Philip Raby on 996/M96/IMS/RMS, etc.

A very thorough and direct overview of the 996 hysteria from the longtime UK Porsche journalist and broker. "So, let�s get one thing clear right from the start. Porsche sold hundreds of thousands of Boxsters, 996s and 997s, and the vast majority have had trouble-free engines. The problem is that the internet and press grab hold of the rare engines that fail and blow the issue out of all proportion. I have done a lot of research on this subject and spoken to many engineers, and I have discovered nothing that would put me off owning one of these cars. I once wrote that I reckoned five percent of M96 and M97 are likely to suffer terminal failure, and was contacted by a Porsche specialist who congratulated me on my feature but suggested that I had over-estimated the problem � he believed it was less than five percent... As I said, there is nothing there that would stop me from owning and enjoying a Porsche with one of these engines." http://www.findaporsche.com/porsche-...nes-the-truth/ Possibly Jake's long-lost British relative?

Old article. Even 0,5% would be legitimate cause for concern given the catastrophic consequences and cost. The debate is not whether it should or should not put one off buying. The debate is whether or not to take some proactive measure to minimise one's financial risk. Extended warranty, LN retrofit...one or the other, both, or neither. The options are limited, clear, and well-hashed. Inasmuch as the financial risk is borne entirely by the owner, it would seem to follow that the decision to ignore or address the issue, and in the latter case how then to address it, ought likewise to be the choice of each owner, unfettered by taunts and cat-calls from those with different opinions.

The question I have now is how long does the LN bearing last before it goes south?

Old? He wrote it on September 12th. Seemed like good information for a prospective owner, complete with concise descriptions and photos of the different issues. He pulls no punches. I'm not sure your comment relates to his information. Did you actually read the article?

all the speculation and conjecture on this subject is a waste of time if you own a car on which the ims failed, its a collosal issue. if you have one on which the ims doesnt fail, then its no big deal. you simply have to determine whether you are gonna worry or not. if u are...get the imsb...if not, dont

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Why don't you contact LN?

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Actually, that IS the debate in my case, and the primary reason I signed on to this site. After reading all I can get my cursor on concerning this issue, I still haven't got a clear idea of whether this is a reasonable DIY job for the mechanically proficient. I am very interested in owning a 996 (due in large part to the reasonable buy-in), but the degree of difficulty in addressing such known issues as the IMS & RMS remains largely unclear, and until that is rectified I'm on the fence.

I am more worried that the cylinder wall will crack than I am about the IMS bearing. I can change out the IMS bearing if I am fearful for a couple thousand $$$, but I can't change out the cylinder wall for the same amount. Hence me purchasing a WP and making sure that this baby runs cool and is flushed out nicely.

I want real world opinion on LN bearing life from independent sources. Calling LN is hardly going to give me that so I posed the question here.

Seems like a cynical approach. Have you ever spoken with Charles or Jake? I didn't think so.

The IMS Solution sure is going to change these conversations.... :-)

Dumb question, but what is "IMS Solution" vs. the LN replacement? Thx!

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The IMS Solution is a collaboration of LN and Flat 6 Innovations. It is a complete design change for the bearing. Look for a full feature on the technology in Excellence magazine over the coming winter.

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I am often disappointed, but not surprised. at how many people comment on a post without actually reading it first. I posted a link to this UK blog post because the author provides a very good overview of all of the M96 issues - complete with photos. He mentions the IMS Guardian and has a link to a previous post that describes it in more detail. Not that cousin Jake can't do his own 'splaining, but it is good to read about solutions from outside, unbiased sources as well.

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? Are they actually cousins?

I have found that few people read articles and fewer understand what they are reading. This is one reason I have pretty much stopped writing them. We receive questions via email that are covered in depth within the articles on my site and I find it funny when people begin their email by saying "I love your site and all the info, but I have a question". Philip and I communicate from time to time, he is a very passionate Porsche follower that lives a life much like mine and shares a ton of solid information. My outlook on the engine failures is different, as I experienced the dark side of the reality on a daily basis. We don't see cars for service work or general maintenance, outside of a few elective procedures and reconstructions everything that we see comes to us blown to bits. We specialize in those scattered engines, so we see a heavier concentration of worst case scenarios. The percentage of failure canot be calculated as the pieces of the equation that are necessary cannot be accurately attained.

Good to seeing this being discussion, and hi Jake Maybe it's not possible to calculate the percentage of failures but I think it's fair to say that the majority of these engines will be fine. It wouldn't stop me from buying one. People like Jake in the US and Hartech in the UK are the ones to contact if you do experience trouble, as they can rebuild engines to a better than new standard. Cheers Phil

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oh this is very weird that "Phil Raby" posts right afterwards... You guys aren't related either, are you?

Nope, don't think we're related.

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I've a UK mag from at least 2 years ago residing in a basket in my loo, wherein Phil Raby opines almost verbatim the same as the snippet posted here. Aside from Jake Raby's new mystery innovation there really hasn't been anything new said about the IMS issue that isn't pure conjecture. Accurate data/statistics simply do not exist that anyone can rely upon to make a truly informed decision as to how to proceed. All we really know is that significant numbers of the IMS bearings have failed (significant meaning, more than merely a hand-ful), when it does fail the consequences are catastrophic, and there engineering science to explain why the IMS bearing design itself is contributory to a weak-link situation. The choices are limited and clear: Buy the car, or don't. Believe your IMS bearing might fail, or don't. Care, or don't. Retrofit an improved bearing, or don't. Purchase an extended warranty, or don't.

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It's all luck. Some guys think it won't happen to them and it doesn't. I find that most people that it happens to don't even know about it till it happens to them. Phil and I probably aren't related by blood, but we share a name synonymous with Porsche passion :-)

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Well... some of us have not been to your 'loo'... Or lowered the 'hood' on a convertible... Or opened the 'bonnet' to look at the engine... Or replaced a 'wing' after an accident... Or owned a 'shooting brake"... Or bought 'petrol'... Or cleaned the bugs off the 'windscreen'... Or tightened a nut with a 'spanner'... Or lost to Italy on PKs in the Eurocup... OK, perhaps that last one was a bit cruel.

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We are waiting for a properly installed LN IMSB to go south before we can answer your question.

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Phil, in the article on your site you mention reading a magazine that supported the scaremongering. Which mag was that, and please don't take this personally, why would I not believe them and believe your assessment?

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Yup. And yet message boards like this persist in populating the internet with content that makes a 996 look like a bad idea, despite - as you say - there being nothing new to say about it for years now. Kind of sad.

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The information in the article was sound and correct but it was rather wordy and sensationalist. In essence, though, it said the same as my blog. Cheers Phil

Jake, you must get yourself over here some time and we can meet up at the annual Porsche event at Raby Castle

>> Believe your IMS bearing might fail, or don't. Care, or don't. My '99 smokes on startup, leaks oil, blows a little coolant.. the chains rattle ... the DM flywheel rattles, and yet about once a month, for a full weekend, all day, it pulls hard beyond 7000 RPM and teaches $120,000 GT3s what it means to brake hard and corner faster Just drive the damn things hard and you will be rewarded. If you idle around hoping to save your motor you are missing the point of Porsche ownership!

[QUOTE My '99 smokes on startup, leaks oil, blows a little coolant.. the chains rattle ... the DM flywheel rattles, and yet about once a month, for a full weekend, all day, it pulls hard beyond 7000 RPM and teaches $120,000 GT3s what it means to brake hard and corner faster Just drive the damn things hard and you will be rewarded. If you idle around hoping to save your motor you are missing the point of Porsche ownership! [/QUOTE] Well said! Exactly right also. If you don't drive it like you stole it at least once a day, don't own one. The damage done to these motors from just lugging around and being garage queens, far outweighs the IMS issue. IMO

Flat6/LN Engineering: You seem to be very confident with your upcoming 'IMS Solution'. Is this confidence stemming from hrs of elaborate endurance testing accomplished so far, or is it from an educated enthusiasm for the future of this IMS Solution? Martin

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well one thing guaranteed is that it will sell really really well inlcluding to folks who have already purchased the LM bearing since the idea is that this is a "real fix" So if nothing else that is a reason for confidence Personally Ill take my chances on the statistics and rely on a car with a known history, regular driving and religious maintenance until and if some new info surfaces that change the statistics. as for the notion that the problems can be summed up with "it will fail or it wont" "some fail some dont" "care or dont", literally *any* problem with *anything* can be summed up with that logic. Anything from heart disease to the iphone antenna issues. If that were going to be the "last word" then there would quite literally be no need to discuss anything ever again. Anything might or might not happen and any given person either cares or they dont by definition.

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We are very confident after having sat our asses in the seat of the vehicle equipped with the unit over a 7,000 mile trip across the continent. Charles and I developed this from just an idea in 2009 and after 5 generations we finally have a perfected unit that passes every challenge we throw at it with flying colors. This includes 5,000+ start cycles, 300+ WOT chassis dyno runs, 170 hours of idling without being shut down (at the hottest time of te summer with ambient temps 105+ for a week) and also back to back testing for MPG, BSFC and power output. It's a true solution from a grassroots effort from the two teams that truly understand the issues and what causes the original design to be inadequate. When we debuted the technology for the first time in my M96 engine class in Edmonton Canada after driving the car there the attendees were both shocked and the general consensus was "damn, that makes so much sense". We will be offering credits to those who wish to trade their retrofit bearing in for a solution when the time comes. Flat 6 will be the exclusive installer for the first 18 months or so as we cannot afford installation complications that other shops may experience and overlook which would cost the technology it's reputation. The only way to know its done perfectly is for the hands that developed it to install it 100%. I finished the 7,000 mile trip last night, our average speeds and MPG were staggering, even through the most harsh roads possible, to include a dirt road that was 107 miles long. Charles and I took our time to carry out this success tour ourselves to prove the confidence that we have in the entire development and that includes having zero spare "solution" parts on hand with us and the only tool we had was a leatherman. The car and engine performed flawlessly and it's all one big rolling experiment with many of our generation II engine components employed that reach well beyond the IMS Solution

I'm still a bit confused on what you can learn in only 7k miles of testing vs 40-100k miles of various operating condition and environment variables that a typical car may see before electing to update or requiring an IMS fix.

I haven't divulged everything and I won't.. That said the factory develops vehicles with projections and no seat of the pants testing, or very, very little. This is one thing that lead to the 23 documented modes of engine failure that we have noted with these engines. That said, when a component is subjected to neglect and abuse and then purposely is forced to fail we learn a lot. Our resumes in the engine development arena are long an the components that we develop sell themselves over and over again. If you'd rather us spend another decade developing the product rather than 3 years and stand by while thousands more engines fail you are probably not the kind of buyer that we cater to. This 7,000 mile test was ONE of the things we have done, not the only one. It was also done as a success tour more than anything since the other real test work has been over since July. It's pretty simple, if you don't believe in it just don't buy it, I am sure we won't be able to keep up with demand anyway- we never can. This same sort of skepticism existed with the current retrofit bearing and we are accustomed to it, because there's always that 10% that can't be pleased or want to be told what they want to hear and we don't play that game. This unit will become the ONLY option for an IMS arrangement in my engines next month, just like the triple row IMS bearing was from te beginning till present day. We have had ZERO failures from those and we developed them in the exact same way as the IMS Solution. If I didn't trust it with my heart and soul I wouldn't use it in my engines that are fully warranted and start with an 18,000.00 price tag. Take that to the bank-

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Fair enough but I think it's a bit hard for some people to swallow if someone says they have the next best thing to slice bread but aren't willing to come forth with enough evidence or information. Until then, I'm just reserving my judgement and not getting excited even though I sense your enthusiasm and belief that this will be the ultimate cure. I hope you understand from the consumer side and the reason why I have questions you may not be willing to answer currently. Also, I tend to disagree with you depending on what you deem the factory to test on with no seat of the pants testing and mainly projections. I have a relative that works in the industry and this is simply not the case. I don't disagree with you about your resume or the fact that your products are great, however I do believe that a portion of your sales are mainly driven by fear and insurance rather than a pure need to get your product(debateable of course). I have to wonder if engines were the cost of used Honda engines, how many people would electively decide to do the retrofit? Once again, debatable at best. You are predicting "thousands" of engines will fail promoting the fear factor again relating to the IMS. Can it happen, yes. However you yourself admitted that there can be many modes of failure and this new IMS solution does not tackle all of them if I'm understanding this correctly. Therefore just because someone gets the new IMS solution doesn't mean their engines will not fail. I just want some clarificaiton on that. However this is the one you seemed to have emphasized the most in your posts here alluding that this one potentally was the most important. Why not emphasize the other tests that seem to be more relevent or hold more weight in your testing processes and explain how those tests could be attributed to the long term real word scenarios? So just to be clear, you are installing the new IMS solution for your engines that you build but are not going to be for sale for retrofit until later on? And even then it would have to be installed in your facilities? I'm neither a fanboy or hater but just approaching this cautiously and objectively while trying to remove the fear factor and replacing it instead with logic. I'm not here to make you look bad or good. I just wish there was more transparency and clear communication so that us consumers can understand more of the facts and hear less of the hype. I really do hope your new IMS solution works out so it can boost our 996 values down the line since it will make upgrading to a 991 that much easier.

As always, the technology finds its way into our engines first. As those are applied worldwide and the technology gains respect and momentum things start to move into the market place in other ways. A good example is the IMS Update that was first used as a triple row bearing in our engines and is now sold to other builders across the globe without a single failure. In the interim, yes it will be exclusively installed through our facility. This is primarily to ensure that each install is done correctly and to hone the installation procedure for future installers to benefit from. Just like we developed the tools and etc for the IMS Retrofit in the same manner and we carried out the first retrofit ever, right here. Not a problem. We are accustomed to this sort of post and the skepticism that exists today. You'll see a feature on the technology in Excellence soon as well as very specific descriptions of hoow it works when the time is right. Right now we are working hard to do all the things right in regard to bringing the units to the market place and thats why you won't even read about this on my website or the LN site. I have only mentioned it here on these forums and maybe once on 986forum.com. I can see now that I should have refrained from doing so. Thats all I'll say, from this point forward my lips are zipped and the keyboard is locked. Trust that ANYTHING we develop is done to the best of our ability with thorough testing in the real world behind it. We haven't earned the respect we have from being ineffective.

Good idea boost the 996 values and lets start a FUD 997.2 campain sometime next year so it will lower the value of values and I can upgrade

Thank you for your response and yes I figured you sort of jumped the gun in your enthusiasm by letting the cat out of the bag a bit prematurely. However, you did a great job in the hush hush dept for all this time so it's not all that bad. I look forward to reading more about the upcoming product and also see it in action.

Thank you Jake and Alpine003 for running this civilized conversation on a topic that has been quite emotional in the past. My 00 C2 has 140k+ kms so far, never had the IMS bearing replaced and it is certainly in my plans to do it in the future as it has been an excellent machine. We all appreciate you giving Porsche owners a possible IMS Solution alternative in the future other than the Porsche OEM replacement part option, especially if your Solution has the potential to be a 'definitive' one. In my view, as opposed to clamming up, I would recommend you keep updating us on your successes. I look forward to reading your article in the upcoming Excellence magazine. Cheers! Martin

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I to look forward to reading this after Martin buys it and passes it one office over!!!

Let's talk M97 here for a minute guys (indulge me please Jake - count me as a supporter by the way) 1) Has there *ever* been a M97 Intermediate Shaft Bearing failure documented? Note that I spelled it out because I don't want to hear about other engine failures - only verified M97 IMSB failures. Somewhere someone said it's never happened. So far I haven't heard of anyone ever seeing one failed. 2) Once your ultimate solution hits the mainstream - years down the road - will I be able to DIY retrofit my M97 ( notwithstanding the question above) Thanks!

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Schmuckle...dude. There are as many DIY IMSB retrofit threads here on Rennlist as there are "how do I open my trunk with a dead battery?" threads. You can't swing a cat here without someone pulling their trans for a clutch job and replacing the IMSB while they're in there. Jake will sell the kit plus tools for about $700. Jack the car, drop the transmission, pull the old bearing, tap in a new one....you're done before dinner. I would have done my IMSB when I replaced my clutch this summer (see my thread here somewhere) but I have a later style M97 in which the bearing can't be pulled from the outside. ...

My '99 smokes on startup, leaks oil, blows a little coolant.. the chains rattle ... the DM flywheel rattles, and yet about once a month, for a full weekend, all day, it pulls hard beyond 7000 RPM and teaches $120,000 GT3s what it means to brake hard and corner faster Just drive the damn things hard and you will be rewarded. If you idle around hoping to save your motor you are missing the point of Porsche ownership! these are the posts I love, no scarmongery, just enjoy the car the way it was built!!!

Can't say that anymore.

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There you go - they fixed it good eh? (not) So - is it fair to say the newer design is at least *better* than the old design? Thnks

Its the SAME design.. The ball bearings and races are just larger, but it IS NOT a design change. We don't consider it better, because it can't be serviced without engine disassembly. The very early dual row bearings are the *best* of the bunch, but thats like trying to pick a less rotten egg out of a dozen rotten eggs. Again, thats my opinion thats been formed from seeing these things grenade on a weekly basis, so it is totally biased and probably a bit unfair because we don't see engines that aren't broken.

Sorry Jake, but in the grand scheme of Porsche global sales I dont believe the IMS issues are as bad as you make out, yes you may see alot, but then Porsche sold thousands of 996 & Boxters. All vehicles have issues, your business is making money from addressing one of them. You should be applauded for that, but unfortuneatly such posts and replys on internet forum help drive such issues out of proportion.

I appreciate your opinion. Come answer my phones for a week and your jaw would hit the floor by Wednesday in disbelief. No one could imagine it unless they lived it first hand. Like I said, I am biased by what we are exposed to every single day. To us it seems like every car on the road is dead or dying because of exposure.

Haters, Imagine if you will a parallel universe. "But there's no Flat 6 Innovations" When your ***** snap, your guna have to pay Porsche to pick your ***** up. $$$$$$$ LOL

In a class on Buying a used Porsche, our local Indy and PCA National Tech Adviser shared that replacing the IMS Bearing is your best investment if you are buying a Boxster or 996. However, he also noted that his shop has installed over 80 LN Bearings and of the bearings removed... only 3 where bad. One he noted could have failed in hours. So in this very un-scientific sample, of aware and active Porsche owners who wanted to care for their 996, 986 Porsche's, less that 5% failed - but who among us wants to be the 5%.

I'm not a hater at all, if you read the post I said that Jake should be applauded, I think his work is great in that he has developed a fix for those that previously would have had a scrap engine. I just think the overall IMS hysteria is overplayed and there are hundreds of good engines for every one failure, personally I dont believe it is 5%. That is my view and I respect others including Jakes that differ.

I have the LM upgrade as i too read all the horror stories pre-purchase. But dealing with two different indys in Miami and the local Porsche dealer over the last two years the concensous from all 3 is that the IMS failure is a RARE event. Can it happen along with the other 20+ items that "could" go wrong sure but after 2 years of ownership and meeting many 996 owners outside of the forums I just don't see that it can possibly be as big a % as is being touted.

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I would like to share a similiar story. I bought a used Porsche part online and picked it up in person this year. After talking to the guy, I ended up finding out that he was a Porsche Master Tech and had been with the same dealership for 30 years. As you can imagine my eyes bulged and my heart pounded when I heard this. And if it wasn't for my wife waiting in the car for me, I could've easily had a 4+ hour conversation with this guy. Of course you know what my first question was. What he said was very interesting. He indicated that he never personally saw a failure directly attributed to an IMS the whole time he was working there come in his shop. However, he said the dealership's owner's neighbor suffered a blown engine and the IMS was most likely the culprit. This is when he personally found out that Porsche would not really step up to the plate in any big way which left a sour taste in his mouth. He acknowledged the fact that direct IMS failure is rare in his experiences yet because of Porsches lack of support in these cases, he personally would probably do the IMS retrofit for a piece of mind if he had a 996 or 997. Which brings up something that's been said again and again. I think the IMS retrofit is hugely a personal decision based on what types of risks you want to take and whether you can sleep not having it. Some people like to take more risks and chances than others. There is no wrong or right regarding this IMO. I would like to say though that people that considered doing an IMS retrofit at their next Clutch change interval might be turned off or elect not to do it if the convenience is not there for anyone to be able to install it except at the Flat6 facilities or select installers. However I can understand Jake wanting to keep a certain level of QA process as to not taint the reputation of his product due to faulty installations. My $.03

I agree with alpine's remarks and had similar experience when I asked one of our local Cleveland inde's what they have seen. So, for what it's worth (which ain't much), out of 5 or 6 LN IMS jobs over the past two years, none of the removed bearings showed any outward visible signs of problems, and, they said they personally hadn't seen any engine failures in their shop due to IMSB coming apart. The owner went on to say that it "seemed" like many of the failures he's heard and read about were coming out of the west coast for some reason. Now I presume that there are a lot more Porsches running around Cali than Ohio, so that might explain the higher incidence on the west coast, but who knows, maybe it's the salt air or smog out there.

I agree with most of the previous comments and the Servicing Director at Weissach in Vancouver (Canada's largest independent Porsche dealership) stated the same experience - only ever seen one or two IMS induced failures while supporting literally thousands of 996/997/986/987 vehicles. That said I'm going to put the LN bearing in at the upcoming clutch change (12-18 months away most likely) just for peace of mind. In the interim I check the filter at annual oil changes and other than that it doesn't even concern me!!

Someone didn't remove the seals from those bearings and actually inspect them. You can't tell if the bearing is in any mode of failure process without inspection. Ask him of those 80 how many had ANY engine oil inside the IMS tube when the bearing was extracted. The very first stage of IMSB failure is a compromise of the outer seal which allows engine oil into the bearing thus washing the permanent lubrication from the bearing. The outer seal then inhibits enough engine oil from reaching the critical areas of the bearing to allow for proper cooling and lubrication of the bearing. This is why the engine oil is inside the tube as it has already passed by the outer seal, through the bearing and then by the inner seal and ends up trapped inside the tube. An IMS tube with oil inside of it means that IMS bearing is failing. Of those we have pulled here, certainly more than anyone in the world we have seen less than 20 engines that had dry IMS tubes. There is no other way for oil to end up inside the IMS tube except through the IMS bearing-period. Washing the oil from a recently extracted IMS bearing and then giving it the "spin test" is the better way to grade the health of an IMSB, the oil gives an artificial sense of better health than reality. Cutting the bearing apart reveals it all. A "spin test" without washing the oil away is virtually worthless. We didn't create a solution for a false problem; we created the retrofit and now the Solution because of demand from people just like you guys. Less than five years ago if your IMS bearing was failing no one had the tools or knowledge to extract it and you needed a new engine. The factory didn't offer a part and they still don't outside of a new IMS assembly that requires full engine disassembly to be fitted to the engine. The factory claimed that the bearings were not serviceable and everyone else listened while we took the challenge to develop the tools and processes. I built the first extraction tool from old scrap pieces laying around the shop and 12 bucks worth of parts from the local hardware store. The day I pulled the first bearing with it all that mattered was the fact that we broke the rules set forth by the factory, and every Porsche service writer and technician in the world at that time. Times have changed and what was once deemed impossible by the factory and dealerships has now seen every dealer in the US and Canada installing the Retrofit bearing with the exception of just three. One dealer even got a smack down from PCNA for their brochure saying that pretty much the bearing had to be applied, else the engine would fail. If you guys that we are fearmongers, you should have seen that brochure!

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I'm leaning towards that way, not out of fear but the fact that my car will probably be coming close to 130k miles by then and if you think about how fast this bearing spins and the fact that all bearings are wear items, it might just make sense to do so while you're in there at this kind of mileage. But then knowing my luck, the chain tensioner would fail and the chain guides would disintegrate into the engine anyhow. Now if there were several documented 200k+ mileage original m96 996's all over the place, I might think otherwise.

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20% of Porsche's have been sold new in CA

I had 110,000 miles on my daily driven 2000 996 when it was finally time for a clutch change. I had my (very experienced) Porsche mechanic friend replace the IMS bearing for the LN Engineering version, along with the RMS, while he had it all apart. I did it for what I consider inexpensive peace of mind. He agreed that it was a good idea. How did my bearing look when he removed it? Perfect. No visible signs of damage anywhere. However, am I glad I spent the $700 on this bearing and support? Absolutely.

My bearing came out pre-purchase and dealer that did the LN bearing said no signs of wear on old bearing. Am I glad I did it sure I might not have bought car without it and certainly sleep better but do I think 996's are blowing up left and right? Nope, sorry I just don't see it and there are a LOT of 996's in South Florida.

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Mine has 200k miles and an original bearing and the bearing will be coming out in the next week or so.

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996 Production #s (not sure if this includes GT3 & TT) 1997: 14 1998: 9248 1999: 28,040 2000: 20,979 2001: 27,275 2002: 33,013 2003: 29,536 2004: 23,145 2005: 4012 Total: 175,262 5% would be about 8,750 Do we think there have been 8000 IMS failures on 996 cars? - Bill

This is how I look at the IMS issue. Lets say there was a 4% chance that your new oven was going to start on fire and burn your house down, but if a certified technician could look at the part responsible for that 4%, and replace it if needed, wouldn't you do it? Its really that simple. The only way to tell if an IMS bearing is bad is to take it out and inspect it. Then if its bad, replace it with the better bearing. If it turns out it isn't bad, then you still have a better bearing than you started with and can also sleep at night. Not rocket science just common sense.

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I'd agree that it would be simple if it were not for the "better bearing" being a service item that requires inspection/replacement at the 40k to 50k range. I have the "better bearing" sitting at the dealer - considering I have 75K on the original, clean oil analysis at every oil change, and asking myself why I am replacing a good part that in my case obviously has a longer service life? And will I end up replacing it and all the other "while you are in there" stuff every 3 years? I think it was posted that LNE sold 7,000 bearings, not a lot of data on how many miles folks have on them, people sleep better at night because they believe the better bearing eliminates the risk - time will tell. Even Jake avoided answering the question of the expected life of the LNE bearing. I know I will have it installed because hell I would be fool not to, while I am in there for a clutch at some point in the near future.

I hardly think likening your IMS failure risk to your house burning down is a reasonable analogy. ApexComp said it well, 5% of 996's are 8,750, now add in 5% of Boxters and early 997's you have to be in the region of 20,000 units. 900 dealers worldwide would be 22 blown engines per dealer, it just doesn't add up, if there were that many we would all know about it and know of numerous owners with a failure

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You are not making any sense at all. If you are replacing the bearing anyways than, that's not the same as the technician inspecting your over. Its him inspecti g the oven and then regardless of the inspection, you replace it anyways.

I didn't avoid the question concerning bearing life.. The dual row units are good forever, single rows not so much because the bearing is 1/2 the size of the dual row. We can safely say the single row is simply too light duty. I don't like projections and since we haven't seen any single rows really "wear out" it'll take more years to know. The key is throwing the factory design away.

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Hi Jake, When I rebuilded my engine, I took better look at the ims-tube. From what I found on it, I thought that the oil was allso coming from the oilpump driveshaft spline? The oilpump end of the ims-tube is pressure lubed, and if there is a cavity from driveshaft to ims-tube, oil will slowly fill it. Sure, when the ims-bearing is submerged in oil, it will slowly get filled. Oh, and for your new project, can you install this new part with out taking the engine apart?

If you cut an IMS tube in half for a cross section you'd see that the oil can't make it's way into the tube from the pathway that you describe without modifications being made to allow it. The IMS Solution installs as a retrofit that does not require engine disassembly. The installation of the unit is very similar to the current retrofit bearing. There is one additional step, but it takes 10 extra minutes to carry out.

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I just had the LN dual row bearing installed on my 2000 996. From your statement, I assume that I am good for life on my old beauty?

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We can safely say thats one less thing you have to worry about. Now, go change that damn water pump.

Thank's Jake, I have 25k km's on your retrofit bearing, so might consider changing to this new product when it's available.

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Its only going to be available for the single row bearing, more than likely. I doubt it will see release to the general public through at least the end of 2014 as we will only be installing them here at our facility, initially. We are also going to be very careful about training installers of this unit.

Ok, I have the dualrow bearing. So this is not for me

Lets say 1% of IMS go bad. Just 1% but you have no way of telling if it is your car till its to late. There is a great chance it will never happen to you. I did the upgrade dualrow and dont worry about it at all. Yes Jake I took your list of preventive items to the dealer and we did almost all of them including the water pump. I am glad Jake did the work he did to help develope the IMS update and I hope he makes alot of money for his efforts.

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I cannot argue with the last point of course. That said, I have two questions if you please: 1.On the LN website they say the single row is 2/3 the load rating of the double row. You say it is half. Which is correct? 2.Also on the LN website they say they have had 5 failures of the single row ceramic bearing, but they do not say how many of the single row bearing have been placed in service. Can you please give more meaningful numbers? It would be nice to know how serious the failure rate of the single row bearing is, and whether those of us running the LN single row bearing are living with false security (I have 11K mi on mine). It would seem to me that if the failure rate of the steel bearing is something <5% and the LN bearing is much better (being open to oil, and made of ceramic) that the failure rate should be much, much lower. What I am getting at, is your development of the Solution because you are dedicated to reducing the failures to zero (most admirable BTW), or because the ceramic single row are failing almost as frequently as the steel bearing? (sorry that's 3 questions )

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But what if that part on your oven cost $50,000 to install. Would you do it? For me to replace the IMS when I don't need a new clutch, the cost is about 10% of the value of the car. Not a good investment to spend 10% to eliminate an event that is 4% likely to happen (allegedly). $700 when a tech is already in there? A better investment, surely.

How about a 1% chance of someone running into you and totalling your car after you get the IMS retrofit done. Point is there are many risks in life and life's too short to be worrying about stuff. If you're the worrying kind, get it done and sleep at night and be done with it. If not then go on with your life and worry about other things. As I've said before, this is highly personalized decision and I don't think anyone should be preaching or condemning someone for getting it done or not getting it done. To be fair, Jake didn't create the fear first and then develop his product. Fear was created by Porsche and Jake took the opportunity to minimize it and make owners feel they can rely upon and enjoy their Porsches long term. Unfortunately the long term results will have to wait to see how successful this is.

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I disagree with this. While I admire the work that Jake does, and appreciate that somebody is out there innovating for our benefit, he is out there front-and-center pitching fear. Who else is taking out full page ads calling the M96 engine a ticking time bomb? Nobody has done more to stoke the fear of IMS failure than Jake. Porsche, for their part, has done a really poor job diffusing the fear with available facts (and Jake should thank them for that). It would be really interesting to know what the failure rate is. But, consider that there are likely more than 400,000 M96/97 engines in the wild. Do we think there have been (or will be) 20,000 failures (5%)? 4,000 failures (1%)? At this point, probably Porsche doesn't even know (b/c cars are almost all off warranty).

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We are only 12 years into the game! Do you think the failure % will go up 10 years from now? 20years from now? Jake & LNengineering have supplied 100% of the relevent IMSB knowledge for FREE I am gratefull for their efforts.

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Please read what I said carefully. I said he didn't "create" the fear. I agree with you 100% that he is promoting the fear but he does have a business to run and a lot of time/effort/$ invested in this product. Capitalism and marketing at it's best...

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As someone who was blissfully unaware of ims issues before being a member here, it is at least good to know that a solution of some kind exists should I need it. Regardless of arguments about failure rates of 996 engines, the reality is already reflected in the depressed resale values. Porsche could have managed this much better. I do agree with others who have posted that their interest lies in selling new cars not maintaining 2nd or 3rd owners. Still love the car, just sucks to be caught up in this issue.

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In defense of Porsche, all engines are going to fail, it's just a question of when. Interesting question. I guess the "fear" comes not so much from the design (which could be better), but from the expense of the solution. If Porsche offered replacement engines for $1,000 as a goodwill gesture, nobody would be afraid of anything, right? I think my perspective would be that Jake's marketing approach represents capitalism at its worst. I'll argue (for a moment, and I'm not sure I believe my own argument) that his fearmongering has done more economic damage to the owners of M96 engines (in terms of depressed market values) than he has good in "saving" engines. Let's figure, for a moment, that his fear campaign has knocked $1,000 off the fair market value of every M96 equipped car. That's something like $400 million dollars in economic damages. He'd have to "save" 20,000+ owners for us, as a group, to come out positive. All this said, I am grateful to Jake and his team for working on solutions. I'll probably send my car his way when it's time to do the clutch (hopefully not before...), because I respect his passion, the work he does and the information that he shares with us. But whether he is a net economic positive or negative force on the M96 owners community, I'm not sure.

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I was being somewhat sarcastic when I said capitalism and marketing at it's best. I echo your last statement about his passion and wealth of information he shared with us, however it's a double edged sword I feel. If he hasn't shared the info to the degree he has, his products might've not reached as many people and might've not sold as much so it would've been in HIS best interest to get the word out. On the flipside, if he kept quiet about his product or no one knew about them, the people that really needed them(either for repair or worry issues) would've suffered. Bottom line is he didn't manufacture the problem(Porsche did through their faulty design). He did however make efforts to try to re-engineer a flaw in the M96 engine for the Porsche community and for that, we should at least applaud his efforts in taking the time and effort to do so(no one else bothered to at the time). The questionable part for some people seem to be what started out as pure objective info sharing on his part has manifested itself into a more fear marketing campaign as of late. Maybe he's both a good engineer and salesman? Dunno... But if you create or promote enough fear, you can practically sell anything(and at any price). Remember Y2K survival packs and Y2K computer glitches? The amounts spent on both were pretty staggering. Costco is even selling survivial packs in anticipation for the Mayan 2012 end of calendar day. This is all probably great entertainment and read for Jake.

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Thank you alpine, it has been one of those days where I REALLY needed a good laugh... P.S. I am not trying to poke fun at you but my thank you is very sincere.

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For me at least, I have found that reading the RL 996 forum in the past year or two is inversely proportional to my enjoyment of my 996. However, certain other RL forums are very entertaining...

I like reading this stuff. Do I need therapy?

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I think we all need therapy since we bought 996's.

this has been one of the most entertaining threads on here lately, with some good balanced arguments that hopefully will give some comfort to potential owners. 996's are great cars, designed to be driven, and generally dont explode at the % rate that is often mentioned on the internet. Got mine back after 2 weeks in shop (not having the IMS replaced), I have 3-4 weeks left before the weather turns and I am going to drive it as much as possible, love this car

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+1, and Jake thanks for all the info which made my decision to replace IMS and water pump very easy.

My 996 "IS" my therapy

I bought my 996 for what I condsider a very reasonable price for a great sports car, so putting a little extra in for the LN IMS when changing my clutch was a no big deal. ^^^ MIamiC70 +1 on my therapy every time I hit the throttle.