NADA, KBB, Black Book, Pricing All Over the Map / Help

The pricing for the 1999-2004 996, CS, CS4, and Turbo is all over the place. The Porsche Dealer "True Price" is a joke. Can someone please give the correct place to look for auction prices, true trade-in, etc for these cars. Please dont give me the "whatever someone will pay" answer.

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The pricing is all over the place because your looking at 5 model years and at almost all 996 models. Compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges. A '99 996 will obviously sell for less than an '04 turbo.

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+100 to above. In addition to sources you mentioned, I also checked this: http://www.excellence-mag.com/resour...ide/1041874889 LOCATION plays a big role in pricing (example: prices are generally much higher here in California).

Excellence and NADA are the most representative of true negotiated prices for cars recently sold.

They're all over the place because sales prices are all over the place! What you're seeing is the dynamics of supply and demand, which unfortunately happen to be quite random because it's more related to how patient the seller is and how selective the buyer is as opposed to actual supply/demand. You're going to have to simply get a price range in mind and then go from there. My advice is if you're buying, arm yourself with documentation for whomever estimates them the cheapest. If you're selling, go with the highest reputable estimate. Then negotiate from there. I've always thought excellence was way high- the sellers in there always seem to be overly optimistic about the value of their cars and sales prices reflect that. "Real world" sales prices are nowhere near that; you can go on autotrader and see that in an instant just by the asking prices.

Those tools are used as an indicator of price or value and as such do vary, especially when looking at so many different years and models. Perhaps you are spending too much time trying to find the perfect price and the perfect Porsche.

go to the nearest auction and pick up the lastest sale prices they publish these in a tri fold pamphlet... Look at ebay....

The other thing to consider is options, the price of these cars varied hugely when new depending on spec.

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Options rarely add much value to a used car's price. If I recall correctly the dealer bible, Black Book, does not even list options other than sunroof/moonroof and transmission type. It is mostly miles and condition. This is a good reason to look for highly optioned cars, since they won't actually cost you much more. Most of the online guides are bs, Kelly Blue Book in particular. And the 'trade-in value' they list is worthless. Dealers only care about wholesale value, which is usually a few hundred less than KBB's low trade-in number. Excellence value guides are instructive on trends. Porsche Market Letter is even better. Recent auction prices and Black Book are what dealers use. The 996 value plunge seems to have mostly stabilized. Good condition, good mileage 996.2s have perhaps even gained just a bit, edging back toward $27-28k retail. Turbo prices on the other hand seem to be coming down after staying strong for quite a while. Perhaps used 997 turbo availability is affecting this. Anyway, there is no exact answer. Porsche sports cars are rare enough that it is difficult to cross-shop between dealers and private sellers the way you could if you were looking for a Ford. Dealers are also willing to hang on to cars longer to get their money back, unlike most used cars that they just want to move. It is a bit of a seller's market out there in used car land, with supply far behind demand. But be patient and picky and eventually you will find what you want... but you need to figure out what you want.

Of course the prices are "all over the place", and thats a good thing! As these 996s age and begin to transition from driver's cars to collectibles the value of any individual vehicle will become far more dependent on that particular car's condition, options, location, etc. (notice I didn't say 'mileage'). What I think of as the 'base price' on these cars has dropped to around $15k-$17k. Now before you panic let me explain ... this is for a good, clean, straight, functional driver with wear and tear typical of a 10 to 13 year old car. A heavily optioned minty fresh showroom new example will sell for approximately twice that (keeping in mind that such a car would have sold for somewhere around $80k new.) Anything in the middle is, well, in the middle ... so your effective range is around $15k to $28k.

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Depends on your definition of Model vs. Options. If you think about the car in terms of it being a Porsche 911, there are some options that add a lot of value. Like the Turbo package, or 4WD, or a convertible top. If you take a narrower view on what a "model" is (i.e. 996 Turbo Convertible), then options like "CD Changer" don't do anything for value.

I agree as far as guides go option don't make much of a differance. But when I was looking at cars I didn't even bother to look at cars which didn't match my list even if they were very appealing cost wis,. While I did consider equivalent cars costing much more which suited my preferance's. So to answer what options mean I'm thinking things like color, leather interior things which are difficult to change after purchase.

for me, OPTIONS played a big role in in the car I finally picked: full aero kit, nav, PSM, Bose, leather, 19-in rims, heated seats, PSM,, mufflers/intake done, etc.

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Actually the definition of options vs. model is very clear in the automotive world. Turbos, AWD, and cabriolets are clearly different models with separately listed values.

Whenever I buy a car, I always look at dealerships, local publications, online sites like autotrader and cars.com and even Craigslist just to have a feel how much the market is asking for a particular car I want to buy. For me, I tend to buy just within my region. When I gather info on prices, I average it and set a price that I would be comfortable buying. Like most people here said, a 911 varies so much in models and prices with tens of thousands difference especially when they were new.

I know when I emailed several used car dealerships they ALL told me an 02' 64k miles excellent condition inside & out would ONLY be worth LOW LOW 20's (by low I mean 21-22) & one even said 19k, I just told them thank you for your time, and after seeing a few pics of my car a couple of them said they might could give a lil' more but it wouldn't be much and they understood it would be Crazy for me to just give it away for that but it is what it is! jmo

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When I was shopping 7-8 years ago, the AWD and convertible top didn't seem to add any value at all. I can't imagine that it's changed this many years later.

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Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. 2012 Excellence Magazine Buyer's Guide: 2002 Coupe $18,000 - 25,000 2002 Cabriolet $21,000 - 29,000 2002 C4S $23,000 - 31,000 If you can find a C4S offered for the same price as a like mileage/condition coupe you let me know.

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And what part about a dealership low balling a trade offer is surprising? This has little to do with value and everything to do with maximizing profit margins. I recently traded in a BMW 3 series and in the end got nearly $2k more than the initial offer.

If you're SELLING a cabriolet or a Turbo, or a 4S they will tell you at the shop that it has no added value--but you can bet when they're selling it they will be pushing that on prospective buyers! Since there are no two-alike Porsches any longer due to optioning variations, pricing variability is likewise broad. I do not believe for a moment that options will not contribute to the value of a used car on the used car market. For example, the checking of the "Tiptronic" box when ordering definitely affects the salability of one of these cars. Many racers want sunroof-delete, while a sunroof may be a deal breaker for others. If I were shopping for a used car I would definitely be attracted toward spending more for a loaded car over a striped car. There are significant ranges in cars available from the strippers to the loaded--and everything in between. For that, we are very fortunate. Many buyers buy precisely what they want or need--stripped or loaded. With so many cars available out there in the market place you don't need to settle for something you don't want!

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Dealership Low Balling???? THIS is the EXACT same numbers you provided for Us! 02' Coupe 18k to low 20's! So where is the Low Balling!