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YOUR RESEARCHExcruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
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Clean i'll break out the mics and start
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
After I get everything cleaned, I'll break out the mics and start with some measurements on the wear surfaces inside.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
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Leading evidence: 'Clean i'll break out the mics and start' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Check anyways' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Install 4 months 2k miles, temperatures are right as rain
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They have been installed for 4 months 2k miles, Temperatures are right as rain.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
Replace with a ims solution) and i have yet
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
No bore scoring, the IMS bearing is still looking good (though will be replaced with a IMS Solution) and I have yet to find the crack in the cylinder head but honestly haven't looked too closely, so I'll have to buckle down and really give the heads a good going over.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
Use college professor
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Anyone need a slightly used college professor for summer work
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
Use internal wire lock, like what we
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The factory dual row used an internal wire lock, like what we use on the Single Row Pro.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
Replace (and consumables)
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Suggestion · Original poster
I'm a little down today...just got a quote from LN Engineering for Nickies and Pistons and several other engine parts that I would need to replace (and consumables) for $11.5K.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
Replace with a ims solution) and i have yet
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
No bore scoring, the IMS bearing is still looking good (though will be replaced with a IMS Solution) and I have yet to find the crack in the cylinder head but honestly haven't looked too closely, so I'll have to buckle down and really give the heads a good going over.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
Run into this situation it would be better
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Suggestion · Original poster
My impression at the build class was that if we ran into this situation it would be better to scrap the head and get a replacement that didn't have pieces of impeller in the coolant spaces of the head.
Excruciatingly Slow Rebuild But Lots of Pictures Coming
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I picked up "the cheapest M96/21 on craigslist" (Pun intended - no malice though) and started tearing it down. In the process, I have taken lots of pictures and have many zip-locs full of parts, and some containers.
How much did it cost? Well, let's just say it was more than $299.00 and less than $301.00. It had intermix but the PO seemed to catch it early, most of the signs intermix (milkshake) has been limited to showing only on bank 4-6 side and the rest of the engine is in remarkably good condition, there was intermix sludge in the sump but no metal wear FOD. No bore scoring, the IMS bearing is still looking good (though will be replaced with a IMS Solution) and I have yet to find the crack in the cylinder head but honestly haven't looked too closely, so I'll have to buckle down and really give the heads a good going over. This motor looks like it has fewer than 20K miles on it, as I clean the parts, I am really surprised at the lack of wear, the only thing that seemed to be leaking was the RMS.
Now, if you're curious, this is my plan. I'm going to do a full build/rebuild on the motor; perhaps go to 3.4L Nickies with some other performance modifications and then find a 996 or Boxster roller to have a fun little car with a strong little motor. It'll be a slow process as I am also working seriously on my plan for my 997 rebuild next summer (this car has a good 188K miles on it and still goes like a champ) and the LNE parts aren't cheap, but they are the best so I'll be going with Charles' services as I move forward. After I get everything cleaned, I'll break out the mics and start with some measurements on the wear surfaces inside.
In the meantime, if there is a part you want to see close up on or a measurement you would like me to take, let me know and I'll do what I can.
So here we go...
What it looked like before I tore into it
Guts
As I get ready to drift off to sleep for the day...I leave you with this. What is it? Which one, is the real question.
100,000,000 femto points "on account" to the first one correct
When I popped the seal on this guy it made a sucking sound and there wasn't a bit of grease in there, just oil. BTW, bearing in otherwise good shape...so which one is it?
^^^Exactly, Charles earned himself 10^-7 points, I do not know what the points are good for but its always good to win...even if you are a professional.
Here's a pic with the seal off and you can see the 2nd row of bearings in the back.
IMSB from the inside
Firstly, NO FAIR CHARLES! 🤣
Second, what�s with the 6204 designation on the seal - or does it actually say 5204 and I just read it wrong? In any case, good luck with the build - at least you�ll know you won�t have to worry about the IMSB or The Cylinders any more! Make sure you�re extra careful with the wrist pin clips!!!👍
I'll have to check that seal when I get home today. I've had some good instruction on the wrist pin clip installation last winter in Jake's Engine Building class but, if anything, it taught me to be extra alert when installing those little guys. I'll practice on this motor for a while before I send things off, I want to get to the point where I can set a clip in the dark
Came home for lunch...seal is marked 6204DUA17 (NSK). From a quick search of the inter-tubes it appears to be a correct marking, perhaps it was just manufactured for these cars.
OK, here we go again. I pulled the cracked head (4-6) from its storage box and started to look at it.
Can you tell which cylinder is cracked...
From the bottom?
Also, one internet cookie to the first one to identify the brown stained passage in the first image here. Its about 1/3 over from the right and a just a little down from the top of the image. It looks sort of like an old time key slot...here's your chance at glory
Did the bottom tell you anything?
How about this one from the top...can you see it?
Lets zoom in a bit, there on the center right between the spark plug hole and the core plug.
Now I know what Jake would say, "replace that head" but I'm gonna see what Len (Hoffman) thinks. I don't know, but it seems like going out a buying another head from ebay or a recycler has too much risk for the cost. I'll just have to wait and see. Any ideas?
AND...there's a little something in the first image that is nearly undetectable...pointing to the cause of the failure. I'll post more on that tomorrow (with pics)
The culprit
As I was inspecting and cleaning the cylinder head, I spotted this in a coolant passage.
Right inside that coolant passage...a little glimmer of plastic.
Unsurprisingly shaped like part of an impeller blade on the water pump. Its no wonder that there was an almost new water pump on the engine when I bought it.
While it was quite easy to remove with a small pick, I noticed that it was heat welded onto the head and a small bit was left attached when I removed this piece. My impression at the build class was that if we ran into this situation it would be better to scrap the head and get a replacement that didn't have pieces of impeller in the coolant spaces of the head. But I'll check anyways.
Yep, and the reason I made these to catch these little devils.
Lenn Hoffman can fix that crack no problem, that is the easier of the two common cracks..
Those are quite interesting, do they make the car run hotter at all? How did you fix them in place? You could put sight ports in the water pump body to monitor the screens. Even better have some bore scope cams fixed into the pump body and monitor the screens from the comfort of the cab
I always appreciated sight ports on my motorbikes, so easy to see whats going on.
Oddly enough, as you made this post here, I was discussing the head with Len on the phone and he said the exact same thing about the crack. Also discussed some other work as I aim to take this motor to 3.8L now. Feeling power hungry.
They have been installed for 4 months 2k miles, Temperatures are right as rain. They are held in place by the vertical crush strength of the 27 gauge welded steel wire. I have thought of a way to do a "extreme test" just to see what it will take to crush the catch screens when I feel friskier, but for now the "actual road tests" will have to do..
I'm a little down today...just got a quote from LN Engineering for Nickies and Pistons and several other engine parts that I would need to replace (and consumables) for $11.5K. On top of that, I'll have repair costs for the cracked cylinder head and head work to make these heads work with the 3.8L displacement upgrade. And thats not everything, probably another few thou to finish off. The Nickies are the only way to go in my opinion, they are a proven technology and I just dont think that Porsche has really ever addressed the existing issues in these motors to make the short block a reliable alternative. I'm also very comfortable with my discussions with the LN people to trust the quality of both their work and the products they supply. Don't get me wrong, I knew this was coming, but there's always a shock when you see it on paper. I guess its the cost of dipping my toes in the water
So my problem lies with how to approach the continuation of the build. I'm in no hurry because I don't have a car for this motor, but I have this puzzle in my back room and it needs finishing. Gotta feed that monkey.
Anyone need a slightly used college professor for summer work
Oh, BTW, the port (passage) was the Secondary Air Injection port. I guess I'll keep that internet cookie for myself.
My brain hurts
A bit at a time...
I just got a package from LN today. Thanks for the Black Friday Sale.
I must say, I always enjoy talking with George (Charles's Dad)
Added to my collection of parts for this build: IMS Solution (for dual row IMSB), six K1 rods, a billet IMS to crank tensioner, plus an oil pump drive hex key.
Now, gotta work on getting the Nickies.
Shiny parts for the build
