Thinking of taking my 996 for it's first DE event...

I have a 951 with some VERY fun DE days on it. I just picked up a 996 and would like to take it to a track day. Several times in this forum I have see 'it happened to me' threads. Someone goes to a track day and has engine problems soon there after. If memory serves me, the thread I am thinking of diagnosed the problem as oil starvation of the engine. The track will be the new Kansas Speedway, high banks that the NASCAR guys run flat out on. I'm betting it will cause some serious G's on the long way around the banks. Is there anything special I can do to prevent oil starvation, if indeed that is the problem? THX!

A good start is getting the X51 oil pan. However, on a high bank, I don't think it'll be enough. You should consider an Accusump, but only if you want to track the car a lot. Otherwise, just keep the revs low and use a higher gear while on the banking.

how about running street tires or just throttle back a bit on the bank - that's a cheap solution and after all - it's a DE...not a race just a thought, I have not seen any issues locally but we dont have high speed banks have seen a number of cars cough and smoke because they had too much oil in them..the old thought of "make sure and top it off before my track day" seems to get more people in trouble than I would have thought

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+1

I have seen a lot of people say that as long as you are on street tires you can't pull enough lateral Gs to cause starvation. Don't know if the banking really changes that.

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Don't believe that. I saw oil pressure fluctuation in T7 (110 degree right hander, flat) at Road Atlanta on pretty lousy street tires (Sumitomo HTR ZIII). However, I was almost as fast through there in the 996 as I am in my 944 turbo racer on R compounds, for whatever that's worth.

Wouldn't banked give you LESS starvation than flat? I mean, you are physically putting the engine at the same plane as where you are forcing the oil, right? X51 "sump kit" is a waste without the rest of the X51 package. It will not help starvation much, if at all.

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Exactly what I was thinking. In a highly banked turn the force vector generated by inertia remains the same, but the angle of the car relative to the horizontal is changed. So relative to the angle of the car, the force vector is less.

Just make sure you have sufficient oil to start with and drive it! So many worriers, makes me wonder why anyone buys a 996... you're more likely to kill your engine missing a shift, or spinning out and hitting a wall butt-first than you are to starve the engine of oil.

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I can get oil pressure fluctuation driving 25mph on the street taking a corner... with regular or factory x51 engines. Fluctuation is not "starvation"...

Thanks for everyones feedback. Here is the track if someone is interested. Slow turn buy turn... You Tube At speed... You Tube

Your future= Attachment 692180

^^^Look who just got out of jail.......probation will be short lived

awe boi - pass the popcorn

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] http://newagexbrainwash.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/stoner-meme.jpg?w=545

LOL

Note: there was a smiley face at bottom. (humor)

posting that pic on a thread from a concerned owner with a smiley is a tad like telling you wife her sister was good in bed - with a wink

I bet the OP has read all "those" threads and got the joke.

yea - he sounds well informed

Here is a pic of our oil baffle which is an improved version of the X51 unit. We sell these direct but are also available from LN Engineering, Tarett Engineering and Pelican Parts. Feel free to contact me with any questions you have! Thank you, Don Weaver-EBS Racing [email removed] [phone removed]

Not sure if you saw this thread. I am not making any recommendation regarding the merits of the different posts, since it appears the opinions vary greatly, however felt it presented a number of different perspectives on the issue. https://rennlist.com/forums/showthre...errerid=114694

I was wondering how long before that thread resurfaced. Such great insight from "experts".

I remember reading that post golftime. If memory serves me a deep oil sump was installed but not the deep oil sump pick up, unbeknownst to the new owner - which sucks. I mean, what good is a tall glass of ice tea if your straw does not go to the bottom? I do appreciate everyone's input, both pros and cons.... and even KrazyK's wink/smile/bomb joke.

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[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/popcorn.gif

Im trying to be careful with my comments (unlike some) but I am working on the insult to post count ratio. Bottom line, track at your own risk (or rather your cars risk)!

and while you are at it - cross the street at your own risk.... you might slip on a puddle of oil

KC, why do you want to track the 996 anyway? If you have a track car, use that one and save the 996 for cruising. In other words, why would you risk the engine if you have doubts? "It is better to err on the side of caution" as a wise man once said. (Im sure others will say go for it, so your choice)

If you want to err on the side of caution, then stay off the track. Take the 996 out and have fun with it. It will be good to hear your comparison between the two cars.

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just never start the car - its too risky! the first engine failure I saw was a guy who stopped to fill up the car, got in, turned the key and KABOOM right at the gas station. just dont do it!!! I have YET to see one go boom boom on track - city pputt putt driving will kill your car faster than track driving - and if it does fail @ some point, well at least you had a good time!!! WOW - sorry this is NOT why I own a Porsche - even when I had my 996 with a 100+k miles I tracked it - and yes I worried...but I tracked it...and my 3.2 has 200k miles on it and I track the **** out of it - I had over 20 track days last year alone - yea... I worry a little but why would I own a Porsche and not go out and enjoy it there is a miss conception about a track day I think. I dont hammer my car, I dont beat it and it is NOT racing... I drive the car and I mean drive it! (this year has been focused on getting full throttle as much of the time as I can,.....so yea....I am driving it!!) but it is done smoothly and with love, not thrashing and abusing - and my car gets LOTS of pre and post track maintenance - which means its getting the best care I can give it this "be gentle with it, or it will break" attitude is just plain wrong and as for WHY WOULD YOU - I can help you --- because its a damn fun car to track! I was in one last Saturday and thinking - DAMN, this is a great car - then my student ran out of gas - but as we sat track side and waited for the tow truck all I did was reassure him...his driving was very good and he already knows how bad it feels to run out of fuel and shut down the session,,,no need for me to remind him of that - but WHAT A FUN CAR!!

/\ RIGHT ON ED! Blows my mind why someone would buy a Pcar and let it deteriorate in their care. Ownership is about enjoying everything the car has to offer. It is not...I repeat not a statue.

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I have no intention to address the engine issue presented, but I would like to say that tracking the 996, or any 911 for that matter, is such a different experience that it is well worth doing. Definitely will add to your skill set. And it's just plain fun too.

I guess people buy a 996 for different reasons, but,,,, I dont think Porsche had track racing in mind when they built and sold them. They probably expected a "track" customer to buy a GT2 or GT3. When I see a 996, Im thinking nice car to cruise around town, go to movies, go out to eat, type car. NOT a daily driver and certainly not a track car. The ultimate decision is up to the owner and who pays to fix it, so do what you want just dont blame Porsche or the "race track gods" if it blows. I dont see how a car NOT abused deteriorates if you take care of it?

KK.....you would be better off in a Buick. Sorry bud but you have no clue...at all.

How about an 87 Buick GN? Now your talking! And,, since Im "clueless" please post the links to some of your DIY's you have done so I might learn something from you.

[QUOTE=KrazyK;10120770 NOT a daily driver and certainly not a track car. [/QUOTE] That would be pretty disappointing if Porsche held that view of the Carreras. Many people buy a 911 because it is the most exotic car that is actually practical for everyday use. While not a dedicated track car, Carreras certainly should be track capable. My comparison is the Jeep Wrangler. While the Rubicon is the best off-road, I wouldn't hesitate to take any Wrangler on a trail. This actually bring up another interesting point. A Wrangler engine will run at pretty much any angle. I've had my Jeep basically standing on it's nose in a straight vertical condition, and with a wet sump engine, it didn't suffer from starvation. I've also been in 30 degree off camber situations, again w/o problem. So if Jeep can do it, why didn't Porsche?

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LOL. Mine is both right now and I am so very happy with it.

Why on earth would you "NOT" daily a 996? Everyday for me and a thrash through the hills on the weekends when I can, the car is way more capable and reliable than me.

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What you don't get is the history of the 911. The car is designed with performance at the fore front. They ARE meant for daily driving and the track....but only cruising for dinner?...please. Some owners only drive them in good weather while others drive them like they stole it. That is their prerogative and that is all good and fine. The guys who do track their cars realize that they are driving a car capable of +170 MHP. Never been that fast myself because I run out of room. The feeling you get coming into a corner at 120 is unbelievable. And guess what, the car is happy....really happy. My car tends to run so much better after a track weekend. As for the DIY's. I've done plenty. Most of them is what I have learned from others on RL. But if you do search you might find some. I have changed out my suspension, replaced my rotors, rebuilt my calipers and painted them too. Added stainless steel brake lines, changed out motor mounts, added a short shift kit, changed my seats, done the spark plugs and coil packs, had my cans off more than I care to say. During DE season the brakes are bled and track pads are put in...this happens several times a season. Changed the transmission fluid and replaced a back up switch for the reverse lights. Changed my ignition switch....that was a bitch. Added GT3 brake ducts and today I bought some used GT2 brakes ducts...better rotor cooling. Clean the radiators every Spring. Its simple 5 screws and the front bumper is off. Fixed the frunk locking mechanism, change the oil every 3-5K miles. A few months ago I bought a Durametric....great tool. Need more? Bark up someone else's tree while your humping your bumper. You clueless? Oh yea. Now.... how about those Packers!

Pete recently got heat in the garage - he types more now

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But I gotta get the bourbon bottle out of the garage......makes me chatty

that is my problem - well the chatty aspect of the equation we tried to put together another weather warrior track day for today, but the numbers were to low so we had to cancel I have no idea when the next day will be - but I have plenty of things to keep me busy prepping the car

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Bang on Pete!

Im just giving an opinion but this statement is laughable. I would go nuts if I used my car for a DD. Its too small, too low, theres very little cargo space, and its completely one-dimensional as for as use. Though it is fun to drive, DD's are usually practical. Either a pickup to haul stuff, or a great MPG beater to put travel miles on. And, speaking of Rubicons, I have one and would not want to use it as a DD either (with 37" Iroks). Whatever you like is what matters, just my opinion. Im not being argumentative but I dont think Porsche had DD in mind when they built the 996.

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I 100% disagree - I think that is exactly what they had in mind since the 356 days Porsche has often been considered the car you could take to the track and "race" (their words) on the weekend, drive it home and drive it work Monday morning --- it IS what makes a Porsche special - because it is NOT a single purpose car...never ever has been (at least not production models) I think you should research the history and what the good Dr has left on record for us to live by - and I will tell you - try and keep up my end of the deal

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My 996 is the my daily driver. If I'm going 3 hours away or just 5 minutes away. It goes with me everywhere unless the SUV is needed. It fits me like a glove. You, sir, are crazy with a K.

I think this is a tongue-in-cheek remark by KrazyK regarding the somewhat suspect build quality in the 996 model.

Each of us define Daily driver differently... My 996 was a DD until it took on a total Track rat roll... My 328 GTS made a great DD as well. It all comes down to what you feel comfortable in and with.

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Huh? I take one kid to school every day in mine, often pick up that one and two others from the other school later in the day. This weekend I went to three different stores and got enough supplies for a large BBQ we had yesterday, no problem fitting everything in, was able to hit the freeway on the way back up to 90mph between on and off-ramp, basically had fun on the everyday drudgery trips around town. We have a Minivan and a Touareg available at all times as well, and I choose to drive the Carrera every chance I get. What's more, my wife agrees and if we are going ANYwhere she first tries to rationalize taking the Carrera. Usually I agree! Heck , last week I took my oldest snowboarding and not being sure of the road situations up in WY, I took the Touareg. Regretted it the entire way there and back since the roads were great. Next time, P-car for sure! On top of all that, the Porsche gets better gas mileage than our other two cars even though the T-Reg is a TDI. If I was not able to drive it every day, there is no way I would have bought the car. No fun having a garage queen, IMO. Just a depreciating asset.

Im certainly not ragging on the 996 but: If anyone can find Porsche printing this about the 996, sounds like several people that blew up there 996 have an easy individual or class action suit. I doubt any auto manufacturer would be this crazy. If you show me this in print from Porsche I will admit being wrong. So post up.

Porsche. Engineered for Magic. Everyday.By Becky Johns, Friday, March 25th, 2011 at 4:02 pm For the first time, Porsche is challenging many Americans’ perceptions of Porsche sports cars—and in particular the 911—in a new campaign launching today. The “Engineered for Magic. Everyday” campaign, via agency Cramer-Krasselt/Chicago, seeks to show the many dimensions of the iconic Porsche 911 and the brand’s other storied sports cars through the lens of daily driving. “The magic of Porsche is how thoroughly the cars transform your everyday, routine driving,” said David Pryor, vice president of marketing, Porsche Cars North America. “It’s not only about the weekend joyride. It’s the only car in the world that combines true sports car exhilaration and the drivability for daily use. This campaign brings this fact to life, painting a bigger picture of the real Porsche value proposition, in some cases through the words and images of owners themselves.” Spanning TV, print, online, mobile, direct mail and a cinema promotion, the campaign drives home the engineering genius that allows these coveted sports cars to be everyday drivers. “When most people think of Porsche, they think ‘magic’—and the cars certainly are,” said Marshall Ross, chief creative officer, Cramer-Krasselt. ”What is markedly different about this campaign is we’re not selling the dream-car mystique of Porsche — that’s already a given. The creative challenge here was to tell the truth of the drivability of the car and still make it feel as special as it really is.” Debuting in selected markets tonight during the NCAA Tournament, the TV spot features vignettes of Porsche sports car owners in a number of seemingly everyday scenes: a parent picking up kids at school, a man running a home-improvement-store errand and a mom clearing away snow from the windshield each with titles re-characterizing the car as “school bus,” “pickup truck” and “snowmobile.” In another vignette, as a man fires up the engine after a long day at the office, we see how the car’s incredible, mood-shifting virtues—as his “getaway car”—complement the everyday ones. The closing voiceover says: “Engineered for Magic. Everyday.” At the hub of the integrated campaign is a consumer-generated website— PorscheEveryday.com —where owners can share their own everyday stories. With a combination of professionally produced videos and images along with owner-submitted content, the site builds a mosaic showcasing the many ways a Porsche is engineered for everyday magic. For this effort, Porsche has once again reached out to its passionate and active loyalists and enthusiasts to participate and contribute to the story. Last month, to start things off, Porsche sent 200 Flip video cameras to select owners asking them to contribute videos. The brand has also invited input from all its owners, the Porsche Club of America, dealers and their customers, and the million-plus Facebook fans for everyday stories, photos and videos. In partnership with the Reelz channel, Porsche will also invite amateur film-makers to submit films that demonstrate “daily magic.” Ten filmmakers will be selected to experience daily magic in a Porsche and then make a film about the experience. The winning submission will be shown in cinemas across the country—a first for Porsche—and on the Reelz channel.

Here's the commercial that C4CRNA references... You Tube

Great info but I guess I missed the part about the 996 and anything about "track" or "race". And, yes I would love a new 911 over the SUV.

So as I'm sure most want to know....KK.......why the hell did you buy a Porsche? I'm sure your pcar wants to know. It wants to run with the wind, beat the sunset and make its owner happy. After all the "what do you think of this one, that one, this......." threads... I don't get it.

he purchased his Pcar so he would be able too join Rennlist...

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Though didn't he recently get banned for some reason?

Well - I looked a little and it turns out I dont have to convince myself so I dont give a rats azz But I know I saw an old commercial where Porsche said pretty much exactly what I said above - you can search youtube for Porsche commercials ---- or just hide in the corner and worry your precious suffering ill fated use ---- pray I dont get a hold of your car because she might not want to come back home afterwards value in ownership is enjoyment of time spent vs cost to spend it - enjoy yours how you like and quit all the class action law suit, IMS blow up rhetoric here is an official Porsche Poster - PRINT - I know it's not a 996 - you search the years you like, I'll search the years I like did find this 996 C4S Cab I found some good pics and lost an hour - what day is it?

You guys ever hear of the Porsche Koni Challenge race series?

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Love these...

actually I think it's a Boxster but I was hoping no one would point that out

Is that KK leaning up against the red 911?

Now, if I could get my wife on the front of our Pcar dressed like that... All would be right in the world.

you know that is right

Im sure we all bought for our own reason. I did so I can slowly transform the car into like new condition by replacing every worn or broken part. I also drive it sometimes on "date night". Why is it a problem if someone does not want to race, track, or DD, their Porsche?

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it's not - but it is a problem to tell others it is look back at the conversation - who says what - we only say its fun, and it wont hurt the car - "someone" likes to say you'll regret it and come home in a puddle of oil on a flatbed calling Porsche AG asking who to file the law suit against come on man - are you bi-polar (I ask because we -- err I meant I is)

I think your right, its just too dangerous out there for my Porsche. Maybe I will detail it all winter and bring out for sun in the spring.

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are you bi-polar?

Didnt take long for "someone" to derail this thread into Insult City.

you must be new here - that is NOT insult city not even from the suburbs of insult city

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Wow, it's responses to threads like these that cause me not to want to check the 996 section when I view Rennlist. Buy a Pcar and then be afraid to drive it hard...Really???(BTW, this comment is not directed toward the OP.) To the OP - I have personally tracked 996s and MANY others have as well without any issues. However, I'd be a bit leery about taking the 996 on a high banked oval track, not because of anything to do with the 996 but rather I'd be wary of tracking any high performance "street" car in such a way. Blowing out a rear tire(especially in a rear engined 911 on street tires) under the high G loads experienced on a high banked oval would concern me more than possible oil starvation issues. As far as tracking the 996 on a road circuit, I say go for it. If you are still concerned with oil starvation simply stay on sreet rubber and add an X51 oil pan and/or an accusump system if it makes you feel better. Don't pass up the chance to track your 996, I guarantee you'll have a blast. P.S. - Congrats on the new 996...

Mine is at 123k miles today. I drive it everyday, in fact I was thinking of starting a new thread to show how dirty my car is since I haven't had a chance to wash it in about a month. Somewhat of an anti-beauty thread. It's so dirty that there is still some nose prints on the side window from when I had to take my dog to the vet the other day because the wife had the SUV at work. I take it to the grocery store, home improvement stores, and to go cruising. Then about 3-4 times a year it gets beat up on the track. Even at 120k+ miles on the odometer it still pulls strong to 7000 RPM and laughs at me when I think I'm surpassing it's abilities on the track. Then another 6+ times a year it's avoiding the cones at the autocross track where once again the driver is the limiting factor in the amount of fun it can have. When I first got into the Porsche experience my first 944 was a garage queen for a long time. But then when I relocated to the South I decided to only bring one car with me and it was the Porsche. My commute wasn't long I decided to make it the everyday car. Since then I wouldn't have it any other way with a "regular" production model Porsche. My commute is much longer now but it's still a treat to use the car every day. I couldn't imagine commuting in a boring car every single day. Sure I might get less than 20 MPG in town but who cares? Since it's not likely to become a collectors item why shouldn't I get the most I can out of it? Sure it cleans up real nice as you can see in my avatar but if you get closer you see some paint chips and other items that would keep it from winning any beauty contests. They bother me at times but then I get the satisfaction of knowing I use my car in every way I can. And if something breaks? I replace it, in fact since I've started tracking I think my car is better maintained than if I drove it only every once in a while. After all a track inspection is pretty thorough and you can't play if your car is even suspected of being sick. We all buy these cars for different reasons but if you really want to see what it's capable of doing...TRACK IT!

I'm sure this video has been on this forum before, but it helps convince me that the Porsche engineers considered g-forces and oil starvation during development and testing. Pretty cool sound also! You Tube YouTube: "2009 Porsche 911 Engine Oil Sump Test Rig"

KC-944 - Talking to locals about the track, they have said that the layout should prove to be brutal to street cars. Between the long full throttle runs on the oval, to the heavy braking at the end of the oval, the brakes and tires will take a toll. And expect your temp gage to be leaning to the right. A third radiator and real oil cooler would be a must. Heartland will wear out a set of tires and brakes on a weekend, and it is a slower track. Looking forward to see the first runs.

KC, by all means I agree. Track it and please install a dashcam so others can enjoy the track experience. Keep at it and continue to best your personal times for each lap. Push the car to its limits and please post your findings. I cant wait to do the same. Thanks.

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That is cool as hell!

Im sure the exact same test was used on the M96 so its track proof for sure.

Trolololololol. KrazyK I've only ever muted one other user on an internet forum over the years. You sir, will be number 2. Happy trollin to you.

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just about there with you on that one

Heck, just when I was starting to agree with you.

I'm there too.......where is the emicon for a ******* punch?

3 against 1, thats not fair! You better bring more guys. Relax everyone. That was a joke (I hope from him too) and a fine example of internet humor.

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Yes......just poking.....

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boy - you nailed that one