oil leak-IMS?

i have an '02 C2 996, engine rebuilt 25 k ago, don't ask why... now there's a leak out of the back, got an estimate for IMS replacement for $3k the entire IMS assembly can be bought for $700 plus labour am i getting gouged by my supposedly trusted mechanic? is it IMS or RMS? any feedback would be great thx

There is no way to know if it is RMS or IMS flange leak until you take it apart. Manual or Tiptronic? (tip requires engine removal, manual doesn't require it, but it is an option). It is a fair amount of labor, and depending on the shop's rate that may not be that outlandish.

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i have an appt tomorrow at $145/hr, they say they don't need to pull the tranny to give an estimate.my other shop said 3 hours to take the tranny out. both are reputable shops, why the difference? one guy is obviously overcharging for the parts. can i get away with replacing the seal, the bearing, both or the whole shebang? i'm trying to save $$ as i already spent tons on getting the motor redone if the engine was completely rebuilt would they not have replced the IMS assembly? they said they did. why would it start leaking after only 25k am i getting f*d? it's a six speed thanks

where are you located?

vancouver bc all the prices are in $cdn except for the IMS assembly the shop is charging $2k for the IMS and i can get them online for USD 700 or so thx

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vancouver bc

the repair price doesn't seem crazy, but when i did my ims it included replacing the rms as well. if your quote covers both, i think its reasonable but i'm sure other will respond who know more than i do about these issues. good luck

thanks for your help appreciate it seems like a very short time for either to start leaking, considering it's only been 25k not happy in any way thx

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Time isn't the main factor for the RMS. There have been several iterations of the RMS. The original ones are more prone to leaking than the updated ones. As far as IMS, you need more information. There is the IMS, and the IMS bearing. There are a few choices in aftermarket IMS Bearings, with the LN Engineering being the preferred one by most. There is a single row bearing and a single row pro (retrofit of a double row into a single row fitment. There is also the IMS Solution which is more costly, but permanent.

The parts cost to fix a RMS or IMS flange leak is nothing - there is a seal on the IMS flange and a rear main seal. Like well under $40 in seals. (...plus some loctite flange and wicking sealants, new bolts for the flywheel and pressure plate, a couple of aluminum sealing rings for the chain tensioners and a green cap/seal for the camshaft, plus it makes sense to do an oil/filter while you are there since you just drained all the oil.) Once you are there, it is easy and inexpensive to replace both seals. That's just the seals, not the IMS Bearing. For the IMSB there are lots of different options as Bill outlined above, at all kinds of different price points. What is costing you is the labor - there is no way to see the RMS or the IMS flange with the transmission installed. So, to diagnose, you need to tear it all apart. Once you are there, then you just add the cost and incremental labor to do the bearing. Yes, it will add up to thousands for a shop to do it.

Rebuilt 25K ago, but how long ago was it done? I'd be talking to the shop that did the rebuild first and see what they say. Is the $2K quote for the LN IMS Solution (best option) or ceramic bearing?

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The rebuild was done in November '16, the guy gave me a 2 yr warranty, which has now conveniently ran out. the car ran great with no issues It was the first place i called - the shop is out of business, the joke is on me. thanks for your input Aloha!

They are easily fixed. Not sure why you're being so dramatic about it.

Do you have a name of the person that did the rebuild. The guy must be working for someone.

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i'm just surprised and slightly pissed that i have to fork out more $$ when i already spent lots and thought i had the problem solved for a while the problem is that it might be easy to fix if you can do it yourself, i'm a mechanical engineer, but without the experience and a hoist in the garage i'm sort of reliant on mechanics, their time, shop rates and parts markup. i know it might be easy and relatively inexpensive anyway, i know i'm whining, but it's a surprise i didn't need thanks for your input best

he closed the shop, moved away to restore early 911s people know of him, but don't know where he is whatever, my loss best

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**** happens, just be glad you're not dealing with something catastrophic. Maybe (hopefully) an older version RMS seal was used and now needs replacing.

Three hours to remove the gear box, one hour to two hours to remove the pressure plate, clutch, flywheel, and change the RMS as well as the IMS bearing, three hours to put the gearbox back, one hour for oil change test drive and misc... That is 9 hours. At $145 per hours, that is about $1300. The IMSB is $700 US (LN ceramic, I think, not the Solution) so now we are at about $2500 Canadian dollars for the repair. That is not too far from the $3K price. As for the engine rebuild work, it was over 2 years ago without any issues. The car was driven 25Kmiles, no issue under the warranty period. I don't know if you can honestly place any blame on the engine rebuilder. This is a Porsche, one with a couple of well known issues. It costs to own this car. Everyone knows it. I know the repair is a surprise to you and that is bad but no one ever promised that Porsche ownership is going to be cheap. For comparison, I am spending $1000US on my daughter's Audi A3 to change the starter, alternator, radiator and some hoses so she can take it to college at end of summer. My labor is free. My wife's 997 just costs me $1000 in parts for brakes. My labor is still free. It is costly to own German cars. I knew that when I signed up.

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This is why I still daily drive a 1997 Honda Accord wagon 5-spd! My friends make fun of it and I laugh all the way to the bank! Cheap to own! Lol

So everyone is positive that the "leak out the back" is RMS or IMS and nothing else ?

Those are the two usual suspects. But, there's only one way to know for sure. Are you handy with tools?

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I am not certain of anything unless I see it with my own eyes. If the fluid is motor oil, and it is coming from the bell housing/engine seam, then there are three sources I can think of: RMS, IMS Bearing flange/bolts, or seam between engine halves. If it is gear oil, then it could be the input shaft seal on the transmission. If it is brake fluid, then it could be the slave cylinder. I can't think of other sources offhand. RMS and IMS flange are the common culprits as far as I know.

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+1,Over 3 years and 25k miles and you think he still owns the car and is just letting you drive it? Probably one of the reasons he closed shop and moved away to restore old Porsches. Track him down and make him fix it, JK, yea you are whinning, just get you a lift and start doing your own repairs, you may have a change of heart..

There is a certified by LN shop in Seattle.. Probably a ok tow with a truck/u-haul and car trailer. I'd get a oil analysis and inspect the filter, pull the pan. Just in case its too deep to repair. (they would do that) Did your guy pick the IMS that was used? He should have had a long discussion about the actual selection of parts with you.

Things that support and seal things that rotate fast dont last forever. I agree that 25k seems low but there have been many reports of low milage cars with failing ims or cam runout that will cause leaks. Maybe the guys did something wrong or didnt check something correctly but it could easily just be bad luck.

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This whole thread is a bit perplexing. You had a rebuild carried out on a 2002 Carrera in 2016 that came with a 2-year warranty. Now, 25,000 miles and three years later you're wondering if you got the shaft? Now, after all that time and money, you're not sure what they did during the rebuild? Really??? The term "rebuild" is used so loosely in mechanics, you have to get a clear estimate that's itemized in writing to know what "rebuild" means by the shop that will carry out the work. Instead of ranting further, why not help us all and post the itemized invoice on the work that was carried out on the car in 2016. Do you have it? Seriously, I wouldn't walk around with a defeated attitude. The person that did the so called "2016 rebuild" fulfilled his obligation. Things happen with this engines that defy all normal mechanical logic. We're talking 31 modes of failure, man! Heard of them, yet? My best advice is pull yourself up by the bootstraps and attack the problem one step at a time. Dropping the transmission on these cars is not a fast job by no means and a $2-3K estimate for IMS replacement is pretty good in my opinion. If the guy that did the rebuild installed any IMS bearing other than the LN Engineering IMS Solution, it will mean it's time to replace the bearing anyway. Out of warranty... is OUT of warranty.