33 captured repliesDiscussion pagination complete · Source accounts, not a confirmed diagnosis
THIS DISCUSSION / SOURCE-DERIVED OVERVIEW
Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCHWhat would you do?
Leading reported evidence
Replace over a dozen wires
Performed · outcome unconfirmed
No successful repair reported for this finding.
0
Reported fixes
0
Unsuccessful attempts
1
Discussions
Read evidence and context
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Over a dozen wires were replaced; there were no other traces of rodent damage then or since.
Leading evidence: 'Replace over a dozen wires' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'above my knowledge level' (1 discussions; 0 report identifying it and 1 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Clean but priced in turbo territory' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
Source reports, not a diagnosis or a success probability. Counts refer to discussions and can overlap.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
All wires were replaced and there were no other traces of rodent damage then or since.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that suspect a cause
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suspected cause
wiring issue is above my knowledge level but if its not resulting in any issues like check engine light or other codes, i personally wouldnt worry about it.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion · Original poster
They were either neglected, had been in serious accidents, or were clean but priced in turbo territory.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that contain suggestions
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suggestion
Its been years since the repair, I would think any issues that would come of it have already.
These are separate views of the same evidence. Frequency alone does not establish a fix, and these counts must not be added together.
above my knowledge level
No successful repair reported for this finding.
0
Identified cause
1
Suspected cause
0
Reported fixes
Read evidence and context
Discussions that suspect a cause
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Suspected cause
wiring issue is above my knowledge level but if its not resulting in any issues like check engine light or other codes, i personally wouldnt worry about it.
Counts describe captured discussions, not unique people or a diagnosis. Author identities are not reliably stored. Exact duplicate evidence is counted once across matching discussions; one discussion counts at most once per action/state. Multiple repairs reported together remain a combination. Suggestions and failed attempts do not establish a fix. Matches cover whole discussions and can include related faults, model variants and incomplete threads.
33 eligible posts · 0 unverified posts · 1 discussions match the subject in their title or opening post.
Rennlist: 1 discussions
0 evidence records excluded for query context · 0 excluded by outcome qualification · 0 adjusted by outcome qualification.
0 acknowledgements have no verified action link; they do not establish a repair result.
Generation: 20261027T042512Z · outcome-qualification-6. Deterministic extraction; no AI model inference. How we use sources
Hey y'all. Long-time lurker and first time poster. I think I�ve finally found the Porsche I�ve been patiently waiting for, a 2004 996 4S cabriolet 6-spd. But as with everything in life there�s a catch and I�d appreciate your Rennlister opinions on what you�d do in my situation.
TL; DR version: In 2013 and 2017 the car�s wiring harness around and under the intake manifold and oxygen sensor were chewed up by rodents. All wires were replaced and there were no other traces of rodent damage then or since. Would you buy this car for the right price?
Turning 40 next month
and I�ve been looking for a 4S coupe 6-spd since January. I�m in western Canada and a few have come up for sale here. They were either neglected, had been in serious accidents, or were clean but priced in turbo territory. Fast forward to this week and I came across what looks like a nice 2004 cabriolet. Not a coupe but that�s not a deal breaker. Specs below:
https://vinanalytics.com/car/WP0CA29974S653507/
102K km (63K miles)
Originally sold and serviced by Porsche Beverly Hills
Imported by the current owner in 2010; had 51K km at the time
Full service history up here with a well-regarded Porsche independent shop
Complete Carfax report validates all sales and service history in the US and Canada
All known issues completed and documented: IMS (LN), RMS, water pump, etc.
Only accident on record is $1,500 spent on the right front fender
Asking CAD$30K (USD$22K)
The owner is a nice, retired gentleman and he provided me with access to his shop�s online service history for the car. He�s spent almost $25K on it in the nine years he�s owned it. Within the past couple of years new parts have included an alternator, water pump, ignition coils and O2 sensor. New ContiSportContact 2�s were put on in 2015, 15K km ago. IMS, RMS and clutch were all done in 2013, 20K km ago. That service alone cost over $6K.
In 2013 and 2017 the shop noted there was wiring damage in the engine likely caused by rodents. The damage was to the wiring harness around and under the intake manifold and oxygen sensor. Over a dozen wires were replaced; there were no other traces of rodent damage then or since. I spoke to the tech who�s always serviced the car and he said he�s confident all the damage was addressed at the time but that you can never be 100% sure where the little ***** may have gotten to or what they sunk their teeth into. FWIW, when he asked me how much the owner was asking and I told him, he said the car is a steal at that price and he would buy it as is.
But after reading on here all the horror stories of rodent damage and the longer term risks, I�m now scratching my head on whether to pull the trigger. I�m less concerned about the risk of breathing in rat poop from the A/C vents than I am about electrical wiring and fuel lines crapping out on me down the road and costing me thousands. Do you think the risk is overblown? If it were your money and it passed a PPI, would you go for it and just hope for the best?
Thanks in advance!
beautiful looking c4s and $22k seems like a great price for that level of mileage, especially with all the service documentation. wiring issue is above my knowledge level but if its not resulting in any issues like check engine light or other codes, i personally wouldnt worry about it. best of luck and i'm sure you will receive plenty of opinions.
Sad but Bill is right. Most after market IMSB manufactures state that these bearings go bad just sitting in the car and should be replaced.
IMS Retrofit™
Classic
4 years or 50,000 miles
IMS Retrofit™
Dual Row
6 years or 75,000 miles
IMS Retrofit™
Single Row Pro
6 years or 75,000 miles
IMS Retrofit™
MY 06-08
6 years or 75,000 miles
RND RS ROLLER
IMS Retrofit
4 years or 50,000 miles
IMS Solution
All kits
Life of the engine
“
Now, not everyone agrees with this but this is the conventional wisdom.
Car looks good and excellence service history.
You could manage with oil changes, filter inspections, cam dev,.review/reportsl, oil analyst, and drive it.
Some people gamble....
I'd probably give the seller credit for disclosing the wiring issue and buy the car. Have the IMS solution done and drive it. Looks like a really nice car.
With the caveat that I only read your TL;DR: If you're looking for something to drive for a while and then cash out for something else, it probably doesn't matter. If you're looking to hold the 996 long-term, I'd pass.
When a Nissan dealer wanted to perform an engine bay harness swap as a diagnostic step, I refused. Even if the technicians only crack one connector, water may eventually intrude and oxidize those pins. Imagine trying to diagnose something a year (or 10,000 miles...or another owner) later, when the engine bay is once again full of engine.
I'd offer him $20k cash in hand on the spot (200 - $100 bills - 2 stacks of $10k ea.) - take it or leave it. My bet is, he takes it...You gotta be willing to walk...
That's not how this works. The connectors are weather proof. You can take them apart as many times as you want as long as you damage the seals. They are not one time use.
Because aftermarket parts sellers who invented the better bearing say so. Time or miles.
Crazy I know.
See previous post listing LN replacement intervals for their IMSB.
They're only weather-proof as long as none of the plastic retaining those seals cracks. If ANY slop is introduced into the closure, moisture gets in.
Even if nothing gets cracked, forcing two parts together when one has 15 years of heat cycling and the other still has release compound on it is going to sometimes result in an imperfect connection. Mismatched connectors do not mate the same way that brand-new connectors will.
Sadly Rodent damage is a very very very common occurrence on all makes and models now a days. Manufacturers make the insulation out of a soy based product and the bastards love it. I have repaired or replaced dozens if not hundreds of wire harness on all makes and models. As long as it was repaired correctly and weatherproofed i would not even slightly be concerned. Wiring repairs are a daily occurrence in the shop for all types of reasons. Do them per the service manual and its a permanent repair.
And also to put the cars value into perspective, I purchased almost the identical car 1 year ago for 28k with the same mileage. I think 22k is a steal for a C4S.
Thanks so much to everyone for your comments and feedback. I feel much better about the car now. I also should've clarified that it has the LN Engineering IMS Solution; it's oil-fed so should be good for life! The car felt tight and well put-together on the test drive. No noticeable squeaks or rattles and that PSE with the top down was an auditory orgasm!
Today I offered him CAD$28K (USD$20,750) subject to a satisfactory PPI and am waiting to hear back.
If it's helpful to anyone else also shopping a 996 C4S, last night I took a look at what 2002-2004 C4S prices were on bring a trailer dot com and there were 21 sold over the past year. I did a simple regression analysis with price the dependent variable (including 5% buyer's fee) and mileage the independent variable. All the cars were coupes, all but one were manuals, and six of them did not have an IMS retrofit. This is a small sample size so not surprisingly those six non-retrofit cars diluted the results. So I've separated the analysis below into two groups: one for the 15 IMS-retrofit cars and a separate one for all 21 including the Non-retrofit cars. Hopefully it gives other shoppers a ballpark starting point for where a 996 4S coupe should be priced at.
IMS-Retrofit 996 Price
= -0.1444 x mileage + 41,247
Non-Retrofit 996 Price
= -0.1109 x mileage + 38,711
Come on man, this must be some theory from the dark web. If the connector clicks in place, has the weather proof seal and is not cracked it will be weather tight. Just don't be a knuckle dragging ape when working on them and all will be well.
I know about those posts and the history behind them. They were basically forced to come up with those intervals in order to shut people up. A bearing like that sitting in the oil rich environment of the engine will not deteriorate if the car was only driven 20K kms in 5 years. Sounds crazy because it is.
I don't think anyone else has mentioned it, but I would HIGHLY encourage you to have a shop that can read codes (present and stored) to get a better idea of if there are any lingering issues from the wiring. If none, I wouldn't sweat it. It's something that all cars are subject too, so yes, it can be a huge problem, but it's also fixable -- and if the aforementioned advice is vetted and comes back positive, I'd consider it a non-issue.
Looks like a really nice car and I totally agree the PSE is addictive. Love your data points above, certainly a reminder that you're getting a great deal if the seller accepts anything near your offer price.
If all falls through -- you might look into the one in the link below. Not close to you and not the best place to find your dream 911 but a similar spec and looks to be uber clean....
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2004-Porsch...r/133139086080
If those charts are to be believed, I should have paid $30K for my car.
Please tell me those are kilometers and Canadian dollars on the axes.
Good luck with your purchase. Looks like a good deal.
OK, I was prepared to be impressed. In fact, I thought I was the only one to ever do a regression on values. Seems I was mistaken. However, you have reversed the normal dependency. Your regression should predict price based on dependent variables(prices vary, mileage is a vector constant). Since you didn't do this, you got a pretty poor R^2 value. If you have another couple hours set it up this way:
Y = Ax1 + Bx2 + Cx3...n
Where
Price = (-age) + (-mileage) + int cond + ext cond + (desirable value option on scale, 1-100, not too granular) + IMS retro + (N, your other chosen factors)
Also, try to take more samples. A sample set of 15 is pretty low. For N variables, there should to be approx (2.635)N samples or the QoS will cause outliers to damage the R^2. i.e. The scatter caused by low samples is contributing to poor R^2. Much of these indies are guesses, but it is what it is. Remember, what we are trying to predict is the price, not the mileage, or other factors. But - well done to start!
edit; oops, made a sign error! caught it
Looks like a nice car. Some very good options.
As others have stated PPI by Porsche Dealor or shop that can read codes and has Porsche experience.
Factory in the IMS cost in your budget
Agreed, buy it. The issues would still be showing up if it had more wiring probs I would think. Nice looking car, well adult-maintained. My 2 cents American.....
Today the seller told me the car sold for asking price with no PPI subject. Probably to the damn tech who serviced it. I loved it but not enough to roll the dice on without a PPI.
Thanks everyone for your feedback (and docmirror for the laugh). Back to the waiting game.
Towja. Write the check.
Did I say something funny? Is my advice on regression analysis flawed?
For the 996, it might take a while, but get what you actually want. Don't settle.
