My first Carrera 996: C2 or C4s?

I'm going to sell/trade my early '98 Boxster with 63,000 mi for a 996: C2 or C4S. I did a search here and found some comments about AWD vs RWD. These are my concerns: 1. Florida summer torrential rains; no snow. My Boxster spins 17" rear wheels easily in the rain. Not awful to deal with..kind of fun but a consideration. 2. I've been driving and tracking mid-engined cars for almost 5 years: Boxster and Ferrari 328. I drive my cars hard on the street to: no drag but high rpm, heel-toe down shifting, and agressive in curves and corners. I imagine I'll have to 'learn' the rear weight bias of a 996. Should I start with the 'safer' AWD C4S or get the 'less adhesive' C2 which arguably has more communicative steering and road reading and feel? I will go to PCA track events to learn the car either way. 3. Don't worry about cosmetics. The obvious applies. I won't get a C4 because if I decide on AWD the wide-body C4S is sooo gorgeous. 4. Price: like the C2 better but could get the C4S if my heart desires. My wife is cool with either. Am undecided if the C4S is worth the dollars and that is of course highly subjective. Thanks for any advice.

I have a 2001 C4 and in the rain it is awesome. On dry pavement you get the awd benefits only when driving agressive. My car really sticks on twisty/curvey roads. When there is a little drop and a turn the car jumps and grabs the road. I just finished a club tour and we took a 30 mile twisty/curvey road and it was awesome. I lived in Florida and have driven in the heavy rains and you will enjoy the control of a C4 or C4S.Also C4 and C4S includes PSM. Also check out the limited enhanced engine option. C4FDR

Well if its your first Porsche if you got the dough I go for the C4S but understanding which I read on a magazine that PAG may increase engine output on future C4S but thats just rumor. IF esthetics/suspension is the main reason over the c2 since the engine is the same then go for it. I always liked rear wheel drive cars only ie gt2(wish I could afford that ). Regards. Mike

Trust me,just test drive a cab with the top down,It's really something else.Don't get me wrong,I love the boy racer look of the 4S,it's just that roof.I wish Porsche would just go ahead and build a 4S or TT cab.

In my opinion, the C2 is going to be more satisfying to the driver. It may not have the grip or stability of the C4's, but as you are obviously a very experienced driver, I think you will find more satisfaction in a rear-wheel-drive.

I spoke with two of the main mechanics that service my Boxster and they both encouraged a C2: less weight less weight not needed on track not necessary unless there's snow most track cars disable the differential They did not deny the sex appeal of the C4S body.

Save the money from the C4S and buy a C2 Cab....Top down driving and a sleek, sexy, narrow-body. But get 18" wheels optional wider tires

If your going to the track get a C2 coupe as it is the lightest and the fastest (albeit not by much) of the non turbo Porsche. If your going to use primarily as a car for "fun" driving around town, get the C4 Cab, it's heavy, but it's fast in it's own right, safe in most weather conditions (safer than the C2 to some degree) and should hold it's value well. I have met a lot of Porsche owners who take their cars on the track once or twice a year but drive mostly on the street. They obsess about weight and handling but rarely push their toys to really appreciate the gains made from all the equipment changes they do to their 911s. Of course that is their right, for a lot of folks it's a hobby and I am certainly not bashing it, just throwing in a realistic taint. And I'm sure there are hardcore folks that go to the track all the time, but thats a different story. These are just my viewpoints, hope it gives you something to think about and helps you in some way. Quibbs *Damnit Jim, I'm a Doctor not a tap dancer

Good points. This will be my daily driver replacing my Boxster. I will take it to PCA Driver's Ed, AutoX and perhaps other track events. It won't be a die hard track car for sure. I don't think I'll go for the cabriolet. My Ferrari 328 gts gives me great open air touring---almost no wind buffeting--and is a fun track car to. I drive it on weekends, occasionally to work, and when the Boxster is in for repairs. I will dearly miss the Boxster but we could use the extra seats for my two boys. I won't get a BMW, the Ferrari Mondial a/c isn't good enough to be a daily in the heat 7 months of the year where I live, a used Ferrari 456 is too expensive, a Ferrari 412 is a p.i.t.a. I don't think a Camaro or Firebird or Mustang is for me, dare I mention them in the company of Ferrari and Porsche.

Go for the C4S, if I had the extra bucks I would have gone the C4S route, the wide body is really gorgeous and front is as turbo as it gets,turbo brakes. By the way, it is only a little more for a Turbo then you got everything you want, power, looks, rear spoiler. Go for a Turbo, sell the ML & 328 Bocky 02 C2 coupe

[quote]Originally posted by bocky: <strong>Go for a Turbo, sell the ML & 328</strong><hr></blockquote> The ML is my wife's car and she loves it. She needs something to haul the boys and their friends. Beats jewelry. I sometimes think of selling the 328 but it drives, sounds, and looks so good. It was my dream car and I love it. One day I'll put a Tubi exhaust and that should be fun. It's a keeper. And it's beaten the S&P500 for the past two years! Stretching for the 996 TT is too much money for me. It's about $30k more than the C4S and almost $45k more than a C2. I have no intrinsic desire to get the TT, I don't think it looks nearly as good as the C4S with the tail and air intakes on the rear 3/4 panels. In fact, it is the first factory Porsche that looks a bit like a kit car to me. Call me crazy but that's the subjectivity of it all. I'd love to drive the 996 C2 and C4S but there are none in stock at Champion. I'm going away for a week but when I get back I'll check back with them, Braman, and the Collection (dealers close to me in east south Florida). Some rave about the communicative steering of the C2 and it's lack of extra weight; others swear by the grip of the C4S. The rear quarters of the C4S are so sexy too. If they made a C2S like they did with the last generation of 993s that would be perfect!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jim I have a '02 C2 I ordered that is to be built in March and delivered in late April....I bought a '00 Millennium C4 a few weeks ago....just couldn't resist and I am going to cancel on the '02 C2 It is BLK/SB with 18" wheels, PSM, mats and Technic Pkg...I'll be happy to introduce you to the general manager....it is in the SE...the pricing was great! Email if your interested Berkley '00 Millennium C4 '01 ML 320 '01 S60 T5 '01 986 S (sold)

I've just driven a C4S that a friend picked up last week. He previously had a 993 C2S. You have a delightful dilemma, & can't go wrong 2 or 4. I was very impressed with the C4S, would buy it myself (if I was in the market at that price point). One might predict that it will hold value a little better (if that matters). Anyway, I don't quite understand why there is so much criticism of the water-cooled cars (I've a '87 Carrera) - these cars are quite fine. The C4S doesn't feel heavy or ponderous, the only impact of the driven front wheels I noted was positive; grippy power-on turn-in to tight or decreasing radius corners. Didn't drive it in the wet... It has more of what every good 911 has had - makes you feel you can deal with anything thrown at you & makes you confident that you can take anything on... if you wish.

[quote]Some rave about the communicative steering of the C2<hr></blockquote> C4 steering is amazingly communicative, one of only a few examples of an AWD car that goes against the general notion that AWD/4WD cars lack good road feel and handling. And to be truthful, the C4's steering is actually more neutral than the C2's, which understeers more.

it's odd that there would be even a noticeable difference on the street at all between the two cars. our 325xiT has a constant torque split apportioned and i still cannot tell the difference between that and a non_AWD E46 3 series. i'm no genius in terms of driving and i have my hands full in an M coupe; so for me, in decision making for a car with the engine BEHIND the rear axle, the C4S was an easy option. the wider track and traction bear out as the C4S is faster on the nurburgring than the C2; granted the GT3 is even faster still.

1.OPEN AIR TOURING: I can do that with my targa 328 gts. 2. Interestingly, most sports cars, either for the street or hardcore for the track, do not use AWD. I think the main goal of AWD for the 996TT is to prevent wheel spin with all the torque. Many tricked out Carreras whether 993 or 996 do not use AWD. 3. Ah, but the C4S is soooo sexy. When I get back home I'll try to find a C2 and C4S or at least a C4 to drive.

C2 or C4?, well, IMHO, I think it depends on whether you like to �tinker� with the handling of the car (C2) or just drive with assured confidence (C4) on track or street. I moved from Boxster (2.5ltr) some years ago to a C2 having test driven a C4 & C2 back to back. C2 was least confidence inspiring but then I liked the idea of getting the perfect balance/handling of my previous car, the Boxster. So it was a C2 Cab for me, no TC or any electronic aid. Boxster had TC but made no difference to handling IMHO. So far C2 Cab has presented me with many challenges in terms of handling and I am almost close to the perfect set-up for streets & some track for me. I do like tinkering though � suspension upgrade, wider track wheels & tires, higher performance tires, tire PSI corrections etc etc etc. I have just purchased a 964RS for true track days thrashing! Still getting used to its ALL or NOTHING handling � truly uncompromising car, just what a 911 should be.

Some of you mentioned the PAG option of the C4S. What's that?

I think they meant Porsche AG (PAG)...the parent company in Germany vs PCNA (Porsche Cars North America). Mike '02 C4S

shameless bump

The "purer" Porsche driving experience is probably in the C2, but for those of us who do not steer through the apex with pure power, the C4S can be a fast, albeit a less challenging ride. Is it underpowered to use AWD? That depends on how aggressive you are. After about 1000 miles in my first month with a new C4S, I have no problem reaching the limits of this car's handling capabilities in corners with the stock 320 hp engine. BTW, for perspective on the C2 on a track you may want to read R&T's March 2002 review. Steve Millen thought that the vertical travel of the C2 suspension was too great. He also though that the front end was too light and conveyed a vuage feeling over the brow of a corner at the track. (Presumbly the C4S's lower suspension and heavier front end would minimize this characteristic.) Another driver thought that its steering was uncommunicative on the Mazda raceway at Leguna Seca. There are a few C4S's available in the Boston area with a few hundred miles on them and the luxury tax already paid. The dealers are asking about $90k with modest option packages. The dealers around here tell me that there is a year or more wait for one ordered. eBay has not had one avbaiable for a while. The two here this weekend are Arctic Silver, a great, but common color. IMHO, one should buy a Porsche the way he or she wants it configured and not be too concerned about the aftermarket interest in color combinations. How many black/black and Arctic Silver/black TT's do you want to see? The customization opportunities for a Porsche are incredible, but few take advantage of them. As to the police proclivity to ticket bright colored cars, it is probably true, but as long as we drive safely without weaving around other cars and are observant we should avoid most arbitrary speed enforcment. If they think that you are racing, it doesn't make any difference if you are over the speed limit by much or at all--you're toast.

Quite an interesting discussion you've started here. Enjoyed all the comments. For me, It was a visceral reaction to the beauty of the C4S that clinched it. I just had to have it. Didn't even compare prices. And, let's all be honest.At this price range, a few thousand won't dissuade you from the one you like. Unless you are a regular track driver, the differences in weight, performance, behaviour, will never really manifest itself with any significance. It makes for good foder at forums like these though, or at the PCA dinners over beer. <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />

Re AndrewP: I have and read that issue or R&T and indeed noticed that. However, if I get a C2 I will get the 030 suspension upgrade or lower it with H&R springs. On the otherhand, car mags love the BMW M3. It's a fine car but it really did nothing for me when I drove it: steering too light, shift gates closest of anything I have ever driven, and I just can't see myself in it.

I also have had a very different impression of a car than car mag reviewers, but their perspective is uesful. I find that Motor Trend, Auto Week and Sports Car International tend to have knowledgable and objective reviewers. One thing that they almost all get wrong is the ease of use of MB controls, which after a couple of years with a CLK and CL I find are very intuitive with little or no extraneous settings/controls. This tells me that their time in a particular car is quite limited and that they have editorial agendas. At the level of cars that we are talking about it is obviously very subjective. This is especially true with Porsche's.