25 captured repliesDiscussion pagination complete · Source accounts, not a confirmed diagnosis
THIS DISCUSSION / SOURCE-DERIVED OVERVIEW
Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCHSolve this puzzle. What Broke?
Reported or suspected cause
thermal runaway
Reported cause
No successful repair reported for this finding.
1
Identified cause
0
Suspected cause
0
Reported fixes
Read evidence and context
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that report identifying a cause
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Reported cause
That is definitely spun bearings ...note the black discoloring is due to thermal runaway...
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Have seen a few m96 run for quite a while with a spun/worn out rod bearing, with minor/moderate sounding rod knock, before the whole shell disintegrates to pieces in the sump like in above scenario...
Leading evidence: 'thermal runaway' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'thermal runaway' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Run quite a while' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
Source reports, not a diagnosis or a success probability. Counts refer to discussions and can overlap.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Performed · outcome unconfirmed
My guess is someone used RTV sealant, which flaked off and blocked the oil pickup, which in turn overheated and spun a bearing or two
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Have seen a few m96 run for quite a while with a spun/worn out rod bearing, with minor/moderate sounding rod knock, before the whole shell disintegrates to pieces in the sump like in above scenario...
Run till bearing totally came apart and it was steel
Suggestion or failed attempt
No successful repair reported for this finding.
0
Reported fixes
0
Unsuccessful attempts
1
Discussions
Read evidence and context
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Engine was continued to be run till bearing totally came apart and it was steel on steel,,, crank journal on rod big end with bearing completely gone into sump in pieces....
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Root cause/chain reaction = " incompetent grease monkey" using globs of Silicone that became dislodged and circulated through the timing chains and ended up blocking the oil pick-up tube which caused a low flow of oil which caused a thermal runaway of the bearings resulting in blacked spun bearings .....
These are separate views of the same evidence. Frequency alone does not establish a fix, and these counts must not be added together.
Run quite a while
No successful repair reported for this finding.
0
Reported fixes
0
Unsuccessful attempts
1
Discussions
Read evidence and context
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Have seen a few m96 run for quite a while with a spun/worn out rod bearing, with minor/moderate sounding rod knock, before the whole shell disintegrates to pieces in the sump like in above scenario...
Run till bearing totally came apart and it was steel
No successful repair reported for this finding.
0
Reported fixes
0
Unsuccessful attempts
1
Discussions
Read evidence and context
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Engine was continued to be run till bearing totally came apart and it was steel on steel,,, crank journal on rod big end with bearing completely gone into sump in pieces....
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Root cause/chain reaction = " incompetent grease monkey" using globs of Silicone that became dislodged and circulated through the timing chains and ended up blocking the oil pick-up tube which caused a low flow of oil which caused a thermal runaway of the bearings resulting in blacked spun bearings .....
Counts describe captured discussions, not unique people or a diagnosis. Author identities are not reliably stored. Exact duplicate evidence is counted once across matching discussions; one discussion counts at most once per action/state. Multiple repairs reported together remain a combination. Suggestions and failed attempts do not establish a fix. Matches cover whole discussions and can include related faults, model variants and incomplete threads.
25 eligible posts · 0 unverified posts · 1 discussions match the subject in their title or opening post.
Rennlist: 1 discussions
0 evidence records excluded for query context · 0 excluded by outcome qualification · 0 adjusted by outcome qualification.
0 acknowledgements have no verified action link; they do not establish a repair result.
Generation: 20261026T122219Z · outcome-qualification-6. Deterministic extraction; no AI model inference. How we use sources
I am doing forensic on a 996 3.4L 5-chain engine that suffered a low oil pressure event. It looks like a new Short Block is in order.
The first picture shows "black non-metal stuff" blocking the oil pick up tube.
The second picture shows bits and pieces of metallic ferrous thin pieces of stuff that is sitting at the bottom of the oil pan.
What's the black stuff (I have my guess)?
What's the metallic stuff that broke?
If it was a low pressure event, the metal is most likely layers of the bearing(s). They are a bit crumpled, but do you see any edges that might have been quite straight?
The piston coatings are ferrous, but I don�t see why those would come off during the event. Maybe they�ve been there for some time. Which also means you likely have bore scoring�
The only place I know that has this ferrous material is piston coatings. Maybe the low pressure event overheated the pistons and the coatings came off during the event. Therefore, no scoring.
Maybe a little more info on the low pressure event. What was the described failure? Street, track? Pressure warnings, temperature warnings? No start?
As for RTV, where did that come from? When was the last service that used RTV? It�s a lot to block the pickup. Maybe the engine has been pressure starved for sometime and it finally overheated enough.
Disassemble!
To me, without having pieces in my hand, going only by your pics.... sure looks like bearings pieces.
Probably from a spun rod bearing.
Although the bearings top coatings are copper & tin alloy, the shell backing plate is steel (magnetic). My guess, oil pressure instability m96 issues, caused rod bearing to get lose then with excessive clearance bearing finally spun. Engine was continued to be run till bearing totally came apart and it was steel on steel,,, crank journal on rod big end with bearing completely gone into sump in pieces....
Bearing failure could have been helped along if the imsb was also going & shedding steel debris, or bore scoring added aluminum shavings helping bearings destruction.
Have seen a few m96 run for quite a while with a spun/worn out rod bearing, with minor/moderate sounding rod knock, before the whole shell disintegrates to pieces in the sump like in above scenario... Its a testament to how good some of the m96 design is that it can go for so long with spun bearings without throwing a rod immediately like many engines do...
Thats my take with the info I've got....
That is definitely spun bearings ...note the black discoloring is due to thermal runaway...
The bearings have a thin metal steel shell that is lined with a Copper layer ,then a layer of soft "Babbitt" material (Babbitt is lead + tin soft white metal and non-magnetic )
The black rubbery stuff that was blocking the oil pick-up tube is gobs of Silicone that has broken off and gotten chewed by the timing chains..
Root cause/chain reaction = " incompetent grease monkey" using globs of Silicone that became dislodged and circulated through the timing chains and ended up blocking the oil pick-up tube which caused a low flow of oil which caused a thermal runaway of the bearings resulting in blacked spun bearings .....
Sounds completely plausible Porschetech3, that's pretty amazing that its spat the shells out!
I've managed to save an engine once that literally started knocking as i pulled into my driveway (not a P-Car but a 20v Toyota powered Lotus 7) bearings were just wearing through to copper and didn't even damage the crank.
But i had no idea it could spit them out
@yelcab
did you get this engine apart? Take a picture of the "blue/black" Rods to show Rennlisters what Thermal Runaway from lack of lubrication looks like !!
This is a source reference. Confirm exact model applicability in the original material.