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YOUR RESEARCHSpark plug question
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extension wanted
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Reported cause
As I remember, my problem was the extension wanted to let go of the socket, leaving me with the socket attached to the tightened spark plug.
Leading evidence: 'extension wanted' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'extension wanted' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Check into the 4 electrodes' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
As I remember, my problem was the extension wanted to let go of the socket, leaving me with the socket attached to the tightened spark plug.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
I used the 4 electrode as they are what the dealer uses for my year car.
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Suggestion
ill check into the 4 electrodes when its time for replacement.
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Suggestion
Since th engine has possibly 10 years and 45K miles of what I gather has been otherwise trouble free service from the plugs I'd just replace the old plugs with the same plugs, new of course.
The best product I've seen for changing plugs for a 996 is the magnetic socket you can buy from Pelican - I used one two weeks ago (borrowed) and it works great - better then the old type with the rubber inside them.
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I've been wanting to tackle changing my 10-year old plugs and now that it's getting nice and cool out, I figure I'll be able to get it done. After searching, I haven't found an answer to my question:
The manual recommends single electrode plugs. But it's old. Renntech says the new Porsche recommended plugs are 4 electrode. Do I need the 4 electrode Beru copper, or will the Bosch Super single-electrode plugs work just as well? I just want to get the right plugs, because I NEVER want to change them again!
The number of ground electrodes means nothing as far as the performance of the spark plug. Go with what is available and cheapest, correct heat range and gap. Platinum plugs provide no additional performance either but will last longer than standard copper plugs. You have to decide whether the premium price of platinum plugs is worth it.
NGK BRK6EK plugs are a good choice and have a copper core for best heat removal.
If you are going to the trouble to remove the plugs I'd just budget to replace them with new ones.
Since th engine has possibly 10 years and 45K miles of what I gather has been otherwise trouble free service from the plugs I'd just replace the old plugs with the same plugs, new of course. Why fix it if it ain't broke?
Be sure the old plugs are correct though. If not then I'd breathe a sigh of relief nothing bad happened and replace the wrong plugs with the correct ones.
Sincerely,
Macster.
I changed mine out about 1 month ago. It was "fun". As fun as 6 hours can be.
I used plugs from Porsche (sunset porsche). THe outside of the box says Porsche but of course the plugs say bosch super on them. I used the 4 electrode as they are what the dealer uses for my year car.
One of the most useful tools I had was long (8 inch long) needle nose pliers with about a 20 degree bend to the end of them. They were awesome for gently pulling the rubber boots off of the wires that connect to the coils. I then used them to disengage the coil wires from the coils. It made the job much easier.
Things you need to have.
Lots of 1/4 inch and 3/8 inch extensions and swivels to get into that tight area.
I believe the 4 ground strap plugs allow for the 100k mile interval. When I changed mine, all 4 sides of the electrode were worn from where the ground straps "point" to - the sparked jumped. I guess if you look at it from the 30k "normal" plug interval, with 4 ground straps, you can make 100k. Once one side is worn excessively on the electrode, another ground strap will be the shortest path, least resistance for the spark. All the plugs I've seen in aviation use 4 grounding straps.
Built 100's of F-15/F-16 engines (brand witheld). Build occasionally on the weekends still.
Went to school and built a couple of flat-6's, none that were airworthy.
These had the plugs. I remember the instructor saying there was a reason aviation plugs have 4 ground straps but I don't remember. I believe it was simply if you lost the gap or the strap itself, you have 3 others to depend on.
cool. ill check into the 4 electrodes when its time for replacement. even though my plugs are from 2001, i only have 45k on them. as long as the factory plugs were platinums.?? (thats why i want to pull one) ill leave em alone.
i really doubt factory platinums with 45k would be wore out, the car isnt driven very hard.
The plugs on my airplane (and most of the ones I've seen) have two grounds that need to be gapped. But also note that, typically, Lycoming & Continental engines are amazingly crude -- essentially aircooled industrial engines from the 1940's. They're designed to run at slow rpm, under load for the equivalent of 200-250,000 miles. Having no advance to the ignition & manual leaning of the carburetors, they are prone to plug fouling.
I don't think there's much similarlity between their technology & a recent car engine. I'd just see what the factory recommends & just use it.
Lame opinion: as long as your plugs aren't fouling & you're not burning a hole in the top of the piston -- use what the factory recommends. There's not a lot of horsepower to be gained from screwing around with heat ranges or gimmicks on a well designed engine. The recommended plugs will burn the fuel. Claims that fancy designs will do a lot better is mostly marketing. If a simple plug change would get a lot more hp or efficiency, the auto manufacturers would be all over it.
But...it's your engine.
The best product I've seen for changing plugs for a 996 is the magnetic socket you can buy from Pelican - I used one two weeks ago (borrowed) and it works great - better then the old type with the rubber inside them.
Regarding multi-electrode plugs, yes, service life is increased a bit, but don't forget that there is still a single center electrode that will wear; longer life, yes, but I don't think 4 electrodes equates to 4 times longer lasting than a single.
I read some interesting things on multi-electrode plugs that bares mentioning here too:
1) Depending on the head design and sparkplug location, multielectrode plugs can actually disturb the combustion gas flow adversely degrading performance. Not sure if this would apply to the P-head design.
2) The extra metal of three more electrode can absorb and retain more heat, thus increasing chance of detonation.
Food for thought. I say use what P recommends.
An electrode is a conductor through which electric current is passed.
Therefore,, there is both a center electrode and ground electrode on a spark plug. If both were not electrodes, the plug would not work.
Porsche recommends the Beru 4-conductor plugs, according to Loren, so that's what I ordered (@ $13 per)! Hopefully these plugs will work well - I would hate to have to replace them twice!
Yes, but when the term "electrode" is used, most would think the center in my circles.
That's where the companies focused the most attention to like the platinum plugs.
The industry's official name of what you call the "grounding strap" is "ground electrode" From Champion to Bosch. You need to move outside your "circle" more often.
Have fun changing those plugs! It's close to time to change mine again and I'm not looking forward to it. Just make sure you have lots of patience and no place to drive the car for a least a few hours. Magnetic socket and extensions/swivels are a good idea also.
I bought the recommended KD swivel socket set w/ magnets - I'm ready!! I figure I'll do the plugs with the car in the garage, so it can be worked on in stages, even if it's night or raining outside.
Haa! You guys are pretty funny. I can see both sides of your stories, and being an EE, I should have been super specific and said "multi ground-electrode".
I need to do this soon too. What's this magnetic socket I keep hearing about? I assume Suncoast or Pelican has it?
Which takes longer, dropping the exhaust cans or fighting the plugs? As I remember, my problem was the extension wanted to let go of the socket, leaving me with the socket attached to the tightened spark plug. That was a real pain.
Once all the skin was off my elbows and knuckles, the physical pain wasn't that bad.
Which takes longer, dropping the exhaust cans or fighting the plugs? As I remember, my problem was the extension wanted to let go of the socket, leaving me with the socket attached to the tightened spark plug. That was a real pain.
Once all the skin was off my elbows and knuckles, the physical pain wasn't that bad.
Just use one wrap of duct tape to hold the socket and extension together. You can use the duct tape on all your angle joints and sockets to help keep it all together. Cheap and easy - it's also very flexible for the angles. That's the only way I could have changed all twelve of my 993 plugs before. A magnet on an extension stick is helpful too. Someone already mentioned the 'magnetic plug socket', but I used a very lightly applied single wrap of duct tape around the open plug socket end and around the plug base to ensure the plug did not fall off the socket when sliding into place - the 993 has very 'deep' heads.
Do you recommend jacking one side up, changing 3 plugs, then doing the other side the same way? Or is it easier to jack the rear of the car up and remove both wheels first?
Also, is it better to disconnect the coil wires before removing the boots from the old plugs? Not sure it mentions that in the Renntech article.
Or like I did, use low profile ramps and back the car up on them. I then, removed the exhaust cans and you a lot of access to the coil packs. No tire removal needed.
Whatever floats yer boat!
Ah. My jack is a Craftsman aluminum POS that I wouldn't trust to support the engine/rear for hours while I struggle with the plugs. Could I lift by the rear cross member, place only one jack stand, then lower, resulting in your one side approach?
That would work fine and you can even keep the jack under the cross member for extra piece of mind. You have to get on your back anyway, so you just need enough room to move your arms around. My rear tire is maybe 6 inches off the ground and have enough room.
I have to get on my back? I thought sitting would be fine after raising the rear and taking off the wheel, since the plugs are at mid-wheel level, right?
Sweet jesus just do it already!
It is much easier to change the plugs if you dropped the exhaust.
What you haven't heard is that the exhaust bolts might not come out all that easy. Some of the bolts may snap on the way out. If they snap in the block them you have to drill them out. Then the time you saved removing the exhaust first magically disappears.
If you leave the exhaust on (the way I did mine) you will definately be on your back praying to the gods to help you get the rear most plugs out.
Laying on your back and reaching your arm up through the area inbetween the head and the exhaust tubes with extensions and swivels. DOn't even think of doing this when the car is even slightly warm. You will be burned.
My forearms are the size of most folks thighs so i did not get out of this job unscathed.
I had the advantage of a lift but the wheels were not in the way.
I was thinking that a tool like the sidewinder (
http://www.sidewinderproducts.com/_wsn/page3.html
) might be handy when removing some of the plug locations (towards the rear) that are covered by the exhaust manifold pipes. There is also this design - however I know of no one who has used one, but it looks interesting for perhaps lower torque uses,
http://www.amazon.com/Cal-Van-Gearle...161881&sr=11-1
.
There is also the Stanley version:
http://www.stanleytools.com/default....otator+Ratchet
I'm sure Snap On and MAC have something that would work as well.
It was worth the trouble. I'm sure it won't take as long on my 2nd time around. Having done it and knowing the tools needed helps. You may find an ignition boot cracked, so be prepared for that.
Unless their a cute redhead, I wouldn't offer to change plugs for anyone.
Im such a jerk, but your beloved NGK plugs you always talk about even call them " ground straps" along with "ground electrode".
http://www.ngk.com/sparkplug411.asp?...d+strap&mfid=1
I guess my circle isn't so bad after all
I was not responding to you calling them ground straps, but rather you stating that they were not electrodes. Your statement was: "Oh and guys, its ground straps, not electrodes when it comes to single or multiples. Plugs only have one electrode."
Let me know when you decide to do yours... I'd be happy to come over to give you an unsophisticated hand and hopefully pickup some tips (like dropping the cans) for when I go to do mine. I'm in San Diego too.
Rudy
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