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YOUR RESEARCH1st DE Event @ Mid Ohio (brake fluid question)
Leading reported evidence
Replace both
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Read evidence and context
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Stock pads and fluid are probably OK, especially since you just changed both.
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Suggestion
Now you could benefit from all sorts of improvements and stock parts won�t be good enough, and you better check tire pressures as it�s not hard to get PSI above the max rated pressure on the tires.
Leading evidence: 'Replace both' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Check tire pressures as it�s not hard' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Suggestion
Now you could benefit from all sorts of improvements and stock parts won�t be good enough, and you better check tire pressures as it�s not hard to get PSI above the max rated pressure on the tires.
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Check tire pressures as it�s not hard
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Suggestion
Now you could benefit from all sorts of improvements and stock parts won�t be good enough, and you better check tire pressures as it�s not hard to get PSI above the max rated pressure on the tires.
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Finally (after having the 2001 996 C2 for 7 years) I've signed up for my first DE event (Mid-Ohio). Can't wait�
New stock motor mounts and stock rotors/pads going on tomorrow, with fluid flush. Can/should I use racing fluid (like Motul 600) for this one track event and keep it in for street use for the remainder of the year? Or, should I just go with standard Porsche Dot 4 fluid? I am obviously not an experienced driver, so assume I will be using my brakes much more than most. Thx in advance�
I run Motul 600 in all my cars. It is a fantastic fluid and is a cheap "upgrade" from the stock fluid. You likely won't get anywhere near the limit of your brakes, but it's not going to hurt anything having more performance than you need. Make sure you replace it yearly as it picks up water faster than other fluids.
RBF600. I run it in our racecars (24 hours without boiling) and have run it in every BMW, Corvette and Porsche I've owned and tracked over the last 15 years. The stuff has never failed me.
Mike
Congrats on signing up for your first DE.
Porsche fluid is totally up to the task for your DE. You can certainly upgrade (ATE Typ 200, Motul, etc...) to another brand, but it isn�t necessary for your first outing. Fresh fluid is the most important thing.
Enjoy Mid Ohio!
Eh I wouldn't go out on track with stock pads, but that's just me. I'd want at least a Hawk DTC-30, Ferodo DS2500, etc pad.
I DEFINITELY wouldn't go out on stock brake fluid. ATE Typ 200 at least. RBF 600 costs twice as much as Typ 200 but it is a little better. That's what I'm running now.
Since it's your first DE you probably won't be pushing your car's brakes to their limit. Stock pads and fluid are probably OK, especially since you just changed both. Just pay attention to your pedal feel and listen to your instructor - approach it patiently and you and your brakes should be fine. However, if you willing to re-spend the money for Motul 600 and a street/track pad, then that's just a little bit of extra peace of mind.
Which DE are you attending? The end of April or early June?
I don�t know, I always had brake issues on the track with stock fluids. People always talk about not pushing the car to the limit for DEs, but that�s what a track event is for. I would run the better fluid.
Prospeed RS683 - Fantastic fluid..You will gas the brake pad before you boil that
Edit - even though this is your first event, My .02 is don't skimp on fluid. With some laps under your belt and confidence building you can quickly get past the boiling threshold of many fluids
I'll be there in mid-may, hope to see you out. You'll be fine on ATE200 for a first HPDE. It's cheap and excellent, no reason to spend $$$ on botique fluids if you're still new, on stock brake components and low-grip street tires. Usually raining at mid ohio anyways so you won't need much brake lol
For your first event you'll do fine with stock pads and fluid. As others have said, it's more important to have FRESH fluid (sans air and water) than "racey" fluid. Same for pads. A new-ish set of OE pads will be fine for your first weekend. You'll probably use about 20-25% of a set of stock pads per day at the track.
Your assertion that you're new and will be using your brakes a lot is right...and wrong. You'll probably be hesitant to go super fast because you don't have the skills yet, but that means you'll probably be arriving at corners a lot slower than an expert driver, so you won't have to brake as much, and you'll probably tend to ease off early and not really brake hard at the last minute. As your skills progress, you'll be exiting each turn faster, arriving at the next turn faster, and waiting later to brake, thus putting a lot more strain on the brake system. That's when it's time to start thinking about upgrades. But with that said, I run in the advanced/instructor group on stock pads and rotors and have no issues. I use Ate Typ 200 fluid. Have never had an instance of fade with this setup. Stock pads stop hard every time, 100% reliably and repeatably. The only problem is that they get consumed rather fast. The main advantage I'd see by going to a more aggressive pad is longer life, but financially it just doesn't make sense. I can get an OE pad set for ~1/3 the cost of any sort of "track" pad, and those pads are NOT going to last 3x as long, so it's not worth the extra cost. But that's just my opinion based on my experience!
The more I think about how people respond to posts about DEs - too much variation in responses - I think the main determining factor on whether or not stock is '"fine" for DEs is really up to the driver. For example, I like to push things, so even on all season tires, I was passing 911 turbos, Ferrari's, Corvettes and Vipers on my 18-yr-old Cab...
A DE can be relaxing or it can feel like an all-out race. Yes, I know some folks say that DE is NOT a race, but honestly, we are in a 911 on a race track with no speed limits. And it can be just as dangerous as a real race. So, honestly, this whole idea about which fluids discussion, whether or not stock tires will work, stock oiling system, what pads, etc. - it all boils down (pardon to pun) to how much you intend on pushing your car and HOW you intend on pushing your car.
Example1: You can use lite braking and lite gas and still squeal the tires through all the turns via momentum driving, focusing on lines, etc. Your limiting hardware factor is going to be tires, followed by oiling system limitations - yes, even all season tires can cause oil starvation or cavitation on turns. Stock oil in this case might not be good enough.
Example2: You can use full throttle on every straight and then slow down for easy turns. Your limiting hardware factor will be engine power and therefore, engine cooling ability and proper oil for redline runs. Again, stock oil might not be good enough.
Example3: You can perform late braking on all the high speed straights and then go easy in the turns. Your limiting factor will be heat build-up in the brakes and you can easily cook the brakes or boil them. Stock DOT4 fluid would not be enough here.
Example4: You aren't driving particularly hard, but because you are new, you are black flagged to come into the pits. You stop for the track worker to tell you that you didn't allow someone to pass. You then head back out and notice that you have no brakes because they boiled (because you came into the pits with no airflow after the straight.
Example5: By the end of the day, you become a quick learner and you combine one of more examples in the above. Because, hey, isn't that the point? Now you could benefit from all sorts of improvements and stock parts won�t be good enough, and you better check tire pressures as it�s not hard to get PSI above the max rated pressure on the tires.
On the other hand, you can take your stock Mazda 3 wagon out there, learn the lines, have a great time, and never have any issues at all. But I promise, the second you start pushing that thing, you will find a way to break it down.
Thoughts?
Mid May is northern ohio PCA DE.
Went with Motul 600 and stock pads/rotors� Mechanic was installing SS brake lines today (while doing the new rotors/pads) and stripped the long hard line at the right front wheel. To replace that line I've read the entire front of the car needs to be removed, including the gas tank (which is full BTW)� Mechanic is going to try cut the line and splice on the end piece with threads� Does this sound realistic/safe?
watch that oil pressure gauge if you can, dont be surprised if it starts to dip into the 2-3 bar range once the engine temps start to climb (which they will)...
With Motul 600 and stock pads you'll be fine. I don't know what's involved with replacing the entire brake line, but if done right splicing in a connection should be OK. The only issue is whenever you put a connection in a line it's just another chance to have a leak.
Be safe, listen to your instructor, don't drive over your ability, and have fun.
Great post and I agree. Too many variables to give black and white answers but safe answer is to be prepared with the best you can afford.
Sounds like you�ve chosen your parts. Sorry about the brake line mishap. Have a safe and fun experience
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