Oil Leak after shop service-Need advice

So I am in a bit of a weird situation. Back in mid 2020 I had my RMS, IMS & AOS all done at the same time not long after I had purchased the car as preventative maintenance. I picked the car up but had to take it back a few days later for a CEL which was fixed. When the car went back a second time I mentioned to the shop owner that I was still seeing an oil leak on the driver side near the AOS. He acknowledged my concern but never got back to me on it. Not sure what happened there but at the same time I was having a no start issue which they ran into while it was in the shop. They found the issue (bad crank sensor) and got it sorted out. I'm not sure if there was some confusion in what needed to be checked since the main concern was a CEL (not oil related) and looking back at my emails the owner did state they would try to determine where the leak was coming from but did not get to it right away as he mentioned he was having a "chaotic" week. This was during first lock down and there was a full lot outside his shop, so I could see where he was coming from. After that my memory gets foggy and I can't remember why I did not bring up the oil leak upon pick up. I just remember being happy that my car was running again and I just wanted it back in time to enjoy it before the cold weather. I drove it a few times before winter came (still leaking oil) then life took over soon after and I moved to a new home also becoming a first time home owner and then the house just took up pretty much all my time. I did however manage to put about 5k miles on the 996 since the service. I've done lots of searching on here and other forums since then trying to determine where the leak is coming from. Now with a bit more time on my hands I've been able to get under the car and clean thoroughly to try and find the source. I long suspected the AOS because the area around it and around the bellows boot was covered in oil (see pic below) . What kept throwing me off was the coolant hoses in the picture were also oil soaked as if the leak was coming from the top. So I cleaned the area thoroughly again and took it for a short 5 mile drive just enough to get it warm and pulled it back in and threw it on the Quick Jack. This time there was no oil around the AOS but all over the crank sensor and area adjacent to it on the bell housing. Almost like it was coming from the small opening above where you can see the flywheel at the right angle. I let it sit over night and came back the next day. The area around the crank sensor was still a little wet but had begun to dry. The area immediately to the left of the crank sensor on the bell housing had also begun to dry. However there was fresh oil at the bottom of the bell housing where the trans and engine meet. (I'll get pictures up later tonight) about a month after RMS,IMS & AOS So I guess my questions are could the RMS or IMS fail and cause the flywheel to sling oil up and out of that opening? And if so could it really move that much oil and cause a leak this bad? If one of these is the issue shouldn't it be covered by the shop? I'd really appreciate any input if some of you may have been in a similar situation where you had your car in for a particular issue that was not totally resolved.

It�s been so long and largely undocumented communications that you pretty much have to start fresh and find out where the oil is coming from. If oil is leaking from the RMS, IMS or AOS work that was done in 2020, I�d see if the shop would warranty the labor. But I wouldn�t broach that topic right away. I�d first explain that you�ve had this oil leak for quite some time, and you�d want them to try to find and fix the issue. Lesson from all this is: try to follow-up with the shop via email about expectations. That way, you both have a documented example to go back to. Foggy memories are common as it is, even without the COVID experience most of us have gone through.

To me, it looks like it may be leaking from two places from the AOS. The bellows (it is a pain to get that right), and also possibly the tube that goes into the block above the CPS. It's possible it is all from the bellows though. A leak there will get everywhere.

As above. I inherited a leaky AOS when I bought my 996; the tubing is brittle and a repair shop used the wrong clamp, which cracked it. May or may not be your issue, and it’s a mega pain to get in there to confirm. Sounds like you may need to negotiate with the shop to diagnose and fix.

I took the time a few weeks ago to clean the area all over again to start fresh. Drove it around for about 20 miles and got pretty much the same results. Not sure how to post video but the results were pretty much just like the pictures above. Oil was everywhere and I couldn't make out where it originated from. So I cleaned it thoroughly and went for a short 5 mile drive this time and this was the result. Very wet around the crank sensor but pretty dry around the AOS. No oil on the hoses or area above the AOS either. I still have all my invoices and email conversations we've had starting with my PPI and the last visit for the CEL and no start issue. The last few show emails show mention of an oil leak and him addressing my concern. So I've got some decent documentation, just trying to figure out a smart and reasonable way to approach the situation. after a 5 mile drive

It's not a Porsche if it doesn't leak oil from some where. My opinion is your RMS is weeping. Maybe driving your car more often and longer would help swell the seal and stop the weeping.

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Had the same problem and ended up being the RMS.

Rms can leak over time if you don't drive the car. And it can leak if you do. But you just replaced it... Aos replacement takes less hours than does an rms replacement, since you gotta drop the engine for the rms. During the same procedure you can check the ims as well. Hence your shop probably dragging their feet. Seems to me that they should be able to pinpoint where it's coming from and fix it. Question is who pays for the fix. The oem aos is a brittle product. Wouldn't be surprised if it was a brand new but 20 year old aos sitting on the shelf that just broke. Do yourself a favor and get the uaos. If it's any consolation, my engine was dropped a week ago at my indy to replace the ims retro, rms, oil cooler and low temp Thermostat, as well as replace my motorsports aos with the uaos track version. Also having my guard lsd rebuilt. Doing my 10 year refresh of major "key" parts on the car. Never really paid attention to exactly when the rms starts to weep. But I will out of curiosity. Good luck finding and resolving the leak. It's an awesome car worth the cost of getting it right.

So the shop finally had a slot open last week for me to bring the car back and I just got word them that the car is done. As I had suspected it was the RMS. And unfortunately they will not cover it so I am stuck with with the bill. Not really happy about that but I REALLY just wanted the leak gone more than anything. I will post pictures up later tonight.

Hopefully they got it right this time.

Thanks for coming back and posting final resolution. Sometimes just getting the job done and moving on with life is the real winning story. Enjoy the 911 in good health!

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So, why did they not cover the repair? Did you supply the parts the last time or did they order the parts and charge you for it? Curious why would they not warranty their work.

Yes I supplied my own parts and it's also been almost 2 years since the actual work was done, so I don't think that went in my favor. With the exception of the LN IMS bearing, all my parts were OEM Porsche parts though. And according to them the Porsche OEM RMS is problematic so they prefer to use "their" RMS ( I don't think they mentioned where they sourced it from). That seemed a bit odd to me but I took it with a grain of salt. So I gave them the go ahead to proceed with their RMS. They finished the job the end of last week and kept it over the weekend on the lift to make sure no leaks were present. That was after a road test and confirming the clutch felt fine. They did also mention they had to replace the bottom clutch slave cylinder bolt because it was broken. How does that happen? Anyway here are the pictures they've sent me

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I'm optimistic they did. But if not, then it's going right back and they WILL cover it. After all it's "their" RMS I totally agree, this was really the only thing holding me back from taking it on a long days cruise off my local back roads and Blue Ridge Pkwy

Clutch slave bolt broke because most mechanics dont use torque wrenches and someone in the past went way to heavy on it.

Even the Genuine Porsche Parts Warranty is only 2 years, so , time was not on your side on this one...And if installed my someone other than a PSC, it only covers the part, which is only about $30 bucks. Curious to know what part they DID install that they think is better than the Genuine Porsche RMS ( that was updated about 6 times until finally a PTFE version fixed the leaks).. If you look on the repair bill it show what they used...

So I picked the car up yesterday and talked to the mechanic who remembered me from the last visit. I can't remember the exact details but he explained the difference in material between the OE and Victor Reinz seal. And how they have had better results with the VR over OEM seals. He used another 996 they had on the lift (almost identical to mine) in for an IMS and RMS job as an example. So that gave me some piece of mind and made me feel better, despite the bill. I live some 50+ miles from the shop so when I got home and parked the car to look under and see that it was completely dry and no drips on the floor was a MAJOR relief. You guys have no idea how satisfying that was to me, feels like I can finally breathe again.

You brought in the parts? OK, you own that one. They are under no obligation to provide a warranty for a part they did not supply. OK time to move on. As for the IMS bearing, yes the factory part is problematic and that is why we pay $800 for a LNE bearing. As for the RMS, I only buy Porsche factory RMS. The cost of doing the job again is too much to bank on a non Factory RMS seal. That goes for all the cars I work on (Ferrari, Porsche, BMW)

Not sure if you read any of the previous post but that is what I used originally. The LN IMS bearing was fine, that was done at the same time as the RMS and AOS along with a few other items with all OEM parts when I took ownership of the vehicle.

Enjoy the car! It loves to be driven!

How many miles had you covered in that 2 years? The RMS has always leaked on my cars over winter when I don't use it as much, but start using it every other day and it seals again. I didn't know Porsche had revised it to a PTFE one, interesting.

My rms seal leaked 3 times in 20k miles over 2 years on my 2003 C4S…..after 40k miles when I had it……once warranty expired, sold the car asap…..avoided IMS issue….Porsche kept upgrading the seal without great success up to 2009…. Only plus is I got to know dealer personnel well enough during that time that anytime an allocation comes up I’ll get a call….GT 3s….Turbos, etc….

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I drove it about 5k miles but the leak was always was. It didn't just start to leak all of the sudden.

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Out of curiosity, do you have the service history of the car going back to the early/mid 2000s during the go-no-go days. The factory RMS of today is pretty robust. Yes, it can leak, from my experience its from not driving the car enough. Who knows, maybe your shop didn't do a good job replacing the seal. If this has been a common occurrence over its history, hence the service record history, maybe you have a go-no-go issue that was never addressed. Either way, an rms leak isn't catastrophic. It's just a pita. You will need to review your clutch and flywheel condition sometime in the future, you get the chance to replace the rms as well.

After changing the flywheel, clutch, RMS, and adding the IMS solution, I drove it for a few days and noticed an oil leak, and damn if the RMS began leaking again, even with experienced help we rushed the job....the second time was the charm. Since that time, I now take my time, coffee, cigar breaks and will not attempt to hurry the job at hand.

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All I have is the CarFax history report, no actually repair invoices. The last major service before I took ownership was the RMS, a Clutch and a timing chain job at about 91K. When I purchased it at 98k I had the RMS along with IMS and AOS done. I had read and seen some occasions where a few people had some leaks after sitting, but I was not aware that the go-no-go was an actual real issue more common than not. I just can't stand leaks, let's hope it's taken care of now.

I can let you know that my RMS has had leak issues over my ownership, 99 with about 56K miles on it, but when I drive it, it always seals up.

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if you scan go-no-go here on RL you will probably find some info. It was a tool and procedure used back in the day to determine if your engine/crank were aligned. The tool was developed because the vast majority of RMS' were leaking. So under warranty, if you had a leak, you would bring your car into the dealer and they would use the "go-no-go tool to measure the alignment. If the alignment was off more than the acceptable range, they would replace the engine, even though the engine was fine. Hence why a lot of folks that may have a replacement engine assume it was an engine failure. It may have been a go-no-go engine replacement before Porsche perfected the RMS durability. The reality was that Porsche realized that they had to make a better RMS of which they did. I just bought the latest RMS version and had it replaced on my car a month ago, plus the IMS Retro and UAOS among other items for my 10 year major refresh. To put this into perspective, from 2002 thru probably 2008 when my car was under extended warranty, I would bring it into the dealer if I saw any drop of oil and ask them to use the go-no-go tool to measure alignment. Mine was never out of alignment, just like the vast majority of 996s. But I always got a new seal, and they would also replace the IMS seal as well because early on it was part of the procedure. Skip (Porschetech3) can probably shed more detail on the process with his vast experience than I can. Today, this stuff is forgotten because it ended up being a non event. We talk more about the IMSB, AOS and Bore scoring. All of which have easy to implement solutions and in reality are non-events if you do the right things. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. You replaced the key failure items already. RMS isn't catastrophic. While it cost you money to do it a second time, my bet is that your Indy was extremely diligent in doing the procedure a second time. These cars and engines are really tough as he'll. The real problem is that a good number of owners just didn't do the right procedures and wonder why their engine failed. Sure, there are failures that occurs due to manufacturing errors, but it is a very small percentage. And yes, the engine can fail on the track do to oil starvation and lack of cooling, but again, these issues can be easily solved for. Just like any other engine from any other manufacturer. Best advice I can give you is drive the car like it should be driven, which is with vigor, and change your oil at least 2x a year.

I think the obvious point is bringing your own parts is not always a good idea, no indy will cover his labor with your part. if he puts his part and his part fails he has to eat his labor if its still within his specified warranty of the work, of course bad independents shop are another story. I don't believe a dealer would ever use your parts, even if they were factory Porsche parts because they are required to get the latest correct part using your vin, so if a part like the RMS has been modified 12 times through out its history you may have obtained an earlier version from an on line retailer. Happy you got your car finally dealt with..

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Yep, Glen gave a very good overview of the RMS issue. Yes many engines were replaced in the early 996 cars due to RMS leaking. They would get One-two-three new RMS seals, then a new engine if the leaks still persists. The 996 GT3 was the worst for leaking ( more on that later). Several new seal updates were tried, then the go-no-go tool came out because a few engines had the hole for RMS off center and the easiest way to tell was the go-no-go tool. There was even a revision to the install tool that set the depth of the RMS in deeper. If the tool was a no-go , the engine got replaced, if the tool was a GO, it got a new RMS seal only using the revised "deeper" RMS install tool.... After about 6 RMS updated designs, the PTFE versions seems to have fixed the leaks, BUT must be installed correctly. The PTFE seal must be installed DRY. It comes with an expander ring on the inner circumference, and once installed it shrinks back to size to a tight fit. The tight fit allows some of the PTFE (Teflon) to transfer to the crankshaft sealing area for a PTFE on PTFE ( Teflon on Teflon) slippery tight running surface. It must be installed dry to work correctly... The 996 GT3 "mezger" engine were VERY NOTORIOUS for leaking RMS while siting a few days.. The GT3 engine crankcase was designed to be under a high vacuum, and comes from extreme oil scavenging and this gives a few more horsepower, but also causes air to be pulled in past the RMS, so the RMS "lip seal" is actually turned around backwards compared to Carrera engines. This keeps air from being pulled in, but once the seal relaxes after a few days, it would drop oil. At the time the Official Porsche response was, "just drive it more often,it was designed that way"..Some customers who were out of warranty and couldn't stand oil leaks would opt for the "Turbo Mezger" RMS which had the lip seal in the orthodox orientation that would stop oil leaks but would allow some air in in high RPM situations. Then a revised PTFE RMS with a "double lip" in both directions solved the issues. So, yea, lots of updates in the first 7 years , so I don't want to hear any fuss about any of the updates I do to my stuff..lol

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That's some great background info. Now that it's explained in better detail, I do recall coming across a bit of that info in me earlier research but did not quite fully comprehend. My main goal is to have a solid and reliable platform, suited mostly for spirited daily driving and random long road trips. With the major stuff out of the way I can move on to some the easier maintenance items and then onto refreshing the suspension. And I'll definitely be driving it with intent, it 's hard not with the Fister mufflers. Great point, as some one who actually works on the parts side of a car dealer I honestly don't know why this didn't occur to me at the time. Just because you are ordering the newest (updated)part number does not guarantee you will receive the latest version, especially when ordering online. Thanks for expanding on that, I have a much better understanding of it now. It's wild it went through that many revisions to find a "solution".