996 purchase

i want to upgrade from my 964 to the best 996 i can afford, probably 40K or so. there seem to be a lot of nice internet cars at around 40k, usually incomplete records. ex: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=011&item=320016109705&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AM EWA%3AIT&rd=1 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=011&item=320016109705&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AM EWA%3AIT&rd=1 I see little of posts on rms , blown engines, lately. does thast mean that if a car is dry, has had an rms fixed and passes a ppi it is relatively safe to buy. or do i have to skip this entire generation of cars if i can't spring for a turbo or gt3, both of which hace different crank and seals i'nm told. sorry to bring up an old subject, but my mechanic, dan jacobs, says that every 996 that comes into his shop is on the 2nd engine.

find new mechanic. the easy way out! lol i am happy with my 996

You're mechanic needs to calm down with the hysteria. I'm on my second 996, neither had any engine issues whatsoever.

Your mechanic sounds like a dip**** and perhaps he's causing the blown motors himself (not really, kidding)........................ Get a new mechanic or feed him some valium. I've had many and had almost no problems. I've had one rms amongst several cars and it was because the clutch installer used the existing seal and was a moron. He also blamed the car and was later fired.

Had a Boxster and now a 996 and no engine replacements for me. Small oil leake in the Boxster that was taken care of with a new cam housing gasket. I know several 996 and 986 owners and come to think of it none of them have replaced an engine except for 2 that swaped out from a 2.7 to a 3.4 in their Boxster, otherwise they would not have done an engine replacement. Don't get me wrong, there are 996s that have had engine replacements; however, the talk is mostly hysteria. On a used 996, major issues have mostly been addressed. Get the PPI, from another mechanic (IMO), and enjoy.

RMS is overblown IMO. I had a PPI done when I was considering purchasing my car. I was concerned b/c the car had been for sale since Nov '05 and not driven much. They P-car dealer noted dampness around the seal. I couldn't get the independent dealer to pay to fix it b/c the P-car dealer had told them and me it could be 5 weeks or 5 years before the seal really leaked a bunch. Bought the car anyway, got a couple of drips after a few weeks and now it has 'healed' itself. Also agree you should find a new mechanic. That comment is irresponsible. The water cooled 911s are very reliable. There may be some problem cars out there, but consider the range of possible drivers of these vehicles. Some are driven at 4/10ths every day as a fun car to commute in. Others are taken to the track 4-5 times a year and driven hard. Still others are redlined at every opportunity by abusers of cars. It comes down to getting the best, clearest history you can, buying private party from a 'Porsche guy' if you can and not seeking the absolute bottom dollar deal because, as many will cite here - if the deal seems to good to be true, it likely is..... Happy hunting, Piccia '02 Targa

I ran into the RMS issue shortly after purchasing mine. It was not a big deal and I got it taken care of at a very good indy shop. I would not say that the RMS issue is overblown, since I have personally been affected by it. You should pay attention to that area while you are shopping. I know a couple local guys that have also had the problem. But I would not let an RMS leak stop you. Overall, everything else about the car has been a joy.

You can even find early 996's at dealerships in that price range - mostly 99's and 00's, but you might get a higher mileage 2001. I preferred this route since I could test drive the car, and compare it with other models at the same time. I was even able to get an after market 4 year warranty through the dealer and I couldn't be more satisfied (with the car and the warranty). I'm sure the internet purchase will yield similar results. Good luck! -td

70,000 racing and autocross miles and still on my first engine!! GET A NEW MECHANIC ASAP!!

NEW MECHANIC or new engine? the choice is simple.

I ran into the RMS issue shortly after purchasing mine, CPO'd. It was replaced for free buy the dealer. Then 4 months later during a Clutch replacement there was another small leak found by my In INDY, it was replaced for $50. Two RMS's in one year is an issue in my book. But what many don't mention is that it's not a very costly repair considering how much people talk about it. When I first heard about the RMS I thought it was a 1500 -2000 repair. I was happy to find out it's only a $700 repair on Average.

As others have stated the facts just don't support your mechanic's comment. I've got a 986 and a 996 (both M96 motors) and both of mine have been flawless. I have a close friend who is the service manager at a large Chicago Porsche dealership and he claims that they see very few 986/996/987/997 engine replacements with the cars that they service. It sounds like your mechanic has bitten into a moldy fig and has issues with Porsche's wasserpumpers. Good look with your search and welcome to the 996 board

perhaps he is spot on Read the september edition of Excellence where they say rms failure is reported at between 50% and 100% see my other recent post: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/292842-50-100-rms-failure.html good luck

This not always the case....rms failure can lead to a new engine! The seal can be replaced if the crank assembly is still centered in the crank case. If it is not centered (tested with a special tool) than the engine should be replaced. I have not prersonally had one but. I have had an intermediate bearing go bad which lead to an engine replacement...and is also another know 996 problem.

I bought my 99 with a 4 yr extended warranty and they have paid around 25k in repairs over the last 3 years. I have my tranny and engine both blow. That said, what bugs me most is that I seem to have been the unlucky one at events so it looks like I just had a bad car, it was all dealer serviced and it isn't abused by me. Hopefully, I'll have better luck on the new engine/tranny. But, I would not own one without a warranty now.

How is he "spot on"? RMS very rarely results in a new engine. RMS is a known problem for these cars but don't blow it out a proportion, it's just a leaking seal. What evidence do you have that these engines are failing in the massive numbers implied by his mechanics statement?

No more evidence than you have that they are not First off as you correctly quoted I said Perhaps. Second who are you to question his mechanics experience? If porsche told you that there was a 50% chance that you rms would leak would that make you think twice about your purchase? If I was buying a car out of warranty then I would think three, four or five times!! about it...then walk away My car and the Porsche Brand is simply not special enough for me to walk into one with a 50% or greater chance of taking an oil **** on my nice garage floor!...and having no recourse other than a drip pan and an extra quart of synthetic mobil one on hand! You are correct that many rms leaks can be fixed by replacing the seal but many cannot (for reasons stated in my above post) In speaking with my porsche service advisor he estimates that "better than 50% of rms leaks can be fixed with a new seal. Still that leaves way to high a number for me to take a risk outside of warranty on one of these. I say if you have a mechanic you can trust TRUST YOUR MECHANIC!!! and go in a different direction car purchase wise. Be that a car with a warranty or another brand.

You should be able to find a nice 2000 for that with low miles, good options and a solid service history. Due to your concerns, you are much more likely to have problems with a 99' (especially and early one). In 2000, most of the bugs were worked out; but there are several on this board that have positive experiences with early cars. My recommendations: 1. Get a Carfax and make sure it is clean. 2. Make sure the car has everything it should have - 2 keys - Full set of books - Full service records 3. Check wearing items - Clutch (I have driven several used ones were the clutches were worn out) - Brakes front and rear (ditto from above) - Tires (could cost $1000+ to replace all 4) 4. Drive several cars before making a decision.

Dell I just noticed another 1 post member. You want to hug it out?

Not true. As I stated I have a good friend that is the Service Manager (not just a mechanic) at a Chicago area dealership. He has told me (more than once) that they just don't replace that many engines on these cars. However, you would prefer to believe a mechanic who indicates that every 996 he works on is on it's second motor? Does that even sound somewhat logical to you?? It's obvious that you've got an "axe to grind" on the RMS issue and I agree that it's clearly a weakness on these cars. However, it's just a leaking seal, and it is very rarely a terminal condition for the motor. According to my friend the new seal seams to be solving almost all of their leaks on the first replacement. You want proof that your 100% failure theory is wrong. Ok, I've got two cars with the M96 motor and neither one has failed. That's 100% success for me! If you think you're driving around in some sort of ticking bomb, sell it! I wouldn't want to live that way.........

I wholeheartedly agree with Ray. Why buy a car that you believe is going to self-destruct? I wouldn't have much fun driving at all if I had to worry when and where my rms would leak. Relax. If it's broke, fix it. In the meantime, enjoy it.

listen sport one more time 1)never had an rms failure 2)no axe to grind...just want to give the poster more info to make an informed choice 3)your 'my service manager trumps your mechanic' atitude is just plane silly' provided both these guys are telling the truth then they are both speaking from THEIR OWN EXPERIENCE....highly subjecitve and second hand...take all advice with a grain of salt! 4)We obviously have differing expectations of our car company. When I agreed to spend $90k on a new Porsche I expected it not to leak oil in the time I own it. I further expect that if it did so from a know problem then Porsche will do all in its power to keep me and my money happy!

which is why i bought it new and under full warranty

It seems like the argument below is on the frequency of engine replacement. Are there any statistics? I'm wondering if this is anything like the 2001-2003 BMW M3 engine issue. I followed this pretty closely since I used to own a 2001 M3 coupe. First there were sporadic reports of engine failure. It wasn't clear just what fraction of owners were affected. Initially BMW was blaming the owners saying that over-reving and not properly breaking in the engines were to blame (they even sent letters out reminding owners of this). Owners were getting pretty upset and finally some were sending nasty letters to BMW. One of the letter writers was even keeping a database on the failures. Eventually, reports were appearing in the press (maybe this is what finally made BMW to admit there was a problem). BMW finally issued a recall (two actually) and added a warranty on the engines good for 100,000 miles or 6 years. In the end, I'm not sure if there really was a significant number of failures (maybe a few %) but BMW did do something about it (after much prodding). From what I'm reading on this board Porsche is not going to do anything about it but maybe that's because the number of failures is actually quite low?

Hmmm........someone is getting a little testy! You can continue to believe you are driving a ticking bomb. You can believe mechanics that say every 996 they have serviced is on the second motor. I guess I just flat out disagree. I'm done conversing with you since you clearly can't keep it friendly. Have fun with your time bomb........tick tock......tick tock...

now what could be more 'friendly' than 'sport' cheers

Firstly, I went from a 964 to a 996 and I am as happy as a pig in pooh. Secondly when I purchased my 964 way back when the 993 was still a new car the doomsayers and a certain group of journalists were slagging off about the 964, saying very similar things. Every Porsche series from the day they were invented has had some kind of issue(s). The 986/996 RMS issue is just like the lack of headgasket issue with the 964. Some leaked some didn't. Did Porsche drop the ball? Yes they did. Did Porsche do a good job sorting out the problem? No they didn't. Porsche have generally never directly admitted liability and are not good at admitting mistakes. The engine harness problem on the 993 took 10 years and a very determined 993 owner to get sorted. The secondary air injection issue on the 993 will never be sorted by Porsche. You pays your money you takes the risk. What you have to decide is this a calculated risk or not. My 964 never let me down and I do not expect my 996 to either. There is an element of luck, but that applies to any motor vehicle you purchase even new ones. I can also tell you that here in Switzerland the cost of ownership from insurance, spares to servicing costs are less with the 996 than with the 964 which makes my wallet very happy. Ciao, Adrian.

Personally, I would buy a 996 under those stated conditions if the price were right, despite the fact that the RMS leaks may still occur.

Well, as far as Dan Jacobs is concerned if it is the Dan Jacobs that owns Hairry Dog Garage in CT, he is very well respected in the area. I have been to his shop for PCA events and he runs a great shop and handles a stable of local club racers. I have talked to him briefly and he seemed to have no axe to grind. If he said it, although there is obviously some degree of sarcasm/humor in the statement he may just be saying that RMS and intermediate shaft problems are very real and at least something to consider when buying an older 996 outside of warranty.