997 Hardback sport seats in a 996

So, I posted this last week in the "what did you do to your 996" thread. But its probably better off/more searchable/find-able if it's got it's own thread (this was also a suggestion by a fellow Rennlister). I picked up a set of 997 Hardback sport seats for a good price here on Rennlist. Before jumping in I did a few searches and it seemed like it wasn't going to be a big deal to get them to work. Physically, they mount exactly like the 996 seats so that's easy. As they're mostly manual and only the seat back recline feature is electric, it basically means there are only 2 wires (power and ground - Purple and brown in my car - not sure it this is standard or not. Some of the online photo's show red or red and black) for the recline, and the seat-belt buckled/unbuckled sensor. The biggest problem being that Porsche changed the plugs they use to connect the harness and seat, so it's not a simple plug n play situation. This being said, it's still a very simple hack. The 997 socket (Big Yellow shell) has male spade lugs for the power recline feature. I went to Napa Auto Parts and picked up an assortment of female spade connectors for about $8. It turned out that the yellow female spades fit the positive 12v lead and the red female spade fit the ground lug in the 997 socket. The 996 harness plug has female "funnel pin" style jacks for the power side, and some funky little 4 way pin style jacks for the seat-belt sensor. To connect to the power side of the 996 connector, Napa didn't have any of the male funnel pin connectors, so I bought a package of the smallest bullet connectors they had (these were the "red" size). As it turned out, they were too big to fit into the receiver/jack of the 996 connector, so I had to modify them a bit by crushing/folding them together with a pair of needle nose pliers, then filling them with solder and grinding them down a bit to the final size to fit the jack - this sounds complicated but it's pretty straight forward (just a pain in the butt). With a little trial and error I was able to get a nice tight press fit so the connections won't come apart accidentally (I hope). The seat-belt sensors were a little scarier because they were contained in a multi-part/multi-pin enclosure within the "big yellow shell"... In reality, it was very simple to deconstruct the shell and remove the smaller grey shell that holds the two pins from the seat belt sensor. Once your remove this grey piece, it's simple to remove the pins with a tiny screw driver (just push down the barbs that are visible on one side of the shell, and the wires/pins pull right out). Once I had all my wire available/accessible I connected them to the existing 996 harness connector, hooked the battery back up (always disconnect the battery before you work on electrical components) and tested the seats... ... ... They worked, albeit backwards - no problem, just swap the power and ground wires and all was good. Also, not seat-belt bells/lights... beautiful! Once I knew everything worked properly, I went to work making sure the seat-belt sensor wires would stay plugged in to the jack and the pins wouldn't short together (since they were just pins at this point and weren't contained in their shell anymore, they were a little unwieldy). I just used heat shrink tubing in various sizes to create a solid "plug" that would stay plugged in. Once this was done, it was just a matter of zip tying the plugs to solid places under the seats so as to remove any stress from the new jumper wires between the incompatible jack shells. I'll attach a few photo's for reference - sorry they're not really comprehensive of the entire process, but it's really simple (simpler than it may sound). I hope this helps anyone doing this in the future.

I bet it feels like you got a new car!

Quotes source post: 16217971

It definitely feels like "my 20 year old car got better" Wow, what a difference - pretty amazing! Much, much, better... I'm really happy with the difference.

Quotes source post: 16217980

Beautiful seats. I bet they're radically different from the base 996 seats. Anyway to make the leather match better? I know some people have the leather dyed black which is easier than trying to match the lighter tan color. Enjoy!

Quotes source post: 16217990

I'm going to dye them Savanna Beige - I already got the dye - at some point this winter. It shouldn't be too difficult. There are also a few options for new seat covers in the proper color - they're not cheap though...

Quotes source post: 16218009

Great work and they look fantastic. Your going to dye those seat savanna beige? Have you ever done that before? I think you might be asking for trouble. I gotta find some dark blue seat with silver seat backs for my car!

Nice work dporto! I keep casually looking for a deal on either 996 or 997 sport seats as they fit me marketably better than the standard 996 comfort seats in my car. As for dying your seats I�ve used Leatherique dyes and reconditioners with good result. Not too difficult, just takes time and patience: as with most other projects, prep work is 90% of the battle. I�d think going to a lighter shade (I�ve only redyed the same color) may be a bit of a challenge, but still doable. Keep us posted.

Quotes source post: 16218022

I'll do a test spot on the back bottom of the seat cushion. I don't think it'll be difficult at all. I've done the drivers side bolster of my original seats and they came out great. I've also done the shift boot (which happens to be "natural brown" had I only known!) and a couple steering wheels. Ultimately, if they don't wear well after the re-dye, I can always go for new seat covers (original Porsche Leather) in the proper color. The draw back to this option is that it's expensive. The best price I've found (Topsonline.com) is around $1500 for both https://www.topsonline.com/model/Sea...And_Turbo.html . And the most expensive is Classic 9 leather shop http://www.classic9leathershop.com/u...e-997-and-987/ at $2350 for the pair (which is basically what I paid for the entire seats) Then they have to be installed...I'm not an upholsterer so who knows - I'd rather not go this way, but we'll see.

Quotes source post: 16218161

These guys were at SEMA and I bought some of their stuff. It really matches well and since it goes on like a paint, you can recolor seats better than just rub-on dyes. I've tried all leather dye products, and these are the best IMHO. They match to Porsche specs and have Savannah beige. https://www.colorbondpaint.com/produ...iant=313000503

Even though the Leatherworld stuff is called "Dye", it's paint...The only true "dyes" are the Analine dyes that were used in "the old days"... I would venture a guess that it's very similar to Colorbond or any of the others. Their claim is that it's the exact same stuff that the manufacturers use - I subscribe to this. If there is a difference, it's more akin to the difference between Benjamin Moore and Sherwin Williams than anything else. When I re-finish the seats, I'll do a post/write-up.

Quotes source post: 16218225

I have Leatherworld dyes too and have found they work no better than other rub-on type leather colorants; however, the Colorbond refinishers come in aerosol form which I found to produce a better factory-like finish with auto applications like seats and other leather surfaces. The same refinisher can be used on other plastic surfaces too. Again, it truly goes on like spray paint and soaks deep into the leather to produce a durable finish. Seems like the rub-on type wouldn't produce color change you desire because you're going to a lighter hue of brown (going darker can be easily achieved with traditional leather dyes), but I'm looking forward to your results. Good luck!

I spray it on...

Quotes source post: 16218286

Using a preval sprayer? or does Leatherworld now sell a aerosol version of their dyes? I don't see it on their website.

I'd be dying all the other panels black or darker brown before messing those seats up Those are the best color seats imo.

Quotes source post: 16218460

Yeah, they're nice, but the interior is Savanna Beige (which I like BTW)... I'll be "dyeing" the seats... Nutty P - no preval here - I've got real/good spray equipment

Quotes source post: 16218009

Definitely keep us updated with the Savannah dye. I need some touch up in my interior What brand did you select and why?

I got the LeatherWorldTech leather dye (POR941 Savanna Beige). I've used this stuff before and it works great. I've used both the sponge on technique and spraying - it works well both ways, but the spray is better/more even for large areas. See this thread: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...therworld.html

Well done. Thanks for documenting what you have accomplished. I am fairly sure that I have seen people be very successful with going to a lighter color so have at it and let us know. Can you feel a difference in the seating position?

Quotes source post: 16220124

Oh yeah - so much better! If you get a chance to sit in a 997 with the sport seats, do it - but beware, you won�t want to go back to the stock 996 seats.

Quotes source post: 16220137

They look amazing, more modern design over the previous sport seat in the 996. I'm looking forward to the transformation. Please post pictures when you have time.

That looks good. How does the weight compare? Do they get any lower to the floor than the 996 seats?

So dporto - while this technique is still fresh in your mind, any thoughts about creating some pre-made electrical "pig tail" harnesses for both the seat back adjustment power and the seat belt power, for those of us who still dream of installing 997 seats in our 996s but totally lack the technical know-how???? For a good price of course...LOL. All kidding aside...wouldn't THAT be a pretty lucrative side business for someone with a little electronic expertise? BTW the news seats look AWESOME. Good job!

Quotes source post: 16221235

There are companies out there that make wiring harnesses - that I�m sure, could/would do it. I actually reached out to one, but didn�t wait around to hear back from them (haven�t heard back either). Lucrative? Eh, I doubt it. First, I don�t think that many people are doing this mod. Second, it�s only 2 wires/4 connections. I did order a few of the shell pieces/connectors but they haven�t come yet. Maybe when I get them (if they�re right) I�ll make up some �pigtails/jumpers� and figure out what they�d cost to produce and sell with a reasonable profit...

I just put my track seat which has a 997 GT3 buckle attached to it in my 996.2. The 997 receptacle has the grey connector with 2 wires in it. The 996 recepticle appears to have 4. Which 2 connections did you attach the recepticle to in harness and do you know what the other 2 do?

Quotes source post: 16221871

Well, the receptacle does/can accept 4 wires, there are only two in it. Just look at what's in there and you'll see. You stick the two pins from the 997 (grey connector) into the two holes with wires (from the seat-belt) connected to them. I had seen other posts about people leaving the 996 seat-belt receptacle under the seat etc... I actually thought about switching the seat-belt receptacle from the 996 to the 997 seat, but it seemed like more work than it was worth. Ultimately, the way I did it worked well and it was super easy. ** I drove the car with the new seats all weekend, and they're really great - super comfortable, and they look amazing (even though the Natural Brown isn't the proper color, the contrast isn't all bad).

Excellent work!!! I'd love to do the same with my 996. Mike

So, the sensor plug goes into the big black plastic shell on the far left (as pictured above - sorry it's in shadow) bottom 2 holes (there's are actually 2 - 4 pin receptacles. The seat belt sensor goes to the bottom two holes of the connector closest to the outside of the shell). As far as I can tell, the orientation of the blue & yellow wires don't matter it's just an opened or closed circuit. Mine worked the first time I stuck 'em in there so I don't even know if I did both side s the same. **Ironically enough, both the seat back were wired backwards the first time I plugged them in...

Quotes source post: 16223710

Thanks! Do you have any idea what the other 2 unused wires would have been for in this scenario? I think I will try to do a wire tap on the seat belt recepticle side and the harness side with a disconnect on the seat belt side. For now, this seat will be swapped to my 991 when used on the track.

Thanks for the help! I wired up my 997 buckle to the 2 wires you showed. However, I did it a little different. I need the ability to move this seat and buckle easily. Therefore, I used wire taps beind the car side connector and behind the buckle connector joining them with a wire. Then I cut that wire and added insulated quick disconnectors. Here are the photos. All of my car side harnesses under the seat are loose since this is for an all manual bucket seat. When I want to put this seat in my 991 I will just disconnect the 2 red connections and then go back to the grey oem connector from the buckle to 991. Thanks for your help! I guess once I get my 996 buckle, I ordered from ebay the other day, I will be posting it for sale in market place.

As always, there�s more than 1 way to skin a cat! Personally, I have an aversion to tap cons - especially when it means tapping into a wire harness. In my experience they invariably lead to electrical gremlins, in addition to making it difficult to �go back to stock�. As long as you achieve your end goals and are happy with the results, that�s what counts.

Ugh... got a airbag warning light on dash 🤬 not looking forward to tracking this down... must be one of those unused pins in the yellow shell?

Quotes source post: 16227039

I havent done anything but drive around the block since, so far, so dont know if I will have the same issue.

Quotes source post: 16227076

I put close to 100 miles on mine over the past weekend, and the light just came on yesterday😩. I�m sure I�ll be able to figure out which pins are for the airbag and hook up a resistor to them (I�ve seen references to them online - just have to look them up again). I�ll post when I figure it out.

Hmmm... In this thread https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...996tt-diy.html it mentions "reversing the seatbelt wires"... I guess I'll give this a try... will report back.

Went in and flipped the seatbelt wires. It didn�t turn the airbag light off but it did cause it to blink once after starting the car. I then hooked up the Durametric and reset the �airbag� fault which showed up as �45 drivers seatbelt�. Took the car for a 20 mile ride. The light hasn�t come back yet... will note if status changes.

Ugh... The light is back - turned on after about 40 miles last night (so I'm figuring something like a 60mi drive cycle ?)... Back to the drawing board - I'm thinking that maybe I need to insert a resistor to the airbag (drivers seat) circuit...will update again

I have taken car out 2 times for 5-10 miles plus a spirited 100 mile drive. No lights still

What is that white connector that you've tapped into - mine doesn't have that. Mine has a grey connector contained inside the large yellow plug shell. I'm assuming these two connectors are housing the seat-belt wires?

Quotes source post: 16239776

It is gray and it is the seatbelt connector that is inside of your yellow harness. It is the only thing I am plugging in since using a Sparco seat.

Hmmm...looks white in the photo. Ok - drivers side or passenger side (or both)? And only two pins/wires correct? Thanks in advance

nice111

Quotes source post: 16240054

I have only done the drivers side. There are only 2 wires in it yes.

Quotes source post: 16240121

Ok thanks. I actually tried taking the 996 seat-belt receptacle off the original seat and connecting it to the harness... no help! I'll let you know what happens

[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:] https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/popcorn.gif

Quotes source post: 16240154

Good idea. Is it possible you need a reset to clear now?

do your seats have air bags? is that tripping the ab light?

Quotes source post: 16249323

Yes, the 997 seats do have airbags in them. I don�t quite understand how they�d trip a light by not being hooked up (I.e. the car side harness doesn�t have a signal for them since the airbags are in the doors in the 996). I�m thinking that maybe I have the seatbelt wires plugged into the wrong contacts.

So, I'm resurrecting this thread as I've begun the "re-coloring" of the natural brown 997 sport seats. I've decided to just do the "insert" portion of the seats. I've lived with the natural brown (which I love btw) for a few months now, and while I could certainly live with it like this, I just can't leave well enough alone (besides, I've already got the stuff to change them!). In any case, I really do like the natural brown, there's just a little too much, so they seem a little out of place. I've decided to just do the "inserts" for several reasons. 1) I think it'll tie the seats to the rest of the interior. 2) Since the backs are painted I won't have to tape them off in order to do the bolsters. 3) The bolsters get the most wear and tear, so I think having the factory finish on them is the best option regarding wear over the long term. 4) I like the look of the "insert style" - sort of like these except not fabric... https://www.rstrada.com/blog2/2018/5/14/pepita-inserts anyway, here we go... Taped off, cleaned /primed, first coat on seat bottom (almost clear) 3rd coat - starting to look like something 4th coat - looking really good. Probably need 1 or 2 more though... I decided to use a "brush on" technique (using sponge brush applicators) so I wouldn't have to remove the seats (my son's BMW is in the shop so there's no room in there anyway). Spraying would be quicker but there are also some drawbacks (around the edges for one). The biggest PITA is the "perforated" leather of the seat insert... NIGHTMARISH! It literally took me 1.5 hrs with a toothpick to clear all the perforations before doing the last coat... and I've got to do it again after each subsequent coat. You can't really do it wet because you get a ridge around the perf... Oh well, if anyone has any ideas... (I might try compressed air after the next coat...).

Did the 5th coat today on the passenger side seat. Done! I used the "blot on sponge technique" for a little better coverage and lack of "streakyness" created by brushing. The only caveat is that blotting creates air bubbles! you have to go back with the dry side of the sponge (fine open cell foam like used in mattresses) and re-blot all the bubbles. Even with this step, coverage with the sponge is at least twice as fast as the foam brush, and it leaves no streaks... I think I'll do the drivers seat like this the whole way (except for the edges, where you have to use the brush to get between the insert and the bolsters).

Quotes source post: 16217957

i want to rent your AGA tool

Sorry I don't have the one for the tip. Why would you post in this thread, and not PM me?

Because I�m a new member! Thanks!!

I really like how the two toned turned out! Too bad you don't have natural brown laying around to outline the rear seats!

Seats look great! I had a rare opportunity to buy a set with only 5K miles on them ($1K) and passed thinking they'd be on CL for a long time giving me some leverage to negotiate. Nope, they got shipped to the mainland when the guy moved (they never sold) and I missed the boat. Finding a deal like that here is as rare as finding a roller like I did. Good luck getting the airbag light fixed.

Quotes source post: 16440884

Ha! You're killin' me! I just want to get the drivers side done and move on!

Quotes source post: 16440896

Bummer! They're really way better than the 996 seats (comfort/support wise). Yes, hopefully I'll get the airbag light figured out at some point...

Quotes source post: 16440332

Very nice. Doesn't look encouraging initially but really gets good. I don't see any bleed at the edges either. Do you have a photo of the sponge applicator that worked best?

" Do you have a photo of the sponge applicator that worked best?" I don't have one off hand. I won't be home for a couple days, but I'll put one up when I get home if I remember. It's literally a piece of "bedding foam" (medium density open cell) about 2.5" square by about 8" long. One end is flat/square and the other has a bit of an angle to it, to get into tighter spaces. There's no "bleed" because the bolsters were taped off (as seen early in the thread) - the edges of the inserts go quite deep (close to an inch in some places) so you've got to get the tape down between the seat insert and the bolster. The best/proper way to do it, would be to remove the insert entirely, but there are hog rings and stuff involved and I didn't want to go there... still might do it for the drivers seat, but not sure... Thanks for the props!

First coat on the drivers seat using sponge applicator... So much quicker/better. Better coverage, and doesn�t clog the perforations as badly as the brush did...I only used the foam brush around the edges with more of a blotting technique as opposed to brushing.

I finished the drivers seat yesterday, so I figured I'd close out this thread... Maybe I'll post again if I decide to do the outer (bolster) edges of the back seat-backs to match the fronts (I got the dye ).

Looks amazing. Great work!

Quotes source post: 16487226

Thanks - I'm really happy with the way they turned out, and it definitely ties them into the stock interior much better than leaving them all natural brown

Quotes source post: 16487226

Very nice! Did you ever get the AB light fixed?

^^ No sir ^^ - mostly because I haven't bothered due to other projects I've got a few other things (namely front bumper back to paint guy and coil-overs) that should give me a little down time - hopefully I'll get it figured out then.

Quotes source post: 16440884

^^ Well, I couldn't leave well enough alone... My son was prodding me a bit to tie in the back seats (backs only) to the fronts...

Holy guacamole! Just the perfect amount for contrast. Two thumbs up, Siskel and Ebert style. Are you contemplating finishing the bottom cushions in the darker shade after you assess?

No, the bottoms don't have "edges" SO I'm going to leave them as is. Thanks for the props!

WOW! This looks amazing! Porsche would have charged $10,000 for that interior. Really like how you did both the fronts and the backs to match. Nice job! Daryll

Quotes source post: 16489452

^^^ YES! Finally Since my car has been laid up in the shop all summer I had a chance (actually many chances) to address a bunch of little issues. This was but one of them. I wound up just plugging in the latch side of my original seatbelt and leaving it under the seat. I think I tried this once before, but must have plugged it in to the wrong leads (it's only two prongs of a four pronged connector). Anyway, all fixed - no more airbag light...

Which brand of dye is that?

https://leatherworldtech.com/porsche...e-color-chart/ for the Savanna Beige https://www.seatdoctors.com/porsche-...ra-leather-dye for the Natural Brown (I couldn't find the Natural Brown at Leather World - if you call them they might have it though)

Thread resurrection - again. Dporto, great job on the leather dye - really classes up the interior. I just bought a set of 997 Hardbacks to put in my 996 and am researching the wiring issues. My 997 hardbacks (manual slide, power recline) are heated, so I'll be adding that feature as well. Good info here on the wiring issues. Question: what seats did you start with in your 996? My 996 came with full power/memory comfort seats - trying to figure out if I need to keep the power/memory ecu from my 996 - pretty sure the power mirrors run thru that ecu...

Quotes source post: 17186742

Wow... sorry it took me so long to respond to this - just saw it! I had the 996.1 power/comfort/memory/heat seats in mine. I just unplugged everything. All the memory/power stuff stays with the seat. My 997 seats don't have heat in them so I didn't have to hook that up. All the power connections are a little further up in the thread. It's simple - two wires for power, two wires for the seatbelt/airbag. You'll have to figure out which wires are for the heaters, but that shouldn't be difficult. Good luck - post some photo's when you get them in

Quotes source post: 17233236

Thanks dporto, I'll post pics when I get them installed. Cocoa brown sport seats going into a black interior. I'm considering dyeing some of the interior trim cocoa as well - really like the two tone look of your interior. I did get the wiring figured out - biggest challenge was integrating 996 heat relay sub harnesses onto the 997 seats to keep 2 stage functionality of the added 996 seat heater switches. Not too difficult though. Should have the seats in and working by next weekend...fingers crossed.

Beautiful work. That contrast really pops