81 captured repliesDiscussion pagination complete · Source accounts, not a confirmed diagnosis
THIS DISCUSSION / SOURCE-DERIVED OVERVIEW
Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCH"New" to me 996 and problems already.
Reported or suspected cause
lack of rebuild tech specs/instructions/advice.there is not 1 book
Reported cause
No successful repair reported for this finding.
1
Identified cause
0
Suspected cause
0
Reported fixes
Read evidence and context
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that report identifying a cause
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Reported cause
The biggest problem is the lack of rebuild tech specs/instructions/advice.There is not 1 book on rebuilding the M96,not one !
Leading evidence: 'lack of rebuild tech specs/instructions/advice.there is not 1 book' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'lack of rebuild tech specs/instructions/advice.there is not 1 book' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Check antifreeze' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
Source reports, not a diagnosis or a success probability. Counts refer to discussions and can overlap.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
I visually checked the antifreeze before I bought and saw no signs of intermix.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
I did look it over carefully and checked oil and coolant and looked for any signs of leakage underneath.
Explicit resolution reports before identified causes, performed actions and suggestions. Within each level, matching component labels precede direct query mentions and inherited thread context; successful versus unsuccessful discussion counts, owner confirmations and independent discussion support determine order. This is not a probability of success.
Discussions that performed work without a confirmed outcome
1
0 original-poster resolution reports. Counts can overlap; they are not unique people or a success rate.
0 discussions have direct query context; 0 report a fix in that context. Other evidence may inherit the discussion’s subject.
Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Checked the oil first and it was a little low....hmm.
Counts describe captured discussions, not unique people or a diagnosis. Author identities are not reliably stored. Exact duplicate evidence is counted once across matching discussions; one discussion counts at most once per action/state. Multiple repairs reported together remain a combination. Suggestions and failed attempts do not establish a fix. Matches cover whole discussions and can include related faults, model variants and incomplete threads.
81 eligible posts · 0 unverified posts · 1 discussions match the subject in their title or opening post.
Rennlist: 1 discussions
0 evidence records excluded for query context · 0 excluded by outcome qualification · 0 adjusted by outcome qualification.
0 acknowledgements have no verified action link; they do not establish a repair result.
Generation: 20261027T005001Z · outcome-qualification-6. Deterministic extraction; no AI model inference. How we use sources
Well I've wanted a 911 for 25 years. I found a local car (00 C2) with 59k miles that a widow was selling. Long story short, I bought it. The closet Porsche dealer is about 2hrs away so I didn't have an inspection done. I did look it over carefully and checked oil and coolant and looked for any signs of leakage underneath. All was good.
I was going to take my wife out in it tonight and I thought, why not check fluids before we go. Checked the oil first and it was a little low....hmm. Checked the coolant and it was a milkshake. There have been no CEL's and the last time I drove the car it ran perfect. The car has great power and no signs of any problem besides this.
So, great the car was a bit of a reach for me to begin with and now it has major engine problems. I know it "could be" the aos or oil cooler, but I'm assuming it's probably a cracked head.
Thoughts, input, complaints? I'm thinking I'll just relist it and try to sell it "as is".
Bit of a bummer, to say the least.
But before you shove the car over the cliff I'd advise you have the car checked out by a qualified shop that knows these cars inside and out.
I know it sounds too simple an explanation but someone could have just put oil in the coolant. We don't know the history of the car but maybe the woman before she became a widow her husband was just very sick and made a mistake.
Or a shop tech did this on purpose with the idea of maybe buying the car when it was brought back in after he diagnosed engine failure? A bit of a long shot, sure, but stranger things have happened.
Even if there is a true intermix problem, the fault can be with the AOS or the oil/water heat exchanger. It doesn't have to be a cracked head or something internal, deep and expensive to fix. The engine can be resurrected with no harm done and it doesn't require bushel baskets of money either.
Remember it is not what you don't know that hurts you it is what you know that isn't so that hurts you.
Get an accurate diagnosis of what is wrong and then you can make a better decision as to what to do.
Step 1 - Relax and get a drink. It's just a car
Step 2 - don't drive it anymore.
Step 3 - have it towed to a good mechanic. Your first priority at this point is finding a good one. If you don't have one, ask.
Just an aside. If it's a serious problem call the previous owner. There is a chance it just failed in 200 miles, but if the previous owner knew (or should have known) then you could negotiate.
drain the pan and see what it looks like in there... i had a heat exchanger go bad in my boxster causing oil in water but the pan stayed clean.
but i would fear the worse as its too coincidental for something like that to go bad right after you bought it. i guess its possibly but maybe more likely that the previous owner cleaned the intermix up and kept test rides to a minimum. did you get a fishy sense from the person or dealer that you bought it from?
I dealt with the widow and her son(25 or so). The son couldn't drive a stick. The car sat all summer and had a dead battery when I first looked at it 3 months ago. They bought a new battery so I could test drive it. The coolant was nice and clean when I test drove it. The oil was clean and full.
Sorry to hear your bad experience. If you plan to keep the car, it's best to get the coolant out and flush the system as soon as possible as the oil in the milkshake will attack all the coolant hoses.
hmmm, always tough buying from someone other than the primary driver/ owner/ care taker.
well, no sense going backwards. get it it checked out by a qualified mechanic and see what the deal is. shouldn't take an expert long to figure out the source and then you'll know what your options are. best of luck.
Normal suction is about 5" H2O and you need a manometer to measure it. If the suction is really high, it could be a ruptured AOS and that will be your best case scenario.
I heard the oil cooler is not known as a common failure point.
Yeah, the closest dealer is 2 hrs away. I'm just disgusted with it at the moment. I'm a fairly competent backyard mechanic, I'm going to see what I can find. Any helpful hints on where and what to look for is appreciated. I only gave 11 and change for it, so I got what I paid for.
Don't over-react at this point. The odds of a catastrophic failure within 200 miles of purchase are,well...minuscule. As said, have it towed to a sound 911 shop and start over with fluids etc. Have them pull the pan and look for baddies. It's way too early to pronounce it DOA at this point.
You may have simply "stirred the tank" on a previously failed AOS.
You are really racing into disaster scenarios...so slow way down. Don't work on the car yourself at this stage. You don't seem to know enough about them.
1. Find a Porsche mechanic nearer to you than 2 hours. Doesn't have to be a dealer but someone with references...and then call them to see they are real.
2. Low oil level. How did you measure it? After the car is fully warmed and the oil pressure is around 2 bars at idle? Or when the car was stone cold...or even less than fully warm? And was the car sitting on very level ground? You can get wildly varying readings depending on all the above. Did you confirm the dash read out of oil level with a look at the dip stick?
Change your oil and filter right now just because you should do that when you buy a used car under the conditions you describe.
3. Coolant milkshake. Here is where you need an educated Porsche mechanic who is very familar with 996s...not some guy who is living in the 356 era. Have the mechanic drain the coolant and look at all of it, not just what you saw when you removed the reservoir cap. Let this mechanic do the diagnostics, including lowering the pan. If possible be there when he does it so you can learn first hand what he finds.
Other thoughts. Milkshake isn't always milkshake. Sometimes people discover milkshake in their oil and over react to it. As I recall in a discussion here, when a car has not been driven in a while water can condense in the oil...and then when the car gets a good drive under it the moisture mixes with the oil and looks like what your are describing. The solution? Drive it some more and let the condensation evaporate from the engine heat.
Brake fluids should be replaced...a flush of the entire system.
When was your transmission fluid changed? Don't know? Do it now.
No CEL lights are showing. That is good news, it means that the Porsche sensors haven't spotted an eminent disaster.
Assume that something is wrong but it is not some fatal cancer. Find a local Porshe Club and if you don't know a mechanic, find one through them.
Do not think the worst. You just bought a used car...stuff happens. Take deep breaths.
Sorry about your experience, maintenance is the expensive part of ownership, the original price sounds for trouble, so going back to negotiate is too late. Ask yourself :
How bad do you want to own a Porsche? (You wait 25 years to buy one priced as a 2009 Corolla)
Are you willing to spend $5000 or more to bring it, to top shape condition?
Are you willing to allocate $2000 a year or less (after fixing the oil/coolant issue) for maintenance and incidentals?
If not, don't touch it and sell it "as is".
Sent from my iPhone using Rennlist
For 11k you can't be too upset. I would drain all the coolant out if the thing. Make sure it intermix. If it is a few people have fixed head cracks on here for a couple of grand by diying. Alternatively sell it as is. You might get 8 or 9 if your lucky.
At least your not 20 k into it and then have this issue.
Sorry to see you are going through this. Hang in there, I bet it's something easily remedied from the sound of it. For the price you could part it out worst case and make all your money back.
You could take it straight into a Porsche mechanic OR If you are a DIY guy, change all the fluids yourself and try again. Let it warm up outside in the drive and if you see steam in the exhaust, shut it down and take it to a Porsche garage for their opinion. If not, then take it out normally (checking regularly in the coolant reservoir) for over heating and unusual noises. I smell a rat at such a low price. I think the seller **** on you. They knew something was wrong. They could have changed the oil and let the car sit until you showed up. I hope I am wrong for your sake. Good luck.
Yeah, I'm fine with yearly running cost. Asking price on the car was 20. I talked her down with the logic of a sitting car will need some maint., no radio code, and kbb values. It's the potentially catastrophic engine damage in the 1st week of ownership that is dismaying. The car just kind of fell into my lap, I wasn't actively looking for a 911.
I live in a really rural area. I can't imagine there's a 996 specialist within an hr of me, but I'm going to look. I would guess in the last year I've seen maybe 3 P-cars locally.
Anyhow, I'm going to do a full drain of the coolant and oil today and see if the intermix is in both.
I appreciate all the input.
I would drain coolant & oil for now untill i find time to diy... If its One if the heads ( most likely), this is a 2k fix if you diy.. Did you check the coolant after you drove it? Maybe the dealer took off the intermixed coolant and out fresh coolant on too so that new buyers woukd see there is no problems with it..
The tank is full of milkshake. I test drove it for about 45 minutes before buying, because I was afraid of this exact problem. Everything was clean and fine. It's irritating...
Southern Ohio. Changed the oil and drained the coolant, I'm refilling with just water now. Going to flush that out, then refill with coolant. The oil looked uncontaminated, I let it set for 20 minutes and rechecked, still no separation.
I had Kraftwerks near columbus do some work for me. Single guy shop. He is very knowledgable and reasonable prices compared to a dealer, but still 2 hours away.
Milkshake is the oil cap is not what he is describing. Even air cooled 911's have that. Oil in the coolant is an
entirely different issue
....which is what the OP says he has.
[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:]
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlist.com-vbulletin/2000x1504/dscn1998_971a9e180441c876d44add5132744febb08cd30c.jpg
[Image-only post; no author-written text. Original image references:]
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlist.com-vbulletin/2000x1504/dscn2000_60ce01ff448594619c3d9254c152e96433da649e.jpg
Looks more like a Latte' than a milkshake...unfortunately both of them suck. Hopefully you caught it soon enough that there's little or no collateral damage, and you can give it a good clean out, repair or swap the head and get 'er back on the road. Good Luck
Agreed. Very similar to my experience in my 99. A waterpump impeller fragment caused a hotspot and even though my gauges did not report an overheat it was a cracked head.
It's not fatal as there are many more well known options to get you back on the road. As posted above do not let the car sit for a long time as the oil will eat the water hoses.
You can get her back !
I am dealing with a similar situation. Engine died 10days/300 miles after I bought it.
I decided to rebuild the engine. I am almost done now. On reflection it was a foolish decision.I should have sold it as a roller .
OTOH, it has been fascinating for an engineer to master the quirks of the M96.
The biggest problem is the lack of rebuild tech specs/instructions/advice.There is not 1 book on rebuilding the M96,not one ! That is why rebuilding/repairing an M96 is a task best left to experts(not me!).
The question I most often mutter when dealing with some weirdity of the M96 is :"Did Subaru do it like this in their H6 ?" or "Do flat 6 Subarus have this problem?" Given the similarity in the 2 engines and that Porsche(reputedly) designed the head/valve train for Fuji, it seems a valid question? No, the Subie does not have an IMS.
Good luck & let us know how it turns out for you?
That is a good plan. The pics are not pretty to look at. Could be a cracked head. But iIRC there are one or two seals/plugs in engine that separate the cooling system from the crankcase and these have been known to fail.
Frankly, given the amount of intermix I'm thinking it is one of these seals, plugs, and not a cracked head.
But it will take an experienced tech to make this call.
I've spent the weekend trying to flush the system of oil. In my attempt I seem to have messed up the thermostat housing. I now have a small leak there. Right now I'm just going to get it full of coolant and hope I can get it in for repairs at kraftwerks. On hindsight, I should have spent the money on cool parts for one of my other cars instead of this really pretty boat anchor.
Just flat bed the car to the shop. Do not try to get the engine full of coolant. Without the proper equipment you can't without running the engine and you do not want to run the engine at all.
And even with the proper equipment if there is a leak between the cooling system and the oiling system the equipment won't generate sufficient low pressure in the cooling system to effect a proper refill of the cooling system.
Just get the car on a flat bed and get the car to the shop.
Man, I Hope you can get out of this without it Really Biting you! BUT, you got this car REALLY Cheap & MOST Likely for a Reason! What's the Old sayin' IF it sounds too GOOD to be True, sounds like that's your case but Hopefully it's NOT! And in these cars, its NEVER as Simple to Fix the Issue as in Most cars! Don't even get me started on a slow blinking turn signal OR one of your Headlights is Dim OR, etc.... It's NEVER as Simple as just changing out a Bulb! jmo! GL!
Car is still at Kraftwerks. I haven't heard anything in a few weeks. I told Jeff there was no hurry, but I sure would like to have the car on these nice days.
Can you tell if the head was already cracked when you bought the car and the flaw was hidden? Either way, it's a bummer. At least it's fixable. Sound like you'll be good to go after, though. Good luck.
I visually checked the antifreeze before I bought and saw no signs of intermix. Who knows... I drove the car less than a week before seeing signs of a problem. I would imagine it was cracked when I bought it.
No I haven't spoken to the seller. The car was her late husbands, and it hadn't been driven since he passed. She was an amputee and unable to drive a stick shift. If she knew... then she got me. I don't think she did and I figure she's had her share of problems without adding my complaints.
Classy indeed! That should attract good Karma from now on!
I have a 2000 as well and you said you are doing some add-ons while at it.
Care to elaborate for a same MY brother: IMS, AOS, Oil Exchanger, ...?
It's getting an LN IMS bearing and spin on filter adapter, updated AOS and expansion tank/cap, and new rms, oil cooler, water pump, hoses, t-stat, valve springs, valve guides and lifters, etc......
Picked the car up today. Jeff at Kraftwerks did a super job. I drove the car home(150miles) and it didn't miss a beat. I had the car for such a short time before finding the problem that it's like getting a new car all over again.
