Castrol RS 10W60 , why not?

I wonder why Porsche recomends Mobil 1 0W40. The core of a 911 is a high performance engine. I know it's perfectly covered by this fantastic oil. Mobil 1 0W40 is enough to prevent wear , and it's good enough to protect the engine on extreme weather conditions too . But i was thinking about Castrol RS 10W60, another wonderful product with different viscosity. Perhaps this is the ideal viscosity to be mounted in warm and hot climate regions. I live in Spain. In summer we have 2 or 3 months very hot. Temperatures raise 40� C or a bit more �what do you think about this?

I believe Mobil 1 has a 5-50 available in Europe but not here in the States that would probably be great for the summer months.

I think 10w is needlessly thick when cold, you might not get proper lubrication. You get more hp with thinner oils so why bother if 0-40 is protecting (and a synthetic 0-40 will protect). RIchard

Contrary to the marketing of Mobil, the 0W40 DOES NOT provide for proper lubrication in hotter climates at startup. Open your window and just listen to the tick, tick tick, when you park your car after a good run and let it sit over night. That's the sound of your lifters being void of enough oil after the Mobil water drained out overnight. Now, change the oil to a 5W50 or 15W50 and listen again. The viscosity of 40 on the hot side is laughable when your oil temps are running at 230F, 240F, 250F..... But, if you don't plan on keeping the car long, it doesn't matter.

So would Castrol 10W60 or Mobil 1 15-50 be a better choice for these engines when weather never falls below 85F? Just changed the oil in mine and I put Mobil 1 15-50 as the 0-40 was not available. The Mobil oil is $7.50 per quart here vs. $32 per liter for the Castrol.

I run the Castrol 5W50 or Mobil 15W50 in summer.

There is a thing that i'm sure yet: When summer comes, the engine needs more lubrication in extreme conditions, and as you say, it would be better to change oil to a 5W50 Thanks

Castrol RS is a racing oil, don't waste your money. Racing oils mean you are paying many many times more to get another 1 or 2 horsepower. Also, while I'm not sure if this applies to RS since RS is API approved, typically racing oils have higher amounts of zinc and sulfur and need to be changed more often (like every 5 hours of running). If you really want to go all out get some Joe Gibbs racing oil...sure you'll have to blueprint your engine first (infact, invent a new process of re-blueprinting by which I mean don't only blueprint it but also close up all the gaps) and change your oil every 500 miles.

seems like castrol 5W50 can be used even in the winter no? after all it does have the 5W rating...?

I either use 5W40 or 5W50 in the winter. Either one is fine, it just depends what you can find at the time. The 5W50 keeps the pressure off you when running it hard on warmer winter or early spring days.

They also recommend Castrol RS "Road and Track" and Castrol RS "Power and Protection" in 5w-40 and 0w-40 weights.

Castrol Syntec 5w50 was removed from the Porsche approved oils list. Not sure why.

Can anyone confirm the tapping sound is due to oil starvation at the lifters? I though oil only get injected to the valves/lifters to cool a hot running engine. I heard the tapping sound when car sits for 2+ weeks. This happened on my 98 E320 a few times. If a heavier old should be used, I'd definitely try it next time.

I always assumed that sound was the cat converters... sure about this??

As I understand it...pretty much regardless of what oil you use, if you let your car sit long enough, the oil will drain down by the simple rule of gravity. The tapping sound you hear at start up is the valves making noise before the oil can get pumped up to them. That's why they recommend you give the car a bit of time to slightly warm up so that the oil can get pumped to the engine parts before you stomp on it and unnecessarily run an oil depleted part of the engine. Some of the guys advocate just getting in there and taking off cold, while others suggest a little more restraint and not to run over 2500 rpm until the oil gets properly circulated by the engine warming up a bit. Moderation seems prudent to me. The real issue in the summertime would be to use an oil that had enough viscosity so that it didn't run like water through the engine and out the rings/valves. At least that's how I understand it...and there are folks on this board a lot more knowledgeable than myself.

Do a search of the web for a hydraulic valve picture. Then you will understand what causes the ticking.

1999, Actually lifter noise occurs when the hydraulic lifters aren't completely "pumped up" to occupy all the space between the cam and the valve. You can only hear this when the car is running because the noise is from the lifter/valvetrain tapping as a result of the space. Oil that is too thick or dirty lifters are the most common cause of this valve noise. Actually, running a lighter weight oil will help this condition because it results in more rapid and complete "pumping up" of the hydraulic valves. I believe the ticking noise that you are referring to is simply the hot exhaust cooling off. Tonger

Just the opposite is true. On a hot engine, the oil (Mobil Water) is so thin that more of it bleeds out of the lifter, eliminating the hydraulic lift in it. This causes slack to the cam which causes a ticking sound. A less thin oil will not bleed out of the lifters as much. NOTE: Does ANYONE really confuse heat ticking of the exhaust to valve ticking?

What were your oil temperatures like before you installed the supercharger?

My water and oil temps are not effected by the SC. A few minor mods actually resulted in both temperatures running less that when delivered by Porsche.

what kind of mods did you do to get a lower temp?

I'm going to guess a lower temp thermostat is all it would take, that any maybe an aux fan switch.

Lower your coolant mix to 40% antifreeze and install manual front fan and engine compartment fan switches (or lower temperature sensor) and your car will run as cool driving it hard around town as it does running at 80 mph on the highway. Stock thermostat as even removing the thermostat will not decrease coolant temp.

1999, I just put in 15w50. No ticking sound in normal driving. But when I came off the track the other day the ticking sound was really really loud. It sounded like an old 993! As it cooled off the sound went away. Something to worry about?

Curious about engine wear from the different weight oils? Blackstone test it. I am sending my Blackstone oil test this week sometime. My friend who did the test on his 996 with Mobil 0w40 came out with flying colors, no abnormal wear. This is with many AXs with a DE thrown in on top of DD.

I get a clatter for about 2 minutes with 5w 50 ( In Australia)

Yes, as stated above too thick of an oil will not keep the lifters filled. I run the water down here in TX and guess what....no ticking...ever, and last time I checked it gets real hot down here too

I've posted my lab results with mobil 1 15w50 before, here's a a brief clip from my sample that was in service for over 1 yr (I don't put alot of miles on the car: "All wear read at or below averages for this type of engine, which is a very good indication of normal wearing parts and careful operation. The universal averages show normal wear after 4800 miles on the oil. Insolubles were low at 0.2%, showing good oil filtration. No fuel dilution or anti-freeze was found. Silicon was normal indicating good air filtration. The TBN was 7.4, loads of active additive left. Try 4000 miles for your next sample. Leaving it in place more than a year is okay." side note: I'm currently trying the Amsoil Euro 5w40 this time. Andrew

How hot is your engine running? The change to 15W50 would not be the cause of increased valve noise (if that is what you are hearing). Porsche themselves approve 5W50 and so even those who do not have a brain of their own and only follow Porsche's guidance can't pin this on the 15W50 as it is the same viscosity of 5W50 at track temperatures. Make sure that the noise is in fact valves and not just the egr valve which can make a hell of a noise when the engine is run hard.

Ok let me try to understand. If your engine "ticks" and you are running one of Porsche recommended oils you should change to 15w50 right away to eliminate the "tick". If your engine "ticks" using 15w50 the noise is obviously from some problem that is not oil related. Seems to me (if he were to employ your previous logic) he should try an even higher viscosity. Maybe some 25w70 is in order? Someone should give it the good old college try......

As he stated, he has no ticking during non track driving since changing to the 15W50. So, yes, your sarcastic statement is correct. He is only experiencing a ticking after a track session and it has not even been confirmed that it is the valvetrain that is making the noise. There are alot of possible sources and causes of engine ticks. Please, enlighten us how a 5W50 oil and a 15W50 oil differ when at temps of 240F+? If the oil flow into the lifters is adequate when the oil temp is 100F, then why would it not be adequate at 240F? If his oil temperature is closer to 300F, he is going to hear valve ticking at times regardless of the oil he uses especially on tight corner tracks.

Show me where I ever said they did? Please enlighten us with your life tests on m96 engines run on Porsche's recommended fills vs. your recommendations....... Show us your test data that has lead to your conclusions (photo's, test data, anything??). Please share why Porsche experts are wrong in their assertions that VarioCam Plus will not function correctly without the recommended oils. Show us your test data that shows VC + needs the thicker fills you recommend. Do you have any substantive test data or just a lot of guesses??

dayum this sh t is getting efing old. do a search on oil and do you'll decide for yourself if 1999 knows what the hell he's talking about.

Bobistheoilguy website. They are shared all their finding on the different weight oil and brand. Great site.

classic stuff!!!

I have never seen this thread before but to run 60W oil is crazy like the OP asked, the tolerances is too tight to run this thick of oil. You are getting in the GEAR OIL viscocities, this can not be good for the motor at all. Imagine how long it would take to push the oil throught the entire engine at start-up. The start-up wear would probably be greater.

Nobody suggested running straight 60 weight oil.

True, but 60, that is a little too thick. I could see using this in drag racing engines with loose tolerances but what I have read is the M96 has tighter tolerances for increased efficiency and longevity.

Multiviscosity oil does not work that way. And the "tight tolerances" you speak about...you mean the ones that contribute to the various engine rattles, etc, or are you speaking of the ones that keep the engine from leaking and burning oil?

just drive guys

Okay, what I was taught and correct me if I am wrong is that the first number is what the oil flows in the winter time, hence the W for winter. The second number is the actual viscocity. So, 10W, as I was taught flows like a straight 10W in the cold climates, the 60 in this case is the actual protection weight or simply 60 weight. As far as tolerances, I read that the piston/bore relationship and the friction bearing/journal relationships are tighter than ever as Porsche was trying to squeeze every once of longevity from the M96.

Guys, run an oil from the approved list and move on....arguing oil with 1999 is a complete waste of time. He will not accept facts and seems to enjoy the dispute a little too much.

I run Mobil 0W40 and do not get this tick, even in hot weather. Why?

Darn, I was hoping you guys would give a big thumbs up to the 10W -60 as I have a case of the stuff sitting in my garage left over from the e46 M3. It was their recommended oil for that tall inline 6 engine. I wonder why? (not being sarcastic)

Two of the best specialist on Porsche mechanical in Madrid, told me that they don't like 10W60. They said that it was very good al BMW-M engines. They recomend always synthetic 5W40 for 996 Carrera, from approved list. They use Castrol 5W40, and Motul 5W40 EX 8100 not Mobil 1 0W40 , too much thin in warm and hot climates

Yeah, that reminds me of the old saying, which I think applies here. The saying is better when read aloud. "Don't argue with your wife.... dicker!"

with nearly 170,000 miles on the car and don't get the ticking either. Just a bit of chain noise upon startup that goes away very quickly as the engine oil pressurizes the chain tensioners. Takes just seconds. What I do notice is that as the oil gets some miles on it -- around 4000+ miles -- the engine seems to be a little noiser than when the oil is fresh. Since I change the engine's oil/flter every 5000 miles I suspect that those that run the engine's oil for longer period of time and more miles the oil suffers a decrease in viscosity -- from increasing levels of water and unburned gas contamination -- and this less viscous oil can result in zero-lash valve lifters bleeding down more when engine shut off. Chain tensioners also can loose more oil and in fact this thinner oil will drain away from all engine surfaces and passages more readily than fresher higher viscosity oil. Also, what can contribute to a car's engine being noisy (or noisier) upon startup is how long the engine sits. With 170,000 miles on my car's engine, the engine gets run almost every day and for more than just a few miles. But for an car that gets used very seldom, or with long periods of inactivity between being used, the oil has more time to drain away from everywhere in the engine and as a result the engine's going to be noisier upon startup than an engine that run's more frequently, all other things being equal. Porches don't like to sit unused for long periods of time although a lot of them do sit unused for long periods of time. While there's a cost to using a Porsche there's a cost to not using it as well. And Porsche engines I think do better with more frequent oil/filter changes, but arguing for this is like shoveling sand against the tide using a teaspoon. Sincerely, Macster.

170,000 miles on one of Porsches recommended oils. Surely you must have been driving in Alaska, right? From the posts of some you could infer that they would have expected your engine to sieze long ago. Way to drive the car!! Got any pics?

no.....NO not another oil thread! PLEASE GOD MAKE IT STOP!!!! Soooo... where can we get oil wenches?

Quotes source post: 3024522

This comes directly from http://www.porsche.com/usa/accessori...toroel-10w-60/ Or use google and search for "Porsche 10w60". First hit.... "Porsche Classic's 10W-60 version is an absolute ultra-high-performance oil. Its viscosity guarantees optimum lubrication behaviour, both during cold starts and in a hot engine at full throttle. The fully synthetic PAO-based (polyalphaolefin) oil also has excellent properties in terms of evaporation loss, HTHS and shear stability. Anyone venturing onto a race track in a 911 would also be well advised to use the 10W-60 oil, since it cares for and cleans the engine."