question about window regulator and switches

Hi Guys, I have a friend's car (02 996 C2) that is having an odd issue that I didn't come across a solution when searching, and I'd like to see if someone has had the same problem. The driver's side door, when opening it from either the outer handle, or the inner handle, will lower the window the appropriate distance, but will then immediately raise the window back up, even when the door is opened, or even when the handle is held open. The "car" seems to think the door is not open, because the dome light will go out after a bit, as though the door was shut, even though the door is actually open. That's the first issue. A second thing I notice is that when trying to close the door, because the window is not lowered any longer, it has to snap into the seal, which seems to have loosened the window. Does this up/down action and inability to recognize that the door is open, sound like a microswitch problem, or a regulator problem? Seems like the switches work, but something is not registering the proper function. Otherwise the function is normal for the roll up and down; it just won't stay down in the required spot, and the car doesn't realize the door is open with it actually is. Pointers? I'll try the "reset" maneuver tomorrow to see if that helps. Thanks so much for any other ideas from those that have come across this issue.

It isn't the regulator. It sounds like the door contact microswitch inside the lock assembly is not showing the door open when the door is actually open, causing the control unit to raise the window as if the door has already been closed. At least that is where I would start.

Thank you for the helpful reply Doug. I'll take a look at where to find that - Do you know if it is in the handle side, or is it the actual lock mechanism on the backside of the door? Thanks again!

It's screwed to the rear edge of the door and is the part that captures the striker on the chassis. You'll have to remove the interior door panel to gain access to the part.

How far does the window drop when its first opened, if its less then 1/8-1/4 inch its time for a new regulator

Ok, Doug, you were right on. Upon removing the door lock mechanism, there is a micro switch that is activated by the latch to give the door's open/closed status - its plunger broke off and so it was no longer working. I actually found the broken plunger in the bottom of the door. I am hoping it can be repaired because I have yet to find a replacement microswitch - I'll try radioshack tomorrow. Seems like a shame to buy a whole new lock just for this little switch! Thanks again for the help Doug. Now... any leads on a microswitch source? I just need a new plunger!

It looks like the same switch that they use in the spoiler to determine if it is up or down. It's not a very robust design. You might be able to fabricate a new plunger out of some scrap plastic but otherwise I think a new lock is the only way to get a new switch. Good luck with the repair!

A quick update that might be helpful - I bought a $5 microswitch from Digi-key.com and successfully repaired the locking mechanism by dissecting a new switch, using the new plunger and seal. Fortunately the Porsche switch can be disassembled without breaking it apart - I broke apart the new switch and everything fit together perfectly. All is well, saving from having to buy the entire lock for this small switch! Thanks for the help.

Do you have the Digikey.com part number?

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I bought three switches since I was not sure which would work best. The first image below was the easiest to cut open and had the same plunger type as the original switch, and I used the blue seal, too. Its part number is: SW719-ND The other switch I bought, could work as a replacement by epoxying it into place if an entire switch is required. Its part number is: SW291-ND

Good find on the switch and thanks for the update on your final silution.

garrett376 How hard is it to remove the door lock mechanism? I have a short in my car and have traced it to that. Thanks, Rich

Thanks for the great information! I'm a little nervous about taking the mechanism out of the door, especially breaking the connection with the outside door handle. Has anyone found a write-up or is it easier than I'm imagining? Thanks again, Dan

+1 on good info! Thanks for sharing. Someone should add this to DIY section!

Great info, I'm just into that now ! Will try to fix the door this week, and will drive the car to the shop if I fail Thanks for sharing...

Sorry to dig back up such an old thread but I am having similar problems with my drivers side window on an '02 C4S. The window only drops an 1/8th or 1/16th when opening the door. Holding the handle makes no difference, and if I push the window down by hand to a 1/2 inch with the door open it comes back up normally when closing the door normally Window works perfectly with the power window switch... Any thoughts?

so now that I have posted some "Newbie Pics".... any thoughts? Do I need to replace the regulator?

hay,dd, whatever happened with your window problem? i have that exact situation now, seems a bit different than all the other problems, like maybe the cable is stretched or something is loose holding the window in the front, howe you get this, it has been anotheryear since update, thanks in advance, kevin

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Garret, per PM, thanks again so much for the solution! I received the switch from digikey in the mail (darn, that's a tiny switch!), it appears likely that upon opening it, in order to remove the plunger etc, it will likely break the case, as its just too small to crack open smoothly with a blade. Obviously this doesn't matter as I just want the innards - however, is the micro-switch inside the door a similar size and build? If so, I am worried about damaging the casing upon dismantling it. Any advice? (I haven't actually removed the door panel yet and looked at the switch on the actual lock) Cheers, --H

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Hi Howard, The Porsche switch popped open easily without being destroyed and snapped right back together with no issues because it's designed to be opened versus the digikey one that's molded together. You can see the tabs on the Porsche switch that lets you pop off the top easily. Good luck!

Just another note - this fix is still working almost 3 years later.

Finally got around to looking at this fix today. The door panel came off easily in a few minutes, with no broken plastic tabs or scuffed leather However, upon removal of the panel and peeling back the sound deadening material, I was left with a couple of questions before proceeding (plus it seems I'm missing a couple sizes of torx sockets): Firstly, Is this the lock assembly I need to remove? Is it just the 2 black torx bolts on the side of the door that hold the lock assembly in place? Is it necessary to remove the metal bracket below to slide the assembly out? If so, how many bolts hold it in place? It looks like 4 bolts, including the right lower corner bolt that holds the air bag in-place (behind the liner in the picture)? or Cheers, --H

Remove the 2 black torx bolts, then carefully withdraw it... there's a plastic tab that inserts into the door lock cylinder that you need to be careful of.

Will it slide out without removing the bracket? Don't suppose you know offhand what size the large torx bolts are? Cheers,

I've got to do the same fix on mine, and it's not a torx bit you need for the lock assembly, it's a triple square bit. I bought a set a a local automotive parts store...not very expensive.

Just completed the fix using cannibalized parts from the Digi Key switch and everything is working properly. Important note: When you put it back together, make sure you adjust the lock mechanism high enough (see bolts in pic) so that the cam is pushed down by the jamb latch on opening to activate the microswitch. You can see in this photo that the cam hasn't been push down far enough, so a quick loosening of the bolts and moving the assembly up by 2mm would make it work properly.

You guys cursed me... I have to do this on my other car now!

So to answer Howard's question above since I just took it all apart: yes I did need to remove the gold colored bracket to make it easier to slide the unit out. Also, I did need to remove the 2 10mm nuts on the back of the door handle so I could pull out the latch unit without breaking the lock mechanism that inserts into it.

My Boxster just starting doing this same thing: with the door open, the window rises up to the top. I will be looking into performing this switch replacement. Thanks everyone!

Please let me know which micro switch is damaged: - with the door open when I pull and release the outside/inside handle the window goes down and up immediately. After that, If I want to close the door after I touched the outside handle (window up), I have to bring the door as close to the car as possible without closing it. The moment the latch touches the striker the window goes down and stays there and now I can close the door. If I push the latch's mechanism with my finger, the window goes down and stay there. - when I open the door from inside..everything is fine..and window goes down and stays there. I can close the door without any issue. Thank you

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hi guys! any update on this particular query? was it the locking mechanism microswitch problem also?

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Just replaced the drivers side door lock on my 2002 C4S due to a lock micro-switch issue - I was having all the same issues quoted in this thread. I used the information in this thread plus the tech articles on Pelican Parts for both door lock and door card removal. I found garrett376's advice (quoted above) to be excellent as I was having a hard time disengaging the door lock latch pin. One other thing to note. The new locks for model years 2002-2005 don't come with the "plastic keep plate" (my name for it) that secures the Bowden Cable in place so make sure you transfer it over from the old lock. See attached pic showing what I mean by "keep plate". Other than that, this was a 3 hour job which I could probably do in about half that time now I know what I'm doing. Not a hard job just a bit fiddly!! These are the tech articles that I used: http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...el_Removal.htm http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...e_and_Lock.htm Plus, useful exploded diagrams showing all the parts: http://www.renntech.org/forums/topic...closed-sensor/

Great thread for what is becoming a common issue but not too difficult to attack yourself! Mark/Pelican Parts

Check out this video You Tube

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Sure wish I would have found this little gem of a thread before I started my door lock replacement. This information concerning the Triple Square head versus Torx is key to this task. I suppose most of the German car owners are familiar with this head, although I was not and it stopped me dead in my tracks from proceeding. This was not called out in the book I just bought from PelicanParts either (101 Projects For Your Porsche 911), which is a bit surprising to me, as it is this unique tool requirement that was one of the primary reasons for buying such a book. I may have missed it, but scanning again I do not see the Triple Square head bolts being called out. As a revision I would definitely call out the Triple Square bits as a requirement for your tool box if owing and planning DIY work for your Porsche is in your plans.

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Exact same problem. Only not working from outside. Any ideas?

I had same issue in my 997. Fixed by purchasing door lock/latch mechanism from dealer. The part I am referring to is #14 in diagram... http://www.autoatlanta.com/porsche-p...section=804-00 Disconnect the battery with window up. Remove interior door panel. Disconnect wiring, airbag, and window motor drive, and door pull from interior door handle. Remove internal metal door panel. No need to remove the exterior door handle if the door handle has a flexible shaft connecting exterior door handle to lock/latch mechanism. This flexible shaft allows you to lock/unlock your door manually in the event your car battery is dead. Unscrew two bolts that holds the door lock/latch mechanism and disengage flexible shaft from door lock/latch mechanism. Here is the flexible shaft in diagram. Flexible shaft is seen in the top right hand corner of diagram and is connected to the key hole shaft. On earlier models 996, flexible shaft is not so flexible as it is made out of steel. http://www.autoatlanta.com/porsche-p...section=804-20 Swap out old lock/latch mechanism for new from dealer. And don't forget to re-engage flexible shaft from exterior door handle to lock/latch mechanism, otherwise you will NOT be able to unlock your door with your key inserted into the exterior door handle. Reconnect metal door panel, wiring, window motor drive, air bag, door pull cable to interior door handle. Re-attach interior door panel. Done.

I'm stuck. (2002 C4S) So I pull open my inside door handle or my outside door handle - window goes easily down and then back up the necessary amount. From the outside - I can close the door, but then need to "flick" the outside handle to make it go down (same goes for the inside). From what I've read, it's the plunger part. I did order a spare "plunger" (SW719-ND). I disassembled the door - took the lock mechanism out and opened it up (see pic). I then checked all 3 plungers and they all seemed to work and click back to normal position. Not sure where I should go from here. Any suggestions other than ordering a new lock mechanism (which I'm very tempted to do at this point). Thanks for any suggestions.

Just posting this in case anyone needs any help in the future. Like I said in my previous post, the window had no issues going up and down. No issue with the quick downward motion, with either the inner or outer handle. The issue was that it always went up when the door was open. I opened up the mechanism and all the micro switches appeared to work. There was something else that was wrong. I ordered a new door lock mechanism and now everything works. It seems like there was some possible electrical issue in the mechanism that wasn't working correctly.

I've found several threads on the subject of window regulators mentioning the cable getting slack and recommending adjusting to take up that slack in the sheath (or Bowden cable). However, I haven't been able to find anything specific to doing that. One post said to pull out the cotter pin (I have 4 of them close together), pull the Bowden tube tight (mine appears to be as retracted as it's going to get), and then re-insert the cotter pin. What am I missing?

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A new window regulator! Cable stretches with time/use. Many have attempted repair but it just is not going to work for very long. Bite the bullet and replace it since you are already "in there". http://www.autoatlanta.com/porsche-p...section=804-30

So glad I found this, having the same window doesn't drop-can't push it down-interior lights don't turn on when I open the passenger door in my 01 996TT. Hoping it's just the plunger and not the whole lock assembly

Just wanted to add to the knowledge base. I pulled my door latch/lock mechanism and discovered the microswitch on the outside of the latch to be worn and defective. However, when the rubber nipple wore off the plastic plunger damaged the plastic coating on the mechanism. I ordered a replacement microswitch to replace it, but from the pictures, you can see why I likely need a new latch. Incidentally, I tried heating up a flat head screwdriver and gently smoothing the plastic coating. This fixed the problem intermittently but still happens. Was thinking about cutting the plastic off and filling with epoxy and sanding smooth. Someone told me you can buy a VW latch instead of the Porsche. Is this true? Not looking forward to spending $350 on this simple problem. Worn microswitch. Shows signs of nipple abuse. This picture shows where the microswitch attaches to the outside of the latch. The plunger touches the black wheel. Notice how scuffed it is.

OK, so I purchased a VW Beatle door latch. It had the wrong pin out, but the door latch and microswitch were what I was looking for. I removed the old latch from the plastic enclosure, soldered in the new microswitch and put it on the new latch. Voila, works perfectly. $25 fix and about an hour and a half of labor. It's amazing how good this fix felt. I was really getting tired of closing my door twice! Replacement part on top with cheapo microswitches and difference mechanism. OEM part on bottom. OEM part on the right. With new latch and microswitch soldered to board. Microswitch

Awesome! Thanks for adding to the Knowledge base!

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Searched, read, researched and I just want confirmation.... 1999 C2 Cab. My passenger side front window makes no nasty noises and works correctly in every way except... ...when opening the door from the outside or inside handle the window drops maybe an 1/8 of an inch, certainly not the proper amount. I can shut the door but the window clearly by sight and by sound hits the roof. I can push the window down while it is open (using little force) to where it should go, and then shut the door and it will of course miss the roof since the window is lowered the proper amount, and the window does pinch shut as it should. So it's only not dropping down enough, all else is fine...so question is...is this the regulator like this post suggests? My research seems to indicate it may be that the regulator is the problem, however, it is just that the cables have stretched and a spacer can be inserted to take up the slack and this fixes it without replacing any expensive parts, just requires removing door panel. Am I cooking with oil here guys?

If you have already done the limit reset on the window - lower window then press the window switch and hold for 10 seconds, then raise the window and do the same thing, and the problem is still there then it is the window regulator. If you're going through the hassle of removing the door panel, do yourself a favor and replace the window regulator with new OE. No amount of trickery with the cables or a spacer will work and you will be back in there again within 3 months.

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From the behavior you describe and based on my experience the window ragulator is shot. A spacer is not the solution. The only real fix is to open the door and replace the window regulator. When my Boxster windows started failing to drop the full 1/2" when the door was opened the tech diagnosed the window regulator. Upon removing the old regulator it just came apart. It was simply worn out. Might add that one was replaced, the passenger side despite the fact the passenger side door gets used less than the driver's side door, then shortly thereafter the driver's side started manifesting the same behavior and was replaced. The window regulator is not that expensive of a part and its labor to replace not that much. (There are some DIY write ups on this process but the job wants to be done right.) I have to add as gently as I can that if the cost of a window regulator is an issue with you I think as you continue to drive the car you are going to be in for a big surprise as other much more expensive items wear out.

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You're saying it's expensive to maintain these car? Hummmm....who knew! Note to self. Thanks for the opinions....

I have to say, the rear window stopped going up one day in my 996 cab. Rather than spring $700-$850 for a new regulator, I sent mine in to Power Window Regulator in Phoenix, AZ for a rebuild. They will rebuild for around $200, claim to use their own metal replacement parts, and warranty their work. Yes, it was a huge pain to get the regulator out, but compared to $2000 dealer cost, or $1500 Indy, my $270 (inlcudes shipping) will hopefully be way better

roch auto sells the window regulators for as low as $130. Ive replaced mine twice now. The Porsche OE unit that I paid close to $500 for didnt even last a year. rocking the rock auto one now.

I had the same issue as the OP. If I lifted the door handle, the window lowered 1/4 inch, but as soon as I released the handle, it raised up again. When closing the door, I noticed that the window would drop as soon as the latch touched the striker plate, so I could see that the latch was not engaging the microswitch fully while the door was open. I simply loosened the triple square bolts on the door lock and adjusted it so that it was activating the microswitch while the door was open. I lubricated the mechanism, tightened it back up and now the window works perfectly, the window stays slightly dropped as the door is open, then closes when it is shut. Took maybe 5 mins from starting to analyze the problem to a finished repair.

So I just finally fixed my rear window regulator and want to plug http://powerwindowrepair.com/ (no affiliation). Rather than pay $800 for a new regular on my 996, they rebuilt mine with better parts than even the original and sent it back to me. I paid about $250 including shipping and did the job myself. Compared to $1500-$2000 dealer cost, I'm way ahead. I did have a wrinkle, though. They rebuilt the regulator and the motor, but for my car, the electronics module failed. When the regulator I got back didn't work, the tech there (Paul, who owns a 996) explained that he doesn't have the ability to test the electronics, and that those have only failed once in his experience, and does probably 3 Porsche rebuilds per week. So Paul was very helpful in testing and diagnosing the issue on the car, etc. He ended up sending me another replacement motor/electronics that fixed the issue. The replacement cost money, but I'm still way ahead of the new part from Porsche. So anyway, I would recommend folks that want or can DIY these, I would use them again in the future.

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ugh. looks like I am doing this for a 3rd time.

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Read the thread. Again. Not convinced it will be my regulator. I will have to double check but I don't think I can push the window down at all. Basically the thing isn't recognising that the door is closing and bringing the window down and up. Plunger Micro switch?

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Is your symptom like this? When you pull the internal or external door handle, the window will drop ~1/2" like normal but it will roll back up as soon as you release the handle when the door remains open?

Nm

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I'll look more closely when I get home. Is that indications the plunger micro switch needs to be replaced or regulator?

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If that's your symptom, it's the external microswitch on the door lock Need to remove the door lock to replace the switch or the mechanical half of the lock. There is a recent lock rebuild thread on RL. Let me see if I can find it.

https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/999467-door-locking-mechanism-rebuild.html

Thanks! I have switch sw719-ND in front of me.

Haven't had the chance to look at the switches yet...things seem to be getting worse though. The door lock light is on (on the button) and won't turn off. When I push it, it beeps very quickly at Me like something is wrong or a door is left open... Anyone know why it would be beeping at Me?

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I've never had that happen before

Reading the net, it's a common symptom of bad micro switches Hopefully it goes away once I fix the switches.

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So...pulling on the handle from the outside does not bring the window down or up.

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Awesome tread! This is the kind of tread I spent hours searching for... how to REPAIR my microswitch, rather than the entire lock... Some people can afford to throw lots of money at their car, I got this car because I was able to apply cost saving measures to lots of things in my life.... Now, I can start the process of figuring out which switch needs to be replaced. My alarm occasionally double beeps when I unlock my car door. My alarm sometimes relocks itself after I open only my passenger door. I think the alarm does not know when the passenger door is open. Would that be the I am thinking that it is the "door lock motor has reached the 'unlock' position" switch. Thoughts? What is the size of the triple square XZN bit? How are XZN bits named? Like Torx is T25, T20, etc. I need to search through my bit set to see if I have the right one, but I cant find it online. Is it like M10, M15, etc? I missed this link above, but this is great information as well: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...m-rebuild.html Update: Just ordered my parts, 2 switches were cheaper $15.03 shipped, at Mouser.com using the Orion part number: D2HW-BR201M I figured that if it is not the switch, the switch will eventually fail at some point, so now I have a spare. Update: It ended up being COLD SOLDER Joints. Opened it up, and saw the cracked solder. Removed all the old solder and resoldered all the joints. Its working great now.

I've been having similar issues as others have described on the passenger door (2002 996 C2 coupe) but it's been intermittent and has been getting worse. I know that I have a bad regulator and bought a replacement 2 years ago. But now the locking LED has been going on randomly, I have been getting horn chirps when locking or unlocking, etc., but intermittently. So I spent today replacing the regulator, and removed the door lock assembly and took it apart down to the circuit board. Yes, definitely bad solder joints (I have a lot of experience soldering so it was obvious, and looked similar to a photo posted in this thread or maybe another related one). I cleaned those up, resoldered, and put it all back together. (Which took a few tries; I didn't see that the regulator has a higher stop built in that you have to remove for the 996). So now it's better in some ways, worse in others. The window reacts exactly right, which is improved. It goes down 10mm or so when opened and slides back up to the top when closed. The interior light works correctly in response to either door opening or closing. So the door switch monitoring the door open/close state is certainly working, which was not the case before. What's wrong now is that it is 100% consistent that the locking system is not working. The red LED is always on. It appears that the passenger door is always unlocked. When unlocking the door with either fob or driver's door key lock, I get two horn chirps and when locking with either, I get one chirp (or nothing). In either case I hear the passenger door lock mechanism doing multiple tries at locking (or unlocking). The driver's door responds correctly, but it appears the passenger door remains unlocked in all cases. Durametric gives codes 61 and 47 (see below). Looking for any advice on what to look at next. It appears the passenger door lock mechanism is now completely broken although the switches, at least one or two of them, are now working correctly and consistently. Maybe I missed something while reassembling the lock mechanism (I can see why it's not a user serviceable unit). I can probably get in there and replace it in 2 hours and not 8 like today (it was my first time tackling a 996 door). UPDATE: if you really want to learn what's inside the door lock mechanism, how it works, how to disassemble and reassemble, this video covers all of it: You Tube It's for a VW unit but very similar to the 996 unit. After watching this, I'm pretty sure I missed at least one important step while reassembling mine. Key sections: 22:00 - detail of electrical internals; top shell must align with worm slider hole 26:40 - worm slide: when microswitch closes it sends signal that door is unlocked 38:00 - reassembly, in detail