I promise...not another RMS/IMS failure post but a must for anyone that tracks a 996!

I feel compelled to share some recent experiences with my 2002 996. My intention of the post is not to add to the online drum beat that 996's are ticking time bombs etc. but to instead offer some insights to fellow racers as to how they can avoid engine failure. I was at PCA Festival of Speed at AutoClub (a lot of POC guys were also there) and instead of racing, I decided to just get some seat time with some porsche/bmw buddies in time trial group. Long story short is five laps into the first session on Friday my engine grenaded. I didn't miss shift, car was warmed up, oil at proper level...just came through turn five saw a plume of smoke and then fire and immediately drove off line. Vali Predescu and Steve Parker of ValiMotorsports were there supporting a lot of people and after pulling into the pits and going over the car they immediately relayed that my weekend in 996 was over. (I did get on later in my street 318ti) Steve tore down the engine and what seemed to be the source of failure was a combination of oil starvation and a tune from the previous owner that was too aggressive. What have I learned from this experience? Having your IMS and RMS fixed as well as a new oil/air separator are not enough. An accusump and deep oil pan are a necessary addition! I was checking gauges across every start finish, no over revs etc. I am taking the car out this weekend for a shake down and its going to be interesting: ***We put a 3.2 boxster engine in and used the 3.6 engine management in (along with the Accusump and bigger oil pan). Not saying this is a solution for everyone but due to my budget and the desire for longevity over HP it will hopefully be a great route to take. I think I might have to rename the car the Nine Nine Sixter! Will let you guys know how it goes, Jason

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How much are those to add?

it depends on the shop but approx 2k.

I should clarify for those of you that are doing autocross or any track without banking: AutoClub Speedway has a very long bank in the Roval Configuration. 11-14 degree banking and over 3000 feet long

RMSs don't kill engines so why even bother putting it in the title? It's just an Fn seal.

Sounds like an affordable solution with the 3.2, but won't you be down on power?

While I appreciate the spirit of this post, an oiling system upgrade is a widely known - if not universally known - recommendation for tracked M96-powered cars. A subject like "Oil system upgrades would have saved my 996 track car" would go a long way toward making such posts easier to locate a couple of years down the road. If you haven't already done so - and if it's not already there - adding this as a reply to the List of Common Issues sticky at the top of 996 Forum would also be potentially helpful for members in the future...

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Yeah, I don't get why this issue always shares a headline with the IMS bearing. Hell, my Corvette has dripped oil for a decade, and I haven't written a single panicked post on the Interweb yet. The original "panic" driving the RMS issue was probably attributable to the new-car crowd who were pissed because their month-old $90K 911 was dripping oil on their free-range, organically grown flagstone driveway... The old piece of tin I slide under the 'Vette when it's sleeping was free, and it would probably clean up real nice if I was inclined to do so...

^^ When I bought my 99 in 2006 all the forum owners talked about then was the RMS.

They didn't know it at the time, but those were the "good old days" before bore scoring and 67 other depreciation-boosting issues were publicized.

I cross posted from the track related one and I apologize. I don't have 4k+ posts but I have been a long time racer and porsche enthusiast and merely wanted to share my personal story with the 996 forum. I am not necessarily encouraging people here to put a boxster engine in car but felt it was a significant lead in to what I plan on doing after this weekend....take the car on the track. It will be down on power as a 3.2 but I want to get back to driving more and the savings will allow me to do so.

What did the transplant cost you out-the-door? Was your 3.6 block toast, or were you able to sell it?

The helpful observation by 88clbsport is also of interest to those of us who drive the canyons enthusiastically.Thank you 88clbsport. In line with your suggestion I fitted a "Technosump" and if you position the horizontal baffle intelligently, I suggest it is an affordable option for some. Pedro(and his aficionados) has used it on his track car at Sebring. Ask him about the 'turn 17' test. With a Technosump ,the Accusump may be redundant which saves some $$$$,complexity,weight and space.YEMV.

I respectfully add there is NO correlation between tracked stock 996's and blown engines. This is extremely misleading to say the least. 996's have been tracked since 99 in my surrounding PCA clubs DE events and I have yet to see a single engine let go because of oil starvation on the track. Can it happen, sure, anything can. But this is by no means a run out and add parts scenario.

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What signs indicate oil starvation or an aggressive tune is what caused the failure versus just a failed rod bolt, broken rod, dropped valve, collapsed tensioner, broken chain, spun bearing, etc.?

Schnell Gelb, is your 996 running stock suspension? Pedro's extension looks fairly thick - I'm guessing 3CM or so, but that's just a WAG. I'd be worried about catching the leading edge of the sump plate, especially given the warning on Pedro's site ("This kit is recommended for track-only vehicles as ground clearance could become an issue with regular city driving due to the extension of the oil pan.") Any experience with clearance issues? Is your 996 a track-only toy? 11-quart oil changes must be some kind of record. I grumble when I'm dumping 9 into my 996...I'm not sure my pan will hold 11 quarts.

I spoke directly with Pedro about this clearance issue on his Technosump and encourage others to do the same.He is a really pleasant fellow - if you have the tech background to keep up with him. As a rare combo of academic engineering and Porsche-wrenching ,I found him very engaging. He is the world's worst salesman - never asked for an order,if I had bought his stuff and had a good laugh about using a "Made in Argentina" IMSB in his DOF kit. To those who say the M96 is not prone to failure from oil starvation ,I would humbly suggest they think about what happens to most of the oil in the shallow OEM sump when you brake hard+turn sharply (like turn 17 at Sebring).If your answer is "nothing" - good luck debating that with Pedro or probably Raby. I am not an expert in these issues so would defer to them.

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If they are saying your engine is "starved" every time you brake hard and turn sharply on the track, I would have to give all of the 996's in the clubs as the answer.

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It's sad to think my 996 that has been club raced (not DE'd, but raced) has been starved for almost 6 years! I guess we're all on borrowed time in one way or another... enjoy it!

So - what did Pedro say about the clearance issue?

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I guess we are the lucky two.

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Witchcraft!

I suggest you take the sump plate and baffle off an M96 . Look at the oil pick up location and depth in the 'sump'. Observe the design and construction of the OEM baffle (particularly the rubber flaps)around the pick up. Consider the normal oil level in the sump relative to the pick up. What happens during hard braking and sharp turning ? How can the parts as designed effectively constrain the oil so it always keeps the pick up submerged ? If there is any leakage around the rubber flaps .......... Then explain why a horizontal baffle & a vertical is essential to avoid this problem. Have you investigated the X51 type baffles ?Porsche even made parts to address this issue. And then there is foaming & thermal breakdown.The deep sump helps with both.Then there is the inadequate scavenging from the cylinder heads at prolonged high rpm that was solved in the later engines. http://lnengineering.com/products/ot...affle-kit.html http://lnengineering.com/resources/2...m96m97-engine/ But this is not the whole Track-failure story. A well know fellow said this on the subject: "When operating your engine on the track it is being overworked just like a race engine. This is one of those situations where you need a full "race oil" to properly protect your "street engine". Race oils have a life span of less than 1,000 miles with their additive packages being depleted completely. True race oils make horrible street oils so those that are serious about engine protection aren't generally worried about cost or convenience. These people are paid dividends of longevity and reliability over their peers. Basically what we have found is G forces are simply "the straw that breaks the Camel's back" on the track. Hot oil leads to pressure losses, G forces aggravate the issue and things scatter." Just watch this video ! 2009 Porsche 911 | Engine Oil Sump Test Rig | Edmunds.com - YouTube

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It is just CYA. As long as you have not lowered the car.

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Funny you should say that because the first owner I bought it from had a really rare horse.

When I tracked my 99 a few weeks ago on stock tires, after 4 or 5 laps the oil pressure would dip on corners/long sweepers. I pulled in as I do not have an extra $15K burning a hole in my pocket. I will update my sump before doing any additional tracking. Driving around a race track with your eyes on the oil pressure gauge is not very safe either.

I only question that is was a tune that did this. This is known to happen with prolonged high g force corners. Oil starvation was the cause not the tune. Moding the suspension and putting on grippier tires that allow the car to obtain higher g forces then it was designed for is the cause of oil starvation. The engine requires more oil pick up point points and better strategically placed squirters to prevent it. I don't think the deeper sump is going to help but buy a few tenths of a second under high g conditions.

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Thansk for the info on the Technosump! =)

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Haven't you noticed the oil pressure will dip when you corner driving normally on the street, too?

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I can't say that I have ever looked before this happened, and since it's never happened when I did look. I can tell you it was after the car really warmed up after 5 or 6 laps, long sweepers. I normally don't drive on the street like I drive on the track, so I would not expect that this would happen on the street. I'm not usually driving crazy enough on the street for this to happen.

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That's my point: normal street driving, even going 20-25mph around curves causes a drop in the oil pressure per the gauge. If you're worried about the gauge showing a drop on track, you should be just as concerned on the street!

I've never seen it drop on the street, I will look more closely. It shouldn't drop on the street or the track. The reason it is doing this is because the net positive suction head available is going down. You don't want it to get less than the minimum required net positive suction head or there will be trouble. Others can track their car with no sump upgrade, I'm not. I should stop posting about this and feeding the trolls.

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There you have it folks. Any long left hander tracks are the worst for oil starvation scenario since non x51 cars only have one scavenge pump instead of two(one on each side) so naturally banks 4-6 would starve. Important to note that this is really track and/or race tire compound dependent and no need to get over paranoid if you don't fit into one of these two situations.

I've driven on bankings numerous times. I did not have a major issue but I do not like to be on bankings in a street car. If anything fails, tire blows or another car drops fluids you are going to meet the wall at a high rate of speed, Ive seen this many times it aint pretty. Dry sump cars such as the GT3 would be better suited for this track above.

Here is the Boxster/Cayman perspective at Sebring from Pedro. Just remember the engine is the 'wrong' way round compared to the 996. http://www.pedrosgarage.com/Site_5/C...g,_part_3.html The problem was all on video -and the solution: " Boxsters and Caymans ..when fitted with racing tires, can generate such high lateral G-force .. that the oil inside the engine creeps up the walls of the oil pan and the pump sucks air! .. engine running at 7,000 RPM with no oil pressure. And that is precisely what had happened to me last year, when piston rod number 6 let go because of overheating due to oil starvation."

I found this interesting on the 997.1 Turbo, came from the Porsche brochure. That Mezger seems bulletproof... and 9 oil pumps... Wish our engines were built a little better.

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I agree with what you're saying but it is tremendously disappointing that these cars get sold under the premise that they are performance vehicles capable of conquering both the street and the track with only the driver changing the clothing he wears. Porsche knew this before which is why the air cooled cars used dry sumps. And they reinforced it by keeping the dry sumps on the GTx cars. But I guess to save a buck we got the "integrated dry sump" which is marketing-speak for a wet sump not capable of handling sustained sweepers. Do the new DFI engines have this problem or was this just an M96/97 issue?

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We have many examples of engines lasting well into 6 figure milage and it's been now 15+ years. I'd say for a performance car they were built pretty well. Granted there were/are some issues, but it's not like none of them are still running or a super high fail rate after this long. Plus the turbo engine seems to be a different design and would need about that many pumps. IMO

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How did you know that the car had a tune? Is there a way to detect this?

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I think this is likely the case. Read this thread and only found one solid data point: 996 lost engine on ROVAL. The ROVAL is notorious for causing starvation. Probably counter productive to connect any other dots that aren't there based on speculation.

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Just for accuracy's sake, this thread is talking about a 3.6l engine that blew up. The non-x51 and the x51 3.6l engine have the same number of oil scavenge pumps.

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THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID! OK, is it just me, or in the middle of this diagram do you see a giant . . .? (Sorry for the sophomoric comments- back to the serious track talk.)

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I don't know, man, looks about average to me.

No joke, people do refer to the hairpin as the ***** head.