New Owner, Intermediate Shaft Bearing Question

Hi, I own a small used car dealership and deal mainly in late model European cars still under factory warranty. But, I just bought a black on gray 2002 911, tiptronic, with 60k miles, comfort seats, soft look leather, advanced technic package, and 18" 5 star wheels that I don't know the name of (options sheet says RAD wheels). It's my first Porsche. The 997 has really been catching my eye but once I saw this black beauty and the reasonable price, I jumped on it. It was a CPO car up until late last year so I'm hoping most of the major issues that I read about have been taken care of. My biggest concern is the Intermediate Shaft bearing. I read on the Ultimate Preowned 996 Buying Guide on here that the factory has a replacement bearing and update for the shaft. Is that something that should preemptively done or would that be cost prohibitive? I plan on putting it through the shop and seeing if the 60k service appears to have been completed or not. If not I'll have the plugs replaced, oil changed, filters etc. done. Ultimately I bought it for resale, but the real reason I bought it was to satisfy the urge to own a 911 that I've had since I was 16! Great forum, I've learned alot from looking through all the posts.

Forget the OEM replacement, if you are going to do an upgrade check on this one: http://www.lnengineering.com/ims.html Some IMS go for 100,000+ with no problems, others are bad with only a few miles. There are lots of posts on this. Doesn't seem to make alot of difference on maintenence, etc. That why you will see some go bad with only a few miles on the engine, and others go forever. Really a bad design. The LN upgrade is the only way to go if you are going to upgrade at all.

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"...should be preemptively done..."? As you've seen in other threads, there's no consensus on that. It's a roll of the dice. I would do it - did do it - but I'm like that. The cost is a fraction of a year's depreciation, to put it in perspective. I like sleeping better. Other guys have more nerve or common sense than I do. "...cost prohibitive..."? In my opinion, no. Around here, it's north of two grand to do the upgrade. Not bad for a Porsche. If you need to do anything else in there, like a clutch or RMS, it becomes a bargain because a lot of the labour is redundant, which is how a good indy would charge for it. If it were me, and I was in love with this car and planned to drive it for awhile, I'd open 'er up, do the IMS bearing, update the RMS and eyeball the clutch while I'm in there. Pay it forward for the pleasure of driving the car. That's one opinion, anyway. Good luck!

+1.. definitely get the IMS upgrade from LN engineering... the 02+ 3.6 engines have seen more IMS failures than the old 3.4 motors... this is a must..

Anyone know who does this upgrade in Dallas Ft. Worth area? Can dealers do it? Or do I need to drive to IL to get this done? And about $2,000? Thanks,

Or ship it to Georgia... :-)

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hey now...

What's the significance of Illinois?

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None. The reference was erroneously typed as IL but should have been LN, as in LN Engineering.

aaaah. Got it. I llive in IL and don't have the upgrade, so i thought maybe there was as especially good shop here for that or something.

Well, LN Engineering is located in Illinois.

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I actually have to go to Atlanta for business. Heck..I can drive it there...let you upgrade it..

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Yeah..that's why I said IL.. Thanks,

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Correct, my bad! I was thinking of Jake's location in GA.

Ok, so another IMS question..which I'm not sure it's been raised previously or not.. How many IMS Failure have we seen on LN Engineering IMS upgraded engines?

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Two issues. 1. Probably too new on the market to even see this yet. And the numbers are small. 2. If there are any failures, do you think that number would be public knowledge? Again, have you talked directly to Charles at LN or Jake at Flat6 to get any of your questions answered?

Hey Dell, maybe you could start a poll about the number of IMS failu....... oh, never mind!

Or....we could start a poll to guess how many IMS threads there will be in the new year!

In all the posts here and on other Porsche sites I have never seen one that had a failure on an LN Bearing, or on one of Jake's rebuilt engines. And we see posts on other failures almost everyday. I would think that if someone had a failure on one of these we would hear about it really quickly,

This fall, in great frustration, I traded my gorgeous but endlessly troublesome Range Rover in on its exact opposite: A Toyota truck. I need something when we're in the country that will start and go, all the time every time, no matter what the conditions. And, of course, I then started trolling Toyota truck message boards to accelerate my learning curve. Let's just say I learned two things: The internet amplifies complaints like a Marshall stack. And there are no guarantees in life, other than the obvious.

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Agreed.

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To answer your question RUF can do it. Give Hans a call.

Th effectiveness of the IMS retrofit program is currently 100%.. I have had ONE engine failure occur with a purchaser.. When the oil pump drive snapped in half due to the insane throttle response of the engine while on the track. At the time that was our highest output engine and we now have a chromoly, totally overkill replacement for the pump drive that snapped and EVERY engine gets one. Build enough high output engines and you'll have parts scatter.. Nothing I create is stock, so things will break when we are making big power. The engine had no warranty, but I insisted to repair it for free, which meant a full re-creation... The client was a real sport and was more than understanding. We now have serialized door decals for the IMSR procedure to validate cars that have had it applied.. People already started lying about having the procedure done and this keeps everyone honest since we log VIN info, stamp each bearing flange and also log the engine serial number so it can be tracked infinitely during service.

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I've seen cars advertised as having the IMS bearing upgrade, but dig a little and they mean that the RMS has been replaced. Most "normal" people just don't understand the difference.

Yes, most sellers and buyers both do not know the difference, BUT on a few occasions people have stated that their IMS was retrofitted with our procedures when it had not been. Both these occasions were cars that had been listed for sale by car dealers. We know where every bearing has been sold and each one is serialized and logged with the engine ID from the engine it was fitted to and the car. This mis-representation has occurred on a few occasions and we decided to make it much more difficult for future attempts to be successful.. This will keep everyone more honest.

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Jake, I assume you mean every bearing sold by you. I bought mine directly from LN Engineering, and from our earlier conversations I'm going to assume you have no record of those. I think this is an important clarification. If I ever sold my car, someone might assume that since you have no record of the IMS bearing upgrade for my VIN, I'm lying, when in fact I simply bought it from the manufacturer and had it installed elsewhere.

Yes, only the bearings we have sold are seeing this procedure.. Charles at LN is doing something similar but hasn't implemented it yet. Charles has a database of who bearings have been sold to as well. I am sure he could verify it easily if need be.