re: porsche crest on headrest as an option on such an expensive car!

i know this is probably silly but the fact that an embossed design on the headrest costs extra bothers me. the embossed design must cost almost nothing--i bugs me that porsche ag tries to profit from an item that should be standard. same thing goes for colored center caps for wheels and floor mats. in the name of customization we all routinely get ripped for extras that should be standard! i was pleased that the c4s had far fewer options than the c2 because this gives us more bang for the buck! just my 2 cent worth! <img src="graemlins/soapbox.gif" border="0" alt="[soapbox]" /> <img src="graemlins/cussing.gif" border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" /> am i missing something? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

I agree. Welcome to Porsche.

"Welcome to Porsche" ...or BMW, or Mercedes Benz, .... Ken

You want options my friend ordered a Mercedes C320 which base price is around 38K. With options it totalled 54K not including tax. He coulda gotten a C32 for that amount. The floor mat thing should be standard and other things as well. Regards. Mike

You think the headrest logo is bad, I cannot believe that you have to pay for foot well lighting. I am also very surprised that they just introduced a glove box.

I have been a Porsche fan for life. However, I too have been dissapointed with their blatant disregard for their customers and I have to respectfully disagree regarding Mercedes. My wife likes Mercedes. We got her a fully loaded E320 two years ago and last month traded it in for a fully loaded ML500. Buying and owning a Mercedes has been a much more enjoyable experience. The treatment we have received by the dealer and Mercedes has been much better than Porsche. (ie. negotiated on price and options, sent us flowers saying thank you, Mercedes merchandise much easier to get. Not to go off on too much of a tangent, but has anyone had a good experience with ordering Porsche merchadise from the catalog? Twice I have been screwed by them. Once ordered $1,000 worth of items for Christmas only to be told just before Christmas they were out of stock. Second time paid $60 for overnight shipping on a shirt that I received a week later.) Any way, that's my two cents. By the way, I still love my 996, just don't think it is a very good value compared to what is offered now-a-days. And another thing, 996FLT6, your friend got hosed. I bought my E320 two years ago when no dealers would not go below MSRP. Fully loaded, out the door, with E430 wheels, I paid $60k.

CLK tyre valve caps cost 20p each. I just had to do it. That is serious bannnnng for buck. hee hee. <img src="graemlins/wave.gif" border="0" alt="[byebye]" />

i have also owned several mercedes and find they offer greater value at the cost of lesser quality control. for example, my 2002 c32 amg threw a connecting rod at 9100 miles and needed an engine replacement. this was the car i traded in for the c4s. i am a bit concerned by reports of similiar catastrophic engine and transmission failures in 2002 996's but at 6000 mi i have had no problems of any sort. i would be interested in hearing whether 996 owners on this board would have been willing to accept a smaller number of options in exchange for a lower price. mercedes usally fits all available options on one page. porsche has about 30 pages of options for the c2 996!! i think this is excessive but i'm curious to see if this puts me in the minority. i do love my c4s. best car i've ever owned with terrific fit and finish as well as incredible handling characteristics. i wouldn't trade it for anything but i would have liked to have paid less money for it!

Engineering Artistic Expressions cost money, lots and LOTS of money...

[quote]Originally posted by ignacio: <strong>i do love my c4s. best car i've ever owned with terrific fit and finish as well as incredible handling characteristics. i wouldn't trade it for anything but i would have liked to have paid less money for it! </strong><hr></blockquote>Ditto. It's a great car but I do think it's a bit overpriced. I.e., I think for around $80+k I should be a bit more thrilled than I am at the moment.

[quote]Originally posted by wwest: <strong>Engineering Artistic Expressions cost money, lots and LOTS of money...</strong><hr></blockquote> They tried to make it NOT look like a boxster. Or is it the other way round. In the same way they tried not to make it look like the Cayenne. Or was that the other way round. Enjoy... <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Porsche options must have the highest profit margins in the automobile industry, which is saying something given the high margin to begin with on the Carreras. If you want to play, you have to pay. This is especially true with the TT. Footwell lighting takes the prize for the most overpriced option on the planet. I've had a couple of MB's in the last three years and expect an SL 500 Sport delivery in Dec. Their options are more limited than Porsche's, but are nearly as expensive, IMO. The SL option packages are limited and one must order some options, such as Xenon headlamps and wood/leather steering wheel, separately, unlike the the 02 CL, which includes a number of similar items as standard equipment.

I don't want to be the bad guy in this thread, but I believe any merchant can charge as high a price as the market will allow for their merchandise. In fact, the idea is to bring the price as high as the market will bear. That's capitalism. Thats's the American way. If people will pay $1.00 for a dohickey that costs $.10 to produce, that's a success story. We can say anything we want about the mark-up, but do we really know what it costs to design, market and produce a Porsche? And when I say "a Porsche", I mean a Porsche in all it's meanings. If it were that easy and cheap, some entrepreneur would have figured it out and marketed it. And options are options. You don't really need them. The price you pay includes not just the cost and utility of the thing, but the exclusivity it brings. The head rest crest is the perfect example. Anyway, just my 0.02.

[quote]Originally posted by Palting: <strong>just my 0.02.</strong><hr></blockquote>So how much do I have to pay for your 0.02?

palting i love all porsches and i do not begrudge anyone their profit but i suspect that porsche might sell more cars and make a higher profit still if they dropped the pretense of making a custom built car for each customer thru a series of overpriced and often silly options. offering so many choices must be very expensive, and is, imo, unnecessary. i suspect most of us buy these cars for the handling, engineering, and comfort not for the overpriced options. i think the average buyer would rather have less options and a lower price overall. am i wrong? <img src="graemlins/icon107.gif" border="0" alt="[icon107]" />

You'r probably right, ignacio. I can't speak for the average buyer, but I certainly would be more likely to pay for an item that adds to performance or comfort. On the other hand, I did pay for those crests on the wheels, a totally useless item, when there was already a unique cap that said C4S. But,darn it, I wanted it. I guess that's the reason for the long and expensive list of options. Some people will pay for certain things, others won't.

Its funny that you raise this topic Ignacio. I brought up the same issue, albeit from a slightly different angle, two days ago: Here. Regards.<a href="http://forums.rennlist.com/forums/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=5&t=001345" target="_blank">Same Foglight Question</a>

i have always enjoyed the selection process in choosing the options for a new car but the 996 options booklet just takes the cake for to many options.i doubt any other producer other than true bespoke car makers have more options. choice overload - i get easily confused. have used the pcar configurator on the website but doesnt really let u look at how alot of the options will fit in the car etc...

I think most 996 buyers would gladly pay $4000 more if the car came standard with all the leather stuff that individually cost nearly $10,000 . By economies of scale, simplification of assembly , significantly decreased hassle factor for buyer/dealer when ordering , PAG 's total 996 profit would be maintained or increased , since all car's would have full leather instead of a small percentage. Without many of these items, the base interior is pretty plasticky for a $80-$100K car.

Just thought I'd weigh in on this topic. At the risk of sounding two faced, I must admit that I really like the opportunity to "personalize" my Porsche and make it something that no one else has. This is particularly true in sunny SoCal where there are very many P-cars! That said, I also found the options and option packages that are available confusing. You can get some options, you can't get others on the C4S. I was even somewhat confused about what exactly comes standard. Even the dealer was confused about what you could get. Although I like the fact that there are many options, Porsche might consider providing better examples of what options are what and what exactly do they mean by the various trim parts that are available with Design versus Advanced Design packages. Clarification not simplification would be my preference. <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />

Ignacio was right on target 10 years ago, and his words still ring true today.

Thanks for bringing it up.

Are you just realizing this? Porsches have always been built a la carte and your general criticism has been heard and voiced around the world countless times. In actuality though the base cars come equipped comparable to the competition. What other company embosses a logo in the headrests of their base cars for free? It may not seem fair but as others have said it's a part of capitalism. Unfortunately, the cost of customization really adds up quickly since none of the "extras" come cheap. For what it's worth, I was amazed at how many relatively base cars I came across in my 996 search. I was also surprised at how many original owners bought cars with limited options list but still opted for things like carbon fiber interior trim over things like PCM. -Eric

10 years ago or today... it does not matter. Porsche is in the business to make money. These cars are luxury items, they are not marketing to the" Value for money" crowd. My car has the crests, not that I cared one way or the other

I have the Porsche crests on my seats, too:

Buy used as most of the upgrades you want are included for a fraction of the price!! New Porsche's are bloody expensive used ones are a bloody great deal IMO!! It's the same with buying a Ducati (my other passion) used low mileage, mint condition highly optioned examples are available all over the place. Let some other mug pay for all the options and take the depreciation hit!!

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Bingo!!

Do dealers negotiate on the prices of new Porsches like dealers for almost all other cars do?

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Everything is negotiable.

I am sure they will negotiate for crests on the seats to.

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I do not understand your logic, sir

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I think he is saying that in a way Porsche double dips (or even triple dips): 1) Options are expensive 2) The margin on the 911 is already high 3) Many items that are option on a Porsche are included in other manufacturers base price

Any of you guys buy Dasani water? Product cost: Zero. Price: $1.25- $2.50 for 16 oz...

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I agree... When a child gets a toy doll, its still a doll with or without clothes. It looks much better fully clothed though for the extra cost. Some hair and a hat looks nice I think. Oh and a pair of shoes and socks LOL. We like to dress up our Porche so it looks better than all other Porsches. The options are out there at a price. Rock on all 996 owners