Selling Car out of State..What to do..

I have a potential buyer that is out of state and can not pick up the car personally so it will be shipped to him. How exactly does someone do this? I've never had to deal with this personally, it was always a face to face, switch keys for cash/check type of deal. How is it done without being scammed out of a car. My goodness, he doesn't even care about doing a PPI.

They typically need to transfer the full amount into you're account before shipping. Or you could put the car up on Ebay with an arrangement with the buyer to purchase the car, then he and you can use the Buyer Protection Plan where prior to you shipping, the buyers cash is held by a third party until he receives car and all are happy. Obviously there will be some extra cost to both parties. See Ebay for more precise explanation. Cheers, Paul

Find a Rennlist member near the buyer and ask them to broker for you?

Have you checked out Escrow.com? Alternatively, you can find a lawyer to draft a contract and act as an escrow agent. They give the attorney the cash, you give the attorney the title, spare keys, etc. and once everything is signed and done, the attorney distributes the cash and title to the appropriate parties. I don't know enough about eBay's Buyer Protection program to comment one way or another on its terms or effectiveness but one problem with eBay is that if the car isn't already listed there you're now going to add a hefty additional cost to the sale that you didn't have before. Of course, using escrow (whether online, through an attorney or otherwise) also has its own (potentially hefty) costs. What about asking the buyer to fly in and pay you in person? Too far, too costly, too difficult? -Eric P.S. Good luck with getting an RLer to do it. I would recommend against getting in the middle of that kind of thing. It's one thing to be helpful by taking pictures of a car. It's another to hand over that kind of cash to someone who is virtually anonymous. Even assuming the best of the RLer, what happens when they go to pay the seller and notice the car has a big scratch or ding in its side that the buyer is unaware of? Does the buyer expect that person to check back with them on any blemishes? Keep in mind that what you or I consider to be normal wear and tear might be unacceptable to an OCD buyer. I can already hear the nightmare conversation, "I can't believe you didn't call me about the curb rash on that rim..."

The guy can't look at it, can't have a friend look at it, and doesn't want a PPI? My BS meter is pegged on this one. As seller, the only way I'd do the deal is draw up a contract outlining the sale and have two original copies with original signatures overnighted back and forth. Have buyer wire funds from his bank to yours (MO's and cashiers checks can be faked). Agree to overnight the signed title and state required transfer docs to him. Have him schedule pick up of the car same day deal is done (you don't want liability for damage to the car after the sale). Document the crap out of the car with pictures and written description of everything about the car included flaws if any (down to minor scuffs). Include the written description with the contract and ask for sign off. I hope the buyer is real and you are both happy with the deal, but it's a scary, litigious world out there and you don't want to get caught in a tornado if buyer gets remorse. Good luck!

FWIW, I've sold two Porsches to out of town buyers. While I'm just an "amateur", here are my absolute Rules: #1: Require prospective buyer to inspect the car in your presence. #2: Do NOT release the car or the signed-over title until the full purchase amount is wire transfered into your bank account. Some inquirers didn't like my rules, but I stuck to them and the eventual buyers accepted them. relinuca

I have sold vehicles to out of state buyers many times. I require them to do a physical inspection in person. Title and vehicle is exchanged for cash. If the buyer refuses to inspect the car tell him you will deliver it to the dealer of his, (or your) choice near you. They can sell it to him on your behalf as a consignment as long as he pays their fees and you get your price. They can deal with the headaches, shipping, etc.

LOL and that is the position that scares me most as a buyer. Once I wire you the funds you are in complete control. You've got a hefty sum, the title, keys, car and I've got nothing. The fact that I met you for a few minutes to test drive your car and you seemed like a decent person ultimately gives me no comfort. The whole thing screams the reverse of one of those Allstate commercials on mayhem...you know, the one where the guy takes the motorcycle for a test drive ("how hard could this be?"). I know it works out for most people and "most people are good by nature" but that's not good enough for me when I'm handing someone, let's say, $30k. Clearly it's not good enough for you as the seller so why would it be any different for the buyer? The best case is for someone to fly/drive in or have someone they know go see the car and, assuming the terms of a sale are completed, hand the seller cash on your behalf while you or your friend takes the title and keys. Next, to me, is some form of escrow. Maybe my profession has left me jaded but, as trusting as I am, I just can't get myself to trust people enough to wire them that kind of money and pray that they will be there the next day when the transport shows up for the car. -Eric

Hope you didnt agree to a "cashiers check" which will be a forgery of course and made out for more than the asking price.

I've sold dozens of cars over the internet. Bought an out of town car for the first time on the internet in 1999. Have bought all 3 of my P-cars on ebay. Its not that big of a deal - there are just a few rules to follow. The seller should never release the car or title until either cash is in hand or a wire transfer receipt is verified by his/her bank. If the buyer wants to use anything other than cash or wire transfer, then insist on waiting 10 business days after the negotiable instrument is deposited before release of the car or title. Never personally deliver a vehicle to a buyer - there are too many things that can go wrong, even with a legitimate, reasonable buyer (ask me how I know). But, with the wrong buyer, it can actually be a safety issue. Always insist that the buyer or his/her agent (such as a shipping company hired by the buyer) pick up the car either at your house or at a public place in your neighborhood. Once you get verified funds in hand as a seller, your risk is minimal. The real risk is for the buyer. As a seller you should keep that in mind - if you are too difficult to deal with, then you'll never sell the car. The principal of caveat emptor applies for the buyer. Offer the buyer a chance to have a PPI done on the car - if he/she declines and then complains later about vehicle condition, that fact alone will likely allow you to prevail if you get sued. Unless you've misrepresented a material fact that can be proved to an objective standard, then the buyer complaining about minor flaws will have very little standing in court. A material fact that can be proved to an objective standard would be something like claiming it has a clear title when in actuality it has a salvage title, claiming no accident history when Carfax or Autocheck show otherwise, claiming true mileage when there is an odometer discrepancy. Because of this, documenting every scratch may be counterproductive - it may be better to describe condition generally such as "paint is in nice condition, I would rate it an 8 out of 10 with minor flaws." Additionally, I always offer the buyer the chance to back out of the deal with all amounts paid refundable and no penalty up until the point the buyer or his/her agent (shipping company) takes possession of the vehicle. List in the bill of sale the exact date and time that possession of the vehicle was transferred to the buyer. Be certain that the bill of sale states that the car is sold "as is" with no warranties, either express or implied. Lastly, remember that if an out of town buyer does sue you, he/she will almost certainly have to do it in your jurisdiction unless you travel to their place (as in delivering the car yourself). To ensure this, put a clause in the bill of sale stating that the transaction was done in your jurisdiction and that your jurisdiction is the sole venue for the resolution of any disputes. This will create a significant hurdle for the buyer in suing you (as a practical matter, they'll have to hire one of my brethren in your locality to prosecute the case). The internet has revolutionized the car buying process in a positive manner. It may create some issues to deal with, but the end justifies the means. Remember the days of trying to decipher 2-line classified ads?

Kcattorney, thanks for the awesome information. The buyer is out of state and I have done research on him and seems to be very well off. In talking with him, he said that the money will be wired over at which time he wants the car to be shipped and title mailed to him. I have taken multiple pictures of the car as well as a video and he seems to be ok with that. He says he does not have the time to see the car physically and is satisfied with what I have provided to him. His explanation is the cost to fly and drive the car back home will cost more than just shipping the car to him. This makes sense. I guess if the money is in the account by being wired in then I am assuming that it can't just be reversed out- can it?..

I call BS on the cost of flying out and driving home. I have done that and the main cost is your time. I bought a BMW M3 at the other side of the country. I exchanged emails and photos with the seller to ascertain condition. We also split the cost of a PPI at the local BMW dealer. We then agreed upon a price and I flew to the seller's location. We met at the bank, where I transferred the money from my account to his, we then transferred the title at a table in the bank. Prior to doing so I made sure the VIN numbers matched the documentation and also got copies of his driver's license. I also executed a standard bill of sale that I found posted by his state DMV. I then hit the road with the car. The cost of the flight, gas, and hotels was a minimal increment on the cost of the car and I got to spend a few days getting to know my new toy well. No sane buyer would buy a car sight unseen AND without a PPI. This is not a difficult thing to do, but it's a hell of a lot easier if you're face to face exchanging funds.

This thread is very informative and interesting, as this will likely pertain to me. If I was in Canada, and were to buy a car in the States or Europe, is it best to fly to either location to do the deal face to face in person, buy the car and ..... have it delivered by cargo ships or by a transport truck (e.g. from US)?

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Sure, but buying from other country brings in a host of other issues that you're going to have to deal with and not mentioned here.

I don't see how much added protection one has by meeting the buyer or seller in person!? There are plenty of confidence criminals that you meet face to face.

The added protection is if the buyer inspects your car in person then they cannot claim the car was misrepresented when its delivered. Plus you get to meet them and if they are trying to scam you "most" people will not want to meet you in person. Bottom line is if the money is in your account before delivery then you are in good shape.

Quotes source post: 10453923

Exactly. An intelligent person will spot the scam when the trade is done in person, as there are multiple ways to sniff it out. Doing the transaction in person ensures the seller gets their money before the car leaves them and the seller gets to inspect the car, ensure the VIN numbers match the car and the documentation and that they're walking away with a legitimate title.