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YOUR RESEARCHDrove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
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car i saw
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I realized it was the car I saw on CL when I started looking at it.
Drove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
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they just swapped the front headlights for newer ones and did not change the amber corners.
Drove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
Replace i can go either way .1 or .2
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All of those are single row IMSB but once that is replaced I can go either way .1 or .2
Drove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
Replace later
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This can be swapped later but sometimes it's more convenient to have it up front.
Drove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
later build months
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Some 2000's have single row IMSB, probably the later build months.
Drove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
rack) rattling cat convertor
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It needed an oil leak addressed (spark plug tubes) loose steering (probably the rack) rattling cat convertor then lacked a few options I would like (full leather, litronics, heated seats, LSD).
Drove a 996 for the first time. What do you guys think of this car?
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Now remember, everyone thinks their 911 is the best ever (me included), but some claim an early build 996 has the performance gains of the watercooled engine and the improvement in handling/susp/ride over the previous 911's, while still having a totally analog ride (no egas, no traction control).
Today, I drove a 996 for the first time. I absolutely enjoyed the car. It is a 1999 Carrera 2 and it's silver with a six-speed. The car has about 76,xxx on it. It is a one-owner, local Chicago car that was purchased at the old Porsche dealer on Irving Park Road before they moved to Loeber in Lincolnwood.
The car is owned by an older guy and I came upon it from a tenant of mine who deals in some Porsches. He is selling it because he no longer drives it. It was on Craigslist for a little. I realized it was the car I saw on CL when I started looking at it.
It drives nicely. I like the feel and the simplicity and this is a car I definitely could drive every day. It is much more of a go-kart than my BMW 335 that I have. The question is, as always, is this the one? It needs some work - it could use a front and rear bumper re-spray, it has some curb rash, and I think one of the speakers is out - the radio didn't really sound the best and something felt like it was missing. Also would have to rip out the Parrot cell phone hook up, not really a fan of those.
The clutch was recently done, apparently, but there's a question as to whether the IMSB was upgraded. It runs good. I'd probably go ahead and sort out the IMSB to be on the safe side. All the gauges work good and all the switches and electrics seem to be fine. The engine bay was pretty clean. As for 76k mile cars I have definitely seen worse. This car could be pretty damn nice with a tiny bit of freshening. It isn't expensive, I can buy the car for lower mid teens which is probably what it's worth considering the half-dozen things I need to do. The interior is pretty straight; not much necessary there at all except maybe a new shifter and boot. It wasn't really beat on - just driven consistently it appears.
I'm not sure if this is the one or not, but it was certainly a decent first one to drive. I'm not a fan of just buying the first thing I see so I'd like to get in at least two more and take them for a spin.
Here's some photos of the car.
Its an early 99 996 with very few options. As far as whether this is the one I would get familiar with the car and decide what options you can live with and which ones you can not. If you are not sure about options just post questions. As far as the minor work you describe, they are all going to need some, so I would not worry about that.
Now, its probably just me, but I would have to make the headlights and tail lights match. This car has the newer headlights with the amber removed, but they lift the amber tail lights and corners. This is probably going to cost a few hundred to fix one way or the other.
Didn't catch that. I'm going to see if there's any explanation for that. Hope it isn't front-end damage.
As for options, I'm really basic. I'd like a moonroof/sunroof, and one thing that I won't give up on is that I really want a car with LSD - option 220 I think they call it. Heated seats would be nice too. I'm not worried about the work, just about learning what's a good car vs. a bad one and I haven't got that skill just yet with 996's.
Ya I like it. Price is right. Gives you lots of room for issues down the road. Good number of miles. Wasn't a garage queen but wasn't driven to death either. I wish mine had that 220 option. From what I understand it's rare.
I like the 99-00 because they have the cable throttle and the double row IMSB. Still worth changing - never know. Mine was replaced at 93k along with the clutch. I also have a 99. Mine wa in perfect cosmetic shape - needed literally nothing. Not even a detail or wax. All I did was clean and condition the leather but it was perfect. Mine also had the leather dash which I do like but could live without.
Stereo can be upgraded. Replace all the speaks with something like Infiniti reference series and get a single DIN deck with BT. Easy enough and you want those features anyway.
You hate to buy the first one, but it has potential.
Btw those headlights look same as mine seems like those are originals. All I did was swap the corners for clear. Headlights and tails look fine to me. My 03 M5 has Amber lights. They look just fine as far as I'm concerned.
Looks nice. IMSB is a must on a 15 year old car with only 76k miles, I would say you are in the higher risk category. Color combo is basic, but will make it easier to resell. If it were my car I wouldn't redo the curb rash, I would get rid of those nasty office chair caster wheels and pick up some replica OEM wheels from the era. What is the option LSD-220?
Porsche option 220 is the limited slip differential. Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned it if it is so rare. I had it on my 928 and it really is a sweet option. Maybe not something that I should even worry about in the 996 world, though...
There's a Mercedes Benz dealer in Los Angeles with a cab for just under $18k. Buying from dealers have some advantages. But if you like this car, and it looks very nice, give it a PPI and then get firm about a price. From what I have heard the early bearings only have a 1% failure rate, it is the second generation that have the big problem. The third generation...large single row...drop back to the 1% failure rate. I must say I am really enjoying my 996...and like you I enjoy the relative simplicity.
In the first pic the trunk lid and bumper cover and driver door seem to match each other but not the front fender or the rear fender.
Arctic silver is hard to match so this suggests those panels were painted.
Also, the headlights look pretty good for a 75K mile car.
Check radiator ducts and the condition of the A/C condensers. If either one or both are real fresh looking the car could have some accident reconditioning.
Not necessarily a deal killer but you want to make sure you are not paying no story money for a car with a story.
Get a PPI.
I see the same thing as Macster, and also the fender on the passenger side seems mis-matched. See photos 3 and 4.
There may be a simple explanation for the mis-match. It could conceivably even be differential fade, though I doubt it.
It would appear that accident repair was done NOT at a Porsche garage as there is an obvious difference in the passenger wing and the hood and passenger door shade. I had a small accident where the front and rear passenger side wings had to be sprayed to match. They are identical and the job was done at a PORSCHE garage. Simply ask about this repair work. Like a previous poster says. 'It should not be a deal breaker' but you need to know. If they mention the repair when you ask, then walk away saying they should have mentioned it before you asked. By trying to hide the fact the car had been in an accident WOULD become the deal breaker for me. I would be thinking, 'what else have they not disclosed about the car?' The only thing the car has going for it is moderate mileage and a double row IMSB and that's all.
If all you want is LSD go for it. I have the heated seats and my opinion is that they are worthless. Take a long time to heat up and don't get that warm. You won't miss them.
I doubt accident. they just swapped the front headlights for newer ones and did not change the amber corners. That's about $80 to do. Or you can go full retro and get the amber bottomed headlights and switch back. You could sell the clear headlights and get the older ones and come out ahead.
And I would look at it in person in good light. I have an artic silver car and depending on angles and reflection the panels can look like different colors.
Also check the visor mirrors and the light in the frunk. the cost a few hundred to fix each and are bad and most of the cars I looked at.
The car had the front paint, I'm agree with the previous observations, you can see the difference of colors from the frunk, the right front panel, front bumper compare to the rest of the car, also it looks like the rear bumper has been respray previously, like others say is not a deal breaker.
But for the price I doubt you can get a Porsche in such a better shape, the interior looks well maintained, it's a one owner vehicle with all the records, the car is running as it is, black interior with silver, which is a beautiful combination plus selling it in the low teens, excellent for a 15 year old car.
Now regardless the radio, that was the least of the worries for Porsche engineers, if the radio is important to you and would like to upgrade i think a Honda Civic is the car for you or a bimmer like this.
Come over and look at my car and drive it. As others had mentioned, I would get something closer to a highly optioned car.
My car does not have LSD and I do not even know that I don't have it.
I'm not in the market for a Honda and I already own a BMW.
The car has clearly had paint work. There's peach fuzz on the front bumper and one of the fenders.
I've decided the car just isn't clean enough for me. I'm going to keep looking and start with cars that are $25,000. This just ain't the one even at a cheap price.
Remember to check it out on CarFax and plan on getting an independent PPI. From the photos it looks like the front end was damaged (wreck) and not only re-painted, but the panels look to be ill fitted. There is too much gap around the hood and front bumper (as was pointed out by others). At around 76K, there are many things that will need to be replaced...brake pads, water pump, thermostat, serpentine belt, AOS, plugs and maybe coil packs. Budget for those items as well as preventative maintenance items, all fluids and filters.
Regarding the LSD -I really miss not having one when driving a front engine rear drive car like a 335i or 550i and that is part of what makes the M5 and M3 worth it for me in comparison.
But on this 996 I don't have it and doesn't seem to matter. I have not taken it to the track yet, but I have done some spirited driving on the street and even on slow corner exit the car tracks beautifully. So not sure I would call this a must have. It's a nice to have option for sure.
+996
Plus for me it's missing the 18" wheels and 3 spoke steering wheel. This can be swapped later but sometimes it's more convenient to have it up front.
On the other side, the car is only 76k miles, black interior(harder to find), local, lower teens which may be a positive for someone like you.
I am passing on a similar low option '99. The bug almost bit me though! It just had too much deferred maintenance for the price. It needed an oil leak addressed (spark plug tubes) loose steering (probably the rack) rattling cat convertor then lacked a few options I would like (full leather, litronics, heated seats, LSD).
No shame in passing the first one and doing some more shopping. I am doing the same thing...
The 17 wheels are a plus for me as I would fit them with snows. 18's are easy to come by for summer. The more sidewall the better for winter potholes!
The maintenance is the key if you want more funds for mods instead of pm/or repairs.
In the 5 years I've owned my car, my mods have gone over the 5 digit range where as my repairs have stayed in the 3 digit range as all the major maintenance had already been done by PO.
I tried working some of the repairs in in conjunction with a price reduction. It has been a week now since I last heard from the salesman. It appears they will continue to look for a sucker to bite on it. I liked the "you pay for some, I'll pay for some" plan but in the end, it is probably best to let that one get away.
I found one today online, 80k miles, new clutch but they left the IMSB in. That to me is freaking insane. Who buys a car like that? Who tries to sell that with a straight face? "Well, I cheaped out on a $700 fix that eliminates one of the main modes of expensive engine failure so you can go back and spend $2-3k replacing it like I should have while I was in there..." CRAZY!
I don't think the Carrera 4's can have the LSD. They use the PSM. Gotta love the abbreviations.
Anyway. I have read some people say the car you are looking at is the greatest 911 ever. Now remember, everyone thinks their 911 is the best ever (me included), but some claim an early build 996 has the performance gains of the watercooled engine and the improvement in handling/susp/ride over the previous 911's, while still having a totally analog ride (no egas, no traction control).
Which is great if you want a race car... The 996.2 seems to have some nice upgrades I wouldn't mind having. All of those are single row IMSB but once that is replaced I can go either way .1 or .2
I like the 5 spoke C sport wheels over any of the twist versions, I like the glovebox, I like the torque of the 3.6, I like no pumpkins...
Both versions are great cars as near as I can tell, neither nearly as primitive as the AC cars.
That's a classic example of lease-spec 996. Silver over black, few options. Even if that one was ordered by a customer and wasn't a lease car, arctic silver 996's, like arctic silver Boxsters, are fairly common. Glad you decided to keep looking.
^^^ That explains it. It's definitely just not quite the one yet. I've gotta see Paul's car and I've just gotta find a tad bit of a later model.
I'm going to look in a different price category too.. Little higher!!
So true. Called a place yesterday for a 2002 996 that had 72K miles on it. It was listed for $26,998. Nothing special about it except it was red w Black Interior and one owner car. However - no service records. I pushed him on it was overpriced approaching other cars that are newer and 996's are not appreciating in value. Based on recommendation from another Rennlister's advice - Matt - I offered $22 - 23K as it was way overpriced (keep in mind it has been sitting there for months). He acted appalled and said he maybe could come of a few hundred dollars. I am sure he will sell it to someone that does not do their homework. Very fortunate to have found Rennlist.
[QUOTE=c4racer;11882193]Ya I like it. Price is right. Gives you lots of room for issues down the road. Good number of miles. Wasn't a garage queen but wasn't driven to death either. I wish mine had that 220 option. From what I understand it's rare.
I like the 99-00 because they have the cable throttle and the double row IMSB.
Still worth changing - never know. Mine was replaced at 93k along with the clutch. I also have a 99. Mine wa in perfect cosmetic shape - needed literally nothing. Not even a detail or wax. All I did was clean and condition the leather but it was perfect. Mine also had the leather dash which I do like but could live without.
Wrong! Only 98-99 C2 has direct cable throttle control. All C4 are drive by wire. Some 2000's have single row IMSB, probably the later build months.
it's not like everybody in the general population of 996 owners knows about this issue. When I was looking at cars the vast majority did not have a LN bearing and many had newer clutches. Several cars had replacement motors, but that did not seem like a very good option since those had the sealed bearing - I would rather have the option to replace bearings over time, I figure they are just a wear item.
They admitted to checking the seal and knew it was a dual row bearing. I am quite sure they knew exactly what the issue was and passed on its replacement. I found that a bizarre choice...
Yes and no, I bought mine and later enter to the rennlist community, based on all the issues from some owners regarding depreciation, cost of maintenance, IMS failure, lack of power and so on I would have to either save more for a 997.2 S or buy me a new Subaru BRZ.
I found the forum entertaining, helpful and also I've been learning a lot about my car, thanks to the knowleadgeable rennlisters, When I bought it, I did it because that was always my dream as a kid to own a 911, if I was thinking more about long term maintenance, gas, reliability, value the numbers on the BRZ will make perfect sense and also I didn't want to be in my 40's and be told I did it because midlife crisis
sometimes you have to do what you like and enjoy!!!!
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I think it (220) is a '99 only option. The telltale is T/C Off where the later cars have PSM Off. Top button, left side of center stack. I am pretty sure PSM brakes the side spinning more quickly to provide that pseudo LSD function.
I haven't seen any complaints among those using the cars for DE. Probably unnecessary unless you are racing the car. That is what I have been telling myself anyway. I didn't find an obvious need for it on a couple spirited tests drives.
Im in the NW suburbs of chicago and have an 02 cab with about 30k miles on it if you want to check it out and see the differences between a mk I and MkII car in person.
My car has very few options; i wanted it that way.
Ron
I like the car the way it is. You can always upgrade somethings and have it your way as most of this group does. The only thing that I would change is those 17" twists, they just look to 986ish (I love the 986) and the 18" or 19" wheels will look better IMHO
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