9A1 doomsday thread

There�s a thread over on the 997 forum re a RLister who lost a motor in a 997.2. It�s turning into a 996 type paranoia thread. Should that make us 996ers feel better or worse about our cars...?🤔

It seems like every Porsche that I've owned has some kind of flaw or issue that can result in catastrophic engine failure or other bad things. The Cayenne had plastic coolant tubes that could rupture inside the engine, causing hydro-lock and destroying the engine. The 996 had the IMSB issue that we all know. The 997.1 turbo had plastic coolant lines that could come loose and leak, resulting in a full engine-out rebuild. It also was reportedly known to fail during track days, spraying coolant all over the rear wheels and causing a crash. My current 991.1 turbo has the 9A1 motor, and I must admit that I haven't heard of a major failure mechanism yet. I'm sure it will come. You'll drive yourself crazy if you worry too much about this stuff. Drive your car and enjoy it! If it fails, it fails.

It's every make of car, just reading enthusiast forums makes it worse. I worked for a Toyota dealership for a number of years, Toyota makes a fine vehicle, but I did my fair share of engine work on them. If you look at any manufacturer close enough under the microscope, you are going to think none of them make a good vehicle.

We want perfection but all engines will fail eventually. Every car maker has problems. Mass production of cars multiplies the carnage over time. Best to do due diligence on maintenance (oil/filter changes) and drive.

Agree, Corvette engines also explodes. They might be half the price but still expensive. ( https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...the-track.html ) Not sure about the hype for these engines, maybe we like our cars to much. My minivan costs more than my 996, but wouldn't care if that blew up. It would just suck but I wouldn't cry my self to sleep... (to be fair a honda odyssey engine is $1200 from the junkyard, a 996 is $7000 from the junkyard)

Can't...find...my...pointing and laughing meme...fast enough.

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Honda Odyssey engines don't normally blow, but their transmissions sure do. I've replace two transmissions in Honda Odysseys, but I also know a couple of guys who have done even more. The early Odyssey's are well known for hoving transmissions that often go out around 60K miles. They run about $3K to have a rebult transmission installed. They may have horrible trannys, but the van overall is a LOT easier to work on than a Toyota Sienna. I hate working on Siennas!

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It gives me great pleasure to discuss minivan engines on a porsche forum! can't imagine do anything engine/tranny related on a minivan, gotta suck! $3k for a tranny? Jikes! Sounds like a 996 tranny replacement is cheaper?

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That is an interesting thread. Regardless of the vehicle it sux when something major fails. Even more so if it was just a few years old and costs large $$ to purchase then the engine goes south. As mentioned above manufacturers can have issues due to a myriad of problems from design to suppliers and everything in between...but it still sux! A few years back the youngest kid went out to start his less than two year old WRX and noticed a slight knocking noise. Took it in and they found a falling rod bearing. This is not a kid, 40 yo, that beats his cars. They replaced short block and other stuff that might have eaten swarf(turbo, intercooler, all oil hoses, etc... It cost the kid nothing. I asked what the bill would have been and it was less than $4k if my memory is correct. $20k+ for a properly remanufactured/upgraded 996/997 engine seems close on ratio price wise...unfortunately! $30k WRX vs. $90k+ Porsche. Are there design problems with the flat six...yes. Are there people who can take care of those issues...yes. Are our cars just cars...yes! Nice cars, but just cars. This being shared by a guy who just discovered his 05 C4S with 54k miles was found to be scored! I'm going to have it fixed because, well I like the car. It was not a shock as I had suspicions for some time. From reading the forums I educated myself to the possibilities by listening to those who know and discounting the opinions of the "sky is falling" folks. I plan to follow the 997.2 thread to gain any knowledge that might be shared. I must say I was surprised at some of the snarkiness.

I was looking at a 997 vehicle listing yesterday and I asked about the IMS and the guy responded that his 2007 didn't suffer from that issue. Told him he was wrong but he wanted to dispute it with me and I didn't feel right raining on his sale thread about IMS. Good luck with the sale.

I think it has s lot to do with how people both perceive and drive their cars. Porsche�s in general are perceived to be �race cars�. Therefore, people tend to treat/drive them as such (not all, but many). This leads to many blown engines... Obviously, this isn�t the only scenario, but I think it�s a real contributor... my 2 cent...

That may be part of it. I think another consideration is that most people associate price with quality. There's an assumption and an expectation that a very expensive car will be very well made, and will therefore not be as likely to suffer from failure modes that can affect less expensive cars. We all know that this isn't always the case. The engine in a Porsche is a machine, just like the engine in any other car. Machines break. Machines wear out. I think the problem is more with people's expectations than it is with the actual car.

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I would argue that he isn't totally wrong. Sure, he still has a sealed IMS bearing, but the larger size in the later engines makes this far less of an issue.

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I agree. I also think people don't understand exactly how much maintenance/repairs it takes to keep a race car going, particularly with a car that really isn't a race car. Expensive to buy. Expensive to maintain. To me these are high performance cars and that means things do wear/break. They are quality for what they are and price, unfortunately, does not make necessarily higher quality. If you paid this much for a Camry you would not expect the engine to go away. Then, again you wouldn't get this performance level. I agree with your perception/expectations comment.

Is there a reason that Porsche abandoned the bulletproof Mezger engine design? Other than cost? Seems like everything since has had issues.

I think you have to look at percentage-wise the failure rates of engines, transmissions or whatever on cars. There are lot more minivans built than 911's and I would bet they are abused more. For the most part, these are enthusiast cars that people have maintenance done regularly. and don't wait until their tires fall off for repairs. Regardless, whether the IMS issue is 1, 2 or whatever percentage failure rate it shouldn't happen. Your engine shouldn't grenade with 40k miles on it.

I wonder how many high mileage Ferraris, Lambos, and Astons there are out there?

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Good point! My guess is none and talk about maintenance costs!!!

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I think that's a tough comparison. Many of us would consider those cars but like Porsche because "typically" they are more reliable for regular use and better built. Especially with the price of some of the new Porsche models approaching that territory nowadays. Porsche's roots were in a being a true sports car that you could drive at the track on Sunday, then drive to work on Monday...over and over again. The more I learn about Porsche's engineering on the entry level models starting with the 996/986 the more I think that philosophy ended in the late 1990s except for the high end models (GT3, GT2, Some of the turbos, etc). I thought maybe with the 991 they "righted the ship" again from an engineering perspective, but with the rod bolt issues that the 991 GT3's had and now perhaps starting to see problems with the stock 9A1's maybe they did not. I'll be keeping my 6-GT3 I guess. :-)

I would assume its all about money. I think Porsche sold about 10000 996s a year in the US. Nissan sold like 30000 or so of their 350z a year in the us. They also put the VQ engine in EVERYTHING, they stopped using the engine 2015 or so. Not sure how many VQs there sre but must be 10-100 more than M96. So Nissan could proberbly put in a ton more money in R&D of the VQ35DE vs Porsche for their M96. Their ROI must be insane compared to porsche. Same with LS family, even trucks has LS engines. Hopefully the Macans pays for 911 R&D!

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Shouldn't some of that R&D be built into the price though? A Corvette was msrp of 40k and 911 was 75k and that is base. I am guessing some of it is in production and GMs size but I would think some of that extra 35k would go into R&D.

I have read that ENTIRE thread over there and am LMFAO at this one. I am reminded of Mark Twain’s quote “the report of my death was an exaggeration..” Anyone looking to sooth themselves in 9A1 failures should find pleasure elsewhere. This is of no moment.