C2 Suitability in Snow

I have searched the archives and the FAQ and have not found the specific info that I am looking for. So at the risk of repeating an often-asked question ...... I have just sold my '90C4 and am considering getting a 996. I am confident that a C4 would meet my year round driving needs in Minneapolis (lots of snow and very cold) but does anyone have any specific experience with a '99 C2 (without PSM of course) and '00 and later C2 (with PSM) in sloppy winter driving. I will of course be putting on good 17" whls and snow tires. Used low-miles C2s are quite widely available here ranging from $47.5 for a '99 to a very fine '00 C2 with PSM for $59. Corresponding C4s are a lot scarcer and hence have fewer choices wrt color, options, and price. Would appreciate any input based on the experience of this group. Thanks in advance: Prabha Gopinath [email removed]

i think in minnesota you would be more prudent to get a c4! someone from quebec posted pictures of a c4 in the snow there. he said it performed as well as his audi allroad. <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" /> be patient and get the best for your snowy clime! or you might feel like this <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />

Prabha: if you go for the C2 take it definately with PSM..It will avoid you some scary surprises!.. Or maybe there's a way to drive it in those conditions.. The C4 for that kind of weather is just the best. Tried mine in winter time here in Switzerland. It's just incredible!. good luck.

C2 without PSM(my car). Dont drive it when there is snow outside. Sorry but too much weight in the back and the car pushes alot when snow on the ground. TAKE THE BUS AND WAIT FOR THE SUNNY DAY OR RENT A CAR FOR A DAY WHICH IS WHAT I USE TO DO. Good luck

hehe! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" /> There are also the snow chains.

My father is considering getting a new vehicle to replace his '84 944. We have been looking around, most recently at a few E36 M3s. He wants to stay in PCA, so he is leaning towards another Porsche. I want 996, but he likes 993 and older, saying water-cooled is a mistake. Anyways...we were looking around, saw this '99 C2 coupe. Prabha, Is the same white one from Hopkins Dodge for under 50K? Edit: forgot to also ask, PSM!?! is that Porsche Stability Management? or what. sorry for the newbie question.

99 C2 with traction control. Performed very well in snow with winter tires. Perry

Any recomendations on what tires (size, brand, style) would work best in the light snow (generally less than 4-6 inches) of Central Ohio on a C4S?

christophorus-official porsche magazine-has specific brand recs for each model both for summer and winter

Re: availability of winter tires. Order them in September..by the time the first flakes start to fall Tire Rack runs out of the higher performance 17 and 18" tires. Perry

I have used the Pirelli Sport 210's (I think that is the model #) and they work well. There are probably better snow tires but these are insurance in case I get stuck somewhere 20 miles from home not in my let's go skiing vehicle. Greg

I have an 01 C2 that I use year round in the Boston area. I have two sets of wheels and tires. 18" summer tires and 17" winter tires. The winter tires are Brigestone Blizzak LM-22's. 205/50R17 on the front and 225/45R17 on the rear. The wheels are off a 99 Boxster, 7Jx17 front and 8.5Jx17 rear. (Probably violating some Porshe rule; but they meet spec. and seem to work fine.) I went with the smaller wheels to get the smaller snow tires on the rear. The car seems to behave ok in the snow although I try to avoid driving when it's really bad out - who doesn't. (Bought the wheels on eBay for a lot less than the dealer wanted.) Used the same tires (or their predecessor) on a 968 for nine years and never had a problem.

I had a 2wd pickup w/ 400+ hp and it was great in the snow with studded tires. I don't think the 2wd verses 4wd is the issue with the 911, I would worry what happens when you get more than a few inches and the snow piles up in front of the car. <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />

I think I would go for the C2 for the following reasons: 1. The C4 is not the best as far as handling is concerned. It may be OK for normal driving or not so experienced drivers because its foolproof, but if you try to drive really fast on a twisty road or during trackdays it is not as efficient as the c2. The porsche 4 wheel drive lacks a real central differential. 2. I drove a lot during the last winter with my c2 under heavy snow - with proper tire chains the car behaves excellent, I never felt I was missing the 4 wheel drive. Don't forget that will all that weight over the back wheels traction is very good. Above comments are, of course, subjective. regards Kostas

"lacks a real central differential" I don't think so. On my 01 AWD the "center" diff'l is within the rear transmission case and the VC is at the front diff'l for a more even weight balance. But Porsche and SNOW/(ice)? My 78 Targa was inadvertantly exposed to wintertime conditions on a mountain pass only once, NEVER again. My 01 C4 stays at home in its warm garage if there's even a slight chance of snow.

Dear wwest, you said it yourself: what the porsche c4 has is a VC (viscous coupler) instead of a real third differential. the system is very much like the so-called "haldex" used in the small awd Audis (S3, TT). the REAL 4wd systems use three differentials (examples are all WRC cars, and the subarus/mitsubishi evos). the VC type awds are OK for general use but a pain in the *** for racing or track use. haven't you ever wondered why ALL recent racing porsches are C2s (GT3,GT2)? regards Kostas

[quote]The C4 is not the best as far as handling is concerned. It may be OK for normal driving or not so experienced drivers because its foolproof, but if you try to drive really fast on a twisty road or during trackdays it is not as efficient as the c2.<hr></blockquote> I respectfully disagree. In my own experience, the '99-01 C2's understeer more than the C4's which are almost neutral. This has been confirmed by others I have talked to who have had the same experience. I have seen auto journalists express the same finding. Also, I am confused when you say the C2 is more efficient. Everyone knows an AWD car will be more efficient when putting down it's power. I can corner faster and power out of turns considerably sooner than on the C2's I have driven. [quote]the VC type awds are OK for general use but a pain in the *** for racing or track use.<hr></blockquote> I would agree that the VC on these cars is not a race AWD system as the one on the likes of the Skyline GT-R, but to say that it's "a pain in the *** for racing or track use" is a little extreme. There are many who track/race there C4's, including a few on this board who have great results. Anyway, just wanted to clear up these points a little. Best

Ditto to SpeedFreak01's comments. I started tracking viscous clutch C4s in 95 and in short order was turning respectable times against any C2.....Today I love the Turbo on the track .....and as for the twisties not agreeing with the C4?....just spent a week of great fun driving a C4cab around Virginia Alleghanies...the car is as neutral & repsonsive as anyone could want (IMHO). Final comment on the snow.....we love to drive in it...here in Wisconsin we get it (almost as much as Minnesotans )....the C4s & Turbos are as sure footed as any SUV with proper fitment & rubber (and the fitment & rubber are at least half if not 2/3s of the equation).....GreggT

Hi Kosta, what tire size did you have at the rear (and front ) and what make of snow chains did you use? harris - athens 996 Carrera 2 01

Prabha, I lived in Mn for 13 years before moving down here to FL. There is NO WAY a C2 can handle a Mn winter snow tires or not. The prices you have posted ($47k for a 99 and $59 for an 00) are waaaaaaaaaaaaay high. You may condsider doing what I did many times while living there. Find a car out of state. The way they salt the roads up there, you should consider a C4 change every 2 years. Regards, Luisjr.

Here are some reasonably priced ones with Ok miles. http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...en&cardist=934 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...en&cardist=957 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...en&cardist=892 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...en&cardist=847 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...=&cardist=1505 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...s=&cardist=837 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...s=&cardist=919 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...=&cardist=1384 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...e=&cardist=700 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...e=&cardist=700 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...=&cardist=1061 http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.js...e=&cardist=982 Good luck with your search.

The C2 (w/snow tires) is great in the snow! I have driven mine in over 12" and it has performed brilliantly for me. Good luck with your choice!

this post is 4 years old...hence the higher prices posted. I always laugh when people say the awd is better in poor traction environments but not as good when the track is dry. Racing is all about staying on the edge of adhesion. That edge might be lower in the wet than dry, but an edge is an edge and a car that is better at one edge will be better at the other. if you say the c4s is faster in the rain but the c2 is faster in the dry its only because you are not getting to the edge in the dry and you need to drive faster dw

I drive my 996/03 in the snow without a problem (provided the height is not crazy) anything over 6-8" I will use the Rover - but 3-6" of snow the 996 with PSM handles GREAT ! with snow tires that is - I have yet to get stuck or have any close calls. I live on a mountain in northern NJ and we get snow bigtime. I think these cars are more capable than most think.

agree. against all advice, I drive my c2 in all conditions, including snow (6" or less) using all season 18" pirelli P zero M&S tires and have not had a problem with traction. No ice storms yet. I would defintitely recommend snow tires if you have room to store them (I don't). Biggest worry is someone else sliding into you (which is not affected by YOUR tires) and salt/ice melting treatment getting on undercarriage. Anyway, if it snows over 6" in Wash D.C. area they close the government and most businesses, so there is good opportunity to hone your drifting skills on the empty streets.....