36k mi $50,700 for a Silver 996 C2 w/30,720 mi So, I guess I COULD get this car for alot less at auction... What's the big disadvantage of this if any? We could use a Sony 36" XBR TV for the price differential between the dealer and the auction pricing, with a trip to the south of France for my wife and I for 2 weeks this May worked into the price differential as well!!! Steve

PS - Sorry - the above prices were for 2000 model year cars. I think I forgot to list that. The following were 2001 year cars that sold last week at Manheim Auction in Pennsylvania: 2001 996 17k mi Black $54,200! 2001 996 29k mi Black $48,200! That's less than the 2000 year model at the dealer! Maybe a 2001 would be the way to go, buying it at auction! Steve

Steve, I would be extremely cautious at an auction, you have no idea what you are getting. I bought a P/U truck at an auction once and learned my lesson the hard way. We found an '82 GMC truck back in '84 ( we needed a new tow vehicle for our race car)at auction , it seemed like a great deal as the price was so much less than a fully optioned new truck, besides what could be wrong on a two year old truck. Basically everything , the vehicle had been cobbled together and one thing after another failed. We ended up with a new engine among other things.I know it's not a Porsche but be careful. Once the hammer drops it's all over. <img src="graemlins/crying.gif" border="0" alt="[crying]" /> <img src="graemlins/crying.gif" border="0" alt="[crying]" /> <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />

Steve, We're definitely blessed to have more than one Porsche in the garage. The black ones are now regulated to street car duty and I'm looking for a track car now. You said you don't intend to track the car (don't know if you have tried it), but I'd implore you to at least come out to the HPDC that Potomac (our local region club) offers. It's a nice "intro to track driving" course that's really fun and quite educational. The HPDC is offered 2 times a year and differs greatly from a full on DE. These cars LOVE to have their legs stretched and the track is one of the few places where you really can. The 996 is phenomenal at the track! Enjoy your search for the perfect car! Let us know how it goes. -KJ

Thanks for the astute comments about buying a car at auction. This is all new to me, so I have no idea what I'd be in for. I certainly don't want to end up with a lemon. I figured that the Manheim HiLine auction would be different, as many of the dealers get there cars there too, and they have the same chance of getting stuck with a stinker. Anyone care to comment on this car at HBL in Tysons Corner, Va? Here's the link to the pics -I hope this works. <a href="http://www.hbloftysons.com" target="_blank">http://www.hbloftysons.com</a> It's the 2000 996 Black/Grey/Carbon w/13k miles. At first I didn't think I'd like a grey interior, as the carbon fiber package doesn't blend in as well as on a black interior. What do you think? Is the grey with carbon sort of a yucky, cheesy combo? I'd prefer black leather and mats as their easier to keep clean and look more like a traditional sports car color to me, though grey makes the car lighter and larger inside. Check out the pics. I need to keep the car to $52,500 but they want $55,800. This may be a stupid question, but do you have any ideas on how to get it cheaper? Thanks, Steve Porscheless but not desperate yet

Hi Steve, I am glad to see you are doing your homework on these cars. It will ensure a good purchase for you. I have for sale a 2001 996 C2 coupe with 8K miles on it, silver/black supple, heated seats, 18 inch sport classics, in dash CD for $56,500.00 That may fit your bill. Let me know. I am at a Porsche dealership and sold this car new myself, it was traded on an 02 Cab. Good Luck.

Hey John You've got mail. Can I get your # to talk off line about the 2001 car? Thanks, Steve [phone removed]

[quote]Originally posted by stever: <strong>I've been capped at that amount by my thrifty, lovely wife.</strong><hr></blockquote> Just for fun, but it's true. The only way that worked in buying my dream car was buying my wife her dream car One more thrifty advice, although I have a beauty in my hands but I am still looking for the irresistable 964 cabrio WTL! 33,000 � Good Luck Stever & Happy Holidays

stever, I have a Tiptronic. The car feels much more alive with a stick shift, but we have a lot of traffic jams in Europe, so the Tiptronic is more practical. Go for a 996, the later the better. The 320 horsepower engine in the 2002 models is in my estimation (and that of others) the best normally aspirated engine Porsche has ever built. Good luck with your wife ...

My $.02 If you get a Tip, it's got to be a 996. The 5spd is so much better than the 4spd. Don't EVER buy a car at an auction! The 996 has been around long enough to be accepted as a "traditional" (but not retro) look. If you can hold out for a few months until the 04s come out you may be able to afford an 02

I don't agree with the "don't ever buy at auction" remark - not to say you shouldn't exercise caution. A word about most auctions these days: when a car comes off lease, if the residual is too high for the dealer who sold it to take back (like because the market has fallen a bit )then they send it to auction. This way the leasing company, often the car company's subsidiary, eats the loss, if any. In many cases, the dealer actually buys the car back from the auction at a lower price than the residual. The lease company takes a hit but they can ususally write this off against profits and so they are not totally screwed. Why shouldn't you enjoy the opportunity to get the car cheaper - that's what many dealers do? I also agree (or disagree with your wife) that buying a car with full Porsche warranty - with at least 20,000 miles or so left to shake any bugs out - you should have few fears. Porsche is pretty good on warranty stuff, I have found. Good luck.

You shouldn't have problems finding a really nice car for your budget. You should be able to get a very, very nice 2000 MY C2 with the right options for the high 40's to low 50's. If you can't find it, I'll find it for you! I have several dealer friends that are up to their ears in recent Porsches with books, records that they will let go at a very, very attractive, near auction price (I'm not a dealer - we run an auto internet site) I almost went to the auction to do same, but decided after talking to several dealer friends, that I could do just as well in the market and have some history on the car. Often, at auction, you can't get the vehicle history. On the reverse, if the vehicle is on warranty, everything will be fixed on warranty anyway. But who wants a car that has a history of problems? email or call me if you need help...I just finished my hunt for a 2000 MY C4 with tiptronic and I got the price I wanted on a loaded car. Awesome car (still have the '87 but I'm selling) Best of luck to you!