"Carrera Power Kit"

Porsche has been pitching these Tequipment kits in current print ads, but I can't find much info. Just curious about what it is, what the price might be. Didn't see anything via searching, but maybe I missed something. Thanks in advance!

X51 Engine...lots of cash for 25HP and a flatter torque curve though IMO. http://content2.us.porsche.com/prod/...ce_enhancement

real power kit

I'm a Boxster guy, but I thought the current power retrofit kit was for the 3.6 that started in 2002. Jeff

Supercharger.... nuke your motor with no warranty. The power kit is much more that just 25 hp. The X51 includes: Modified Cylinder Heads More Aggressive Cam Shafts GT3 Alum Intake Manifold Larger Diameter Headers Reprogrammed ECU Motorsports oil mod on valve cover Race oil pan (plate) with additional baffles Center Radiator (Third Unit) The powerkit is available for the 3.6l motors and brings the car up from 315/320 to 345 spec HP. If you drove one back to back with a 3.6 you might think otherwise. I figure the motor makes about 360 hp. They are definitely conservatively rated. Is all the power up high, yes. But there is so much power it is worth it if ou track the car. If you don't you'll probably never take advantage of it unless you find some open road and deviate a little from what is... publically acceptable. Look out for the local constabulatory and open it up... WOW

"Supercharger.... nuke your motor with no warranty." been hearing the same argument from those paying $18k for the TT 30 hp X50 power kit vs. 200 hp for the same dough. only problem with that argument is it hasn't been well supported by facts. btw, many of us are near the end of or out of warranty. "The X51 includes: Modified Cylinder Heads More Aggressive Cam Shafts GT3 Alum Intake Manifold Larger Diameter Headers Reprogrammed ECU Motorsports oil mod on valve cover Race oil pan (plate) with additional baffles Center Radiator (Third Unit)" the SC includes reprogramed ECU, center radiator, MUCH better (broader) power curve, and about 8 times the power of the X51 (for less dollars too).

oops, sorry ed but it looks like i've done it again, eh.

I agree with Ben. Of all the people on the 993 board who have supercharged their cars, there are no horror stories (some after several years of use now) and they generally rave about the improvement. The SoK kit especially seems to be very well designed

...I've never seen any performance data on power kit cars; 0-60 times, top end, passing times, etc ... any info out there?

PAG numbers from press release

X51 carrera 2, 0-60 = 4.8 secs. 0-124mph = 16.5 secs 50-75mph in FIFTH gear = 6.5 secs Nearly everone who has one thinks the power is more than 25bhp well worth the cash and it also comes in below 5000 rpm ......forget the torque curve it just ain't correct. Everyone who hasn't got one says it isn't worth the money and is basically crap Donny J

So, let me get this straight. Are you guys saying that it's all about numbers? Does reliability mean anything to anyone? Does anyone know why Porsche decided not to turbocharge the M96.01/02 engines and created the much more expensive M96.70 series?

At the end of the day the Carrera power kit is stock and usually installed at the factory and that makes the deciding factor for a lot of people. Espically for people who want to eventually sell their car or buy one. On the other hand Mercedes use the same engine weather it's NA or SC with very few modifications so it can't be that much of a black art.

It depends upon your confidence level. I have a 911 with the X51 package and both my wife and I love it. It seems like a lot more than 25 HP over the normal package. Driving this car back to back with my GT2 today, I really loved it...but I do prefer the GT2 suspension over the M030, it seems more comfortable. It's a great package unless you want that "raw" sports car feel (like I do) and then go for the GT3 (I will). I have no confidence in after market tuners. I wonder where they get their R&D to fully develop and test what they sell...and if it was that easy why didn't Porsche do it in the first place. I'm not saying the aftermarket tuners are no good, but the preponderance of horror stories in general makes we very wary. Who do you trust, and what are you comfortable losing? "You pays your money, and you takes your chances"

Do you know that for a fact? Any reputable manufacturer would go through the effort to modify most of the internals inside an engine before force feeding it. This usually include different valves, valve springs, valve guides, pistons, con rods, connecting pins and sometimes even a different crankshaft.

I know the AMG cars change a lot of parts but for the kompressor line of Mercedes like the SLK230 and C230 those are pretty much stock engines with a modified ECU. Dinan a BMW tuning company also supercharges their engines. They have an agreement with BMW to honour all cars still under warranty with DINAN modifications.

"They have an agreement with BMW to honour all cars still under warranty with DINAN modifications." no they don't. how it works is dinan covers you for failure related to work they've done while your BMW is still under warranty (since BMW will NOT honor warranty on any failures related to dinan). this common misconception often leds people to get hosed. for example, say you had a transmission problem related to dinan tranny ECU software. bmw will say it's dinan and dinan can say it's BMW. then you the customer are left having to litigate against both parties at a cost that will most likely well exceed your losses. ask me know i know :-( dinan has an "upgrade" package for the Z8 for which they cut up the frame (without the customer's knowledge). BMW recently found out and voided the warranty as relates anything structural!

The powerkit is 364 HP.... I was speaking to a Porsche salesman and he quoted the new anniversary carrera to be 364... I then asked him if there was any other additional mods than the powerkit.... he said no and told me that 25 HP for powerkit was very conservative... the number is 364 internally at PAG. that car must scream... Porsches are fast brand new.... but once the are broken in with 10-20,000 miles... they area A LOT faster... I''m wondering what the numbers on a well broken in 996 X51 are!!!

On the comments about OEM's using the same motor for forced induction... I have been looking into putting a supercharger on my Toyota Sequoia. TRD sells superchargers for most of the Toyota line. They strap on to the stock motor and each comes with a 12 month warranty, or the remainder of your factory warranty. If I strap one on my Sequoia, it adds 120hp (1.5x stock) and would carry the full 5 year/60K powertrain warranty (it's new)... Roy ps. I tell my wife I need it for towing

I stand corrected....When I had my 3 Series I wanted to do all the dinan upgrades...

364 bhp internally at PAG...Anyone know how this can be confirmed .... this x51 kit sure is quick? Donny J

It cannot be confirmed. It's all hearsay.

OK... looks like we need one on the dyno to confirm this! any takers? Peter

What's the point? Then, everyone is going to argue about converting wheel horsepower into crank horsepower. Porsche seems to always under rate their HP figures, but the Powerkit is approximately 25 HP more than the base. If the base is a little more than 320, then the Powerkit is a little more than 345. Besides, all engines do not measure the same power. So, one might be 354 or so while another may be 349 or whatever.

"Then, everyone is going to argue about converting wheel horsepower into crank horsepower." why does anyone need to argue. if you use the same dyno on a 3.4 or 3.6 (C2 or C4 depending on what the X51 is as well), can't you use the same powertrain loss % from 300 or 320 respectively? iow, is there any reason i can't use the same 17.3% drivetrain loss from my stock 3.4 to figure out the post dyno crank horsepower from RWHP on the same dyno?

The way I look at it is 4 years of factory warranty. Top bang for your buck in a 996 3.6. It does not come any better! How can you go wrong... added my powerkit after delivery and would recommend it anyone. Drive it and enjoy! Wonder what a SC'd X51 would be like???

"Wonder what a SC'd X51 would be like???" about 465 to 485 hp depending on the pulley used, and it would actually have power throughout the entire power curve.

Wonder how the actual horsepower figures for a run in car compare to a new engine...they must be higher as the performance is noticibly better? Donny J

IMO the Sequoia, Dinan, Mercedes kompressor data points are irrelevant. What we can all agree to is: - Forced induction adds stress to an engine - Porsche didn't use our engine in the TT - Porsche didn't use our engine in the GT3 Therefore, IMO, porsche doesn't see a reliable safety margin in our engines at GT3 or TT power levels. Simple as that. Or, another way of stating this is that significant F/I applied to our engine will lower the reliability/longevity below what Porsche deems acceptable. Whether or not the risk involved is acceptable to folks out there is their own business, but they shouldn't think it's without risk.

kinda hard to use that logic when realizing that there are TONS of people reliably putting 600+ (about the same 50% increase as an SC'd 996) hp on their TTs without any internal mods. unfortunately, 996 owners are often bigger pansies when it comes to mods (or they just buy the TT) so we don't know yet what the 996 motor can or can't take. also, porsche warrants these cars for 4 years and 50k miles. i can see where they might want to be much more conservative since they already have to replace numerous motors owing to RMS failures. that said, if you check the avg mileage on 996s, they're not usually driven near that (50k in 4 years) much. i think we all agree there is increased risk anytime you put 40% to 50% more power thru a stock engine. however, supercharging bone stock motors with no internal mods and achieving these kinds of gains is nothing new - maybe more so for p-cars though. there are a couple of vendors now making 996 SCs and hopefully we'll see how reliabilty is over time. yet, by the time some who are more annally challenged than others are convinced, the 996 will be so old it won't matter anyway.

Viken's earliest post on this thread seems to have been ignored. Since Porsche continues to get blasted for it's desrire to be profitable, why would they not have extracted another 100 hp from the standard engine by this simple mod? Clearly there must be a reason. As far as cost, we need to factor in resale benefits. The factory power kit will probably add to resale value. The supercharger will probably decrease value at resale. I know I'd be very reluctant to add supercharger-related problems to a used car aquisition. Regarding problems, the only supercharged 996 I've ever seen at the track was sidelined with peculiar engine vibrations. The owner had a relatively trouble-free year 1, but a problematic year 2. He thought the problem was in the supercharger. Ben is very enthusiastic about his modification. As someone who tends to put a lot of miles on a car, I'll be very curious about future experiences. Particularly service issues and how far you have to go to get problems resolved. Lastly, what is "annally challanged"? Does that apply to those who think that adding a supercharger to a 996 is a crap shoot? **** distress is more likely to be experienced at the first repair bill for this engine. That owner is going to feel like the passive recipient in an alternative lifestyle bar. AS

"The factory power kit will probably add to resale value." sorry, but the resale market values the X50 and X51 power kits appropriately - ie: $2 to $3k! "The supercharger will probably decrease value at resale." It may or it may increase it depending on who is the buyer. However, I buy and modify cars for me - not the next owner. "Regarding problems, the only supercharged 996 I've ever seen at the track was sidelined with peculiar engine vibrations. The owner had a relatively trouble-free year 1, but a problematic year 2. He thought the problem was in the supercharger." But he's not sure? Anyway, I've known of several 3.4 and 3.6 owners whose stock motors have had to be replaced. Does that mean all 3.4 and 3.6s are bad? "As someone who tends to put a lot of miles on a car, I'll be very curious about future experiences." A high mileage user might in fact have more to worry about. Then again, many of the more highly mileage 996 drivers probably do more "daily driving" then I do. IOW, pretty much all the miles driven in my car are "porsche" kind vs. the kind the daily driver often does. "Particularly service issues and how far you have to go to get problems resolved." Yep, it remains to be seen how much trouble I'll have and how they will be taken care of. "what is "annally challanged"?" Many are so uptight they'll pay the same price for 1/4 the performance just to have a "warranty". I've read many posts about people not wanting to change their airbox for fear their warranty would be void. Yes, there are some risks associated with after market parts. Yes, the manufacturer can claim your mod caused whatever fails in your car even if it wasn't responsible. Yes, it's possible the mod can actually cause that failure. The SC is probably not for those who want to keep their cars stock, are worried about warranty, and are concerned about resale. "**** distress is more likely to be experienced at the first repair bill for this engine. That owner is going to feel like the passive recipient in an alternative lifestyle bar." It's not the end of the world to have a motor replaced if that in fact does come to pass. Would it be fun and enjoyable? Of course not. But the SC 996 sure is fun and enjoyable.

I second that. Ben's car is just a blast to be in and to hear.

I chose X51 because I wanted the extra 25hp. In a few years, when my car is off warranty, I'll start doing engine mods. If i want to do the internals like the X51 kit would be, it'll cost me the same amount in several years. I figure I'm 25hp ahead on my mods, because if it didn't come from the factory, I would never do it. The down time the car would see, ripping out the engine, etc etc... would be extreme. I got X51 at the factory, that dosen't mean my car will be off the road, dosen't mean that I'll pay a ton in the future, and I have the guaranteed quality of Porsche original equipment. In several years when I add modifications to my 996, I'll spend the same amount, but the way I see it I've already got a leg up on everyone else of 25hp.