Breakthrough!! Moving at the Speed of Simon

Hi all: I know that there is a Race/DE Forum, but as a 996 owner who is in here quite a bit, I thought I would share my "watershed" days with all of you 996ers. End of May, I signed up for "Cups & Saucers" at Watkins Glen, finally being able to qualify for THIS advanced, open track day. I also decided this was the year to "go big" and hired a private coach for a few sessions. I was super fortunate enough to work with Simon Kirkby for a few hours. He is the head of the instructors at Club Limerock, if I remember correctly. Simon has been "in the business" for ages and grew up with Dorsey Shrader. Anywho, he is simply quite amazing! His car control and teaching was nothing short of brilliant! I ran a 2:27.9 at WGI and there is much more to go, once I get the eyes, hands and feet to work together. 2 June I was at Limerock and Simon happened to be there before he was taking off to Mt. Kisco to work with a kid who is a karting phenomenon. He made it back to LRP and we went out for the last run of the day. OMFG! His insight is invaluable.......stock suspension (which he said needs to be changed as the steering input is hampering my abilities, right now) Simon, strapped in shotgun, grabbed the wheel more than once to show me the new line and, after a bit of time to dial it in, I turned a 1:04.8. My friend in his race Cayman S, can run under 0:59's. While I am not saying I am close, it is merely for camparison purposes. An incredible breakthrough for me, as I learn to rotate the car, let the back end step out a bit and get on the pwer much earlier. Whoa this is amazing stuff and for what it is worth, Connecticut Valley runs an excellent DE program, and there drivers are fast. I am in the white run group (intermediate, solo level) and for what it is worth, I passed a 996GT3RS, (yeah, mental note made of that one!) In short, regardless of the modifications, (which no doubt help) it really comes down to seat time and the instruction. If you want to get better, I must say from my experience, professional coaching is simply amazing and totally rewarding, money well spent. Just wanted to share the exhuberance, thankx R\ Scott

100% agree Scott, I had a huge day at the track Wednesday and one of my hurtles was consistantly hitting my marks. I ran several 1/2 hour sessions and then a marathon 45 minute one...there is no substitute for seat time and repetition....I have known for years that my head is really thick.... I opted against a coach this time because I knew what I needed at this point and I needed seat time. The car is plenty capable for now. I put down my fastest laps ever and more importantly discovered exactly where to drive and why,..... the track actually "got bigger" several places where it feels tight, opened WAY up and I found room I never knew exsisted and a light bulb came on BIG TIME... now I am no Mario, and I am never going to be "really good" but I made huge improvements. I will go back to a coach for the next DE... cant wait.. BTW I think I need a set of track tires, my "new tires" took a beating...there was a "tire guy" who helped me understand what was going on and the changes in pressures and "reading" the tires made a huge improvement in corner speed (which in turn was pretty hard on my street tires) I liked your story and agree so muvh that the track and a lot of seat time opens up a whole new world of what me car is really meant to do.. its a little scray, and really damn fun

Ed: I feel like I have drank the cool-aid. This stuff is addictive as hell. I, too am no Mario, but personal bests, improvement, run group graduation, yeah baby, that is what I am talking about! You get it! That is awesome, and I am glad that the 996ers in here appreciate the acheivements. Progress is the key, whichever way you get it. My friend has been telling me for two years, "professional" coaching" and I put my cheap stubborness aside and now kick myself for not doing this sooner. RE: Track tires. When Simon drove my car he finised by asking about my tires (Sumi HTRZ 111) that were new for the start of this year. We definatley need to make tires pressure (read increase) adjustments as the lack of sufficent pressure (he feels) is certainly causing sloppines. More on point, I asked him about Hoosiers, once I get the suspension changed. He said "no." He has a club limerock member who bought a set and the lap times didn't change. Most likely because he couldn't get enough heat in them. For me, same thing, he feels, at least right now. Maybe a set of Michelins (Super Sports if they made them in my size) would be "the ticket." And, that is kinda good becaue I have no way to get a second set of wheels/tires to the track and don't want a roof rack at this time, just and FYI for you. Oh yeah Ed, keep up the good work, the rewards of progress are inspriational! Pit out...... R\ Scott

yikes, fingers are not warmed-up, the spelling is atrocious. Off to give my baby a thorough batch, pull the wheels, check the brakes, etc., get here ready for the next one 2 June. Check back in later. Cheers.

So RE: the tire pressure, I too was too low.. I actually had to add air - I was -5 in the front and -4 in the rears. When I upped the pressure the tires (read corner speeds) really came to life - I then had a little "chunking" which I was told was a driving issue... meant I was on the gas before the car was straight and trail braking a little... so I tried to remove those issues and get back to the basics (straight braking, wait till I start to unwind before applying full gas...that was when the track got bigger? so wierd, subtle changes - huge differences. as for a second set of tires, I dont want "the best" or even a full on track tire... just dont want to destroy my tires I drive to work with...I am working on a set of MPSC's with 7 heat cycles in them for $200 for all 4.... I have some rims ni the garage I could use so maybe worth trying. i worry I wont put the heat in them too but as the driving improves so the budget for parts must grow a little.

Ed, I hear ya there with the budget and all that. Yes, I am going to add some more pressure to the tires, all the way around, we'll see what happens. Hey, if your tire guy has an extra set?????? I'm always looking for 225 front and 285 rears. I have begun to do some searching for the new Michelin Super Sports, not available in my size rears, just yet. Not sure if I can get a little bit wider, we'll see, not at critical mass yet. I, too am hoping that with a bit of increase in tires pressure that I see some better cornering. Chucking due to the way you were driving????? What tires are you running? Also, I have been trying to keep my tires pressures around the 36F/44R according to the specs on the gas cap lid........Not so sure that is right anymore. Any suggestions? Looks like your 996 is gone and now you are driving a 911 SC(?).

not SC - Carrera I am on Conti Extreme Contact DW so here was what I was told. Look up your tire on tire rack and look at the specs. There is a max pressure. For mine its 51 psi...he did some off the cuff guessing and said that my sweet spot will be about 46psi.. I run them at 29f and 36r (per manual) - he said start at 35 in all 4.... OOOOO T A Y ? (cookoo) the second I got "off track I check pressure - I was about 41f and 42r with a little less in one front..we added the differance to each tire to make it 46... so where ever the tire was at the point of adding..say back down to 38 from cooling, add 5psi F (to 42) and 4psi R - adding or subratcing form its current pressure once parked to hit your happy number then check after each session and see how well you did... my 3 & 4th sessions I came off track at 45F and 46R - for a 40/60 weight split car, thats a happy place to be...really, it worked amazing as for chunking we have a couple rough corners - poor surface, and when I was on the gas too early (read, not straightline) I was causing the weighted tire to do too much work,..the outter edge cupped and chuncked (a little..I will try and get pics) - so I straightened out my braking and held off on the WOT - it actually made me smoother in the turns because I was more neutral and could carry more speed. dude, i dont know...I am still learning SOOOOO much...I just am all ears to advice

Thanky! I'm taking notes.

oddly (and ask around) you want the tires to be equal pressure when coming off track...I think all the "staggered presures" had me thinking the rears needed more... that's not the case at all (from what I am learing)

first pic is the front...second/third are rears whowing a little chunking (keep in mind these have <1k miles on them you also to help find the happy spot, you have to look at roll over (too much roll, add presure, too little remove) I actually will try a little higher presure next DE.. maybe 46-47 hot next time out at the track talk with someone who is doing "tire stuff" and ask them for help reading your tires... then work with them all day.... you will be shocked at how much you learn and how much it helps

Wow, I will definately look for a tire guy, maybe find someone with a pyrometer9?) check to see what is going on.......but I agree with you, looks like I defiantely need some more pressure in them. 2 June I am back at Limerock, I will be trying a host of adjustments to the tires then, depending on weather, of course, as we have had nothing but rain.

Is limerock in Seattle

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It's just a short drive from downtown.

Ed, Maybe you should save those new Contis for the winter and use the old Bridgestone 750's I have sittng in my garage ... make me an offer ??? That was my plan but it may take a while before I get my C4 back on the road. I have a set of 17 inch rims to mount them on :-)

Jack, lets work something out....I am thinking about a second set of wheels/tires so your timing is perfect... I have a set of 993 Cup Wheels with gargabe tires I could use, or switch up to 17's.....I will need all the info on the tires (dates, tread, heat cycles, size) and wheels... maybe a pic ? you can email me right thru here I think by clicking on my name... if not I will fire you off my info - it's my user name at msn dot come

wait, re-read that... "get c4 back on the road" - ?????? details? is this related to the suspension?

OK I've only have my car for a few weeks now (03 c4s) and many people have told me to hit the track. I have never tracked a car before but reading posts like this really makes me want to start. I have a feeling I'd be pretty embarassed as a total noob but I might just have to give it a try.

OMG...you will NOT be embarressed - every single person understands what its like to be new... and every one is very supportive and friendly....seriously, its a wonderful and addicting thing to be involved with and you will learn things you never even knew exsited... and wonder how you ever drove without knowing.... I highly recommend a CCC or Skills day first, they are slow speed (under 50mph) and offer a whole bunch of seat time to get you started...plus in this area they are dirt cheap! If you come back from the track and didnt have fun....or feel like you were looked down upon for not being a world class driver....i will raise the funds here to pay for your entry fees.....somehow DO IT

OK you guys have me convinced. I've gotta start looking into what I need to do and where I can go (I'm in Austin, Tx).

become a PCA member, and sign up to one of their events... http://www.pca.org

+1 for Ivangene dotframe- you have nothing to worry about. You will be at an event with a bunch of other new drivers and guess what, (?) overall, you will meet some of the greatest dedicated P-car people, who are willing to help and talk to you about anything. Just ask and listen. It really is the people, they are awesome and you will make some great friends while you are at it. On the driving side, you will wish you had started years ago...it is amazing what these cars can do......but in the beginning, you will have an instructor and he will help to to keep things safe. As Redridge stated, join PCA, figure out your club affiliation, check their website, look up Driver's Education and ask the members, you will not regret it! P.S. it's addictive.....

Track & DE days are the highlight of my summer. Doesn't matter if it's sunny or raining, I just need my track fix. You learn so much about your car and your own abilities as well as transferrable skills to take back to the real world. You will be surprized at how much more aware you become on the civilian roads. I've been taking my 924S to Mosport for 5 years now and have learned so much about her. I just got a 99 996 last week and will be taking it to the track June 11/12. Will ask for an instructor for that weekend because now I have to learn how to drive a 911. Can't wait!!

one more thing to note....you will never be asked to drive your car faster then your confort level and never in any manner deemed un-safe. These events focus sharply on SAFE DRIVING the first DE might be a bit of a blurr.... it all happens pretty fast (no pun) and at least I was a little nervous and timid the sencond one, well I call this the dangerous one. Seems for me I knew what to do and that I had enough confidence to get into real trouble. third one you might be having identity crisis...the reality that you might not be as good as you thought could make you feel kind of "short" by the fouth event your learning should begin to ramp up pretty fast... then you become "aware" of something "NEW" and you cant remember any of the old stuff now on the 5th event you might be able to put the new stuff into pratcice...combined with the old - that is IF you have not made any mods to your car that mess with you this patter continues for years....at the end of the event you are already stoked about the next one that is .....WHAT? A MONTH AWAY its not an addiction, ...I swear I can stop anytime.....

This is awesome! It is nice to see, in here, the track junkies that are 911/996 owners. Ed, yeah, that's right, we can stop anytime......(just one more event, PLEASE) and I keep telling my wife, this is the last mod (yeah right)..... and +1 to Ed, again, yes, it seem on the way home, I am anticipating the tech inspection and the next one! Apply, Rinse and repeat, over and over, as often as possible! Mike_UCR- enjoy the new ride...good call on the instructor, the handling is nothing like your 924S, BUT, once you dial it in, you will love it!

I love the enthusiasm guys. "Tracking" is the reason I bought a Porsche. I knew once I purchased the car it was only a matter of time before i started to take it to events and learn the limits of the car. I was a suberbike rider for years and finally felt it was time to drive a proper sports car. To say that DEs are addictive is an understatement. I found that once I drove at speed in a closed environment I could not get enough seat time to satify the addiction. I started driving 2 events a month and soon learned that consumables would be the only thing from keeping me at the track every weekend. For the guys who are on the fence about track days, All I can say is jump over the fence mate. You will discover a whole new world and meet some terrific people along the way. My name is Carey and im a track junky.

dotframe, once you get your PCA stuff sorted out, you will have a blast. About two days before an event, I never get any sleep..... believe me, though it is well worth it. See, even Carey says so! No regrets, I'm sure, and Ivangene will hang out a "alms for the poor track guy" cup, should you decide that the sport isn't for you.......like that is gonna happen. You next posts will be after you get the helment and fire extinguisher, what mods should I do next.......you wait and see, don't say we didn't tell you so. Oh yeah, BTW: stop by to see my cousin Jason, he owns Lucky J's chicken and waffles truck just featured on the food channel...he's parked somewhere downtown (?)and the food is suppossed to be great. at least according to an Austin food blogger. If you have ANY questions, don't hestiate to ask, we will all help. R\ Scott

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look at your local PCA club site http://www.hcrpca.org/ it will list the local events, and you will meet some of the best people ever. We also have tracks in the Dallas area, Eagles Canyon and MSR- Cresson http://mav.pca.org/ again look at the events section, we have an event this weekend at ECR; Also in Texas is the fantastic TWS, look at the Houston PCA site: http://www.lsrpca.com/ We have an event in June, they sell out in a few hours so you have to be quick. I hope to see you at one of the tracks in Texas soon. Look for me in the #41 black SPEC996 You will have a blast!!!

This is a very timely post! Just my 1st DE this past weekend of the year. With the upgrades I've done the car is just awesome. Its the driver that needs the upgrades now. Every DE gets better and better. Last year I was a C driver. This year a B. Not quite at 'Flat Out' status but having a blast and making very good friends all at the same time. This past weekend I drove in the dry and the wet. The wet is completely opposite of what you would normally drive. Dry.....drive tight and hit the candy stripes tracking out...wet...drive wide (really wide) and avoid the dry line. The marbles are your friends in the wet. The best advice is seat time! When it comes to tire pressures I drive the 1st session of the day at normal street pressures. I measure what the pressure is when hot and see how much over stock I am. This weekend I was running 26 and 34 cold and coming off the track at 34/42 or 43. Damn good fun and I'm still driving the track while I sat at my desk today. Signing up for another DE in 3 weeks NOW!

yea, where ya been...we have been holding up the tent all alone over here !

Been psyching up>>>just put some pics up

Yea :thumup: sweet pics

Hi SP! I was wondering where you were "lurking." Even though we couldn't see it, I'm sure there is an ear to ear grin under the helmet. Excellent pix, too!!! I will enjoy a nice cigar in Ed's and your honor, (Carey, haven't forgotten about you, either). Looks like the Spring/Summer track season is well underway all around. I hope and wish all you delve into tracking "their babies" that they enjoy a great, safe, fun season full of advancement and personal bests. More pix, please. My wife took a bunch, I will upload a few once she sends me the pix or I get them on flash drive. I can't wait, back to Limerock on 2 June and maybe some more time with Simon, if he is available!

Been chomping at the bit to get back out there. Work is a cluster fu_k with busy time, short construction schedules and customers who wait to the last minute to order. That's why I have not been on here so much. But I'M PUTTING MY FOOT DOWN! I promise to log in at twice a day! Got to go....off to Chicago to see a satisfied customer.

I know how to get Pete to log in more

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Double dog dare you!

Love that first pic.... WTG Pete.... that front caliper is getting more yellow than ever. Slowing down from 5th gear can do that...

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Thanks Ferd...The left front is almost brown. The dude in the 944 behind said I was leaving rubber tracks in the corners. I had an absolute blast. Getting better at looking thru the turn with the eyes on the next. It is true that the hands will follow the eyes. This past weekend was the best yet!

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double dog !!

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Me want to be the Porsche hood crest on the 2nd pic.