New 996, been sitting for 5 years!

Hey all - I just picked up a non - running 2000 996 for the price of a roller that has been sitting for 5 years, seller says "electrical problem" but I believe barely anything I read on the internet. Wanted to start here, just signed up for the forum after lurking for a few weeks. Car is a 6 speed, 130k miles. Clean carfax and a lot of service records. I bought it and had it flatbedded to my house. I have only had about an hour or two with it so far so I gave it a bath to make it easier to get to everything. So far: 1. Frayed wires in the back relay panel - I soldered them up so the connections are nice and clean. No water or evidence of water in the car 2. Engine turns over by hand just fine. 3. Oil looks and smells fine, filled to proper level 4. Put a brand new battery in, fully charged and car cranks over but very slowly. Going to go over all connections 5. Going to pull the plugs and check for spark tonight. 6. Have a Durametric cable on order. Anyone have any suggestions on things to look for to chase down this no start condition? Obviously IMS is a concern with any 996, if the IMS went would the engine still turn over? Once running, I will obviously perform a full tip to tip tune up (car needs tires too) but want to verify it runs before spending any more money on it. Thanks all!

If you ever want to sell those wheels, have the Russians reach out to my people. I'll take the meeting. Pretty car for roller pricing - good luck sorting it out btw - Pelican Parts has some detail on no-start troubleshooting. Check spark, compression, fuel delivery, etc. I'm a gumby in that area but there's a lot of content available. AutoAtlanta has diagrams of every system in the 996, so don't be shy about checking out their site. Pelican has a lot of parts as well as Suncoast & others.

Thanks Tony - I found Pelican over the weekend, great site. And yea, the BBS forged 19's were a nice surprise, car was caked in a lot of baked on dirt/dust so it was hard to see what kind of wheels were on the car. I'm going to sort the electrical first, get a proper crank going and then drain the tank and replace the fuel pump and filter.

Beautiful car! Flush ALL fluids.

If you want to part with the wheels let me know

Check ground cables and power cables.... At a minimum, do a voltage drop test, alternator + terminal to starter lug as well as the voltage difference when using battery - terminal vs. engine block. Good chance you have a high resistance cable in there somewhere. If you search you'll find threads, bad ground cables in particular are a known 996 issue.

...also, when you pull the plugs, carefully inspect the coil packs for fine cracks. Another very common problem, but not super likely to cause a no-start. Will cause misfires though.

...it could also be as simple as a bad (binding) starter. If you have a current meter check how much current the starter is pulling when it's cranking over slowly.

I can't help. But I have a dream one day to do what you are doing. Keep posting your progress with lots of pics. Good luck.

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^^This^^

Yes, it's the "Y" cable. Very similar symptoms.

id replace the alt, and starter while you're in there.

Thanks guys lots of good info in here. I just did some minor work last night. Found a few more frayed cables. Been really working on getting everything cleaned up and fixing any glaring issues. Will put some time into the starter, battery, cables etc tonight and do a voltage drop test. Will report back with findings. Wheels - Ive had a lot of people comment on the wheels both here and in person. Even a neighbor. They are forged BBS 19". What are they worth approximately? I'd consider a sale or swap for the right set.

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I am also here if you ever need anything so please don't hesitate to shoot me a PM.

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I would love those wheels. I have 2 sets of 18" turbo twists I'd be willing to trade ya. I'm in Canada though, so it would be a PITA to ship, etc.

I am rummaging through the paperwork and it looks like the wheel and tire combo was $6100 installed. That would be more than I paid for the car. They look like RS GT's to me but I'll take a closer look tonight or tomorrow. More than likely I'll run them but I'd consider a trade for the right set.

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Thanks! Love your site, read 15+ articles already. I'm guessing I'll need some parts, how long does shipping typically take to NJ?

Best of luck with the project! Keep us posted.

Great find! Good luck with your adventure! PS keep us updated!!!

UPDATE - and not a good one So I got the car cranking over a little harder and its making some awful noises. I drained the oil and it has a lot of metal in it. Put a scope through the spark plug hole in 2 cylinders and the walls are scored badly. Basically the engine is toast. I'm not sure if the IMS let go or something else but this engine won't run with the scored walls. So - what are my options going forward? I don't want to rebuild the current block, I am not sure I know enough about these motors to try it. Used motor? Reman? Swap in something different?

Sorry to hear that. Cheapest and easiest it to grab one of the used engines off of this site there are two low mileage ones listed at $6,500 now. Re manufactured engine can run you anywhere from $10,000-$20,000. Something different renegade hybrids offers an LS swap kit for the 996. Not cheap but would be a unique and fun car once its done.

Dang, that sucks. So much for the "electrical problem" the seller mentioned. Hopefully if you paid roller price for it you can sell it for not much of a loss now. Or, as nckwrnr said, grab a used engine! Good luck.

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That sucks, sorry you won the reverse 996 lotto. Lots of options none of which are cheap, here are a few: 1/ fleabay engine, cheapish but risk you end up right back here again 2/ renegade V8, more work and more $ than (1) not original engine but more power and V8 if you like that 3/ F6I or equivalent, expensive, reliable and likely more powerful (most opt for adding cc's) 4/ boxster motor, cheapest but still a risk and you'll have less power 5/ some other kind of reman. engine, some risk you end up back here and more expensive than (1)

Sell it as a roller and start over...

Yes....I would consider just selling it or parting it out. That's a real bummer.

Part it out. I'd buy the motor.

The only option I'd even consider on a grenaded older 996 without any particular sentimental value is buying a decent used motor and installing it yourself. Even that is a hell of a lot of work and a fair amount of $ to get something that is a commodity car, easy to find a nice running example for about the same money as you'll have into yours, and one hell of a lot less work than swapping engines yourself. Sorry it isn't better news... What did you pay for the roller?

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..

You could probably part it out for more than you paid.

Ok. Here is what I would do. Again, not my money. Option 1 - Buy eBay motor with a 60 day warranty. As soon as you get it drop the pan and scope the cylinders looking for any damage. Any damage and you are just out shipping. Then put on new IMS, water pump, AOS, plugs and anything else easy to get to. Put in car and drive Option 2 - buy $500 Porsche 17 inch wheels, put on car, sell as roller for $6000 and then sell the wheels separately for a few grand. Option 3 - call me and let me know what you paid for it and I'll give you your money back and take it off your hands

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Price an MB motorsports engine out. They are one of the best deals going with a good rep for quality. Regardless of what you read on here (his politics are frowned upon) his engines are fine. A couple local ones here running around trouble free.

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This isn't a bad price for a rebuilt motor, they will re-sleeve to fix your scored bores and use JE pistons: At $8500 plus the $5000 you spent you'll have a $13500 911 with a 'new' motor, that's pretty good in my book! https://www.vertexauto.com/porsche-r...1-p-12048.aspx

I'm into the car for $6000 and then shipping fees, new battery etc probably close to $7000 for a round number. I hate parting cars out it's a pain and bad moto karma IMO. I love the idea of that Vertex motor are they good quality products? For only a bit more than a used engine. Lots of great suggestions here keep them coming I'll check in tomorrow after I sleep on it!

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that's if the core he sends in is good.

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Actually after reading around on those steel lined m96 motors I'm not so sure, you may want to research yourself a bunch.

Please go here https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...l#post14334932 and ad yourself to the poll.

Your cheapest option is likely to sell and get one that runs. http://stonegateautosales.com/?vehic...tuses=for-sale I've never dealt with these guys, but I recall they buy rollers and sell cars repaired by Flat Six. No coupes, but they have a cab in stock for $16.5

I would get a dozen of these? https://www.vertexauto.com/porsche-9...4-p-12049.aspx

So these engines look easy to drop. My problem is that I have an existing no start condition which may or may not just be the engine. Keep in mind the car has been sitting for years. I'm not sure about a used engine. In the muscle car world I could buy a nice long block and build it up for $3k. Here my options look a lot more limited! I'm interested in either biting the bullet and dropping in a new motor or just cutting bait and moving on. Any decent tutorials on dropping these motors? Anything else to look for/do/fix during the swap? By the way, ive swapped motors in the past but only American V8s so this would be my first flat 6.

My IMS went south and bought Vertex reman engine. No complaints 16 months and counting... Good luck whatever direction you choose.

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From what I understand a lot of people have said its not bad to drop the motor in these cars, depends on your garage space etc and tools available. I dropped my tranny using basic jacks/jackstands and it was a little hairy in my crappy old open garage but I did it. Some kind of decent car lift would make things MUCH easier.

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Interesting, how many miles on it etc? really mixed reviews of m96's with steel liners online. Maybe a lot of them are just badly put together so they get a bad rep?

Cut bait. LOTS of nice running cars out there....

Is it a 3.4l?? If the cyl heads are ok, I would buy new short block. Have seen those as low as 4500usd, not sure if you can get these that cheap. Autoatlanta has those for 6300usd.

Where to start?!!! The engine drop is the least of your worries - it's a pretty simple, albeit fiddly process. Get the car up at least 25" from the oil pan to the floor (depends also on the height of whatever it is you're going to roll the engine out from under the car on - I used a hydraulic table and a transmission jack - I'm pretty sure the table is a bout 4-5" high itself). It seems that parts for these cars add up in increments of thousands fairly quickly. Research is your friend. If you add up the price for parts and figure in the extra time for DIY labor (the first time you do it will take you much longer to label and document what you're doing - if you don't, the chances of making big/expensive mistakes multiply exponentially) you may decide to have it done by a pro (research them as well). Whatever you decide, I wish you luck and good fortune!

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I'm on top of it

I used this to get my engine out http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/Porsche-996-997-Carrera/15-ENGINE-Engine_Drop/15-ENGINE-Engine_Drop.htm

Thanks for the tips guys. I'm wondering now if the ancillary costs will make this a cost prohibitive project. I could get the rebuilt engine for $9k shipped to my door. But then I will want to add all new accessories as it goes back together. Starter, alternator etc. And then at the end of the day I have maybe $20k into a 2000 911 with 130k miles. Obviously new motor but I'm not sure its worth the effort and at that point what would it be worth?

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It "might" be worth 20k with a "new"(rebuilt) motor and accessories, but it's a crap-shoot. The real question is - What's it worth to you and how long will you keep it ? In almost all cases, if the answer isn't forever (i.e. no plans to sell, except for unforseen circumstances) it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

If it has 130K, you might just want to sell it as a roller. Or get some really inexpensive wheels, sell the wheels and tires separately and then sell it as a roller. You could easily have $20K into it, and a lot of your blood, sweat and tears. Or you could buy one ready to go today for $20K with less miles. Best of luck. I thought you were really lucky, but it was just too good to be true.

Time is money, how much did you have budgeted for this project in the beginning? You're on a fine line with this one...

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I figured out years ago, most car projects are only 'worth' it, if you get the enjoyment out of it, if you are looking for market value in terms of dollars most car projects aren't worth it. If you fix the car up and enjoy it for years, then you got a helluva car for $20k, if you fix it up and try and sell it you'll probably be disappointed

What do these commonly sell for as a roller? I'm keeping the wheels and swapping with a set of stockers.

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$5-8k... with 130k on it, there's a good chance some of your suspension needs work as well...

if you part out, I'd seriously be interested in the motor.

I think you're going come out even or slightly ahead with your approach. Given how much these cars are worth, the risk of catastrophic failure, and higher running costs, you get underwater on these cars quickly. Only worth it if you willing to pay to play. If I had to do it over again, I'd buy a roller, do a rebuild that addresses the known failure points, and just drive it. I'd probably be in it for $30K (I'm way over that with my current car btw), which is significantly over the value of the car. Couple of questions you have to ask yourself at this point: 1. What else is going to give this kind of experience at $30K? Probably also going to be an older German car. 2. You could cut bait and go buy a $15K runner. Could run forever, or could experience one of the 29 modes of failure and you're in the same predicament as now, except you started at a $15K cost point instead of $7K. 3. You buy something that's already had the failure points addressed (rare) - best bet is Stone Gate Autos - link in earlier post. This is just the 996 NA. Argument could be made for just ponying up a bit extra $ (vs the $30K I mentioned) and getting a turbo, which is supposed be much more reliable. Good luck either way. Suggest you go drive a running 996 if you haven't already, might explain why a lot of us a burning money to keep these running.

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Sent you a PM

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I'm with you here. I paid so little for the car its still a good start for an engine swap. I'm looking into options for motors and can't get over the cost but at least a decent long block from most reputable builders has all major fail points addressed. I'm really wary of a used motor. I don't think people are all that honest and even if they don't think anything is wrong, my first oil change could prove otherwise.

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Understood but this is a hobby for me. I buy cars and bikes and fix them up, keep them or sell them. I'm not doing this to get rich, its a release from my day job which is high stress high hours. Dropping and replacing the motor looks very straightforward, I think I could knock it out in a weekend easily.

Yeah, a weekend and that motor is out for sure.

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If your doing it for the fun or to learn more about 996's, great idea. I think 911's are awesome cars to work on. I've worked on many different cars and trucks and enjoy working on 911's more than any other. But honestly I can't imagine not being upside-down selling the car after fixing it, unless you really cut some corners on replacement parts. New motor and transmission mounts, new AOS, new coils, new coolant expansion tank, new clutch, new shifter cables are common wear/failure parts just off the top of my head that you would want to replace on any high mileage 996 motor swap done right. None of that likely included with a rebuilt engine, a few grand more right there. Add an upgraded IMS bearing, possibly new cats, all new hoses, etc., another few grand. Then the regular stuff you should be looking at on a car with that mileage... Brakes, rotors, shocks, bushings, ignition switch, etc., yet another few grand. On top of the engine, doing all the work yourself, I can't see less than $5K in addition to the engine to really bring an unknown issues-and-high-mileage 996 up to to snuff. Is the interior pristine? Body nearly perfect without any paintwork? Would you want to keep it when your done?

People are so quick to give up on a good project!!!! You have a nice looking car there, with marketable asset in the nice BBS wheels. Good call to swap and use those to defray costs coming your way. I applaud you for taking this on. In your shoes with so little $$ in the car at this point (and assuming a clean title, not salvage) then I'd look at putting a rebuilt engine in there that addresses a majority of the known issues with these engines. I have never heard of this shop or where in the USA you are, but you should look into their ebay ad. Cool that they will install it for you, just make sure you have all the details covered relative to the core charge as that adds $6500 to the fun: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Porsche-996-...lUBh2t&vxp=mtr Granted there might be other things to sort, but if you don't end up needing to pay the core charge then I think you'll be well enough ahead of the game to address other items as well. Regardless of the 130k miles on the odometer, there is considerable value wth these cars in knowing the engine issues have been addressed and powerplant mileage reset. Good luck!

what cars are you guys working on that makes the 911 fun/easy? lol

I appreciate all of the responses guys. Lot of great viewpoints and insight. I have narrowed down my options to either going with the reman engine (with 12 month warranty) or parting/selling as a roller. I don't want to do a rebuild and I don't want to go with a used engine that I have to upgrade and potentially have grenade on me. I wouldn't be doing this to try and make money but I would like the value to remain close to what I have invested. In other words, can I drive it for a year or two and if I want to upgrade to a Turbo for example, can I sell it and get most of my money back? I'm OK losing say $5-8k for the trade off of enjoying the car for a while. My point mainly was I didn't want to invest $25-30k into a car that would be worth $10k when done, just for an exaggerated example.

I think with a reman engine, prices staying flat, you'll probably get $15K-$18K back out of this car when you sell. Assuming you're doing the work yourself - ballpark: Suspension will likely be a $2K to refresh. Clutch flywheel maybe another $2K, say another $2K for odds and ends (coolant tank, power, engine mounts, blah blah). So you'll be in it for $13K before the engine. Add the price of the engine, less the $15K (conservative) sale price - does that land you in the $5 - $8K trade loss? With a reman engine, I'd hope you wouldn't have to replace the IMSB, but add more to the cost if you're planning to get this done.

You said you had around $7k invested with shipping and all. Minus approx $2k for selling the BBS wheels and putting stockers on... So at that point you'll have around $5k at stake. These cars, properly sorted and in good running condition will bring around $17-$23k on the Bring A Trailer site. Standard silver color, manual tranny, remanufatured engine and will make yours likely sell at in the $20k ballpark. Search that site's past sales and see for yourself. The core charge is the x-factor. If you don't have to pay one, I say go for it. If you do, then maybe you should consider selling it as a roller to someone who can do the job more economically and make it work. They will likely make good money on the car. If you haven't already done so, I would suggest test driving a 996 so you know what awaits at the end...

surfing might be the best mechanic in the world, but reselling a 996 with an owner-installed reman engine is NOT going to bring premium pricing on BAT or anywhere else... Heck even the Raby engined, pro-shop installed, pristine and virtually no mile Boxster S they had on BAT a while ago brought next to nothing. Yes, I know 986 vs. 996, but the reality is that most 996 buyers are going to be a bit gun shy on an owner-installed, no-name reman 996 when it comes to resale time. $20K is generous. Personally, I'd take a higher mile, zero issue, IMS bearing replaced FACTORY engined 996 any day over the same car with a reman replacement engine, even at the same price. If Surfer's engine turned out to be good, I'd be encouraging him all the way to rebuild/replace anything and everything else on the car to have a great driver that he could sell down the road for near his investment. But blown 996 engines just flip the equation...

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I'd peg the sale price closer to $20k. I've been all over eBay, Bring A Trailer, plus sites like autotrader. $15k typically gets you an original motor, lots of tiptronics, may or may not have had IMS replaced. The engine is $8500 and everything is done including upgraded IMS and RMS. The car itself owes me $7k and then say $5k in incidentals. Clutch was done 4k miles ago according to Carfax but I'll see when I get to it. Labor I'll do myself. That gets me to $20,500. I am never 100% confident but I'd bet with a couple hours detailing it, all receipts for parts and engine, I'd be able to get close to $20k out of the car within the next 2 years unless the prices drop off like crazy. So if my math isn't too fuzzy (you guys know better than I do), I should be close to even money barring any major issues that I can enjoy for a few years. The flipside to this coin was selling the car off as is and probably getting my money back or making a few bucks and moving on to a different car.

Perhaps you're right and I hope you are. Maybe if you can demonstrate years of trouble free ownership after the engine swap. But I was thinking 130K miles on the chassis + home engine swap would not be in your favor. I hope I'm wrong, and I think you have a great candidate for an engine swap. Even though I enjoy driving the car, there's a niggling fear that some bad is going to happen. To have an engine that I know has failure points addressed, is a nice position to be in. Hence, I'd go roller + rebuild if I could do it over. Good luck either way, sounds like you were pretty smart about the purchase, so a good start nonetheless.

You are being AWFULLY optimistic about your resale price in a few years. $13k-$15k with owner installed motor is about where you will end up. High mileage 997s are already in the low 20k range. And between 996 and 997, 95/100 people will take 997. People have bought very well sorted 996s with full maintenance records and updates for mid to high teens. You will have a VERY high mileage 996 (by 996 standards) with home-swapped motor and a story. http://www.ebay.com/itm/2005-Porsche...RZXAIz&vxp=mtr

Prices are a bit higher on BAT. Low mileage examples are going to 20+. The higher mileage stuff in the mid teens. I think the OP can demonstrate trouble free history after install, it might benefit the price if it does have the major failure points addressed. http://bringatrailer.com/listing/200...911-carrera-3/ http://bringatrailer.com/listing/199...e-911-carrera/ Go drive a 996 before deciding if it's worth the loss or you want to flip. After having driven one for a while, I don't know if I could stomach not having a p-car in the garage. And the 996 is the cheapest way in to the 911. I know it's not the same, but I was bent on getting a Subie WRX STI before I got the 996. I know it's not the same, but with the STI at 305HP & 3400lbs - they should be close on paper. The STI felt like a bloated vague pig vs the 996, and I have a cab!

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All great points, thanks for chiming in - I have that 997 on my eBay watch list!

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This is my issue exactly. So say I buy a nice car for $15k, great maintenance records etc and for whatever reason the engine lets go. Now I'd be $8k+ deeper in the hole.

No one knows what a 996 will be worth in 3 or 4 years...Your car's value will go down as the miles go up! I'm looking at a pristine 99 with less than 40K on the clock for $19K.

You guys are right it's probably not worth the money. Then again, maybe it's not that big of a deal what the car is worth and I'll just do the project to say I swapped an 911 motor. Nice one to add to my list! This is is a great forum - I really appreciate all of the thoughtful and helpful comments so far.

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Another alternative... http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cult...a-engine-swap/

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😂😂😂😂

Like most have said there will be many other unplanned costs that will put you very far into the red. I recently bought a good running car and getting it caught up with maintenance, I am over 7k into the project. The small dumb things add up very fast. Im down to just brakes and suspension left with my "restore" and I can tell you plan for atleast 50% more then you expect it to cost...lol

Ok so my buddy suggested possibly looking at a donor car. Lots of running/driveable on the lot cars out there with accident damage and salvage titles. And they are cheap. Anyone have any thoughts on a donor car? Use what I need, keep some spares, sell off the good parts and my dead engine core and scrap the damaged body. Ive done this before with motorcycles and it usually works out. If you commit to scrap/giveaway the leftovers than the mess is gone quickly and you make back a few bucks.

Id personally be very worried about hitting the unlucky lottery again with the crashed car's motor. How well can you really test out a car with accident damage motor condition? Plus there is still a large list of "stuff" you SHOULD buy for the transplant. New coils, plug tubes, AOS, aux tank, mounts, oil filler, IMS, RMS, water pump, chain tensioners or clutch parts if need, ect ect.. Just cannot see any realistic way it will work out cheaper then taking the small loss selling your roller, and buying a good running/maintained car for 15-20k (or less). And you will be driving it in days instead of months. Just my opinion looking at it from a $$$$$ perspective.

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All great points. Thanks for chiming in!

Not to put you off doing whatever you want to do, but this page full of 911s from the Seattle/Portland CL might at least serve as a reality check with regard to resale values of cars that seem very nice and at or under 90k miles, inc cabs. https://portland.craigslist.org/sear...o_miles=100000

I would definitely sell the motor to AWDGuy or whomever wants the core, swap the wheels for stockers and sell the BBS, then clean up the chassis best I could and try to sell the roller chassis. If that failed then I would part it out. I can never imagine this being worth the hassle to put in another engine with so many running 996s out there.

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I don't understand why not just fix it? If your into it that cheap and can DIY the motor swap etc why not? You will still have a nice 911 under market value by a fair margin. Enjoy it for a while flip it and move on. Personally I would find a cheap set of OEM wheels and sell off the BBS to fund part of a Vertex engine. Remember a good portion of the guys commenting on this form can't turn a wrench fwiw.

https://austin.craigslist.org/pts/d/...213115840.html This one is local to me. Not sure how much they want for it but may solve your block issues as long as you can transfer everything else. I have been down there before and they are very friendly and helpful guys. As an aside, not sure what your time is worth but don't think that you will get out ahead hanging on to this car. If you must do it, do it as a project, love it because it is a project and not because it makes sense. ...and post lots of pics. D.

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What's plan B or C if your donor car engine blows up after you put all that work into it?

Agree with Shaun on the donor car, you just don't know what you're getting. The core charge for the EPS motor is $4K, you might not get that after it's sent to EPS, but that's probably what AWD would have to come up with to make the OP whole. Good luck either way. I think you end of burning some cash on this if you do it, but I think it's worth it and it's under your threshold. When you factor wear items, I don't think there's anyway you come out even (I think you factored it in when you were saying incidentals).

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"Condition: good" LOL, I'd like to see what they call poor condition.

http://www.ladismantler.com/engine-2/ Surprised no one suggested this yet.

I'm debating putting the wheels and car (separately or together) up for sale as is and seeing if I can get what I need for it. Nothing definite yet but if anyone is interested, shoot me a PM or post up here. If I can get close to my number I might let it go and grab a runner. Something to be said for driving next week instead of 2 months from now.

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.... or 2 years

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LOL good point! Though that isn't usually me, I am of the mindset that I need to strike quickly and get it done. When I did my last rebuild (Mustang 302 V8), the time from hatching the idea to driving the car all buttoned back up was about 7 weeks.

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Did you see options 3 on this list? I'd reach out if you are going to bail on the project.

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Sent you a PM

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I am assuming by your username you are in Jersey (LBI)? Might be able to work something out on wheels if you wanted to go that route.

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Good eye - yes, sent you a PM

If you are still considering dropping the engine......this might help.... You Tube

I know where you could get a full engine rebuild for 6k from someone that's rebuilt at least 10 of these engines. Rebuild includes new cylinder liners and IMS retrofit. You would have to ship the engine to California. If you're interested send me a PM. Could be a good option for you to enjoy the car if you're not tracking it. Either do it as cheap as posible or do it right and get an FSI build.

It's what the car is worth to the buyer that counts... Buyers want different things, and the right car will bring much more money than another one. This is why BAT works, because there's a good chance that a couple of guys will want THAT car, and they run the prices up against each other. I've analyzed the way these sales go down, and you can see that in the end 2-3 people go at it hard, and the last 10 minutes of an auction can net 2-3k more money. BAT told me that they are receiving 40+ 996 submissions per week, and they are being very particular about the cars they select. I added a rare WWII Kubelwagen to my collection this week, so I'm contemplating selling some of my pieces on BAT to downsize a bit.

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I think that's fair to say. I just have to decide what I want to do with it and every article I read or build I look at changes my mind. Again I'm into the car for around $7000 so it's not costing me anything to sit on it. I'm just get anxious to drive!

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Stop listening to people. Make your own considerations and do what you want. There's always people who want to tell you what to think, but after you make your own decision you won't be governed by what someone has told you to think. These days when people tell me "I'm going to do my research", what I hear is "I'm going to read a bunch of garbage by people that know less about the issue than I do; but, I am going to believe them anyway". Misinformation about these cars is rampant.

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This. So true. And definitely not only in car world.

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No one is a leader anymore, we are a society of followers. People don't want to take the chance of doing something the way they think is best, and potentially face failure. If someone else doesn't do it, and write about it, or video it, then they don't want to do it...

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so true, everyone likes to think they "think outside the box" but few do, and on top of that if you do you can be sidelined and thought of as odd too many naysayers these days!

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I totally agree. I'm taking everyone's opinion with a grain of salt. For example, I'd bet I'm one of the few people on this forum to have rebuilt and swapped a motor into anything. Besides the pros of course. At the the same time I'm new here and trying to be respectful of what people have to say when they take the time to comment on my thread. Ive gained a lot of insight so far. Honestly my instinct was to rebuild this block that just seems to be such a foreign option in 996 land. I'm used to American V8s of which I can remove, rebuild and replace in a weekend. The idea of a used motor for 7-8k is crazy to me but I guess that's this world for 996s.

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IMO, you're taking a good approach. If you've got the time, read up on a lot of Jake's posts about the M96 engine, especially some of his comments in the various threads where people were rebuilding their engines. I've never rebuilt anything bigger than a couple motorcycles, but I've learned a lot from this forum about how the M96 works. Jake would be the first guy to tell you that you have to make up your own mind (in fact, I think he already did :-) but he's posted a lot of really valuable information along the way. And it's a safe bet the BS gene got left out of his DNA. OK, end of unsolicited Flat Six commercial:-) But seriously, there are some "been there, done that" people who post on here, and you'll figure out pretty quickly who they are. And yeah, when a brand new LS crate motor goes for not much more than getting your M96 block sleeved, it'll for sure make you shake your head.

I must say, your car looks the part...Good Luck with your choices and keep us posted!

I think the main sticking point with OP is whether or not his block is reusable or eligible for a core refund. A no in that category changes the risk and cost profile from what I understand, but this could be a mistaken assumption. Long term, if you like the chassis & car, diving into a project could yield nice dividends.

After I took Jake's class in May I feel a lot more comfortable with the M96. To take advantage of that new knowledge, I bought a roller to try out my new "skills". The car that I wound up with has an intermix issue. The problem could be as simple as a cracked head. Or, the engine could be scrap. I'll know more in a few weeks. Knowing the disassembly, machine work, and rebuild process can take several months I bought a used engine from a Rennlister to put in the car to have something to drive while I go through the original engine. Assuming the used engine is good (I plan to get the engine swap done over the next few weeks) I'll have around $14K in the car (roller + used engine). What will the car be worth at that point? Probably what I have in it. But, I didn't go into this to make money. This is a "learning lab" endeavor. Buying a running car is a far more rational decision if you want a car to drive immediately. In this case the purpose is to further expand on the knowledge gained in the class. If you want to have some "fun" (your definition of fun might be different) then buy a used engine, change out the IMSB and other known failure points, and work on the car. However, if you just want a car to drive then sell this one and buy a running car. You'll be WAY ahead in the long run.

Hey guys - I'm going to sell the car, I just put it up on the marketplace.. Thanks again for all of the help here, at the end of the day I decided I did not love any of my options so selling the car and searching for a new one makes the most sense economically. I was not attached to the car at all, I've only owned it for a few weeks. https://rennlist.com/forums/vehicle-...t-running.html

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I don't really agree but then again I'm Canadian I'm from a group of friends and guys that DIY. Broken motor? I'm going to fix it. myself. Leaky roof? I'm going to fix it. myself. when I say "gotta go read and research this". that's exactly what I'm doing. educating myself to do the job at hand correctly. don't lump everyone in the same group. some of us are genuinely interested in doing the job properly. and yeah - someone like me needs to do the research and learn. because I want to do it right.

BUT, what does the person know who's sharing that info? Is it "parroted"? Is it mis- information? Does that person, who has become an expert in their own mind, know more about the topic than you do? In regard to the M096 engine, I can tell you now that most of what's shared is "parroted", and hasn't been gained first hand. Guys that don't even have the tools to change their own damn oil are telling people all about what causes IMS bearing failures, and how someone else should repair their vehicle, or what product to use, or why. They have strong feelings about things they know nothing about. That is the problem.

yes, and I agree with mostly what you're saying but it's up to the reader to PROPERLY decipher the information and determine what they want to keep for their project. there was many times I was reading stuff about the M96 and I wanted to reply with "are you ****%�+ dumb? why did you do that?" it didn't take long for me to see who knew what they were talking about and who didnt. and you have to ignore fanbois/haters as they can skew your thinking. between 6speedonline, renntech and rennlist, there was maybe 5 people that I paid attention to. Ive said it many tims and I'll say it again. if I can build this motor in my garage, anyone can. But you need to do your homework. Your course and all the help I got from you, Tony and ashai really went a long, long way.

I think the real problem here is an obsession with hyperbole and repeated, outright dismissals of the value of discussion. It's a technical forum. For people to yammer on about issues of varying technicality. The onus is on the individual performing or paying for work to sift fact from fiction and sound opinion from horsesh!t.

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exactly. took me close to a year of reading, researching to figure out my plan of attack. I didn't figure it out overnight.

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Good luck with the sale, might be a little high at your price considering the mileage on the car.

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Oh ok, what do you think is a fair price? I figured I'd start it there and negotiate it down but I can adjust it. Really shooting from the hip here!

There was a roller on CL Atlanta last week with similar mileage but overall in better shape than yours appears to be. Asking price was $4999. It sold in less than a week. Just one data point, but I was going to buy it over the weekend at the ask. Someone beat me to it. He bought it and installed a used engine and now it is re-listed at $20k. I called the guy and he admitted it was the same car, bought an 80k mile engine for $6k and paid someone $3k for installation. No idea about the quality of the installation, but based on the speed of the flip, i doubt if he did more than a r&r. No idea what the ultimate sale price will be. IMO not worth the 20k ask.

The last two rollers I saw on eBay closed around $8k. But that's eBay, so you never know if the cars really sold.

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Thanks for the feedback, I think you are right on. Im seeing rollers sell $5500-$8k so I think I'll leave it at $5950 and take offers. $5k is a great deal for a roller no surprise it sold quick!

my friend picked up an 01 Carreras with a motor that had intermix for $7500 at a local police auction.

The miles impact value on these cars more than anything. With 134K, I'd call that a 5k roller. The right buyer might pay more, but it may take a while to find them. Lots of my engine customers buy cars already broken, and have us reconstruct them. To these people the miles on the rest of the car really matter.

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$5k would be close for me I'd probably take $5500 for a quick and painless deal. I'm keeping the BBS wheels for another project and the added value there makes up the rest of my money I have into this thing.

^^good to hear you're gonna BUY ANOTHER CARRERA*! Those BBS wheels are quite rare. I'm obviously a fanboy of their wheels, but I've loved them for decades. My 996 has BBS oem units and I used to have some RCs on an oem-spec VW GLI back in '05. Just fantastic wheels that age very well with no flash. *use of capitalization in no way is meant to influence your pending decisions

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Contact Stonegate Auto Sales at [email removed] I told the owner, James about this car and he is very interested at 5-5,500.00 as it is.

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You wanted quick and painless...here you go!

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The car will likely end up with a Flat 6 engine in it, if Stonegate buys it. They've been buying broken cars and holding them till someone wants a car with our engine. Stonegate sells the the car as it is, and we build them a custom engine, to order from the core engine in the vehicle. Thats what Sneaky Pete did with his 997, and Slakker did it as well with his blue 996 that sold on BAT a few months back.

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Jake - thanks for the assist there, I just sent him an email. I have the car up for sale locally for $6500 and am getting barraged with texts and calls so if he can do $5500 I'm all over it.

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He was not interested but said he may know someone who is

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I guess the miles were too high for him. That makes sense, as it seems people value mileage on these cars more than anything else, when it comes to value.

UPDATE - car is sold, thanks for your help everyone, will be back shortly with my new ride!

Congrat's... Pick a nice one! Plenty of great 996's out there.