Modding the 3.6L mufflers for a MKII design

I met up with Darin last week and he welded up a set of the 3.6L mufflers that I bought on eBay for $100. Darin bought the 2 1/4 inch stainless pipe and had it on hand. We spent about 3 hours on the project and it turned out really neat. Anyone else in the SF Bay Area that wants to do this mod, contact Darin on Rennlist. Ive taken a series of six photos that I will try to load on here....but I'm not very adept at this...this is my third try to get the pictures to load. Chuck

Hey Chuck, It was great to meet you. I can't wait to hear what they sound like.

Looks great... Interested in knowing what you think about the mod compared to your aftermarket exhaust

I'll let you know how they compare to the Schnell's I currently have on there. I'm having a garage makeover done this week, so I can't get in there to install them. I'm contacting some of my Porsche friends who have access to a lift to do the install. I have a fused cervical spine...makes it difficult to look up...so I need a lift to do the install. Darin did a great job on them though....he's "FisterD" on the forum if anyone in the Bay Area wants to contact him.

Chuck - you will love the sound! Thanks for sharing the pics. Darin - Great job on the mod. The welding looks GREAT!

Hi Chuck, After our series of emails on muffler mods, glad to see that it all came together - hope the sound matches the excellent 'cut&paste' welding that Darin did!

Garth: Yes, it did finally comes together. Darin and I had a good laugh when I told him that I got him confused with you, and that I was all ready to drive the mufflers to your place when you flagged on my comment about the "Bay Area"....then told me you were in Nova Scotia! Thanks for the compliments on the muffler mod....but all I did was act like a voyeur and watch Darin...and took the pictures. Darin did a hell of a job...and he made up some templates, so the next time someone wants a mod, he won't have to make all the small adjustments....but I think they came out pretty dogone nice and very sanitary. I can't wait to get them installed....and if they sound like all the folks on this forum say they do....then I'll be offing my Schnells. I do like the Schnells, but I'm looking for a little more throatiness. The Schnells are lighter than these stock mufflers, so I'll be picking up some weight. For anyone who's contemplating this mod...if you want the 2 1/4 inch stainless piping with the 90degree mandrell bend, it's not cheap....it's $75 from Burns, and you cut it in half. It takes about 5 days to get it...but that size of stainless is not readily available around town.

so if i was interested in this.... how would i get it?

meaning not do it myself........

I don't get what you're trying to say....How would you get it? Do you mean get the stainless pipe? I just had Darin order it. He's a custom welder and has all the contacts, and had the pipe there waiting for me. If you mean how would you get the mod done? You'd have to come up with a set of OEM mufflers. From the research I did prior to doing this myself, there are two ways to go...some guys mod the original 3.4L 996 stock mufflers....and I think they refer to these as the MKI mod. The guys who choose to do the 3.6L stock mufflers refer to it as the MKII mod. (I'm guessing at this from what I've read). There are two ways of doing the mods. The differences are the way you cut out and attach the 90 degree pipe in between the inlet/outlet pipes. There are examples in the forums along with pictures, and folks who will extoll the virtures of each. There are also folks who have used different sized stainless pipe...everything from 1 1/4 to the 2 1/4. If you mean you don't want to do the mod yourself, you have to find someone like Darin in your area, or there's a guy who sells the mods already done up....I think he's referred to as the "RSR mod"...and you can research/contact him thru archives here on Rennlist. I think he charges $550 PLUS you have to send in a decent set of mufflers as a "core charge"....then he sends you the finished product. I hope that answers your questions. Good luck in your hunt.../// chuck

chuck... you answered my question as exactly as i asked it.... Thank you........ now is this mod better then getting say a fabspeed exhaust...? i was told that my exhaust is going to crap out on me.... so i am in hunt of a new one ........ SOON!

Is it "better than getting a Fabspeed exhaust?"....Geez, I really couldn't say because I've never had the opportunity to personally listen to them side-by-side....but from his response, I think Gota911 has the MK mod in his car and he might be able to answer your question more authoritatively. If you do a search on the archives and enter the search criteria "PSE MODDED 3.6 Mufflers-How close in sound to a real PSE", you'll get a whole lot of info on this subject....from guys who have done it. I was influenced by that discussion thread before I decided to do this myself. I know that the folks who have done this have compared the sound to the PSE exhaust system which will run you a cool $1500. I spent $100 for the mufflers on eBay and paid Darin $150 to do the hard part. I'm not real good at math, but that seems a LOT more cost effective to me. Good luck...good hunting............. Chuck

Chuck, those are some pretty good pics you have there! Paint a good descriptive story for anyone wanting to do the mod, or they can print it out and show it to the welder. And I think Darin did a very neat job, very clean welding and cuts!

Cosmos: Thanks...I wanted to document the process as best as possible for the guys who might want to try this. I had to search a while to get a decent picture of what I wanted Darin to replicate...it's really not that complicated (says me who watched Darin do it all), and for a total capital outlay of $100 for the mufflers on eBay ($30 shipping) plus $150 to Darin...for $280 you've got something that the guys who have done the comparisons say will rival the $1500 PSE setup...minus the PSE vacuum solenoid on/off dash mounted switch of course. Darin: Are you soaking up all this praise bud? You deserve the kudos. Glad we got together. I'm really pleased Chuck

Porsche-Smile - as Chuck stated above I have done this exact mod (MK II mod) to 3.4L mufflers and to 3.6L mufflers. The 3.4L cans were a little louder than my stock 3.6L mufflers, but I was disappointed that the sound wasn't louder and lower. Then I did the same mod on the 3.6L mufflers. They sound MUCH better than the 3.4L mufflers. IMO, they sound about 85% to 90% of true PSE mufflers (I have heard true PSE mufflers only once). Below is some information about the different muffler versions and the different PSE MOD versions. MUFFLERS 3.4L mufflers - have a straight pipe coming from the cat (left muffler shown in 1st pic) 3.6L mufflers - have a accordion pipe coming from the cat (right muffler shown in 1st pic). Both versions of the stock OEM mufflers have 3 internal chambers, which the exhaust must pass through prior to exiting the outlet pipe. PSE MODS PSE MK I mod - a small pipe (usually 3/4" to 1 1/4" in diameter) is added between the inlet pipe (coming from the cats) to the outlet pipe which holds the exhaust tips. The exhaust passing through the "new" pipe never goes through the muffler, so the sound is louder and lower. The MK I mod is shown in the 2nd pic (note that the MK I mod has been done on 3.6L mufflers). PSE MK II mod - the "cap" at the corner of the muffler is removed. Then a hole is cut into the outlet pipe. Then a 2" to 2 1/4" diameter pipe is connected from the new opening on the muffler to the hole in the outlet pipe. This mod allows some of the exhaust to bypass the 3rd chamber in the muffler. The resulting sound is louder and lower than the stock muffler sound. The MK II mod is shown in the 3rd pic. Either mod (MK I or MK II) can be done to either the 3.4L or the 3.6L muffler. However, from what I have heard in person and from video clips, if you are working with 3.4L mufflers and want to get the sound that most resembles true PSE sound, then you should do the MK I mod. Someone here recently did the 3.4L and a slightly different version of the MK I mod and posted a sound clip. As near as I could tell from that sound clip, those mufflers it sounded just like my 3.6L mufflers with the MK II mod, which I like VERY much. If you want to get as close to true PSE sound as possible, listed below are my recommended/not recommended combinations. Remember these are just my opinions, and as the lawyers would write�.. your mileage may vary�. no guarantee, expressed or implied�. Void where prohibited�. etc., etc., etc. 3.4L mufflers o MK I mod � recommended (heard this on a video clip and sounds good) o MK II mod - NOT recommended (personally did this � not worth it) 3.6L mufflers o MK I mod - recommended (I have not heard this combo in person or on a video clip) o MK II mod � recommended (have this now and I love it) Hope this helps!

Just did the 3.6 MKII on my 2002 carrera and I love it.....I am in Nashville and can help anyone who is interested.....sounds so much better....... TENNKTM

Looks like my setup. I get lots of complements about my exhaust sound everytime I drive it.

Chuck, I love the new avitar. I can't wait to hear the new system on Saturday. Nice job documenting the modification. See you soon. Darin, You do great work at a very reasonable price.

Mfletch: Since I spend most of my time on the 996 forum, I thought this avitar would be more appropriate. I don't know if I'll have the 996 done by Saturday. I'll be putting it in the shop for detailing tomorrow, and probably drive the 930 to the G 24 meetup. But when I get the mufflers in, I'll get ahold of you for lunch...my turn to buy.

Thanks a lot chad....... man, i love this forum......time to sign in......

Thanks Chuck and Tim for a great post. This is exactly what I was looking for and a great help for me. I've been considering the PSE but it's rather pricey...so this sounds like a great mod. Could anyone post a sound file of the 3.6L mk II mod? Where at in the Bay area is Darin located? I'm in the south bay. Now I'm off to Ebay to search for 3.6L muffler....anyone here selling any?

man i've been looking for one as well.... now it's going to go up in pricing,...... what a rip.....

Swede: You can PM Darin under the userid of FisterD. He has his welding shop at his house which is on Bethel Island (B.I.) in the area of the Antioch Bridge. His address is 3410 Knightsen Ave., B.I. and his cell number is [phone removed]. He told me that he would be available for any other guys who might want to do this mod... Chuck

Thanks Chuck! I'm actually in Knightsen, which is right next to B.I. and Brentwood. I love working on all things Porshe, so yes I can help anyone interested in doing this mod.

Swede and PSmile: I advertised in WTB on Renntech as well as went onto eBay and set up a "favorite search" routine looking for "Porsche muffler". I got a lot of hits from eBay for the wrong mufflers, but eventually hit the right one....you just have to stay on top of it. I received two responses from folks who were willing to sell me their 3.6L mufflers...but ended up going with the eBay auction and got a set out of a dismantler in Las Vegas. I think you're right....the sudden and increased interest in buying these mufflers is going to drive the price up....I recall reading early on where fellow Rennlisters were giving their OEM mufflers to other Rennlister for the cost of shipping. I wasn't that fortunate, but still $100 isn't bad. I had previous offers to buy them for around $250 to $300 which I passed on waiting for the eBay auction. Shipping is only around $30, so don't let them jack up the shipping on you.

Video of 3.6L mk II mod Disregard the squeaking noise

nice vid....... thanks for that

That was an OUTSTANDING video clip. It took you through all the gears and thru cruising as well. I haven't had a chance to install mine yet, but that video gave me a really good idea of what to expect. I can't wait for the install. Thanks evansaero....great find.

Thanks for the video Evansaero. Gives me a good idea of the sound Chuck Jones, I've searched around and I guess I have to be patient to find it cheap. The only price I could find on Ebay was $175 per muffler....$350 total plus shipping and then the labor to modify the mufflers and then I have to put them on the car as well. I've done work on old cars....but how difficult is it to replace the mufflers on a 911? Need any special Porsche tools or is it all standard stuff? I have to say that this message board is fantastic. Such a wealth of info and very helpful people. I hope I can contribute too at some point when I've soaked up enough info from all of you guys.

Swede: The actual muffler swap out is not very difficult. The hardest part of it is getting the tips to line up evenly. The mufflers sit up under the rear wheel wells...and if you could find someone with a lift it would be a relatively easy swap out. No special tools are needed other than metrics. If you didn't want to mess with them yourself, once you had the mufflers, you could take it to a muffler shop and have them swap them out for you...probably charge you about an hour's worth of labor at whatever the going flat rate is for labor. I was afraid that the prices would start going up on the mufflers as guys got the bug to do the mod. Now if you go look at Gota911's response, you will see another mod you can do with the factory 3.4L mufflers....using smaller diameter stainless pipe....and according to the guys who have done it, it's supposed to be just about the same sound as the 3.6L muffler mod....and you could actually use your own factory mufflers....or buy some 3.4L mufflers probably cheaper than the 3.6L variety. I had to wait about a couple months before I found the auction for the ones I got...but I also posted in the WTB sections of Rennlist and Renntech....where I got two responses. One fellow wanted $350 for his plus shipping and I passed. I got a response from a gal who offered hers to me, but I had already bought them off eBay....send me a PM and I'll give you her email address. She may still have them for sale, although she was sounding like she might want to try it herself...nothing ventured, nothing gained. Chucjk

Swede: The actual muffler swap out is not very difficult. The hardest part of it is getting the tips to line up evenly. The mufflers sit up under the rear wheel wells...and if you could find someone with a lift it would be a relatively easy swap out. No special tools are needed other than metrics. If you didn't want to mess with them yourself, once you had the mufflers, you could take it to a muffler shop and have them swap them out for you...probably charge you about an hour's worth of labor at whatever the going flat rate is for labor. I was afraid that the prices would start going up on the mufflers as guys got the bug to do the mod. Now if you go look at Gota911's response, you will see another mod you can do with the factory 3.4L mufflers....using smaller diameter stainless pipe....and according to the guys who have done it, it's supposed to be just about the same sound as the 3.6L muffler mod....and you could actually use your own factory mufflers....or buy some 3.4L mufflers probably cheaper than the 3.6L variety. I had to wait about a couple months before I found the auction for the ones I got...but I also posted in the WTB sections of Rennlist and Renntech....where I got two responses. One fellow wanted $350 for his plus shipping and I passed. I got a response from a gal who offered hers to me, but I had already bought them off eBay....send me a PM and I'll give you her email address. She may still have them for sale, although she was sounding like she might want to try it herself...nothing ventured, nothing gained. Chuck

Swede - as Chuck said the swap is not realy difficult. Standard metric wrenches and socket wrenches is all you need. An adjustable crescent wrench will also help.... just make sure you get the metric crescent wrench (that was a joke). Here is a shot of the mufflers from the PET. 1. Jack up the car 2. Remove the rear wheels 3. You loosen the clamp on the cats (#29) and slide the clamp on to the cat 4. Remove the three nuts (circled) holding the muffler to the bracket 5. Remove the muffler 6. Remove the clamp in the tip (IMPORTANT: take note of how the "dent" in the tip pipe aligns with the muffler pipe. This will help with the re-install the tips on the "new" mufflers in the correct position) 7. If your "new" mufflers did not come with a bracket (#28) remove the brackets from your current mufflers and transfer them to the "new" mufflers 8. Install tips on "new" mufflers (do not tighten completely yet) 9. Reinstall muffler 10. Replace 3 nuts, do not tighten completely 11. Slide clamp from cat to muffler and tighten 12. Tighten 3 nuts 13. Align tips and tighten nut Listen to the GREAT sound!

Sorry, lost track of this thread ( I guess I got too busy posting on the "nonsense" thread) Thanks Chuck and Tim for all the info. I've got my search set up on Ebay, hoping to score some 3.6L mufflers so I can do the mod. I'll keep you posted on my progress. I'm really looking forward to some louder music in my ears. I have the X-51 option on my car but the option list doesn't show any PSE. However, I think my P-car sounds a lot throatier and aggressive on acceleration than the non X-51 cars I test drove (and I drove a lot before taking the plunge). Is there any modification to the exhaust on the X-51 option or am I just imagining things? Wishful thinking maybe?

Swede: I can't help you out on the X-51 question....but maybe Gota911 can. Hey Gota911: Thanks for that exploded diagram of the exhaust system...complete with "stupid proof" coloring of the parts you had to unbolt....hell, even I could follow that diagram. That really adds to the entire subject of modding the mufflers...making the whole process very clear for those who might want to try it.

For you guys looking for some mufflers to mod....there's a set of 3.6L mufflers on eBay...actually the entire exhaust system off a 996 on sale...currently at $86....go see item # 320094344302. They're the mufflers with the corregated pipe which is the version for the MKII mod. Not a bad deal for the entire system.

Chuck - you are welcome! Matt - I think (but am not certain) the X-51 package came with the PSE (Porsche Sport Exhaust) mufflers. Do you have a switch on your upper console that looks like a pair of goggles (the Icon is actually exhaust tips)? That would be your ON/OFF switch for the PSE.

Winning bid: US $425.00 Cuckoo

Hmm, this post is the perfect segue to some PSE questions that I have wanted to ask for some time. So here we go: (01) Is the PSE option basically the same as the MKII mod, just with a switch to control (open/close) it? (02) If the purpose of PSE ONLY for sound, or is there a performance gain? (03) Is the purpose of the MKII mod similarly only for improved sound, or performance? Thanks

Missed the ebay auction...work keeps getting in the way of my Rennlist:ing and Ebay:ing!!! i've been too busy driving the car and not really focusing too much on the buttons but I don't recall seeing any button with goggles on it. I really don't think it has a PSE....the slightly throatier sound might be from the X-51 tweaked engine or just from my wishful thinking. In any case I think the sound is too tame and I'm still on a hunt for a PSE or the 3.6L mod. Myrmidon, I'm pretty sure the answer to question 2 & 3 is that it's sound only. If it gives any extra HP it's so little that you won't notice it.

01 - Basically, that is correct 02 - Correct, Porsche makes no claims concerning increased HP from the PSE 03 - Sound improvement only, but what a NICE improvement it is!

anyone in socal looking to do the same? i want to do it...... let's try to get a GB or discount on this.....

Chuck, did you have time to install the mufflers on your car yet? I'm curious to hear what you think of the result. Thanks to a very nice local Rennlister I'm now in possession of 3.6L mufflers ready to be modded. I have to say that I'm awe over how great this forum is. So many helpful people who are willing to share their knowledge and even give their mufflers to people in need�like me. Don�t want to mention any Rennlist id�s but a million thanks goes out to Guy! I will be contacting Darin very soon to set up an appointment. One remaining question before I go ahead. Does anyone know if this for any reason would void the CPO warranty? I don�t see any reason why it should but very few things surprise me anymore and I figured it would be a good thing to check before putting it on.

i say if there's a problem, just put in the old muff and take care of the warr issues then......

Swede: Funny you should ask. I've been doing a garage makeover along with working on the 930 so I didn't get to install the mufflers...but today I had to have the oil changed and dropped it off at the indy's shop and told him to install them...so in a couple days, I can answer your question. Glad you were able to pick up a set of mufflers....you're right...there are some great folks on this forum...now you can have Darin do the deed for you. You need to contact him about 5 days before you go over to his shop to give him time to order the stainless steel pipe for you...unless you picked it up....but it's not a readily available commodity. He ordered it for me from Burns...$75 for the U pipe in 2 1/4 inch. Chuck

Oh, we want to see pics of the garage makeover. Did you put in the garage floor mats as well? I'm looking forward to hearing what you think of the mod and the sound. I've never heard the Schnell mufflers but you should already have a better sounding car than I have so it will be interesting to hear how you like it. Tell the indy shop to hurry up!!

Swede: We're a little off subject, but I didn't do the floors because the contractor finally admitted under questioning that there is no floor that will stand up to the beating it would take from a midrise or scissors lift with the steel wheels....so I didn't do it. I went with Premier Garage Co....and am really pleased with the results...finally after 30 years I have my garage...with 2 P cars in it.!! No pics till I get rid of all the crap I've accumulated for 30 years...but when it's all nice and neat...pics will be forth coming. It's not going to show like some of the guys who have those eat-off-the-floor garages. Tomorrow I go with Mflec and pick up the 996 so I'll be able to tell you about the MKII sound...and if I like them, I'll be offing a set of Schnell mufflers with about 8K miles on them ($899 new). If I don't like the sound, then I'll be offing the MKII mufflers...either way, something is going to go. No more hanging onto stuff to clutter up the garage.

Sowwy, my fault for bringing you off topic. I checked with my dealer today regarding the impact to my CPO warranty...I got the answer I was suspecting. Only Porsche original parts would be ok or the warranty goes out the window. So I said how about a original Porsche muffler with an extra little pipe on it? To be fair he had to think about that one. But, the answer was the same unfortunately so now I'm not sure what to do. Am I just being too cautious here?

Yes. What is the big concern, the worst that will happen is you void the warranty on your exhaust. Legaly, they can't void your whole warranty. i.e., if your tranny fails they can't say sorry your muffler is modified so you are s.o.l. (unless they can prove the muffler caused it to fail).

Swede: You're into Analysis Paralysis....use the current protocols of the military..."Don't ask, don't tell." First off, there's absolutely nothing in the MKII modification other than making the car sound a little louder....that should in any way affect the performance of the car. No CEL's come on and there are no hiccups in performance. If you look at the factory PSE mufflers, they look almost exactly like the MKII mod except that they have a vacuum controlled solenoid that opens and closes a valve to the bypass. The MKII just doesn't have the ability to close off the bypass. Some guys who buy the PSE's....don't even hook up the dash controlled switch and just run them open all the time. That's the same dogone thing the MKII does...runs open all the time. I think that....from a dealership perspective....they take the safe road and give you the company line..no mods. That way you can't come back on them for the addition of some doo-dad or other and say that they told you it was OK. Put yourself in a service manager's place. Would you put yourself and possibly your job on the line by going against the company line with some guy you don't even know? Hell no you wouldn't. Now if you knew the service manager personally, he'd tell you something like..."No sweat, but if something goes wrong, make sure you put the OEM mufflers back on before you brind it to me. That way there won't be anything to deny your warranty for" Just put them on and enjoy the enhanced sound that they make....or take three Valium and call me in the morning.

You are so right, I'm in Analysis Paralysis. I'm going for it. Will call Darin tomorrow and set up a time. I'll probably need those three Valiums but what the heck. Thanks Ray and Chuck for setting me straight. Chuck, please psot back with you input once the mufflers are on your car and you've tried it out. Really looking forward to hearing what you think of it.

Swede: I'm going with mfletch tomorrow to see the car at the shop. He's curious and may want to do this too...I got lazy and had them installed when I had the oil changed by the indy, so I haven't had the opportunity to listen to them...but my curiosity is getting to me so I'll give you an update report tomorrow. BUT...if you listen to Gota911, he's sold on them...and he's been around this forum for some time. From a confidence standpoint, I have little doubt that I'm going to like them. And Yutta-Hey....it's not like you've got a lot of money tied up in this project. You got the mufflers free so you'll only be out the money to Darin...and I'm SURE you could sell them to the guys on this forum no sweat if you didn't like them. Tomorrow's the day....looking forward to it. Chuck

Chuck - You're going to LOVE the sound!

Gota911: Well today I went to the shop and fired up the car and am very pleased with the sound of the MKII mufflers. Swede: Give Darin a call...you're going to love the difference from stock. This means I'll be putting my Schnell mufflers up for sale. They are less than a year old with about 8K miles on them. Go to the Schnell site and take a look...all polished stainless and lighter than the OEM. I'll be asking $500 for anyone interested. I recall I paid around $850 for them...but I think now you can find them for around $780 or so.

Chuck, your new mufflers souded great! Thanks for the ride in the 930...it's an incredible car. I'll look forward to seeing you when the 996 is done.

Did an MKII on my 2002 996......love the sound...had it done here in BNA....can help you if you are interested. TENNKTM

Thanks for the posting to let me know how you liked it Chuck. And thanks Mark for the extra confirmation that it does sounds great. I've already been in contact with Darin. Calling him tonight to see if he got the pipes in for Sunday. If all goes well I'll go see Darin on Sunday and we'll install it after he's done. I'm bringing a camera and will record the before and after sound. Hopefully that will help contribute something to all others that are considering this. I'll keep you posted on the progress.

Swede: Fill us in on your mod that you and Darin did last weekend. Did you do the MKII mod with the 2 1/4 inch stainless pipe? Did you take pictures? How do you like the final results? I picked up my car today and drove it home....all I can say is that Gota911 was right...I really like the sound that the MKII mod makes.....I also like the fact that at cruising speed, there is no resonance at all. Glad I did this. My Schnells are up for sale if anyone is interested. They're posted on the for sale board.

Chuck, not to take you back to high school lit, but how would you compare/contrast the the two, Schnell vs. MKII?

I couldn't get the pipe until Monday, so we didn't get together yet. Hopefully this week will work out. I'm really glad you like the new sound Chuck!

I'm hoping to be able to take off around lunch time either Thursday or Friday to go see Darin and get the mufflers done. If that doesn't work it will have to be the weekend...pending Darin's schedule. I'm bringing camera to take pics of it all. You guys already did a great job in documenting it all so I'm not sure I will be able to add any new info. Looking forward to getting this done and to meet you Darin.

Matt - how about a "before" and "after" video? Not just idle or reving the engine, but maybe accelerating away from the building, both "before" and "after" the mod. While video clips are not the same as "in person" sound, at least the video clip would compare/contrast the difference in the sound. I think that would help others understand the dynamics of the changes in the sound.

You mean like this: http://youtube.com/watch?v=el2haZ-lkHI

You like this mod better than the Schnells? Interesting...

Tim, yes, that's the plan as well. I'll record before and after videos. Unfortunately I don't have very fancy equipment for this. Just my little digital camera that also take movies. 1999Porsche911....wow, if my car sounds like that afterwords I'll be very satisfied! Anyone know what modifications it took to get that sound?

Swede: It's NOT going to sound like that sound clip...I don't know what they did with that car, or if they did the MKII mod, but your mufflers won't be that loud. I don't have a sound clip to give you an idea of what they sound like. Arnee: The MKII is a bit louder than the Schnells and a slightly "hollow-er" (word?) sound. Subjective description at best.

Yeah, I'm not expecting it to be anywhere near that loud but it would be interesting to know what was done to that car to get that lovely sound.

Hi everyone! just completed modding my exhaust with the mk2 method. I have a 99 c2 and got a set of 3.6 cans off ebay. I had darin do the work and he did an outstanding job of welding them up, and yes the 3.6 cans match up perfectly to older c2s. My seat of the pants observation is that they are about %25 percent louder than stock at idle and cruise speeds and about %50-%60 louder while accelerating. Its exactly what i was looking for because im not into loud pipes. Its perfect for everyday use and is really intoxicating when your on the gas. I would not recommend this mod for anyone who wants to hear his pipes all the time. hope this helps!

Hi all, finally got my act together and drove up to see Darin. I got a late start and didn't drive the P-car so unfortunately we couldn't put the mufflers on this weekend. Darin did an awesome job. It's clear that he takes pride in doing a good job. We took a spin in Darin's beautiful 993. Ohhh, what a lovely sound! It was well worth the long drive to get someone like Darin to do the job....and the ride in the 993 didn't hurt Stopped by one of Darin's friends to look at some nice old American muscle cars. It was a day in car nirvana Thanks Darin!! Now I just need to find some decent place in the South Bay that can put on my new mufflers! Before and after video will be recorded...I promise. I've already talked the lady in to operating the camera during driving...heheh

Found a comparison of before and after at youtube. Nicely edited so you can compare before and after. Slightly more aggressive sound after the mod. video of before and after 3.6L mod

Awesome Matt! It was great to meet you. " A day in car nirvana"...I like that!

Darin: It's great to see that you've been doing the MKII muffler mod for a few of the Rennlisters. The compliments you've received on the professional welding you do is well deserved. I'm really glad to see so many happy Rennlisters.

Just compare the pic's of Darin's welds in this thread, to the ones found in this link: not so pretty Even an amateur can tell the difference in quality of workmanship. Darin rocks!! (he actually does rock...drums right?) Now, anyone know a good place in the South Bay area that I can take the car to have the modified mufflers put on?

Hi all, I would like to modify my 3.6L muffler with the MKII method. Where is the best place to find and purchase the 2 1/4" stainless steel horseshoe shaped pipe necessary for the mod? Has anyone in Connecticut done this? If yes, can you please recommend where to go to get the mod done? Thanks, in advance. -Cami

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Contact FisterD (see post #70 in this thread) because he has a source for the U-shaped pipe. Any decent muffler shop that does exhaust systems should eb able to do the mod. The Meineke shop near my house did mine for $60. It was a cash, no invoice (a.k.a. off the books) transaction. That price also included the 2-1/4" pipe.

Wow. Thanks for the quick reply. Off to Meineke right now...

i would do the same... but the stock exhaust is just heavy....

Wow x2. Never thought of using Meineke!! Any reason not to just take the car there and let them do it to the existing cans, paying them to do the whole job?

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No, there is not reason not to do that. The reason I did not modify my stock mufflers was because I was leasing my 996 and wanted to be able to return it to stock at lease end, which I did. BTW - just to clarifiy, my $60 price was with me delivering the mufflers to Meineke off the car, since the mufflers were an "extra" set.

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Tim, did Meineke weld them with stainless, and did they use stainless pipe? I'm just curious. Thanks, Darin

Darin, I know I asked for stainless, but I can't be certain tha is what I got. I do know that when we took the mufflers and installed them on Steven C.'s car, the now pipes looked a lot better than the original pipes on the muffler. I had them on my car for over 30,000 miles after the mod.

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Matt, That's a pretty good video. Side-by-side comparisons, very nice. I didn't see exactly what type of mod he did. Darin did a Stage II (aka MKI) on my 3.6's. After that I put in a BMC filter and the sound is just incredible! At a cost of around $300, that combo is hard to beat! You can put them on yourself if you are so inclined. Renntech will have a DIY.

thanks for these great pics and this info, I now have to think about which one (mod I or mod-II) is the best for me. Thanks also for the pricing info... very usefull and excellent information to have!!! Ed

Did the mod-II last week (see my post) - A terrific choice with the nice rasp of the PSE. It does not drone nor is it intrusive what-so-ever. I recommend it highly. Total cost excluding my labor to put them on was $320 including the used mufflers (2000 miles on them), pipe and welding.

Thanks for the info, i have found someone willing to do this and will mod my own mufflers as i am sure I want this. I will post some picts and coments when I get it done. Ed

Guys, this topic is great ! I HAVE to become an active contributor

I have a question for Tim K. (and anyone who can answer). Have you tried a version of MK II which would use only the 'new' outlet and close the middle one, so that the third chamber is not used at all ?

No, I have not tried that. That is possible, but may not be worth the effort. I think it would be very difficult to replicate the angle of the outlet pipe to which the tips are attached. If you want to bypass the muffler completely, you could do the MK I Mod and connect a small pipe between the inlet pipe (cooming from the cats) and the outlet pipe (going to the tips). Or you could do both MK I and MK II mods and probably get the best of both worlds.

I see... thanks for the info. cheers

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The MK III mod!! That I would like to see!

ehhhhh... finally nothing