well, it finally happened - something is wrong with the car...

I have owned my 99' c4 for 2 1/2 years now, and short of oil changes and general mantainence, it has been EXTREMELY reliable...for the 8,000 miles or so that I have put on her. That all changed last night. We had 60 degree weather here for a change, so I decided to take her out for a spin. I drove to work and for some reason, the clutch engagement seemed a little higher than normal, and I thought I sensed a slight vibration from the clutch pedal. I thought nothing of it as I haven't driven her in about a month. I went out for lunch...and the vibration seemed worse...so I knew something was not right. When I left work in the evening and headed to the gym, I noticed the vibration had intensified...and the clutch engagement was extremely high... Just for giggles, I stepped on it and sure enough, the rpm's climbed really high and really quick...so my clutch has started to slip. I made it to the gym and the vibration on the pedal is really bad now...and if I hold it slightly I can hear some sort of chatter. Also...at cruising speed the car hesitated and then all lights on the dash came on and while the car was still running, the gas pedal felt dead...it would not do anything...I put it in neutral and then coasted and started the car again in the process and everything back to normal...(did I just kill the car when the clutch did not engage properly??). On the way home I drove her nice and easy...but the clutch engagement is really high now and if I step on it on 1st, 2nd or 3rd...the clutch will slip... What are we looking at? What would cause the clutch to simply go out like that without any warning? Was she holding on by a thread and finally gave out? I am thinking this won't be cheap...but how much would I be spending? I probably should have the RMS replaced at the same time since it has shown moisture for the past few months (no drip, just slight moist). Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!

Changing the rms, if leaking, is great at this time because you essentially pay for only one labor charge. If you need the clutch change, don't sweat it, it's not a fortune. What is your car's mileage? Changed my clutch at 49000 miles along with the rms.

Wear. Simple as that. Depending on how you use the clutch it can wear quickly. Remember...a clutch is a wear item on the car. Think of it this way...now you have an opportunity for a lightweight flywheel. C.

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I have about 42,000 miles. I drive her the way she should be driven, but never abuse her. A fortune...? What are we talking about? Some of my friends think $ 1,000 is a fortune, while others don't sweat $ 100,000... But you are right, at least I can now do both at the same time. However...is the chatter part of the clutch going to sh&ts?

8,000 miles in 2.5 years? I have 17,000 miles in 9 months. Other than a water pump, everything I've done is just maintance (pads, plugs, filters-cabin, oil, and air, clean MAF, take out clutch spring). Like Chad said, the clutch is a wear item. I'm thinkng I've heard around $1,500 on other posts. Little over the cost of 4 tires.

I just had my transmission replaced under warranty at 92,000 miles. The dealer suggested that I also replace the clutch since the labor would be free. It did not really need replacing but since it was the original clutch, it was close to the end of its normal service life. I only had to pay for the clutch which was around $600. They told me the normal labor for just a clutch replacement would be another $600.

ehh, if you've got some skills you can do it yourself. i can walk you through it. on my 993 i had to do this twice; i got the parts wholesale so the whole thing cost me less than 600 bucks. $472 for the oem sachs clutch kit, 12 plugs, a few seals while i'm there, and some fluids and clamps. took two days. if you take it in to a shop, be ready to drop $3k+. thats the minimum i would charge for this pita job.... while it's down, make sure you change your rear main seal, all of your plugs, upgrade the flywheel, change the belts and any other hard to access items no matter how good they look. you don't want to drop your engine twice in your ownership experience.

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I know, I know...this is my 3rd car so she only comes out once in a great while. If I can have this done for US$ 1,500 that would be great...I am sadden by this but I guess it could have been a lot worse...

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Well, my skills are in the development and production of toys...as far as car skills, let's just say they are limited to oil changes and intake install...and that was sweating it... , so I highly doubt I could pull this off myself unless I had 2 people looking over my back to ensure I did not make any mistakes.

Sounds like your pressure plate has died. This is the only logical reason for the vibration and higher pedal. Maybe some springs have failed inside the PP.

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So...that would mean that the clutch is not necessarily toast...but, if changing the pp, might as well replace everything, correct?

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Yes, replace everything. Clutch, pressure plate, bearings, flywheel (if needed), and if you have any RMS issues, that too. Parts are reasonable (when compared to other cars see: BMW, Audi, etc.). The kicker is the time required. Good shops average $85/hr+ 42K miles on a clutch seems about right, depending on how a person treats it. If you are not rev-matching on downshifts, this sounds to be the appropriate amount of mileage on a clutch. Good luck. C.

Getting good advice. Once you pay to have the engine dropped, don't scrimp on getting all the things within reason done that require an engine drop.

$3K? you're crazy. i was looking at $1500 total, but then the parts were sourced from [email removed] not at the shop or dealership.

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Why would you drop the engine to change the clutch?

Although the clutch being worn is the most likely culprit, the slipping can also be casued by the inadequet design of the release lever. I have seen 4 of these levers get stuck in a partially released position. Either way. when you pull it apart to replace the clutch, make sure you install the newest design of the release lever. About $40 more for all parts.

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thanks for the tip...I assume this lever is an internal part and the engine/tranny would have to be dropped to asses this? Not a chance that something can be adjusted without going through all that trouble...?

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Must drop the tranny to get to it. Here are the parts needed:

If a "finger" or one of the clamping spring fails in the PP, the "fingers" will not be in the same plane together and it will bounce off of the throw out bearing causing your vibration possibly. It doesnt take much, thousandths of an inch.

thanks for everyone's feedback... Seems like a drop of the tranny is at least necessary to find out exactly what is going on...

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I would think most Porsche clutches last a lot longer than 42,000 miles. Mine was still looking decent at 92,000 miles. They told me I could have gone another 20,000 miles or so with it.

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In the 993, you have to drop the engine, but not in the 996- much easier and cheaper. John

just for your reference my local dealer (champion) charges $3K for a complete clutch replacement in a 996. Your best bet is to go to a knowledgable independant shop and do it for about $1.5K

As far as clutch life. I drive 35 miles one way to work. I'd hazard to guess there are people who drive 3 miles that would get far less clutch life than mine. Why? Am I that great a driver? No. I work down country roads and don't engage my clutch (i.e. change gears) as much as stop and go city traffic. Remember, clutches are wear items. Do everything you can to be nice to it (match revs, don't ride at stoplights, etc.), but at the end of the day, wear varies on driving style (controllable) and type (uncontrollable).

http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/...Tclutc_pg1.htm

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One would think. But please re-read my post: 42K miles on a clutch seems about right, depending on how a person treats it. If you are not rev-matching on downshifts, this sounds to be the appropriate amount of mileage on a clutch. Good luck. C. C.

Well, I got a quote to get the clutch replaced, the RMS seal job done, change spark plugs and also replace the fork release arm and small little things in the process...labor, parts, tax included for right at US$ 2,000. Based on what I have read, that is the right amount. I could get the parts a little bit cheaper, but I guess I would want the shop that is going to work on it to warranty the work and parts...if something were to go wrong, and I got the parts, then it would be difficult to prove the job was done incorrectly...? Are there anythings I should ask them to look out for? The shop (IMAGINE AUTO) locally has very good reputation as they work on 911's quite a bit. They are familiar with the car as well and the owner of the shop lives down the street from me... Thanks!