Blue 2002 C4 Cab cracked cyl need help, possible sale

From Pelican http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...e-out-car.html Fella has this: P.S anyone looking to buy an engineless beautiful 2002 996 C4 Cab in Lapiz blue and natural leather interior? I have no affiliation with this other than trying to help him.

This is my car. And I'm open to selling it for a fair price, or any option to get it back on the road. Again, at a reasonable cost. I had planed on keeping this car for a long time; on average, I keep my porsches from 8 - 15 years. I've had this one for 2 years, and did a lot of preventive work/maintenance to it in May 2016 (IMS, Oil separator, plugs, intake tappets, new brakes, new tires...), but it suffered a catastrophic cylinder wall crack. I'm not sure what the protocol is for sharing pictures, for this reason, I'll refrain from uploading any. Absolutely everything was in perfect condition before the engine failure, even the interior show exceptionally little wear and tear.

How many miles did you have on the car? Could tell us the circumstances that possibly caused the crack? Anyway, sorry to hear about the loss of the car. I'm sure you feel gutted. Hope things make a turn for the better.

Certainly, The last time I drove it, the odometer got to 65K miles. My wife drove it to her office, about 26 miles from my house to her office, and just as she was exiting Central expressway (which runs about 40mph during traffic hours), and merging onto Wolfe rd. the engine started missfiring . She called me straight away and I told her to get it to her office (less than 1/10th of a mile) and park it. I had the tow truck pick it up from there and take it to a shop in Campbell, Ca. The mechanic called me that same day to let me know the bad news.] So, the car is less than 65,100 miles if I remember correctly, and it is exceptionally optioned. I can share the VIN if it's safe. Yes, it is very disappointing. I have owned 3 other Porsches ('77, '82, and '92) and none of them gave me any trouble whatsoever. Yes, the A/C hardly made any difference ('82 and '92), and I had to do the chain tensioners on my '82 as well as the fuel accumulator and the oil pressure sensor, but that's all. I think I've spent twice as much on my 996 in two years, as I did for all three of the air cooled ones in a span of about 17 years.

Curious... what was the car's temp? Do you know? Had it been running hot?

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Talk to the shop owner in Campbell CA about picking up an engine from a Porsche salvage business and installing this engine into your car. He should be able to help you pick a good engine. For possible sources of an engine I'll toss this out: There's Parts Heaven here in Hayward CA. They have buildings full of Porsche stuff and if anyone this close to you had an engine it would be Parts Heaven.

I'm familiar with Parts Heaven, since the late 90's. I haven't contacted them yet because I'm sure I'm looking at no less than 15K to get the car back on the road, and honestly, I need to budget for that. Like many of us, despite our taste for Porsches, out budget limits us in terms of how much we can spend on purchasing and maintaining one. I bought the car in July 2015, and on May 2016 I had already spent over 10K on it (preventative work and maintenance). The car's temperature was normal, that's the one thing I always tell my wife to pay close attention to. She said temp was just above 180 degrees, and no chimes alerting her of any malfunctions prior to the miss-fires. There's this option on the well known auction site http://www.ebay.com/itm/02-03-04-05-...torefresh=true , but I'm not sure what/how to test that the engine is working properly when it's out of the car.

appreciate all your feedback and suggestions, guys. This helps me in researching solutions and planing for when I'm ready ($) to fix it. here's a picture: https://1drv.ms/i/s!AnxMlI7qYuT1hXp8jPPjHZbmLrSn . excuse the quality.

Serg996, If there is/was any oil/water intermix in the surge tank/cooling system you should empty and flush the system. Use dawn, or equivalent, dish soap to clean any trace of oil out of the hoses. If you have intermix and leave it in the hoses they will soften and rupture next time you bring the system up to temp/pressure. As I mentioned in the pelican thread I think a "Nickies" rebuild is the way to go. Depending on how much $$ you can spend.

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for a couple k more you can get a rebuilt/refreshed engine. https://www.vertexauto.com/porsche-9...built%20engine

Frank, I don't think there's any coolant in the oil or lines any more. The coolant tank looks clean too. I think whatever coolant made it's way to the cylinder, upon the wall cracking, made it's way out via steam out the driver's side exhaust. I may have to replace the respective catalytic conv. when the time comes, and if it throws any codes when running. I had looked at the Vortex option, but because my engine is not rebuildable, there is no core value and I'd be looking at $15,500 for the 'long-block' plus labour charge for installing all the accessories from my old engine to the new long-block from vortex. At the risk of coming across as whinny; I know there aren't any good options for my situation, but I can't justify dropping another 18-22K on the car. I'm looking for the cheapest option available, although this is not at all what I normally do.

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This is important and something to think about hard. Getting a working motor back in the car is not going to be cheap, but if you really love the car and intend to keep it that long then you might be able to consider it worthwhile in the long run. If you are serious about that kind of ownership time, talk to either Jake Raby (Flat 6 Innovations) in GA or Tony Callas (Callas Rennsport) in CA about the options they can give you. Both will be on the extreme end of the price range, but you'll have a motor that will give you the desired ownership time with no worries about going through this or any other known m96 failure again.

I think they say something like $$ for cracked cylinder core? What ever. I think LN could fix your cracked cylinder, pretty sure they bore away most of the old one to insert their liners. You will see when you talk to them.

Sorry for your loss (made me sick to my stomach just reading of this) The cheapest may be to sell it as is...

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have you considered a boxster S motor? youll be down 50hp but they are $3-5k and thicker walled cylinders so more reliable, good option if you dont mind a slower car

I agree with Bill. This is sickening.... These are the things that make up a 996 owner's nightmare. That is, doing everything by the book and still experience catastrophic engine failure. No wonder the values on these cars are plummeting. 3 years ago the retail value on my '03 Cab was like $25K - $27K. Now it's like well below the $20K mark. In fact, most of the dealers wouldn't give much more than $12K on trade in. The GA DMV value on my car was $20K when I went to register it and now, when I put the VIN in the system and it comes back with just $11,000. The great for taxes but horrible for resale. Yikes! Serg, Jake Raby says that he asks he customers in your situation... "Do you love it?" If you answer is anything but "yes", then he says there is no point in moving forward. You're going to spend a small fortune getting the car back on the road. Even putting a used donor engine in the there will cost you in the $10K area... and then you're right back where you started with an engine that has the same potential for failure. And so, if you really "love" the car, spend the money and let Flat 6 Innovations put a proven bullet proof engine in the car that will give you the desired 8-15 year lifespan you mentioned. Cheers!

Contact James at Stonegate Auto Sales. He'll buy the 996 at a fair price with no hassles. www.stonegateautosales.com

Hey Serg, Not sure all of what your mechanic did in Campbell, Ca, but have you considered seeing if the heads could be repaired? Hoffman Machine Shop here in Watkinsville GA receives many M96 and M97 heads from all of the place. From what I've heard over the years, he's one of the best in the business. Not sure what Jake's opinion is on him, but he seems like he does great work from many of the comments I've read on RL and hear about in the Athens GA area. http://hamheads.com/services.php https://newsite.hamheads.com Len Hoffman shows a M96 cracked head... You Tube

b3freak, It's not the head, but the cylinder wall that cracked. I'm thinking my best option is to sell this body and forget about porsches until I can afford a newer one. Hopefully Porsche worked out the weak engine designs post 996 and 997 models. It's looking like for the first time in 18 years, I won't have a Porsche in my garage.

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The 997.2 has the newer 9A1 engine I believe and has so far been very reliable, it does suffer from carbon build up as do all DFI engines however.

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You have a PM

sorry to hear about the issue. It's like having a dream crushed

Indeed, Dion I thought I did all I could to avoid the situation in which I find myself. From a good, long test drive (cold start), to a proper PPI, and taking care of all the issues described in my previous postings. Having the engine fail despite all my precautions is a real bummer.

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Did Jake have any good news for you? I hope you get it figured out...

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Some of the M96 fails are just a complete crapshoot, you spin the roulette wheel and hope your number doesn't come up.

You should check Jake's PM. I think he's going to propose something that checks all the boxes for you as long as you flexible with color. Better, hurry, I'm very tempted.

Serg, What did you end up doing?

Scored/cracked cylinders = ruining peoples idea of porsche one failure at a time. its a shame.

I've never been against the looks of the 996, I think it was and still is a great looking design even with the so-called fried egg lights, but I despise the weaknesses of the M96 that have plagued so many 996 owners. Thankfully, there's a genius that lives just up the road from me that made it a mission to find solution(s) for the core problems with these motors.

The car remains in my garage, semi-covered. Can't afford to fix it right now but I'm certainly not wiling to let it go to the scrapper or sell it for pennies. I'm still willing to sell it, but not for an insultingly low price. I've seen a few engines on ebay. I might just try to spend some time (whenever I find the time) to educate myself and maybe do an engine transplant myself. what's the worst that can happen ---famous words-- I'll keep you'all posted.

With a used engine you roll the dice again if you keep it. If you sell it, it will most likely break even. If you can get $6-8k, selling it may not be a bad option.

Ahsai; I haven't really posted an advert but two potential buyers I spoke to wouldn't even make me an offer. Usually, i take the ultra-low-risk decision (hence the ppi, and proactively upgrading the ims on this car). And yes, you are right, it would probably be a wash once -and if- I fix it and sell it. I don't think I'll keep this car, but when I sell it, I want to make sure the buyer is getting as solid a car as possible. Can't avoid the risk when buying one of these cars, but I wouldn't dare knowingly sell a junk car to someone.

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I think you said it yourself. You want the new owner to have a solid car. To make that happen though, you can't just throw in a used engine (cheapest) because you won't be able to sleep well at night. Fixing it to sell it will be a wash. Making it solid and then sell it will be underwater for sure.

Here an M96 engine just listed for $3600 https://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/p...148835720.html

Good find b3freak. I contacted the seller. This brings up a related question. How would one test an engine that is not currently installed n a car? Cheers

Beware. The last engine I saw advertised there had been media blasted while assembled. This one appears to be the same. Inside of that one was junk, it had been pulled from a flooded car. That last guy got what he paid for.

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I would listen to Jake regarding the risk factor. $3600 is still a lot of money to risk it. But if it were me, I'd ask for the VIN of the car the motor came out of and try to find out what happened. Ask the seller for specifics... Was it a wrecked car? Or a salvage? If it was a flood car, then I'd run, not walk from the deal. You just never know... it's a toss up. In a perfect world, the seller would agree to some sort of inspection. Jake would have to be the one to chime in on that. All the best!

Here's a reply form the seller: "I do not have any compression numbers and don't currently have a way to test it since all parts are off and don't have a starter or means to bolt one up. The engine came from a customers car who wrecked it, his insurance company was not very generous so we've helped him try to recoup his loss by parting out the car. Engine ran fine prior to the accident (car was not hit anywhere near the engine, it was front right side damage) Not sure if IMS bearing was done or not prior, but probably not due to low mileage. Assume it was not done." The engine is in Atlanta, Ga, I'm near San Francisco, CA. Not feasible for me to really inspect this engine.

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Again, see if the seller would consider giving you the VIN number that may help in making a decision. He would have it if the his story is legit. Hint hint... Atlanta is very close to Flat Six Innovations in Cleveland!

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I won't touch it with a 10' pole... Not a snowball's chance in HELL!

I'll follow Flat6 Innovations' (Jake) advice. Thank you guys. Cheers

Actually it's "Jake"!...and good choice...

Really sorry to hear this. I had the same thing happen to my 1999. Had it 11 years, 120k on it. Pulled out of my garage, and made it about a mile before experiencing the same problems your wife did. When the wrecker was putting it on the flat bed, I saw coolant come pouring out of the exhaust, and I was thinking "this can't be good", lol. I had planned on keeping it till the wheels fell off. I ended up putting it on Ebay, and got what I feel was a decent price for it.

A couple of weeks ago I posted a for sale advert on CL. Got a bout 8 people interested, some had ridiculous offers (honestly insulting). The car went to a local, nice guy who is in the process of disassembling the engine and rebuilding it himself; of course, with new usable block. The guy is very capable, and I might get a chance to see the car running again...though someone else on the driver's seat. Cheers everyone. Looking forward to my next Porsche ---damn, hope my wife doesn't read this.