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YOUR RESEARCHWhat is the total oil capacity for a 996?
Reported or suspected cause
interaction of two very different oils
Reported cause
No successful repair reported for this finding.
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Read evidence and context
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Reported cause
with Gibbs Racing and his opinion was it was due to the interaction of two very different oils.
Leading evidence: 'interaction of two very different oils' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'interaction of two very different oils' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Check engine cold, you will get a higher reading than' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
Change the oil once per year and not once have I checked oil levels in between changes.
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FYI, the oil on the GT3 must be checked wile the beast is running.
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I put in 9 quarts and that filled her nearly to the full mark on the dipstick and halfway up on the digital gauge.
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Suggestion
All the oil has run back in the sump, resulting in this higher reading, with the warm check procedures, there is always going to be some oil off in the far corner of the engine, so you will get a resulting lower reading." The four methods of checking the Oil in a 996 from the article.
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Suggestion
All the oil has run back in the sump, resulting in this higher reading, with the warm check procedures, there is always going to be some oil off in the far corner of the engine, so you will get a resulting lower reading." The four methods of checking the Oil in a 996 from the article.
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I change my own and it usually takes 9.5 quarts give or take but is there a significant amount of oil left in the engine that doesn't make it to the pan or is it negligible/fraction of a quart. I seem to remember that was the case with the air-cooled cars where oil played a significant role in cooling the engine. I googled it but all I turned up was the amount needed for an oil change, not the total capacity.
Thanks.
From an old Renntech post:
"Porsche changed oil fill capacities somewhere along the line during 996 production due to the cars smoking during turns. There is a technical bulletin somewhere detailing the specifics. The cars with the greater fill capacities can be identified via the dipstick. If your dipstick has tangs on it at the yellow ring, it is the new style and the capacity is .5 (cant remember exactly if its liters or quarts) less than the previous style. On the earlier cars, around 9.2 quarts give or take a tenth seems to work and the newer cars seem to take around 8.7 give or take a tenth. When you take about amounts down to the tenth of the quart or liter you have to take into consideration the amount of time you let the oil drain."
...and the subsequent post from the same thread also had useful info re: when you check the oil can change the results...
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There is a letter in Excellence April 2005 ed. page 22-26 that explains this very issue. In the letter Bruce Anderson is explaining to someone the proper method of checking the Oil in modern 996 type cars. As their are four different methods of checking the Oil Bruce go's on to say "How you check your oil will result in different readings. When you check the engine cold, you will get a higher reading than with the other methods. All the oil has run back in the sump, resulting in this higher reading, with the warm check procedures, there is always going to be some oil off in the far corner of the engine, so you will get a resulting lower reading." The four methods of checking the Oil in a 996 from the article. 1. With the engine cold when you turn the ignition key to "Accessory" (Gauge method) 2. By switching a warm engine off then turning the key back on and waiting for the time to run down to zero. 3. What Porsche calls the automatic oil level measurement when you are fueling. The motor must be warm. This presumes the engine is shut off for a few minutes (about 5) but less than 15 min. When you turn the key back on the oil level is displayed for approx. one minute. 4. The Old fashioned way, with the dipstick (Cold engine) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- the article go's on to say that the newer 997 and 997S cars no longer have dipsticks so you have to rely on the gauge on the instrument panel. The bottom line is just check the oil cold on a 996 and it will be fine. This method gives a more realistic picture of the current oil capacity. A little of topic but pertinent. D Man
So sorry I didn't properly articulate. After you have drained all the oil from the pan, is there a significant amount of oil left in the engine or does it pretty much all feed into the pan.
There can be several liters of oil left in the engine even after a hot oil drain interval of 1 hour, or even overnight.
I don't have the numbers for the NA 996 engine but I have the numbers for the Turbo engine.
Engine oil capacity is approx. 12.5l.
Change quantity is 8.5l.
With filter change this increases to 8.75l.
The Turbo drain procedure calls for the oil to be hot (at least 70C IIRC) and a drain interval of 20 minutes.
The NA 996 engine probably retains less oil as it does not have the turbos, their oil lines, etc.
Often when I change the oil I let it drain over night. Once I replaced the oil catch basin with an empty 2# coffee can when the oil was down to drips......... I let the jack down so the car would sit flat (coffee can had clearance from bottom of crank case).
Came back the next day and coffee can was full and about a half a cup or so overflowed on to shop floor.
Mine is a 2000 C4. don't know if that matters, and not sure of there are oil lines that run up to an oil cooler in front.
I was surprised how much oil the girl takes so i always get 10 quarts in preparation for an oil / filter change.
I'll say about 1/4th-1/2 quart more oil can be drained by removing the sump pan & allowing oil to drain for a week after removing drain plug & filter while engine is over 150 degrees. The key is removing as much old oil as is practicle. There is no need to waste time trying to get the oil level perfectly at the full mark.
Gotcha - check when cold. The dipstick is good for whacking people who hover and offer advice, not much else.
FYI, the oil on the GT3 must be checked wile the beast is running. It won't "let" you check it until it has deemed the oil warmed up. One does not argue with a Mezger engine.
Guys please. I'm not talking about what you drain. I'm talking about how much oil is in the engine AFTER you drain your 9 or 9.5 quarts.
I'm going with Macster's answer. Thanks for all the 9 quart answers but he's right. About 4 quarts remain in the engine regardless of how much you drain from the sump. This is his world. The rest of us are just guests.
Isn't that more of a dry sump anyway?
I don't really check it either, and when I do it's only to make sure the oil is somewhere on the scale or between the marks. I guess now we're saying it has around 10-12 quarts, a little low or not on the mark isn't going to hurt things all that much.
That's not my experience when I dissembled an M96 engine. I didn't measure but I estimate around 1~2qts. No way the engine can hold 4 quarts w/o the sump. Most of the residual oil was in the bottom of the cam covers.
The info I posted was out of the Porsche factory 996 Turbo reference manual.
I did say the NA 996 would likely retain less oil than the ~4l the Turbo engine retains. The Turbo engine has those turbos, their oil supply/return lines, collector boxes, separate oil tank, more scavage pumps, etc.
If I had to "guess" I could come up with an ~2l amount of oil retained by the NA 996 engine.
There is the oil/water heat exchanger, the various engine oil galleys/passageways, lifters, chain tensioners, etc., and the engine crankcase and internal parts have a lot of surface area and these retain some oil. I do not think there are many places in the engine where oil pools/puddles -- these areas tend to be sludge producers so engine designers avoid creating these -- but of course if there are any well, this accounts for some of the oil retained.
I do know that the factory has a fill amount for a 20 (or with the newer engines a one hour) drain interval and a different fill amount for an overnight drain interval. To state the obvious if one lets the oil drain longer more oil will drain out as the oil drains away from the internal surfaces and passageways and flows to the sump and out the drain hole.
I do not know what the fill difference is for the same engine for a 20 minute/1 hour drain vs. an overnight drain.
With the car's VIN one could ask the parts department to look this up -- the factory issues refill amounts based on VIN's -- and have this info for future reference.
I saw that, Macster. My comment was directed toward rwiii when he said "About 4 quarts remain in the engine regardless of how much you drain from the sump. "
[QUOTE=Gretch;12937358]Often when I change the oil I let it drain over night. Once I replaced the oil catch basin with an empty 2# coffee can when the oil was down to drips.........
I let the jack down so the car would sit flat
(coffee can had clearance from bottom of crank case).
Came back the next day and coffee can was full and about a half a cup or so overflowed on to shop floor.
Mine is a 2000 C4. don't know if that matters, and not sure of there are oil lines that run up to an oil cooler in front.
Just like checking oil level, if the car isn't level you won't drain max oil from drainplug.
Design criteria of M96 engine was eliminating external oil lines.
Ok I have to ask. What is the point of this knowledge? If you aren't refilling a motor that has been completely disassembled and cleaned it's useless information as no matter what you do (sans disassembly) there will always be residual oil left in the system.
I get wanting to know and pass on info, but in the context of DIY oil changes this thread went a little wonky over useless (for the context) info.
I always try and give a very descriptive title to my posts so if you think it's useless you can skip over it. I don't do the "what part is this" or "guess what happened to me today". I have no problem with those titles but if you don't like what you see don't click it. .....and anything that Raby or Macster chime in on are definitely worth a look.
Live your life.
Jake Raby recommended in another thread to run BR30 for 500 miles as a flush oil before swapping into DT40. Another member on here was getting weird readings from an oil analysis after doing a straight switch to DT40. The results were reviewed by Lake Speed Jr. with Gibbs Racing and his opinion was it was due to the interaction of two very different oils.
Don't shoot the messenger.
I just changed my oil, warming up the engine while on jack stands, shut it down, let it drain for about an hour.
Required 8.75 liters to get it to the top mark on the dipstick.
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I start with 1/2 qt low, and when it drops to the bottom line I add a 1/2 qt when I fill up next.
I don't worry when it flashes because I know I have more than enough oil.
LOW=plenty when you have the 2qt deep sump.
1qt low...meh, I'm fine!
Don't get too concerned on the initial UOA results, especially after changing oils, its the trends that show up over multiple UOA with the same oil that give a better picture of what�s going on inside the engine.
I get you and def something to consider. I think the car has 3k miles on it's current oil change but since it's a new car to me, I'd like to get all the maintenance started and then log everything moving forward.
Definitely do a UOA on oil that�s in the car now, didn�t mean to recommend not doing it. More data points the better. I�ve done 5 UOA (2 with mobil 1 and 3 with DT-40) covering 29k miles.
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