TPC VS. EVO Supercharger kits for the 3.6L 02' Carrera??

I love my new 996 C2 02' model....great power, excellent handling....but I bought this car with the intent on making a monster I was looking at various supercharger kits and F/I solutions even before purchasing the car. And for the love of god, I can't decide on if the TPC (Turbo performance center) positive displacement style blower is more impressive (faster) or the centrifugal one the EVO sells. I would really appreciate input on this and if any actual owners of these kits can comment with details it would be very helpful as well, thanks!

I would do a search since there are several people on this board that have the kits (both types) and have posted write-ups about their ownership...even some updates after xxx miles. You will definitely wanted to hear from Robyn and Kirby as they have them on their 996 3.6's.

Robyn ? Kirby ? Can u guys chime in on how well your supercharger package impressed you...power & reliabiliy wise. Anyone here have the TPC kit ? I would presume that kit to be much faster overall being its a positive displacement style supercharger that gives all its boost starting very early in the powerband like a resposive turbo system. Comments ? Either set-up will represent a huge investment so I would want to be sure I choose the correct one....if either at all* Thanks.

Go with the EVO system. Dependable with great results.

If I were you call TPC [phone removed].

In a highway roll-on....straight up.....02' carrera 3.6 VS. 996 TT w/ X50 upgrade....I want to be able to beat the X50 TT from 40-140. Is this possible with either kit ??

Probably not....

What color is your 996? This way I'll know to pull over when you're closing in at 140 MPH...

EVO advertises 470 flywheel HP for their supercharger package....and this in a platform thats significantly *lighter with less driveline losses*.....how do you figure ?? Oh yes and Kirby, what "minor" problems are u having with your kit ? (I read ur mention of tht in another thread) Thanks.

My guess is that Kirby knows what the kit can do.

Is the EVO kit C.A.R.B. certified? If not, what are the solutions for passing CA smog?

both being equal drivers from 0 to 60 you'll probably get the jump on the turbo.... After that the TT will start to pull away.

THAT would be ONE if the issues... Solution...remove the SC.

You see....that suggestion makes even less sense to me. As a TT is also AWD and would clearly have the "jump"...not to mention its turbo powerband is torqier respective to its top end pull than the centrifugally supercharged 3.6 is (going by ALL the dynos I've seen on both)....hence I would imagine the top-end oriented (powerband wise) Centrifugally blown, lighter with less driveline loss C2 would in fact pull away up top...and *may* be beating to 60 from a standstill becuase of the AWD + torque advantage of the X50 TT... PS: ...don't mean to challenge your insight or experiences, I'm really interested in absorbing the wealth of knowledge + experiences you and the other F/I'ed members have as I'm still in the learning curve on *these* cars...but I'm not a newbie to performance cars or supercharging an N/A.

My 3.4 SC'd 996 C2 beats all stock Turbo's quite easily up to 120. I haven't bothered much above that speed. You have a much nimbler car in the 996 pushing more horsepower. Depending on your SC setup (exhaust, tires, etc) the Turbo will start outperforming at higher speeds.

Newbie to performance cars? How about coming to Summit Point or VIR with the local PCA region and experience how impressive the car is stock(ish)? You'd be amazed. Supercharge the car once you're able to access over 80% of the performance. I have no clue where you can run to 140 in the washington metro area either! Although VIR has a back straight that is nearly a mile long. ;-) I've been in a TPC supercharged 996 and it was highly impressive. A very different feel compared to the turbo. Maybe the longish gearing holds it back somewhat? The 996TT is definitely geared a bit shorter through 3rd gear at least. -KJ

Thanks for the invite, I plan on doing exactly that...just like I did with my Acura NSX (Computech supercharged), Z06 vette (supercharged), and 500HP MKIV TT Supra I had.....I do enjoy the jefferson circuit as well. (General statement)- I would appreciate the "judgments" on doing 140+ MPH on a public hwy be done away with. My goal for spending $13,000+ on my car aren't for *just* better track times at Summit point....its to not be embarrassed by any run of the mill C6 vette on 495 or the interstate. (Not to say it happens often, but thats were MY priorities lie) When you say the TPC Supercharged 996 was "impressive"...would you say it felt (or is) faster than a 996TT (X50) ?? 40-to-140 pull** (was it a 3.6 L 996 or 3.4 u rode in?) Anyone else have input no this....has anyone actually timing an EVO or TPC SC'ed 996 car in the 1/4 mile to see what real improvements these expensive kits in fact give ??

I apologize, I misread your original post. You are NOT a newbie to performance cars. What groups did/do you run with at the track. Unfortunately I rarely run with groups that contains the high HP machinery you had out there. I'm stuck chasing cup cars and turbos and GT3s. I'd imagine those cars felt like bulls in a china shop at the JC. I didn't make any judgment call on how you behave on the streets. Nor do i think any one else did here either. I still don't know anywhere in the metro area where you can go 140 though. And while I understand your priorities, i think it's an interesting comparison of 2 enthusiasts. I get embarrassed when I DO get goaded into contests of speed on the streets however rarely it happens. I am no saint though. The TPC car didn't have the torquey feel of the TT so it felt slower. There wasn't a TT near the car when I was in it so i can't say whether it was faster or not. To me, torque gives the feel of speed and can be deceiving at times. My S4 feels quicker than my 996 but it isn't. The TPC car pulled well from the mid-range to the top end though. I Also recall that it might not have been completely tuned. Sorry I can't be of more help. -KJ

Last time I checked, I was hitting 100 mph from a standstill in 9.5 seconds on street tires.

Out of curiosity, how did you measure this time to 100mph ? Gtech pro, intrument, other ? That seems to be on par with a stock TT to 100mph...which for a 3.4 is stout** EVO states their kit on a 3.6 is a world faster than a 3.4 too. (50 more HP and a lot more torque) I wish I could get concrete results/times on exactly what these cars can do equipped with these two supercharger packages....

I wouldn't recommend 'real' 1/4 mile drag racing with any 996, the suspension/ differential/ tranny /clutch will never handle the stresses, street tires/grudge nite is a different story. the best venue for a 996 is a road course. As a point of reference, my car with minor engine mods, X73 suspension and race tires will spank most stock turbos/sc'd cars around the track, and has. Suspension, tires, driver skill will neutralize raw hp 90% of the time. Now take one of these cars and set it up correctly suspension/tire/driver wise and look out! As far as evaluating gains a g-timer is just as good/accurate as a chassis dyno, IMO.

Put it this way...up to 120 mph, my 3.4 stays ahead of all stock turbos, GT3's and the GT2 cannot pull away. If I wanted to abuse the car by lowering the 44psi I run in the back tires and pull a hole shot from the start, times would be obviously be substantially better. My times are without ANY wheel spin. There are 2 TPC SC'd 996's around here and they are considerably slower and run hotter than hell. They have more torque at the low end, but their intake temps are much hotter than the EVO SC, greatly decreasing the power in the top third of the rpm range. One guy measured 195F intake temp after 2 runs. I can keep my intake temps about 40 or degrees above ambient temps after several runs.

Wow...thanks for that bit of information, very interesting** TPC reccommends a GT3 radiator upgrade with their kit which i thought was peculiar* Your information runs consistent with that. ...do you have any other power mods like exhaust or just the EVO kit? I am curious as to how much your car dyno's at the wheels.

I have a 2004 C4S that just underwent a transformation including an Evo Supercharger system. I carefully weighed the advantages of a Roots blower (TPC) compared to a centrifugal blower (Evo) and found that the Evo system was a more complete package. The intercooler system and the GIAC tuning combined to make a better overall performing (and better looking) system. My ride put down 411 at the wheels which translates to nearly 500 at the crank. While I haven't raced a stock turbo, I am quite confident I could pull cleanly away. An X50 might be more of a challenge but I am sure I could hold my own. I think a C2 would be even faster given the weight differential. I really like my added power and would recommened it to anyone.

Thanks for sharing that, these are the type of accolades I'm looking for to justify the $13,000+ cost of doing the kit to my 02' C2. If you can hold your own against an X50 TT being a C4S...a lighter C2 with a more efficent drivetrain (RWD only) should pull away from it convincingly** ...although it would be good to hear from someone whom also owns a TPC SC equipped car so that this exchange isn't bias or one dimensional....but I'm having trouble finding a person who actually owns one on these forums.

The only mod besides the supercharger is 2003 C4S mufflers that I just recently put on. I have done a few things to reduce engine and intake temps over the stock temps which has also helped with increasing power. As far as dyno results; I have dyno results showing 372 RWHP, 437 RWHP and 407 RWHP, all done the same day on 3 different dynojet systems. I have no idea which is correct, if any....nor do I care. I don't bother with them since you can make them read anything you want. I rely on real world performance to measure improvements. If the car performs the way you want, does it matter whether an artificial power test shows 200 hp or 400 hp? A dyno chart won't win a race. Like Chris said earlier, a good G-timer is as good as a dyno in measuring changes in performance. The stock EVO system is a safe and reliable perfomance mod for the 996. You have to remember that the boost, as with the Turbo, is not present in the engine for 99% of the time, so these naysayers that say having constant boost on a 996 will destroy the engine, obviously do not know what they are talking about. I drive my car extremely hard and have no problems and use no oil. Additionally, you can completely reverse the mod in a few hours time is you so desire.

let me get this straight... you wanna get positive manifold pressure so w/ lots of hp&torque you can beat up on lower hp C2's??? (am I missing something? where's the fun in that?) wouldn't you rather have lower hp and beat up on the more powerful cars?

I haven't heard a word about reliability issues, and I know they exist. What's more reliable, an EVO supercharger or twin turbo. If I drop $13k for the supercharger (instead of $20-30 to upgrade to the TT), will my car be in the shop constantly with no mechanic in town having an understanding of EVO kits?

I have no reliability issues, so if you know they exists, you should enlighten us with the details.

No worries KJ, I think his comment was directed at me, for my earlier post asking the color of his 996, so I could pull over as he closes in at 140 MPH. Still waiting for an answer....

The supercharger system has MANY fewer components and less complexity than a Turbo system. This generally infers a more reliable platform. I know of NO instances of a SC causing any measurable harm to an engine nor any mechanical issues. There have been some instances of an oil line leak as a result of an improper installation but other than that, NADA. There have been nearly 100 Evo 996 kits sold and all reports I have seen have been positive, including mine.

An sc is a very tempting mod, I think the Ruf and Evo systems are the best and about as good. I once saw a tpc on a boxster blow a motor all over the track. The big advantage of a Ruf in my eyes is the Ruf reputation and 2 yr warranty on the motor. I understand evo will be coming out with a 36mo warranty at a higher cost soon. CARB approval is a big problem for the evo, I understand tpc already has it and Ruf is applying for it now. If I was pulling the trigger today I'd go with a Ruf unit just for the peace of mind.

As usual, you and I think alike on this. I think the Ruf would be great, but the problem I have is that I don't really "need" it now that I am using the 996 solely for the street. I wonder whether the cash could better be used elsewhere (e.g., GT3, 997S, etc . . . )

Agreed. I really enjoy pushing my car now, and I'm nowhere near the limit. When I did the PDE Dave Murray took me out on a hot lap in a plain 996, at the conclusion, after I changed underwear, he asked if I still thought I needed a Turbo. I replied, no. 20k for the Ruf and at least 13k for the Evo is a lot of cash to drop, if you're ready to do that why not just take the cash and your current ride and get a GT3. Right now, my car with minor engine mods, X73 and R compound tires spanks alot of cars on the track. But, it is very tempting I must admit.

Chris, what R compounds are you running?

Michilin Sport Cups, 225 fr/295 r.

Dr. W, care to comment on your experience?

Thanks Chris! That is exaclty what I was thinking of moving to for the track. Any reason why you went 225/295 over 235/295?

Don't the AWD P-cars require a specific rolling diameter matched front to back? I'm on 235/295 w/my C2. -KJ

I think KJ is right, I just went with the stock sizes in cups. When I had snows on my car they were way different (sizes)and the awd was constantly correcting itself, a weird sensation while driving.

After many problems related to a poor install I can now say my SC is running perfectly, except for the occasional CEL that I can delete with the OBDII program. It is the Evo and Todd does his best to fix any problems he can over the phone. I would not suggest any of the aftermarket blowers for those faint of heart and not willing to get their hands dirty, unless blessed with a great local shop and lots of money. Has anyone considered using a water spray on the front intercooler heat exchanger? I have been toying with the idea of intercooler cooling which is popular with nitrous or liquid CO2. It would be simple to fashion a plastic resivoir in the spare tire space and use a small pump to spray iced water al la Subaru WRX STi. Just a little R&D with those spot thermometers might show a significant drop in the charge temperature and the cost would be minimal. Always thinking. Just a little more HP please. Will

NOS or CO2 intercooler spray will definitely net you gains....we use to rig those up as a cheap HP bump on our Supra's front mount intercoolers all the time, especially in the summer...the gains are VERY noticable (i'd say 30+rwhp on a stock turbo's MKIV supra.) Have you (or anybody else) also done the header and exhaust (full exhaust) mods yet to complement the blower package? I would presume a noticable gain with full exhaust being the kind of CFM's that are coming out of a supercharged 911 motor.

all this high hp build up.... who exactly are you preparing to race with this sc'd beast?

*Anyone!* ...i think thats the whole point, hehe

there used to be (can't seem to find it now) a club based o/o dc... "the high rollers" or something like that.... they had lots of high hp machinery. never used them on the track though... pity.

You have to also take into consideration the air temp sensor of the MAF if you cool the air after it passes that point. Otherwise your car will run leaner than setup for. The fuel mapping is based on assumptions that the air will be specific temp compared to the MAF reading. So all you would do if you lowered your intake temp to half of what it is now without adjusting the MAF, is maybe a slight gain in power by adding denser air to the mixture, but at a cost of running lean.

As usual, I agree with both of you guy's. I know TD has already bought a lower hp. track car, and I too am totally embarassed with the hp. I have now . 90% of the cars on the track has lower hp. than my stock motor, and what's the fun in passing them, passing turbos and ZO6's with my stock motor,... now that's a whole lot of fun . So, a sc or turbo will just lessen the fun for me.