suggestions for modifications for trackday car

I just purchased a car that seems a good candidate for a track day car. Not so nice that you'd be accused of molesting fine art... not totally clapped out mechanically. High mileage, worn interior. Good exterior. Good brake pads/rotors. Shifts fine. Newer factory engine 12000 mi warrantee almost expired. $7500. I'm hoping to get experienced advise on tactful and appropriate preparation and modifications to make it reliable as a trackday car. The goal is not to have the fastest 911 on the track, but to merely have a solid fun build. Different from past trackday builds, I'd like to not use a sawsall as my preferred tool. I'd like to have the "plausable impression" that I could return this to a street legal car... oh, and I'd like a passenger seat in this car so I could bring friends along for a ride. Suspension: OEM or poly bushings? spring rate/ bar rates? Are bilstiens adequate? Are GT3 front control arms needed? Baseline rideheight/ camber/toe setting? Are OEM 18" wheels adequate? Are there any aftermarket trackworthy wheels that don't cost an arm or leg? What tire sizes work well (DOT race)? Brakes: Supplier for rotors? What pad combos work well? Do you need ducting? Are the hubs a problem? Safety: What race seat and seat-track work well? Any electrical glitches with steering lock removal or master cut off switch? Engine management: Is the ecu tunable? Cooling: Center radiator needed with oem level power? (specifics on manufacturer links/ part numbers would be most helpful)! Thanks all!

You're lucky the 996 forum already had a discussion on the clap this week.

brake fluid suitable for the track

Brakes: -Motul600 or Castrol SRF Brake Fluid -Stick rotors are fine but Sebro or Zimmerman work well for replacement - there are lots of really good pads out there but I think Hawk DTC-70 are one of the best bang for the buck race pads. Pagid Yellow/black are a good combo as are PFC08s. Suspension: - 400#F/500#R is and aggressive combo setup a the way up to 800#F/900#R for stiff track setup - GT3 front and rear sways with adjustable drop links - Good set of shocks. I like Feal because they will do custom valving and springs based upon your application and their race package is only $1600 new. From my research they are only going to be a few 10ths slower than the $10k JRZ 3-way cups I'm currently running. - busings, control arms, etc... Don't spend money to solve problems you don't have. These are all good for specific issues. Tires/wheels: - 245F/275R is very balanced. You can go up to 315 in the rear but won't gain anything from it. - Pick a used set of OZ Alleggerita or some Carrera (BBS) MY02. Both can be found for around $1000. 8x18 et50 10x18 et65 or there abouts -OS Gikken LSD is magical Safety: Roll bar Harness Hans Race seat of your choice Fire extinguisher - Don't bother with a tune. - Catless exhaust and muffler upgrade do help - IPD plenum, throttle body, evo air intake have not proven to provide significant gains on the track. I have a 2520# C2 with 265 rwhp that can get around the track faster than a C7 Z06, GT3 or 996 Cup. Track specific of course.

Left off adjustable rear toe arms. After you lower it you will need them or at the very least the locking rear toe plates. As far as alignment and ride height, it will depend on % of Street vs Track.

I'll give you the advice I was given: replace the wear and maintenance items to make the car safe and get as much seat time as possible.

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Seriously, is that price right? Seems like an amazing deal unless there's something major wrong with it. So...what's wrong with it? I'd recommend getting your basic maintenance (fluids, brakes, etc.) up to snuff, and get a good baseline alignment and a good set of tires. Try that out for a while and then think about what bothers you when you're driving and you wish was better. e.g. safety, seating, handling, brakes, etc.? Different driving styles will be rewarded by different upgrades. I'm surprised nobody has told you yet that your engine will explode the moment you get within a 10-mile radius of a track.

Great deal you got on a stick 996 with a good engine.

Thx guys, Great info! 400/500, GT3 sways and up links, adj rear toe plates, 245/275 hoosiers, Hawk DTC 70's + Motul. Looks like a good start. I'm going to have to look into the shock package a little. I've heard of Feal; sounds like they could put together a good budget package. I've used Penske's before and got lost chasing my tail with all of the adjustments. Presently using single adj MCS on the miata and like them alot... still they cost about as much as a used miata... I think I'll look into the Feal as you'd suggested. Cat test-pipes available? Or, just hollow out the stock cats? It already has a factory sport exhaust... hoping that it's adequate. Is the dealer installed wing functional? Or is it just there to look pretty... and slow you down? It doesn't look as though engine mounts were changed when the re-man engine was installed. Are these a normal wear item to be changed? Do they clunk when they're bad, or cause the shifter to bind?

Besides the recommendations above, the best modification is patience as you climb the learning curve, an open mind, and willingness to learn and listen to your instructor. Nice car. You'll have a blast with it.

oilpan baffle? No experience, just regurgitating what I've seen others say....

I add a deeper sump (either the .5 or the two qt). The deeper one may impact daily driver usefulness (ground clearance ).

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Yes Joseph, an oil pan baffel would be good protection. I could add the small extension to the pan and pick-up to gain some extra oil volume at the same time. I remember seeing a metal pan guard on one of the 911 rsa's running in my run group years back. I think he said it was oem. BTW Rich, how do you like your PSS9's? Yes David, I've never raced a rear engine car before at its limit. It must be kind of like controlling a swinging pendulum on the track. What I have noticed about my other 996 (?because of no weight up front?) is that the front end steers lightening fast... even in a high speed turn you can maneuver... unlike my other track day sedans that can take a set and plow thru the corner pretty well, but only can make small corrections. I think that the 996 must have a much lower front center of gravity... or maybe a more centralized mass... it "feels" more like it's pushing thru tire itself, not rolling over it.

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Suncoast for factory aluminum skid plate, about $125

I forgot about the baffle. Good catch. I like the FVD baffle/deep sump. The Sp996 guys lobbied pretty hard to get the MCS 2-way NR added to the spec and have been very pleased with their performance over the JRZ RS2. Like you said, Miata pricing but their perform very well. David is right and everyone told me the same thing. But I was having too much fun tinkering with my car to listen. But the money I eventually spent on schools and coaching is where the biggest time gains came from. I will say that moving to NT01s and then slicks early allowed me to start learning the difference between slip and slide a whole lot quicker. As for the 996, the secret is to trailbrake the crap out of it. On a slow corner, your braking point is almost to the Apex. And just about the time the rear end is about to slide out from underneath you, squeeze the throttle. She will grip and shoot out of the hole like nothing else.

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Great additional points Slakker. I'll +996 on the FVD pan/baffle combo - and a major endorsement of schools and coaching. I did bondurant earlier this year - learned a ton and gained a new appreciation for a properly prepped 996 on track. On suspension - moving to the X74 setup was like driving a different car on track - almost mind blowing. +996 on Slakker's brake advise. Sebro slotted, stock calipers, endurance "race" pad of choice - Pagid RS29, Hawk, PFC, Ferrodo, etc... combined with quality fluid like the brands already mentioned. I recommend finding an oil designed for track use in a wet sump engine. To avoid turning this into an oil thread - just find one you feel comfortable running that meets the demands of a track driven M96. Don't run your oil level completely full unless you like James Bond style smoke screens when on track. I always advocate for sticking with crap street tires until they become the weak link - you'll learn way more about the car and your abilities without insane rubber masking bad habits and poor decisions. Lastly - I went with OMP seats on various combinations of Brey Krause adapters for my 996 (which in season is almost a dedicated track car). I recommend buying from a knowledgeable dealer who has experience mounting various seats on various adapters in a 996. There are too many options and it's too damn easy to make mistakes or spend a ton of time finding a proper seating position, height, etc... I like the seats but I screwed up on the passenger side - although too wide for me, it's still way too narrow for most of my students. If you plan on instructing or having right seat passengers - get a passenger seat designed for hips of all sizes and genders

The pan guard is factory but keep in mind that it lowers ground clearance by another 3/4 if an inch or so. My PSS9s are good but I don't know how old they are as there were on the car when I bought it. I run them pretty stiff as I mostly use the car for autox and track days. Matt

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Excellent advice for the novice 911 driver. Can't imagine how this could go wrong.

My second day on a track, I got an instructor that drove a GT4 and was a long time racer. Trailbraking was the first thing he started working with me on. Bondurant teaches it Day 2. The threshold braking, release/turn crap that you get from a typical DE instructor is flat out wrong, and even worse in a 911. Consistent corner entry speed and loading the nose for turn in should be your focal point from the start. Then you don't have to unlearn ad many bad habits.

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I'd add test pipes. My cats were damaged doing 2 track days with my car basically stock (gt3 front CAs and Pagid break pads). Test pipes add power across all usable rev range, reduce weight, add a nice note and most importantly keep you from trashing the very expensive stock cats if you ever revert it to a stock car. Plus if they start to get clogged it robs a lot of power. I'd say it's highly dependent on set up (diff, spring rates, alignment, tires) and even specific corner. If you "trailbrake the crap out of it" everywhere, I'd think you should re-evaluate your set up or consider you might be over braking (something I see very commonly as people get faster in there cars). .02

The amount of trailbraking required is inversely proportional to the speed of the corner. My point was the quicker you learn to rotate the rear end with the brake pedal the better you will understand the car. Here's the lap where I beat the PCA SP996 track record set by a pro caliber driver. Now it's not a fair comparison since my setup is quicker than an SP996 but I would be open to your input on where I'm over braking. You Tube

Are you left-foot braking at all? I've not driven a rear engined car in anger, so the trailbraking would take some getting used to for me. The E36 was pretty well balanced although I trail braked on occasion

I'm not left foot braking. I think it's good for a few more tenths but have yet to master it. The ultimate goal is 0% coasting. So you are braking,even if it's 15%, right up until the point you move back to the gas. And the goal is always to get back to gas as quickly as possible. Besides just the weight transfer advantages, it is also a matter of physics. When combining lateral and longitudinal G's, your car can handle more total (combined) G's than max long or lat G's individually. So on a high speed turn like the first turn in the vid, I will straight line brake and get back the throttle at entry. Turn 2 on the other hand, the end of my braking zone is just before the late apex and I'm waiting for the rear end to come around before i release the brake and go immediately back to full throttle (squeezing not jabbing).

OP - Apologies for the thread hijack, I am in similar situation to you and will post my finding but in the interim Slakker, could you provide details on your JRZ Cup suspension setup please? Spring rates, ride heights, rear spacer size, can pressures etc? Thanks

OP - as touched upon I am in a similar situation, 996 C2 that I will use for track use, however it will be driven to the tracks, circa 200 mile round trip, so must be able to deal with the public roads. I decided that trying to add power was a waste of time and money, its well documented that the various bolt on upgrades add very little, so focused on trying to increase the reliability of the M96. Full service and replacement of fluids – Engine, Gearbox, Brakes. FVD Motorsport oil pan, which includes an X51 baffle and gives 0.6L extra oil capacity, it sits a little lower (20mm) than the standard pan, but I have not had issues, magnetic sump plug. – I use Millers 10w-50 CFS Nano Oil. Low temp thermostat, and center rad kit to help with engine temps, I modified my a/c to run with one condenser to further increase airflow to the rads. – I also fitted an underdrive pulley, not for the performance gain, if there is one, but to reduce the strain on the power steering pump when running at continual high track RPM’s. Brakes, I run stock Brembo discs and calipers, with Pagid RS Blue pads, I find these excellent and they do not squeal like the Yellows, as discussed good high temp brake fluid is required, I use Motul RBF660, SRF is widely regarded as the best, its also the most expensive. 997 GT3 brake ducts are cheap and easy to fit and help a little, as does modifying the rad cowls and inner wing liner to allow a little more air to the brakes. – The pedal does go soft after prolonged hard braking, however it always comes back. Going forward I may look to install a caliper spacer that will allow me to run 350mm 997 turbo discs with the current calipers and pads. – However I am struggling to find first hand feedback on whether there is any benefit from the additional 20mm of disc. Suspension, replace what is broken, all of my LCA’s needed replacing, I decided to bite the bullet and go for the two piece adjustable GT3 Cup items with monoballs, not that I needed them, but I may in the future and would prefer to spend only the once, they allow more negative camber to be dialed in, but I do not see this as a must have for initially getting on track. - This winter I will be going back over my suspension, with the intention of refreshing everything. – Hence the query to Slakker regarding his cup damper setup, which I am keen to hear about. Remove weight where you can, I have achieved 100Kg but the car looks standard and with the exception of the rear seats I have a full interior, removing weight improves acceleration, braking and handling and in many instances costs nothing! – The biggest free wins were mats, rear wiper, rear seats, spare wheel, jack, tool kit and sound proofing. – Spends wise best wins, battery, Odyssey PC950 saved 11Kg over stock for circa $200, followed by replacing the front seats for buckets, circa 20Kg saving and far more support on track.

^^+1 I agree with all of the previous post. As for the brake upgrades, I researched it heavily. I even tried upgrading to a full cup suspension (carriers, brakes, and shocks), but aborted due to difficulty and lack value. Since the stock brake calipers lock up the stickiest of slicks and heat fade is not a problem, it all comes down to what problem are you trying to solve? The answer is improved feel for more precise modulation. In my opinion, this can be accomplished easily by swapping the Master Cylinder for a 997 GT3 MC. It's a direct fit, no modifications required. I'll start a separate thread to answer the JRZ Cup question.

You might want to add GT3 brake ducts, to force more air over the brakes/calipers.....Porsche Motorsport AOS, will prevent the mosquito foggier effect, also I might change out the water pump......well, just because it's a good idea to start with a baseline.........I would also recommend Numeric Rwci g shift cable, makes it feel like a rifle bolt action.....u adding wevo motor mounts?..... just a few suggestions.......

Since you have a wing on the back, you might want a front splitter and canards, this will help balance the aero on the car.....

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Was that lap with the FSI 3.8 engine? Do you have a light weight flywheel?

I almost forgot one of THE most important mods. Rennline Competition Wheel Studs. Nope. Stock 3.4L (underdrive pulley and catless exhaust) with a dual mass flywheel.

Thanks all, I am making my "to-do-list". CDS72911: Yes, it seems to be a good deal as a "fixer-upper. I bought it from this nice lady: The car has a lot of deferred maintenance. After all, it has 150k miles; everything is worn. Except the engine, which was replaced when a road hazard took out a radiator pipe, then the vehicle overheated before reaching a freeway exit (thank you Esurance!) Slakker: So you trailbrake these cars to rotate? On other rwd cars I've used on/off throttle to point the car. These sound kind of like racing a fwd car, where you get the back to rotate; then catch it with throttle. Sounds like fun! I think I'll begin by refreshing the suspension and mounts to get started. Any sources for bushings? The wevo engine mounts look perfect. Is there a transmission mount upgrade?; or just replace with stock? I'm looking at MCS vs. Feal shock options; MSChas a new "budget/non-remote" 2 way shock for $3450.... anyone try these? Also, do you buy the sways from the dealer? Or, is there an aftermarket vendor? SWK6cup: Lastly, the shifter is sloppy. I found several oem and short shifter kits. Which combo would pair well with your recommended cable option? Thanks again for your suggestions.

You watch this yet? You Tube

It's rear engine so it naturally wants to push. When you add throttle it's going to transfer weight (and grip) to the rear end. So for turn in, trailbraking transfers the weight to the front end giving you more grip to turn. It also lightens the rear end and its grip allowing it to come around easier. As stated, this is most applicable to low and mid speed corners. As for rotating the rear end with the throttle, since the bulk of my spins and all of my tire wall inspections have come from throttle oversteer coming out of a corner, I can verify that it's possible to do that as well. It's just not as rewarding.

I don't have a lot of experience yet, but I was in the same boat with deferred maintenance including worn out mounts. I opted for the Function First rear (motor) mounts and the Rennline front (transmission) mount. They're both a less rigid setup than I'd use if it was going to be a track car, but higher durometer than stock. I'm trying to keep mine leaning toward a streetable setup. On the suspension, I got a some good deals on the RL classifieds: PSS10 coilovers and MO30 sway bars. Oh, and on the shifter, lots of choices, but I got the Numeric ball bearing shifter, and it is a piece of industrial art.

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MCS 1W shocks are $2750 and they as you know are a great company to work with. They have service here in the states and a bunch of fast Porsche racecars to prove how much they are worth.

FYI, 3M window weld makes a perfect transmission mount insert. It's the right durometer (I think 70 IIRC). And for those that say it's a hack, you can still get the mount replaced the next time you do a transmission refresh.

I would recommend coilovers and poly bushes for the whole suspension .wevo motor mounts Some good brake pads, giro disk rotors if it fits the budget Spend the money for good tires If you can stretch to it , a good torque sensing diff , the wavetrac is excellent . Evans waterless coolant and a low temp thermostat The deepsump and baffle

Sorry but a toque biasing differential is useless in a track car. But a good plate type is the best and first performance upgrade that I would do. 996's are unstable in the rear under hard braking and the differential settles 90% of that out. I ran a Wavetrack for 2 months as it was already in the car when I got it, it was no help under braking and the lockup on corner exit was inconsistent. Replaced it with a Guard and the results were phenomenal.

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I've got a guard in my car , great but expensive . Bang for the buck a wave track is a much better option than tracking a car with a stock open diff . You get off the line and out of corners much faster , especially with the wavetracs preloading , something a quaif diff and similar doesn't have . A torque sensing diff isn't supposed to help on braking , it's not designed to, to expect this reflects a lack of understanding how the technology works. is a guard plated diff better ? Yes but to say a wavetrac is useless (compared with an open diff ) is simply not true .

If you are going to spend the money on a diff a plate is definitely worth the extra $900. The rear end instability under heavy braking is an issue in these cars. If you don't solve it now you will end up wanting to solve it later. Both Guards and OS Gikken make a great LSD but the Gikken is cheaper ($2090). And in the last 9 months, Gikken came out with a 996 LSD that is a direct fit and usually doesn't even require shims.

There were budget constraints in consideration . This is a $ 7500 car . Plus a plated diff must be periodically rebuilt . Ok if doing it yourself , but if sending it to a shop , adds up . On my previous dedicated track car , twice a season . On a budget , that 900 bucks would be better placed with a set of poly bushes . IMO . Tracking a car on oem bushes , especially if they haven't been freshly done , in a multilink car , is not a great idea. If you are going to track with a plated diff , guard will last much longer than the OS G diff , imo guard is the better choice , the longer life makes up for the greater initial outlay . Back to the wavetrac option , it's affordable , never needs rebuilding ( should last as long as a stock open diff) , has a clever preload design a quaif doesn't , and on my previous car , gave me 2.5 seconds at brands hatch and similar at castle comb over the same car with a stock open diff . Bang for the buck , a great option.

I won't argue most of the points Van because you and I always seem to be on the opposite end of opinions. But I will tell you that when I went to swap my TB Diff(Quaife) for a Gikken, it was worn out and couldn't be rebuilt, even by the factory. Also, with 24 plates, the Gikken will absolutely last as long as the Guard and theoretically longer. But there is an 80 page thread somewhere that argues that one to death. Both are very good, very high quality options.

My car had the B&M short shift kit......many don't like it, but was fine for almost 13 years.......the biggest difference were the Numeric shift cables, tho.....like a rifle bolt action......

If budget stretches to it , I'd go with a plaited diff every time . On a budget , I think a wavetrac is a better option than a stock open diff. Not sure we'd disagree on that . I've got a guard in my car . The quality of support service alone makes it worth it for me. Some might prefer the OSG . I found the twice a season rebuild a bit much . Chocolate vs rocky road . A case for each .

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I've been tracking cars with various types of locked diffs for more than 30 years, and I finally understand what you are talking about... what the diffs actually "feel" like! The current car I race (non-porsche) has a torsen. It has 2 noticeable bad habits. The first was a "jerky" application of power when coming out of a tight corner... it was as if the clutch was slipping. I changed the clutch, but no change. It was recommended that I increase the rear spring rate so I could soften the rear bar... didn't understand the logic until now, (apparently the insider rear must have been coming unloaded and allowed the diff to unlock)... I changed the springs/bar and it did the trick. The 2nd evil is now also understood; loose in the rear under hard braking. Apparently, as you pointed out, the Torsen doesn't work in reverse, so when I'm under threashold braking while I'm downshifting; one tire gets the force of braking and the other gets the braking force + downshifting force... and locks up. Kind of long winded... but thank you. Old dogs can learn new tricks.