Dent Wizard - Great stuff! XM - not hot.

Hi, I went to the Potomac PCA meeting yesterday at the Dent Wizard on Randolph Rd in Rockville (nr White Flint Mall). There was a demonstration of the dent removal - they used 2 members Porsche & removed about 8 dents. I had not seen this before, and was surprised - it works very well. Highly recommended for removing dents. There was also a demonstration of XM Satellite radio. I am more of a sceptic on this, since a few of their claims are overblown. They claim CD quality audio, but this is not possible, since they cannot tie the XM into the car's audio system (03+ models), but use an FM modulator. Also, I asked why XM claimed to have superior quality over Sirius, but they did not adequately explain this, saying something about better CODECs. Also, considering they are also pushing for home use, it does not appear to be 5 channel - only 2 channel. The controller does not integrate well with the interior ; as an add-on, the antenna is tacky and sticks out. I would consider XM/Sirius as a factory option, but not as an add-on.

as it is for music 2 channel is sufficient. When at home I run either dts 6 stereo or 6 channel stereo off my denon. Just as long as it's digital. If you had 5/6/7 channel it would be a waste unless you wanted to "listen" to a movie- BTW using anytihng else but dts6 stereo or 5/6/7 channel stereo with music sounds like sh*t unless of course you go with the "pure stereo" which my denon also has and shut everything off but the two channels to make the power supply super clean for super high fidelity 2 channel. I have the high DAC converters in it with the 96khz or whatever which make is noticeably cleaner also. I have yet to try dvd-a or the like yet but I am sure that would be better yet still. Gotta love denon- sorry hardcore denon fan I dig my 3803 esp as I got it for 600 bucks new!!!!

The FM limitation is due to the late-model 996 Porsche factory wiring; there are high-end head units that accept XM tuners through the head unit controls and some -- the Alpine 8920XM -- have the XM tuner built right into the head unit so an outboard tuner is unnecessary. Sound is comparable to the home satellite audio channels -- DirectTV, etc. -- which is to say, excellent. 5 or 6 channel audio vs. a two-channel stereo signal is irrelevant to the quality of the XM or Sirius signal; audio CDs are two channel stereo as well. This would be a function of your headunit or home receiver. As to the antenna, the newest "micro" antenna is about the size of a pack of matches and can be installed invisibly inside the car. Vic 95 C2

I disagree about the 2 channel audio - 5 channel audio is growing in popularity generally thanks to DVD 5 channel, and a lot of 5 channel SACDs are now out. This is not being well promoted, but for example, the Rolling Stones CDs were rereleased last year as dual layer SACD/CDs at CD pricing. I have a Sony DVD/SACD player at home (they are now around $150) and surround SACDs are much better than 2 channel CDs. Even Hip Hop comes out as SACD (e.g. Ludacris). And I don't just buy that, but also classical. e.g. Bach Orchestral Suites in SACD Amazon Bach SACD Link The point is now that I have experienced 5 channel SACD, it is hard for me to buy 2 channel CDs.

Vjd3, In regard to the antenna inside the car, the installer present made the same claim, saying it could be mounted on the dash, and that he did that sort of install, but the XM representative actually stated that the dash was not recommended as an install point for the antenna. He stated that the antenna was designed to go outside the car - his Boxster had the antenna (latest micro model) installed on the decklid, with wiring emerging from inside the trunk. I agree that I would consider XM/Sirius as a factory install (i.e. integrated antenna & head unit), but not as an add on. I also think that audio is heading towards 5 channel, and car audio is moving in this direction as well.

FWIW, I have XM and love it. The only way to really know the difference between Sirius and XM is to try them both, then you'll know XM is better. Additionally, my antenna is mounted "inside" the car under the rear deck, yes under, and the reception is excellent. As a matter of fact when I picked up my car I had to ask the installer where the antenna was beacuse it is not visible. As far as FM modulation is concerned, it shouldn't even be a consideration. Replacing the stock head unit with an XM ready, or now available XM Built in, head unit is the only way to go.

MLA911, Problem is that 03+ models have the MOST Bus system, and unless the whole car is rewired & the Bose system scrapped, a new head unit cannot replace the MOST unit.

I have had XM for 3 years and love it. It's in two of my cars and in two of my homes. The advantages to me are not the audio quality: it's the range, and the programming. I switch back and forth in the car all day between financial reporting, and Deep Tracks. In the cars I use a Pioneer unit that inserts inserts between the car antenna and the existing radio, kind of a hard wired FM modulator. Works great, and the head unit in the car is smaller than a deck of cards. Self installation in both cars was under an hour. BTW, have had nothing but great results from Dent Wizard folks. Steve 99 996 76 930 64 356C 00 M5

I have heard 5-channel audio in my home, and it's awesome, but it's also designed on the premise that you have equal and balanced fronts, rears and center channel (as well as a sub, presumably), something which you really can't achieve in most cars (the 911 in particular). Your rear speakers are fill at best, and a center channel won't really work because you're sitting to the left of the soundstage in the driver's seat. I don't know that it would be worth the hassle in a car. The micro XM antenna gets excellent reception behind the glass on the back deck in the 993. YMMV. Vic 95 C2

Just got Sirius factory installed in my new company car, an A4 ultrasport quattro. Love it- only other satellite experience is my DirecTV though...

I have never seen any audio devices (CD,DVD, LD, analog or digital) that output anything other than a stereo signal. The 5 channel audio format is coded into the soundtrack and the component receivieng the signal does the processing (DTS or Dolby processor). I also have the XM in my daily driver. You would have true digital CD sound quality if you were to get the indash reciever/headunit. The FM modulator just makes it easy to add to any vehicle and most folks do not know from sound quality.

I have had XM for almost 2 years now and I love it... Now it is on all our 3 cars. Previously on my Boxster S, I have th AUX enabled and ran the XM on AUX and it sounded great, but now in my C2 Cab, I have a CD Changer so I can use the AUX option, so I run a delphi FM modulator and it seems to be pretty good connection...

Sloth, There are several formats which have 5 discrete channels encoded - Dolby Digital is a 5 channel signal (as on most DVDs), also DVD-Audio and SACD are 5 channel formats. If you look at the back of a SACD player or DVD with onboard decoder, you will see 5 discrete outputs (actually 6, one for the LFE - Low Frequency Effects, AKA subwoofer). See the Dolby website for more info - here is a link to just 1 document about it: Dolby Link

I think we are saying the same thing...

Sloth, I'm not sure where you see an agreement, since your original statement was: "I have never seen any audio devices (CD,DVD, LD, analog or digital) that output anything other than a stereo signal" The point is that DVDs and SACD etc DO output more channels - I have a SACD player which has 5 discrete outputs - Front Left/Right, Rear Left/Right and Center (+LFE). Maybe you are confusing Dolby ProLogic, which does extract 5 channels from a 2 channel signal, but Dolby Digital, SACD, etc have 5 channels separetly laid down. My apology in advance if I misconstrue your original statement, but I read it to say that you have only seen 2 channels encoded.

posted by Sloth I have never seen any audio devices (CD,DVD, LD, analog or digital) that output anything other than a stereo signal. The 5 channel audio format is coded into the soundtrack and the component receivieng the signal does the processing (DTS or Dolby processor). Maybe we are confused... I am talking physical outputs and not the number of output channels encoded on the media. Do the new DVD and SACD players actualy have 5 separate channels worth of audio outputs on the back? A separate channel (output jack) for each front, rear, and center channels? I think we are getting confused between a 5 channel signal coded onto a DVD (DTS or Dolby Digital) vs. 5 channels of outputs on the back of a DVD player or preamp. I will admit to being out of the loop for a while and perhaps not up on the latest and greatest. Either way...

Sloth, Basically there are 2 current states: 1) Dolby Digital (e.g. DVDs) which have a digital stream, which can be decoded into 5 channels either by the decoder in the DVD player (which then has 5 analog outputs), or by a receiver/preamp receiving the digital signal, which then decodes it, again producing 5 analog signals 2) SACD (& I think DVD-Audio), which are designed for surround sound - however, because of concern about copy issues, SACD does not allow a digital signal output for decoding by a receiver/preamp. Hence SACD players do the decoding inside the player unit, and have 5 analog outputs. IMHO, it does not matter where the processing takes place, but the fact that there are 5 discrete signals recorded. Most home theater receivers have a 5 channel analog input to allow for SACD players, etc. If I were to have XM/Sirius radio at home, I would want a 5 channel signal, otherwise may as well keep buying SACDs - it's hard to go back to stereo...