Close to Purchase of first 911, Looking for Guidance for Newbie

Hello there. Just joined Rennlist recently but have been looking and learning from the forums for a while. What a great resource. Finally very close to making a purchase after a long time looking, reading and doing research. Like many on Rennlist, I have wanted a 911 from as far back as I can remember. Here is my situation and was looking for some opinions on making a decision. I am debating between two vehicles being sold by private owners: Car 1 2002 996, aprox 50K, Cabriolet 3 owners, good service records from owner 2 and present owner (owned for 1 year). Clutch/flywheel/engine seals replaced at time of purchase last year, 3K miles ago. NO PSM, Color RED with Black interior and soft top (no hard top). Car 2 2000 996, Approx 42K, cabriolet , with hard top and wind deflector. 4 owners, Extensive service records, Especially from 3rd owner ($10K of work performed at Porsche Dealer). Current owner has had for 1 year and is a PCA member. Cluth replaced at 24K according to records, other work includes mufler replacement last year from present owner. NO PSM, Color Silver, black interior, black soft top and a hard top. Both vehicles I can get for a very similar price and drive very nice and I will be getting a PPI done on whichever one I choose. (I already have a reputable location for this and they saved me from a potentially bad purchase recently) My question: Red is not on my top 3 color choices and not sure if I can get my head around having a red convertible (nothing against anyone who has a red porsche, just dont feel it is my color), but it is a 2002 (MK2, bigger engine (better?)). I like the silver one as it is better looking in my opinion, has a hard top also. Neither has PSM. Also I have seen the same vehicle as Car 2 (same year/options/38K/2 owners) with PSM at a dealer asking a little more, but carfax shows that it has been services at a Porsche dealer all its life. Going to check it out soon. PSM, read it is recommended to have. I am a good driver but not an advanced driver by any means. I know it is designed to help stabalise the vehicle in the event of a dangerous situation and will activate even when it has been switched off, and probably a good thing. But should it be a make or break? So assuming many of you have come across this type of conundrum in your searches, what would you advise? Thanks in advance to any advice you can offer.

Go with the Newest you can afford! Also if RED is not your favorite color DONT GET IT! just wait and search search search the rite one will come around

get the 02, the hard top--you can get it for around $500. not a big deal

Welcome AckyE. There are lots of Porsches for sale, be picky, choose the color you like and get one with complete records. The power difference is minimal between '00 and '02, someone will chime in with the actual difference. I don't have PSM on my '99 and I haven't driven one with it, but my coupe is a pleasure to drive nonetheless. Good luck in your search, don't be hasty.

+1 Don't settle. If you lool far and wide and are patient you will find your ideal car.

Where are you? This is a nice car. http://www.weissachautohaus.com/cars...B/101206B.html This shop is about $5K over market but they are usually clean cars.

I had a 2000 cab and now own a 2002 cab. The 02 is a bester car all around. The 3.6, headlights, exhaust, inside and outside changes are all great. The red is nce if you don't mind all the attention.

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+1, MK2, C4 Cab, low miles, well optioned, but IMO, the price is still reasonable. A thorough PPI, Carfax, this would make a great first Pcar. Also, it could use some tasteful mods (upgrade front bumper, Aero skirts, exhaust). As kent mentioned, hard tops are available for these quite easily ($500-$700).

Red Porsche's are ugly actually I really wasnt thinking red either, and even after I got it I figured it was the right car / wrong color... a year + later I have to say I really like the red....I would buy another one, still not my favorite, but its pretty easy to take care of and looks nice - unlike that "old man grey" the way around the PSM system is a PCA membership and a few days out at a car control clinic with an instructor helping you get the car loose you you learn what to do....(notice I said CCC - NOT DE!) too bad the clutch was replaced and ont the "you know what" but then again if you opt to do that you wont be out any other parts $ I am not as big a fan of the MKII's as some, the bigger motor is only noticable if you already get 10:10 out of the smaller one and most dont. I like certain things on the MKI's better than the MKII's but maybe thats because I had one and it reminds me of "good times"

Logic says newer is better. My heart goes with the '00. I had a silver cab for 7 years, never tired of the color and always looked clean. Much perfer the mechanical cable throttle to the electronic on '01 up. Love the original GT1 headlights too. Hardtop is not a deal breaker, you can find them for <$500. I would sit in and drive both. Check out the details and wear of the interiors, look in the front trunk, at the battery tray, tool kits, spare, etc. Also get them on a lift and look underneath. Are both clean, dry, free of rust and corrosion? After doing this, think it over a couple of days. It will come to you.

I agree with Tarek -- if red isn't your color, don't get it. It's nice that they have good service records -- that's something I didn't think about until after I'd bought it (it's not an issue now, but leaves me in the dark about what's been done, and won't help at resale time). The prices seem high to me -- I see quite a few early 997 cabs in the $40-$55k range, which is 4 to 8 years newer than the ones you're looking at. That 2002 C4 Cab from Weissach that Chao pointed to seems like a nice car at a far more attractive price. For a daily driver, I think PSM is really nice. Even more so if you plan on driving it year round (remember to budget for winter tires). I wouldn't think it was make or break for most people. If I was going to let my new-driver kids drive it a lot I'd feel differently.

If red is not on top of list don't do it only because is cheaper. Having records is good to have. PSM + 1 Be patient and keep looking. I know you are very excited to buy one but take some time or go with gut feeling. I have bought my cars using gut feeling (and of course use your brain)

Agree you shouldn't get a color you don't like. Be patient and the right one will come on the market. Also, get the newest one you can afford. Mk2 has some desirable improvements IMO.

My two cents, I have both year cars, one hard top one soft. I don't know where you live (weather related) but I doubt you'll ever use the hard top if you are in a warm to temperate climate. As stated above favor the newer car, but let the PPI do the talking. PSM is no big deal, helpful in the wet if needed but you can always slow down. I like P Cars in all colors, I've had black, white, red, they all rock. Net you will love to drive which ever one you get

Thank you guys so much for sharing your wisdom. Can't believe I have had so many responses since I posted this last night! BTW, I am in Chicago. I should update my information. Just learning my way around the forum as a member. So woke up this morning and have been in two minds still. After reading your replies I am still stuck. - Kind of leaning towards the red for the later model (get the newest one you can afford). - Also, the hard top does not really make a difference as I will not be doing winter driving (hopefully not) - Really feel strongly about buying closer to home than expanding my search far and wide. That I may leave for my next purchase, once I have some more experience under my belt and I am sure fellow Rennlister's will guide me to the right places to get PPI etc. -PSM Feel better that its not going to be a deal killer. And yes I can always join PCA (already got my application waiting ) and take some CCC lesons. -The car Chao shows advertised, yes it is nice, and exactly $5k more than it should be. The red is similar, but C2. - Either way, got my PPI guys, Midweest Eurosport, who have been extremely helpful and saved me from a rusty, rim bent, panel replaced overspray job of a 911 I took there as a somewhat novice in the game. - Got a Benz dealer with a 2000 39K, asking $30k, same as the silver I looked at , but carfax shows always serviced at a P Dealer. They have called me 3 times since yesterday. It has PSM!! Lets see if I can get the link correctly in this thread. Any suggestions on negotiating the pricing if this one is a must have? http://www.mercedesbenzofwestmont.co...st&PhotoType=1 BTW, my wife says just make a decision and stop talking about it!! She is all for me getting it and enjoying life. Little does she know how addictive this is and once I start looking at mods, watch out!!! Thanks again guys. One day, maybe I will share some of my knowledge with a novice.

I recently purchased a 2003 C4 Cab ($29.5k, 36,000miles). This looks like a nice car but if everything checks out I would be starting the negotiation in the 24,000 range.

Also recently purchased an 03 C4S; dealer price is clearly higher, but if you're willing to pay it and it's the exact car you want, then go for it. As you've already heard, there are too many cars to settle on something you don't like (year, color, etc), and it very quickly becomes a part of you, so make it a reflection of who you are.

Don't let your wife talk to mine. She was all for it until she realized how much time I was going to spend in the garage tinkering with it. LOL! When I was shopping, I found that NADA was spot on with regard to pricing. Especially with the dealers. I would check the NADA wholesale. That will tell you within a couple of hundred what that dealer has in it if they took it on trade. If they got it at auction they probably paid less. Negotiate for the mid point between NADA wholesale and retail and you will have a good deal.

So went to the dealer at 5 PM yesterday to see the 200 911 from my last post. Met with the salesman who took me out for a drive. I noticed some curb rash on the wheels, (my investigation tells me about $200 a wheel to get fixed), otherwise some scratches on the silver/aluminum interior panels. Drove fine from what I could tell, but no history was available. With my inexperience, I may be missing some key areas but that's what the PPI is for. They are trying to get records for me from the P Dealer across the road where it seems to have been regularly serviced. I did notice an upgraded sound system controls, which seemed cool, although have not done any research on this. Dealer wanted me to commit to something, I said get the records, then we can chat about price and if that works out, then we can do the PPI based on the agreement...but I understand they are there to do business. He gave me the "What can I do to get u to buy?, I said slash the price by 50% and I'll take it as is". I hope he know I was joking...did not get a response from him Then chatted again to the owner of the Red 02. Still trying to get my head around the red, don;t know if I can do it still......Decisions, decisions... OK, so I did another search and thought, well if I am looking at a MK1, regardless of year, why don't I check out a few 99s. In then end, I should buy something I am totally comfortable with, and I have seen some impressive 99s here on RL. I may save a few $$ and keep it for any future upgrades or mods. And maybe I'll score something with a good history and well cared for by the PO. I did like Peter 642's comment about " it very quickly becomes a part of you, so make it a reflection of who you are. ". Good thing to keep in mind. I also checked out NADA values. Thanks, this does give me some more to consider. The search continues..

Definitely, go with at least an 02 or newer. Lots of features added in that year.

When i was searching for mine in september and october i literally couldn't sleep or function, all i could thing about was Porsche..lol..i even flew to LA once on a whim to look at one and wasted $500 on that stupid trip! i was going nuts... Someone said "Think of how many people get to complain about shopping for a Porsche" lol..so true.. a month later i found the one i wanted COLOR is so important YOU HAVE TO GET THE COLOR YOU WANT EXTERIOR & INTERIOR or you will never feel the "love" Records you gotta have them- serious PPI- Negotiate Negotiate Negotiate

babylonboots: I do feel the 02 plus is my best bet, but I wont miss what I never had, so being the first 911, even with a Mk1, I think I will be in heaven regardless. Takek: I am glad u understand what I am going through, as I am sure may Porsche owners have been through this. I am breathing Porsche for the last few months. Records, that's going to be something I will be a stickler for, no doubt. As for color, yes, I will definitely most of them, Red just does not seem to do it for me. Thanks again to all for the support. Hopefully I can post some pics real soon.

sounds like your approach is pretty good... I love the "what can I do to get you to buy the car right now" line let's see, a full PPI from an INDEPENDANT place other than yours... fix everything that comes up on the PPI, offer me a CPO and lower the price.... oh and free tires for life.... that would do it for me

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Ferraris are RED, Lambos are YELLOW Porsches are SILVER

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Hey wait a minute, I resemble that remark...

get the vin, and call suncoast to get the options on the car.... that will give you an idea what the car has. GL, it seems like you know what youre getting into, just be patient.... its a good problem to have.

Here is a decoder.. http://www.autoatlanta.com/life/vin/vin.php?

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I agree MKII cabs are prettier than MK1s. OEM Aerokit is a different matter..

I love my MkII cab, but I am bias . Black is hard to keep clean, but dam it looks good when it is.

The silver ones have more engine problems.

hey, chicks dig the red.... so I hear, I have never experienced it

If you buy a red car people will confuse you as having a ferrari... Once my wife told me some guy asked my wife if our black boxster was a ferrari

Silver ones have more engine problems! Some of you guys are nuts! I think I will fit right in So almost through the weekend. I did make an offer on the red one on Friday, although I was a bit embarrassed to say it at the time. He wanted to hold out for a little more. And to think of it, it was a halfhearted offer. After having slept on it, seeing more encouragement here and having had a chat with the wife, I am glad we did not settle on it. Its an 02, I keep saying!!! I had better get off here. Its Mother's Day and I kind of promised I would not visit the forum today. Ill keep u updated on what happens next. Oh, the dealer did not call me yesterday, although I though he might. Well he had no service records to produce.....still waiting for it from his "friend" at the P Dealer. Not going to rush it, I promise. Really, I'm not!!

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If I may, if you want to not miss what you don't have, don't read any more posts in this group! Pumpkins, ashtray deletives, cubby holes, and (alas) glove boxes... Not to mention Fister D, upgraded suspension, aerokits... Too much. I must get out and drive. Left Hand canyon is calling... To the hills I must go.

A little background may be needed: If you read all of the various engine failure threads ( I won't mention any specific component) you'll see that they are full of speculation based on hearsay, and anecdotal evidence. One of the people who probably has the best experience in this area made the observation about silver cars. Of course this is due to the fact that silver is a popular color, if not the most popular color, so it follows that he would see more silver cars with problems.

OK, Guys, Im almost there. Looking at two potentials: Both same year/model etc. 2000 Silver, cabrio, hard top etc. About 40K on each. One is dealer one is private. Dealer says he has records from 1800 miles , Porsche Dealer serviced, but I could not read it when he faxed it to me. Private also has many records. Thinking of throwing out a price to the dealer, he has quoted me his lowest price already, a few grand more that I would pay for the private one. If he can match private deal, I would be inclined to go with him. Worth a shot, I think.

its all in the options.... its under the frunk.

Hello again. Thank you all for your advise and support. Have not posted for a few days as I have been trying to figure out what I am doing. So here's an update. I am the proud owner of a 1999 911 cabriolet!! Its blue with gray interior. 66K on the clock. Basically here is what happened: - Called the guy Monday, he said it was sold. Called again and said I would like to see it in case of the buyer backing out. He called me , buyer backed out, someone else was coming to see it Monday night. How about Tuesday? Was a little disappointed but said OK, no problem. Tuesday he called me and said the guy last night messed him around and did not leave any deposit etc. So I played it smart and took a cashiers check for a deposit. Money talks. -Tuesday went to see the car. Liked it, liked what I heard, but seller was not up for getting a PPI from my guy. He was OK if I went to a place closer to him. The seller travels a lot for work so was anxious to sell. I DID NOT GET A PPI!! Here's my reasoning. Seller had receipts for work done one the car from a reputable Indy (Just had IMS done a month ago!! BINGO!!). Apparently that was not the issue when he had taken it to the INDY so ended up taking it to P Dealer who diagnosed an issue with coil pack that was arcing (sp?) and a check engine light. Also had receipts for a new cabriolet top last year as well as clutch replacement last year. I thought that if the P Dealer had found any issues, he probably would have had them fixed. -Anyway, agreed a price (went back and forth) and gave a deposit. Yesterday picked it up. Its mine now!! -I am in heaven, just love to look at it in the garage. - Temp plates on, insurance is good to go, wife is happy. Wooo Hooo!!! - Moral of the story: Wait, be patient (I talked about getting one of these for 15 years!), research everything. Get a PPI! Although I did not get one, I will be taking it to Midwest Eurosport for a thorough inspection so I know what I am getting into. I hope all will be well. I trust my instinct. And if there is anything wrong, well, u know I will let u guys know! Here is a basic pic. U think I should post more here or a new thread to show off my ride? Off to the PCA Porsche show in Bolingbrook to meet my future Chicago Porsche family!

Congrats! Harvest your pumpkins and drop that thing! Enjoy!!!

congrats... we have some mods in store for you.

Congrats! Neither; stop typing and go drive it.

Yes Sir!! Hoping the rain holds off so I can get out on the road. Thanks guys.

Congrats on the new acquisition! She looks great!

Glad you got the Porsche you wanted, looks nice. Enjoy!

Final Update: As I did not get a PPI prior to purchase, I ended up getting it after the fact. Everything checked out. Only issue they found were cracked ignition coils. These were cracked where they get bolted in. Although there are no signs of misfiring. And I got the oil change, they added a magnetic bolt for the oil pan, clever idea I think. I have now got a few projects to do: -60K service (oil change was done with inspection, serpentine belt was done by PO). They asked $800 (yikes!) to complete the rest of the 60K service, which is mainly inspection (I assume most of this was done at the PPI anyway) and I believe fuel filter change and plugs. I have investigated the process for changing the plugs/coils and am considering doing it myself. Any suggestions? I am fairly competent, I like to think - Rear WallReplacement: This is cracked up pretty bad and I have read its an easy fix. I just washed the car yesterday for the first time. Man, this is one sexy car! It has curves like no other. Did not feel like a chore at all! I love the way it shines in the sun. Pic is from my phone, excuse the quality.

That's a shinny car

Nice light weight MKII rims....

she cleans up pretty good.... enjoy!