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YOUR RESEARCH996 vs 911
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Run kind of rich at anything
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
That car was a beast, and plenty fast, but it smelled of fuel all the time (it ran kind of rich at anything but WOT) and was only just as fast as my 996...not faster.
Leading evidence: 'Run kind of rich at anything' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Run high 13's out of the box, or fast enough' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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An old Carrera with the stock 3.2l it can run high 13's out of the box, or fast enough to keep up with a current tip.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
That car was a beast, and plenty fast, but it smelled of fuel all the time (it ran kind of rich at anything but WOT) and was only just as fast as my 996...not faster.
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My S/C is no more noise than my 996, does not smell like burnt oil, is not gutless and the steering is not heavy.
So while in the process of trying to sell my 2002 C2 I traded with a Porsche friend for a day. He was considering my 996, he currently drives a 1987 coupe. It's Red with Ruf bumpers and wheels, tinted windows...not my style but whatever.
I was kind of looking forward to spending the day in the 911, I was an airhead for ten years you see. Very very fond memories of my classic 911.
Well, it wasn't more than 5 minutes into my ride when I reconfirmed what I've been saying all along.
I am not looking back!
This 911 was noisy, rather gutless, the steering was heavy, it smelled of burning oil. OK, so this particular car was not set up right - way different than if I would have owned it - but it made me sad you know.
Frankly I was glad it had tinted windows because people were looking at teh car and at least they couldn't see me. I just felt like screaming "It's not my car!"
Anyway - any of you 911 guys trolling around here still thinking the old cars are better than the newer cars. Well I'm sorry, but Ive seen the light.
I imagine some of the more enlightened of you will as well one day, and still others will grow into grumpy old "back in my day" type of guys.
I still maintain - I love the 911 (when properly dialled in) and I will own another one day - but it will be for nostalgia, not for the performance.
Hang on - let me get this out before you respond...
Great point. My buddy owns an 89 Targa which has been his "weekend" car for 8 years, and he just picked up a BMW 335i as his new DD. I was with him when he got into the targa for the first time after driving the BMW for two months. Words like "gutless" and "a real disapointment" came out of his mouth, and he is a Porsche nut!
I love my Speedster, but never make the mistake of driving the GT3 and then the Speedter. It must be the other way around. The Speedster (and 964s for that matter) was a great car for its day. I would love to have an entire collection of "great Porsches" of old, which I would take out, dust off, and drive to re-live that particular "period". However, when I need that ***** to the wall adrenaline rush, I head straight for the newer 911s - particularly my GT3.
At some point, I am certain that the GT3 will feel old and tired, and the "latest and greatest" Porsche will be in my garage to satisfy those primal urges...
-B
Why can't we all just get along...
It sounds like you drove a poor example. The older models definately lack the power and refinement of the newer cars but they certainly have their appeal and can be a blast to drive IMHO.
I think we'll be safe...especially when gas hits 6$ a liter.
Old cars are fun to drive tho, just not daily. The speed you need to reach to be at the limit in a '72 911 vs a '99 are tremendously different. You can be having fun in a 71 at around 80MPH, the '99 doesn't even wake up till about 120 or so....and then the Smokey's are not too pleased
993 owners: Trying to convince everyone that their car is better or has "more soul" (?!?) than the 996
996 owners: Don't expect the 993 to be as good as the 996, 'cause it's an older design
I think the 993 guys are paranoid that someone won't think their car is as good as a 996 because it's older, and thus, they lash out at us sometimes. Personally, I've found that any time you're dealing with any kind of technology, it's always best to buy the newest you can afford--and I'm not the only one that thinks that, so the 993 owners are always up against a rising number of newer owners. With all the P-cars since '99 being water-cooled, this "problem" of the 993 vs. 996 thing will be over in a few years, as they'll simply be outnumbered.
I agree Jasper, the 996 is just better.
I am not disappointed in my car because I have nearly 500 hp and I am not a track guy, I am a drag racer, so this car ('87) fits the bill. But, I miss the overall package of the 996.
I WILL BE BACK IN A 996.........
I also own a 79' S/C and I don't agree with a lot of your comments. Granted the newer cars are a huge step up in comfort and performance, as they should be. My S/C is no more noise than my 996, does not smell like burnt oil, is not gutless and the steering is not heavy. It sounds like your friend has a few issues with his car. With my S/C at just 5 mph, you can't tell that the steering isn't power assisted. At 20 mph, it is far lighter than the power steering in my 996.
My rebuilt 3.0L is putting out around 230 hp (Euro compression, web cams, SSI heat exhangers, Bursch exhaust and a modified fuel system), or about 15 hp higher than your friends Carrera. Even though it is a revving motor with the cams, it still pulls strongly down low. Your friends Carrera 3.2l has a lot more low end. Remember that those older 911s weighed a lot less and hence don't need as much power or as wide of tires. My S/C only weighs 2480 lbs, or about 600 lbs less than my 996 (lightened with Euro GT3 seats, no back seats and a Fabspeed exhaust). Although it has less power, with so much less weight the performance is not as far off as you think. An old Carrera with the stock 3.2l it can run high 13's out of the box, or fast enough to keep up with a current tip. Even stock they are far from a dog.
Porsche had to add power steering due to the extra weight these cars gained from genereation to generation, so I woudl not be bragging about it. That is like saying you are proud they made these cars several hundreds of lbs heavier. The older 911 is also a lot smaller, about the same dimensions as a Miata. I immediately notice the different in width and heft whenever I switch between the S/C and the 996. An older 911 is a car you can really pinpoint around a track with precision and it rewards when you do it smoothly. The newer car is a lot easier to drive, until you get well above the limits. Then it turns into something similar to the 911 of old. Both cars reward you when you drive them, just in different ways.
When I drive my S/C around, I get the same stares and nice comments I get when I drive my 996. I can rarely go to a gas station without someone coming up and making a comment like "I always wanted to own one of these cars." Are they better than the 996? No, but they are still better than most of whats on the road today.
Oh hey - totally agree. My buddy's 911 is set up poorly. That was the largest part of the problem. One of the biggest problems is the oversized RUF wheels - I had them off the car once and they weigh HUGE pounds. Surprising really. They are too wide at the front as well, making the steering slow, ponderous and heavy.
My own 911 was stripped of any and all parts not necessary for speed - I weighed it at 2400 lbs. The motor was carburetted (webers) with JE pistons and webcams. Dyno'd at 230 hp at the wheels. That car was a beast, and plenty fast, but it smelled of fuel all the time (it ran kind of rich at anything but WOT) and was only just as fast as my 996...not faster. I do miss that car, but not enough to wish I had it back instead of my 996.....and if I would spend the kind of money on performance mods on my 996 as I did on that 911, then there's NO WAY even that 911 could catch my 996.ever.
Interesting you say this because I was driving down the freeway in my C4S when I came up to an older 911, Guards Red. I looked over to give a thumbs up to the guy but he snobbingly held his chin high and didn't look over as I was hovering right beside him. Go figure! I got a wave from a 993er recently though.
Funny you should say that...a few year sback (in my 911 days) another friend let me trade a drive in his (well sorted) 928 GTS for a drive in my liteweight 911. I was underwhelmed at the time. My comment was something along the lines that the car felt as heavy as it looked.
I do remember though that I lost him and my 911 in the rearview mirror. I though at the time that probably wasn't used to an engine which needed to be wound right out in order to go fast. He was probably used to all that lazy torque.
Anyway - they're all special in their own way...even the Ruf wheeled tinted window car. When I dropped it off my buddy said he missed the noise..
