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YOUR RESEARCHaverage owner age
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outliers (people buying at the extremes)
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Reported cause
A median is not influenced the way the mean is due to outliers (people buying at the extremes).
Leading evidence: 'outliers (people buying at the extremes)' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'outliers (people buying at the extremes)' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Check pag has increased prices' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Last time I checked PAG has increased prices on a yearly basis.
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Bastard fired right up after reinstalling a charged battery in her the day I sold it (hadn't ran for nearly TWO YEARS).
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I'm 35 almost 36, but I bought mine used (2002 C4S) about 2 weeks ago.
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Suggestion
Corvettes on the other hand are based on a single demographic that doesn't seem to change: 50 year old white male with a $100K salary (80% of their new car buyers)...and yes the correlate to a mid-life crissis.
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Suggestion
I just don't get the people who care more about their title than actually using the knowledge it represents to do something of value (not trying to imply that any rennlisters do that ;-).
Outcome qualification: Negation, uncertainty or missing explicit repair resolution overrides the raw extraction signal.
981s or 997s, i plan
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My next Porsche, likely a 981S or 997S, I plan to buy next year, late February or early March, if I can get what I want for a trade in/private party on my 03 C2.
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176 eligible posts · 0 unverified posts · 1 discussions match the subject in their title or opening post.
Rennlist: 1 discussions
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What's the average age of a Porsche 911 owner these days? I read somewhere perhaps in WSJ that the average age is in the 50's (new porsche buyers). Is that true? Sounds a bit high; although from what I see here in SF that seems about right.
I'm 35 almost 36, but I bought mine used (2002 C4S) about 2 weeks ago.
I think 30 to 40 ish is for buying used, for buying new I'm sure the age is much higher.
I have to believe that the average age of a 911 owner is much less than 50. Somewhere in the 30s would be my guess. My expectation is that the article you allude to lists the average age of the owner of a new 911, and I wouldn't be at all surprised that it would be upper 40s, low 50s. Most guys in their 20s and 30s are saddled with large mortgage payments and of course the expenses of raising a young family. A $90K purchase in those circumstances may be a challenge even for those with substantial incomes.
OK, I fall into the 50+ category.
Thought about buying new, but then would have missed the "opportunity" to buy my kids their car, pay for their 2 university tuitions.....
Actually, I'm not a fan of taking the first year or two depreciation hit.
First, I would very much doubt that the average was that high. Most Porsche drivers seem to be younger. This is especially true with Boxsters. I would estimate somewhere in the 40's. I am 37 and bought my first 911 at 32. Most of the newer 911 owners I meet are established in their careers with kids somewhere between elementry school and high school.
Corvettes on the other hand are based on a single demographic that doesn't seem to change: 50 year old white male with a $100K salary (80% of their new car buyers)...and yes the correlate to a mid-life crissis. Some of the Corvette sites track these demographics year to year along with production numbers, etc. Surprising, about 60% of the Corvettes produced are automatics. This trend is also very different different with the typical Porsche buyer (except for Cayenne's, which are all autos).
Here in the Bay Area, most of the Porsche owners I have seen on the roads (and met and various drive meets) seem to be in the 40-50 range. Not too many young folks seem to go for Porsches. The preferred choice there has been Acuras, BMWs (particularly the M3 -- I always see younger folks in an M3) and Infinitis (again, many G35 Coupe drivers are young).
I had read somewhere (this was maybe 6 or 7 yrs ago, so it may not apply to the C6 vette) that the avg vette owner (buying new) was about 60yrs old, male, and 80% were automatics. The Z06's only come in stick so that may have changed the results and at one time I believe the C5's, auto was the standard trans and you had to pay extra for a 6 speed.
I 've own three vettes, a 94 when I was 25, a 95 when I was 26 and a 2002 Z06 when I was 32, (all 6 spds, of course). I bought them all used, but I was usually the youngest vette driver that I came into contact with.
I sold my 02 Z06 recently to a 23 yr old.
The Journal article referred to NEW 911 buyers I believe. I don't doubt that figure since all the new 997 drivers here in the Bay Area seem over 50. Don't know why but all the convertible drivers are bald. Maybe a correlation? (That's why I'm not inclined to get a Cab.)
Yes there are tons of BMW M5, M3's in the Bay Area...
I'm 32 and eyeing to get a 2000 996...
First Porsche 6 months ago at age 57. Did have a bunch of BMWs previously, and most recently a couple of Audi S4's ('01 and '05). They're very different cars - the '04 C4S is my weekend toy and I love it more each day!
Actually the demographics haven't changed that much. Corvette owners by average are getting older and not younger. What the Z06 did, is add some new customers and shift a lot of manual drivers from Coupes and Convertibles to FRC's. For 2005, 59% of all Corvettes were autos. In 2004, 77% of all Corvette Coupes were autos with 71% in 2003 and 70% in 2002. The Z06 has never been higher than 24% of the total Corvette production (2003). They are currently made in much lower numbers then they were a couple of years ago.
Hey, scientists are cool. Engineers are nerds.
Congrats on the recent entry to the club. I was told on the day I obtained mine - okay, you're through the door, now do something with what you learned.
My wife and I are both nerds (she the M.D. and me the lowly Ph.D.).
30 for our first and 33 for our second. 34 for our upcoming 3rd P-Car. No chance prior to 30 with us being in academia for the better part of our lives!
Firstly,it's pretty cool to see where others are coming from.
Secondly...
Don't undersell yourself. There's nothing lowly about a Ph.D.
No offense intended to the MDs that have posted...
An MD takes memorized information to diagnose and treat. A Ph.D can go in with no background knowledge and use nothing but the information at hand (in addition to knowledge of where to find information) and deductive reasoning to understand and modify a system. As a Ph.D you should be able to use resources and logic to understand pretty much anything that is thrown at you. The same cannot be said of an MD. We cannot do surgery, but we should be able to diagnose pretty much anything from a washing machine to color variations in a paint. My training is in chemistry, but with a little time to gather background information I can tackle pretty much anything from any scientific discipline... as long as there is a mechanism, then a system can be understood and modified.
Spoken like a true Ph.D but the whole memorize, diagnose, and treat is gonna get your *** whooped by people like my wife. It is more than that. I thought the same thing until I saw her in action.
My "lowly" comment was more of a compliment of my beautiful, intelligent wife.
I am sometimes amazed how fricking smart she is and how good she is at her job. Takes alot to impress somebody of my academic background but she did it. I am just a bit more modest about my education and still can't believe that a typical beer drinking, skirt chasing, frat-boy from the south got as far as I did in academia.
What's funny is she is just as impressed by me but I don't get it. Who do you think she comes to when her weekly JAMA comes in the mail and she needs the stats interpreted to understand that article? That's right. Me, the stats prof. I still don't get it though since I don't see what is so difficult about interpreting stats.
But when all is said and done I still can't believe that growing up as a kid, that postter of the 911 I had on my wall is now sitting in my garage!
Don't get me wrong, I have the utmost respect for MDs, but an MD is not a Ph.D and a Ph.D is not an MD. My wife is an electronic engineer (no Ph.D.) and to be honest what she does boggles my mind.
I like your description of college life... sounds about typical for most PhuDs.
As for being a stats. prof. That takes stamina. I still remember throwing my first stats. text book at the wall and putting a big crease through it... never used it again... in fact, I probably don't use most of the mathematics that I learned.
I design and make materials... just a fancy cook, but it's a lot of fun.
I too had the poster on my wall... mine was a black slantnose. I always said I would have one.... ended up with the 996, but the slantnose still gets me everytime I see one.
Awesome! Mine was a white slantnose. I thinkn the caption was something like "perfection." I still get giddy everytime I get behind the wheel and drive the car.
I'm jealous. I saw a red one this weekend at a classic car show in Hatboro, PA and it made me want to buy it on the spot. Perfection is the only description I could give that car.
I am just a plain old dumb high school graduate, and even that was only with a 1.75 GPA. Today I work for the CTO of one of the largest software organizations in the world, and my ideas can be found within the network management systems of 8 out of 10 of the worlds largest telcos. I always tell people that I graduated from the University of Barnes and Noble!
My experience is... success is not due to what you know, rather how you apply what you know... it is not about your degree, it is about your desire.
That said, I do respect the effort that goes into the pursuit of a degree or doctorate. I just don't get the people who care more about their title than actually using the knowledge it represents to do something of value (not trying to imply that any rennlisters do that ;-).
Oh yeah, to get back on topic...
Boxster at 29 (sold)
964 C2 at 31 (still have it)
996 C2 at 36 (just got it)
Oraganet, I beg to differ with you on the comment re MD's and their lack of creativity and use of rote memory. There are plenty of MD's who perform basic science/bench research; just take a look at NIH funding rates and RO1 grants. Also take a look at the past nobel laureats of Medicine and Physiology who are MD's Hartwell, Pruisner, Horwitz, Marshall, etc...
Like the previous comment, a degree does not impart talent or creativity, it merely gives you a framework for it.
Back to the topic on hand, I am surpised at how many advanced degree holders there are who own a P-car....
No Playah Hatin Degree for me but much respect to those who had follow through with their education...
My first porsche was a 964 when I was 25 years old and at 28 I got the 996.
Just a Masters and I'm a Sr. Consultant for a retained executive search firm
29 when i bought my 996--had to do something for myself before turning the big three 0, currently 32
anyone going to the PCA fun run to Santa Paula airport this Sunday?
I agree entirely. It's not the degree, but what you do with it.
I personally have more respect for someone who has acheived success without a piece of paper. They have taken the road less travelled and worked harder to get there.
I have come across many people with higher degrees that were not worth the paper their degrees were written on because the people who had them either lacked talent or application.
Just a BBA in Finance and International Business. I couldn't wait to get out of school, so no master or PhD for me. I'm an energy business & technical consultant.
38
'02 Targa purchased in June. First P-car was a used '95 968 at age 29.
BBA Management and Marketing; MBA Int'l Business. Currently a corporate communications leader at a major health care services company.
Piccia
'02 Targa
I love this thread. I hope that you're firing up your calculator to do the age/educational background analysis.
As for my comment above, I put it in this context - work hard for a few years to get your graduate degree and certain doors open for your automatically. In my field, without a Ph.D, there are some doors that are very hard to open and in a lot of cases insurmountable. I know of one person who has reached the pinnacle of (industrial) scientific levels with a BS and it took him a lot of hard work and stubborness to get there. Many people never make it because "they only have a BS". Overcoming that prejudice takes a lot of commitment and work.
Two people come to mind that have acheived the pinnacle without even a degree - Bill Gates and Steve Jobs - unique cases where hard work and singlemindedness got them to the top. There are not many others that get as far as they did... or even a fraction of that distance.
33 (last week).
30 Inherited my dad's C5 Vette Convertible. It is a rare 6 speed and it was an extra cost option.
31 I ordered my '05 997 Carrera S new. I always wanted one when I was a kid. The 911 was it for me. Begged my parents to take me to the Porsche museum in Zuffenhausen when we went to Europe when I was 18. Have a couple of hundred diecast cars - mostly Porsches. Gone to both Rennsport Reunions. You could say I'm hooked.
At 29 I took over the family bus when my dad got sick and later died.
30 acres of commercial real estate reasonably close to the city with 1300 ft. of freeway visibility. About 8 acres developed. 107,000 square feet of commercial buildings including 60,000 square feet of self storage. Out of one of the buildings I also run an RV/Trailer dealership (utility, cargo, car haulers, motorhomes, travel trailers, fifth wheels etc.). My plan is to develop the remaining 22 acres by age 55 and grow the RV/trailer business.
As for edumication, I've got a BA in Economics and Psych and a "practical MBA" in law, finance, management, hr, marketing, property management etc. I have excellent advisors (essentially my dad's group of guys) that have helped me learn what I didn't know and gain experience without making any catastrophic mistakes.
23, No degree. Going back to school for CS+(French|Journalism|Photo). Google sysadmin (sort of)
On a tangent, any Latin speakers here? Anecdotally, it seems like a number of my favorite people have turned out to (also) have some degree of fluency.
I have to conclude after reading this thread that most porsche owners are nerds with degrees; except for one model, hand model that is; even that I doubt his/her authenticity... I wonder if the same could be said of Ferrari or Aston Martin owner...
Yes it'll be a busy weekend for me to do all the calculations...
I have heard that once you turn 40 the hand model market dries up, I am considering applying for a CEO position with a major corporation and preferably access to a corporate jet. Anyone have any leads?
I'll look it up in the Maritz database for you next week. I'm certain the "median" age is in the 50's - median is slightly different from average, it means 50% of the owners are above that number and 50% are below. The median age is usually a year or two higher than the average when the median is in the 50's simply because there is more "room" for numbers below to be farther away from the median (stats peole will "get" that). For the entire auto industry the median age of a new car buyer is 47. Cheap cars typically have a lower age and expensive cars always have a higher age.
Note that the Maritz data is only for people who bought new, so it won't tell you the average age of a Porsche owner for the entire functional population of Porsches out on the road.
realist.....let me help you out a bit with your attempt to describe stats to the group here. First, the median is not "slightly different" from the average, it IS very different in it's definition from the mean (average) although both are measures of central tendency.
A median is not influenced the way the mean is due to outliers (people buying at the extremes). Mean (average) is just that, an average of ALL data points (sum of x/n). Median is that value that falls in the middle of a data set and can sometimes be a computed value rather than an actual value (odd vs. even data set). And to further confuse things, the mean and median can be the same number when the distribution is normal.
The median is the BETTER statistic to report for car data because car data by their very nature are skewed (positively) as well there are not as sensitive to outliers unlike the mean (average). Another great place to use the median over the mean is in the real estate market where outliers have a HUGE impact on the mean since the outliers ($1M+ homes) are usually much further from the median than most data points.
I would be interested to see what you uncover for median age in teh Maritz db. I do however, find it very hard to believe that the median age of a new car buyer is over 50. If you don't mind when you check out the median can you also get the mean and standard deviation from that db? SD is something I would be very interested in.
Hand model... hahahahaha.... Remember George Costanza and the oven mitts to protect his hands?
36, operations VP - first 911 (964) at 31. Those were the days....
First Porsche-a new 1977 1/2 924 in 1977 at age 31
Latest Porsche-2001 911 Aero this year at age 60
26 other Porsches in between these two
Almost 30 years worth of these fine cars!! And everyone one had features to like, some more than others. And everyone was fun to drive!!
Without these cars, it is not likely I would have been introduced to autocrossing, concours, track events, club racing, rallying, and the many fine people we met because of our PCA involvement. My life would have been very different without these cars.
30 now. got my 996 cab a couple of months ago as a 2nd car - but drive it a lot these days.
had a 924 when i was 19. what a piece of **** that was. dont count it as my first p-car either
First Porsche at 46 was a new 2001 Boxster S. My current Porsche is an 2004 C2 Cab and I purchased it new on my 49th birthday. I am now 51 so I managed to buy my Porsche's while I was still in my forties!
ha ha ha, 1999, you just have to be that sharp, ouch
for those who own one in 20s I envy you. I just wish my dad will bought me one when I was young... it's not their fault to have a rich daddy.
Trand in 2 BMWs plus 10k for 996 when I was 36, 39 now. damn, those car were expensive back then...
My first and current p-car at 21, an 89 911 Carrera 4. I am now 22 and still in College working on getting my PHD in History and hopefully my second 911, a Gt3.
Absolutely! Have owned it for about 4 months and it has been in the shop 70% of the time. They have two techs from Italy looking at it on Thursday.
They look great but i dont think you are supposed to drive them. Have heard the 06's are much better. Might give them one more chance!
18 bought my 944 turbo s....as for pure euro my first car was a camry and as long as your record is clean your insurance should not go up much specially if you get non turbos
I was 26 when I bought my speedster, had to sell as wife was pregnant. Later at 30 I had 363 coupe, but got job w/car and sold. Now 72 and have 911 carrera. I am 26 again.
28 with first my first 1988 911 then onto two 964s and now 41 with my 4th 911 (a 996). Very happy with it but the earlier porsches sounded loads better.
I'd say the 996 is dropping too, got mine for the price of a used Focus. At that price it's a viable option for us younger "stance nation"/"tuner" crowd.
You guys might not like the results
age 18 (2009) 83' 944 - sold at 20
19 86' 944 Turbo
21 06' Cayenne S (had 951 and 955S same time)
22 04' Cayenne Turbo (sold 955 S, kept 951)
23 99' 996 (sold CTT for it, recently sold 951 back to rennlister I got her from). I'm head over heels on this one, something about the car really makes me happy. Probably won't sell for a very long time/never.
Still a student (part time since 09'), I've been selling insurance (now focus is on commercial) since a few weeks out of h.s, kind of fell into it as my parents are both in Medicine. Need to stop buying Porsche's (well hell cars in general; on number 12 as of last Sat first two my parents got, both leased Jeeps...but its been all me ever sense) as I hope to open an agency in the very near future, need to save and have some more capital.
72. Late bloomer. Semi-retired writer...meaning somedays I do write and some days I don't. First Porsche was '93 RS America at age 52, then a '95 993 at age 56. Went below radar for about fifteen years then picked up my '03 996 this last September. Prior to Porsches I enjoyed a lot of Italian cars. One year of college, got drafted, bumped into walls in the dark, found a door ****, opened it and stepped into my life.
36 and just purchased my first Porsche 996. Almost in tears thinking about storing it for winter....2 car garage and living in snow country not a solution to store a car on driveway!!
42 and have owned two 986, 944 turbo S upgraded 1989 (current), 04 996 Cab (current) and two 57 speedster both fake but cooler than any other car I have ever seen!
84 Carrera 57 1st then 2 more until I got a 01 C4 @ 67 the 4th one !!
but I feel much younger when I drive it !!!! by the way I shall never grow up anyhow (:
Flat 6 History:
1966 Corvair Corsa 19
1966 911 23
1969 911E Targa 24
Sold all three at 25
2003 996 Targa 59 -- Yes, 34 years without Porsche but only German cars in between.
John
'03 Targa
23 when I bought my 996 C2 in May, but currently 24.
My car history...
18 YO - 1998 Subaru Impreza 2.5RS Coupe
19 YO - 1973 Datsun 240Z(Restored)
20 YO - 2000 Subaru Forester L
22 YO - 2013 Subaru BRZ Limited
23 YO - 2000 Porsche Carrera 911 996 C2
I currently own the Subaru Impreza and Porsche.
23 (first real job) - 1987 944S Bought for $5250 and sold to a buddy for $4K a few years later. Engine blew not long after.
27 - first 911 1980 911 SC targa dark blue with awesome dark blue leather. Bought for 8K and sold for 7K to a co worker after years of fun. 180K plus miles on her when I bought it. Indestructible.
31 - short Porsche hiatus then bought another 1987 944 for $4500. Didn't drive it nearly as much as I should have, let it sit, and sold it at a deep discount this year. Sat for almost two years with what I thought was "electrical problems" with a botched removal of a non factory alarm. Bastard fired right up after reinstalling a charged battery in her the day I sold it (hadn't ran for nearly TWO YEARS).
35 - late July I sold the 944 and picked up a 2000 996 with 49K on the clock for $20K. Absolutely love it. Open to winter storage tips. Damn Wisconsin weather......
36yo now
picked up my 2002 996 c2 just over 4 years ago, when i was 32. it is the first car i have ever owned... having lived in cities all my life.
no plan on selling it anytime soon, although i'm slowly prepping it to be my "winter beater."
22, 27, more in the early 30's, some in the mid 30's, a few in the late 30's
1 in the 40's. Cant seem to stop looking at the 996, so hopefully one more in the early 40's. Now I seem to have the urge to keep them all, next dilemma.
Many more to come...
Figures in my China
Sport cars, Women Age 21~30 (they all look like teens anyway lol)
Sport cars, Men Age 30~40
Cayenne (+40~99)
Panies (+50~99) huge hit with those less-than-young women here. Go figure...
My 'base' Porsche boxster is faster than any of those so I don't fit in any categories. 888!
Bought my first Porsche, a 99 Boxster, when I was 24, back in 03. Bought my second Porsche, an 03 996 C2 in 2011, when I was 32. My next Porsche, likely a 981S or 997S, I plan to buy next year, late February or early March, if I can get what I want for a trade in/private party on my 03 C2.
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