2W or 4W in So CA?

I live in So California. I haven't been to the snow country in over 10yrs. However, that isn't to say I won't be heading back for some skiing in the future. Have been pondering the value of 4W and the cost difference, verse 2W for southwest driving. Also what those of you do with 2W when you head to snow country regarding chains? Any input would be greatly appreciated...

It's not really 4WD...its AWD (all wheel drive)....and it's not really meant for better traction in inclement weather (although it is serendipitous). AWD provides a performance benefit that allows you to get better traction and apply more throttle while in a turn without oversteering. Other people may be able to describe the benefits better than I could but an AWD Porsche is not a 4X4.

If you want to do the driving 2WD If you want the car to do the driving AWD Obviously a simplification, but you get the idea.

Titan, I personally believe you don't need the AWD in SoCal as it rarely rains (watch.... we're probably going to have another El Nino this winter....). As for snow conditions..... I take my other car.

Hey Titan...I'd go with the 2wd. It's lighter, faster and drives more (but not the same) as an older Pcar. More fun, I think!

The C4 will have more grip for most situations and has been said previously, will be easier to drive. I personally like the way the C4 feels.

The key is to ... just buy one!

A C4 with PSM is virtually idiot proof. Your chances of wrecking are much smaller because as you start to loose control, the car "takes over" and corrects everything but the steering; and it does it better and easier with a C4 than a C2. That said if you want to track your car, the C4 will allow you to apply throttle earlier than a C2, giving you a higher exit speed. Faster out of turns, harder to loose control, superior car. If on the other hand you are looking for a car you can drive sideways, and enjoy that sort of thing then a C2 is definetly for you. Also keep in mind that the really good drivers prefer the 2WD handling, hence the GT2 and GT3 are 2WD cars, while the Turbo, made more for the average driver is AWD.

My choice is obvious. I bought one!! As stated before, the AWD is not for inclement weather. The AWD is for better performance. The clearance of the 911 is too low anyway for any meaningfull use in snow. I garage mine for the winter to avoid the car-eating saline slush. Buy either the C2 or the C4 depending on how you like the car, not for potential use in inclement weather. Here in the US, you can only get the C4S coupe. There is a multitude of performance advantages in getting the C4S over the C2, IMHO, thats why I bought one. I am not going to start another C2 vs C4s debate. Suffice it to say that either car will be a great car to drive in good weather, but neither car can be an SUV in bad weather.

Having owned both 2WD and now 4WD I would agree that one's confidence in things not getting pair shaped is far more in the 4WD vehicle (electronic inputs and all). All depends on how you want to use your car. If your road driving is going to include cornering speeds that require a driving skill level that will separate your ability to appreciate 2WD from 4, then you are obviously carrying some velocities. If you've got roads conducive to that, or you're going to get it on the track, then I can certainly appreciate those who get more fun from developing the skills to balance the inputs and outputs of 2WD.

The performance difference is so close btwn a C2 and a C4 that its pretty much the driver that will make the difference. So it really depends on your driving style, if you like the feel of hanging the tail out around a turn, go for the C2, otherwise, if you can afford it (cost wise) go for the C4 cause you could use it snow if need be, and it might help get you out of a hairy situation someday...as Palting put it "My choice is obvious..." P.S. - DonW...isn't Misty a C4???

Duuuuuuuuude....! in SoCal you'll never need the AWD, if it's traction in inclement weather you're worried about if you're worried about ski trips, buy a Cayenne, you will probably be able to fit your equipment in there as well.

Consider this: you're not seriously thinking about taking that beauty up to Mammoth or similar places in the winter are you? Forget about the difference between 2WD and AWD. They use cinders on the roads for traction in snowy conditions. Think of how you'll get sandblasted by the car in front of you kicking out a cinder stream.

All wheel will get you past chain alert, but it would be unsafe without snow tires. The performance tires put more rubber on the road with narrow spaces between tire blocks for heat dissapation. The spaces are to narrow for snow & they clog and aren't wide enough to clear on the rotation. As a result the entire tire is on the surface, thereby reducing psi (pounds per sq inch) and and making the car lighter to the surface pressure. A dangerous condition. follow these posts, they're good advice......

Thanks for the thoughts. I am a driver type person I guess that's why I am waiting for my C2. I was hoping to hear from those that drive their C2/C4 in the snow, oh well. Sorry to those that took my typo mistake literally (4W verses AW) although, AW=4W to me (as is my Escalade) without low range. I also buy nothing that I can't drive in all conditions for fear. Looks like I'll need a set of snow tires I also can't afford a new P C2/C4 and a Cayenne because my wife wants a new VW turbo S. Go figure :lol:

I know it sounds unsavory to say Dmitri...but the answer is yes! I expect to drive it in up to Mammoth or the like with ski's on the rack at some point.

If you're a fair weather Skiier you can take your C2, I've taken a BMW Moto (althought it got dicey on the Norcal snow packed ski area entry roads). But Dmitri is right , the roads are sanded, C2 is low, you're going fast - get a bra......

TitanL, As previously mentioned, the C4 will be great in the snow with the proper tires. There are several posts on here that talk about which snow tires are best,etc, and there are several of us Northeastern wackos that take their Pcars skiing...no problem at all....but if you have a 'sclade': "AW=4W to me (as is my Escalade) " then why would you use the porsche to go skiing?

Having a C4 does not make you a non-"driver type person" in normal driving only 5% of the power is directed to the front wheels. But should you need it (and only then) up to 40% is available to the front wheels. I believe that makes it a better car.

No regrets, but of course the 2003 c2 stands head and shoulders above the 1999 3.4 C4! I must admit that the the PSM in the C4 kept me outta trouble many times, mostly due to knuckle-headed indecisions in the rain. Luckily it does rain enuff here in the Bay Area during the winter to truly enjoy and appreciate the C4's prowess. On sunny days, nothing beats a C2 if you just wanna have fun..... My .02 cents

The 02 Escalade AW... which costs me $700 a month... The hitch in my giddy-up is I can't afford to keep the Escalade and a new PC2 and a new VW turbo S for my wife... along with the large home we close on next week on a Par5 green. For CA living standards I figure I have it pretty good as it is. So something has to go, I figure it's the Escalade :lol: Furthermore, neither of us drives all that much. We're 2 miles from my wifes practice, we use my auto on the weekends, and although my company is based 60miles away, I seldom go in due to my fancy home office... Some weeks my Escalade sets in the garage for days. Know anybody that wants a great 02 Escalade with very low miles?

Titan, if your monster truck is on a lease, try www.tradealease.com david

Alright already. If I read one more statement about a C2 as a driver's car and the C4 as a safe-in-the-rain-car, I'm gonna pop a blood vessel. Anyway, my tummy is full of lobster and my head is awash in vino, so here goes. Oh, here's a smilie to start with in case any one takes offense . The C2 is faster from a standstill on a straight line, but the C4S is faster on a road course. Proven in Nurburgring. So, the C2 is a better dragster, but if you want to drive, the C4S is a better and faster driver's car. Part of the reason the C4S is a better car on a road course are it's stupendous brakes, which was designed to stop a rampaging more powerful and heavier 420 HP TT. Add the better balance at the corners due to its wider stance and stiffer if not lower suspension, higher traction due to it's larger tires and wheels, and top it off with the AWD which will pull you around corners making for later braking and earlier WOT. Now that makes the C4S a driver's car. In the wet AND in the dry. Here's some more vino . Here's a pic where I passed a C2 and a track dedicated mini. Here's a side shot blasting down a curvy back "straight". Does this not look like a "drivers car"? You wan't that back end sliding out? Here's one with the right rear wheel up in the air with the car rotating towards the apex, moments before WOT plants ALL the giant wheels down and rockets that car out of the exit towards the straight. You want a driver's car? Get the C4S. Given equal drivers, ther C4S will beat the C2 all day long. The C2 ain't that bad, though.

In defense of the C4S, it is very much a driver's car, make no mistake. It would be an extreme exaggeration to suggest that the C4S drives "for you". It does not. Awesome car in terms of outright performance. The CHP has to be asleep to let you through chain control in something like a C4(S) without winter tires (Blizzaks, Alpins, etc, not silly SUV-ish M+S/All-season/Do-nothing-really-well OEM's). I've lived in Tahoe much of my life, and believe me, the CHP has a hard-on (can I say that here?) for presumed "cheaters", i.e. C4 drivers. You'd better have the right stuff. Anyway, all the AWD/4WD/PSM on the planet is not going to defy the laws of physics, particularly when confronted with the way that you'll be tempted to drive on snow/ice in your light little 911. While I prefer C2's, I'd want the extra weight of the C4 over my front tires for winter driving, even if the front wheels weren't pulling. But AWD and PSM aren't even in the same vicinity as important as a set of real snow/ice tires for winter driving. Are you prepared to swap wheels every time you go skiing so you can take your P-car out for a good trashing? Pick the P-car you want, leave it in the garage, and take the Escalade. It's a truck, you'll be able to live with winter tires all winter long for ski trips. My Bridgestone Winter Duelers (Blizzaks for trucks) work great on my Tundra, aren't too objectionable for noise and ride. Just a thought, don't know about fitments for your Caddy. Don't waste your time with OEM crap. -DT

BTW, all those shots were with PSM off. The AWD doesn't do the driving. I drive the AWD to get the best out of them.

Have some more wine, Palting! Here I was posting a reply at the same time with, among other tidbits, a defense of the C4S against comments made by some who evidently haven't driven one, only to find you bashing C2's! We've heard all this before. Yes, your C4S has rigid suspension, vs option on C2. Yes, it has rear tires that are 1cm wider (wow) to fill out the big fenders. Yes, it has bigger brakes that help haul down the 100+kilos add'l weight. Yes, it costs more than a C2 without lthr, 030, PSM, etc (duh). Yes, it grips better than a C2. No, it's not a Turbo, it just looks like one. Save the "C4 is the real driver's car, C2's get beat by Mini's" rhetoric for those who doesn't know the real difference. -DT

Palting, thanks for putting it so eloquently. A picture is worth a thousand words. And here is a smilie to boot

Heh-heh-heh. I knew I'd upset somebody. Alright, DT, I edited out the mini barb. Although true in the above instance, it was more due to the souped up nature of the mini as well as driver diference. It is not my intent to bash the C2, just to put out the facts. It's in response to the urban legend that the C4S is "heavier therefore slower", or statements that the C4S is not a driver's car since it is safer, has PSM has AWD, etc, etc, etc. Those who know and have driven both cars and know the Nurburgring lap times can attest to the statements I've made in the prior post. C2 and C4S are both drivers's cars to be sure. The C4S I just believe to be more so. Thanks for the smilie Leon. A toast

A topic that will keep us entertained for a lifetime, no doubt! Don't confuse "fact" with "opinion", though. Too much of that here already. Those same people I know who "know" will take on a C4S with a similarly-equipped C2 any day on a road course. That means 030, C18's, 3.6 liters. And it's also just their opinion (they don't race cars for a living). I really like the C4S on its own merit. It's just that I can't stomach Porsche's marketing strategy of making a $90K fake Turbo complete with fake vents and wide fenders with vacant cavities. This platform was designed for 400+HP. I have no doubt that your interests are purely about performance, but you have to admit that this may not be the case for the average buyer. Bottom line, it looks awesome, it looks just like a Turbo. A C4 with bigger brakes, 030, and more standard options would be the same car as a C4S from a performance perspective. How many of those do you think Porsche would sell? C4S money will build a C2 with even more options, and it doesn't pretend to be anything else. Just my opinion. I don't need to find anyone else to try to substantiate it. I'll leave the "fact" part to professional drivers who race GT3's and GT2's. No AWD's in that bunch. That's the formula, that's the sport. But a Turbo would be awesome, and I wouldn't kick a C4S out of my garage. -DT

Ok, lets clear two things first: you can't compare a C2's handling/performance to a C4S because its has several other changes to it other than the AWD which come into play too like the wider track and tires, standard sport suspension, turbo brakes and 200lbs added weight. So to be fair compare the C2 vs C4 which is a C2 with AWD and no more (C4 is not imported by PCA but its sold in RoW). And second, a thing that hinders handling perfromance and pleasure on the C4 and puts a lot of people off is the understeering of the C4 but don't comfuse that with AWD, its from its suspension set up and was dialed in by Porsche I guess to make it safer, slip on the inexpensive idespensable essential RowM030 (not US M030) and the undesteering is completely gone and will handle like a true Porsche should handle (that goes for C2's too) Now Porsche's AWD is NOT a permanent 4x4 like the one on your SUV or Audi's Torsen differentials, its a viscous-coupling differntial, that only gives you AWD capabilities when you NEED them, otherwise normally behaves like a RWD (with RoWM030's). The question is, are you willing to give up the MARGINAL performance loss of the AWD? (only noticeable when at the limit & when you are in perferct road driving conditions) in exchage of the added benefits of Porsche's AWD system in the streets? wether its slippery road surfaces, a mistake when cornering hard, other driver's mistake next to you on the road, gravel in a roundabout or simply the added safety margin you have when exploiting the 996's limits track or street. "If you want the car to do the drivin for you get a AWD..." now thats an ignorant statement, I don't mean that in a disrespectful way, obviously either they never driven the AWD (w/ RoWM030) or are clueless about the different AWD/4x4 systems and their handling characteristics, how about also "If you don't want your car to do the braking don't get ABS!" "If you don't want your car to do the steering don't get powersteering!" These type statementes sometimes comes from C2 drivers that have the stock suspensions on!! now thats a serious needless performance/handling handicap! much greater than the one you would get from AWD (by a profesional driver in the perfect conditions of a track)... unbelievable

Excellent points, Carlos. You have to compare apples-to-apples, i.e. cars with similar suspension. Us yanks are indeed handicapped by lack of RoW, whether it be a C2 or C4(S). Nonetheless, our 030 is still a bargain, and much better than stock. Another point that you didn't mention is that PSM, when added to a C2, provides the "safety net" for situations you describe above. Standard on the C4S, it is the best traction control system I've used - very inobtrusive. Turn it off, however, and that familiar 911 feeling is back. -DT

I've seen C4's perform better than my C2 on the track. In the tight turns, its difficult for an average driver like me to beat the advantages of the AWD system. They (AWD) can power through those turns where I had to be very careful with the throttle to prevent oversteer. Some people say that hanging the rear end out is more fun, but I've driven AWD cars and I believe it feels more fun to floor it through a turn and feel the car grip like mad because it has AWD. Don't tell my wife, but I'd like my next car to have AWD.

I live in West LA, and my 993TT is never driven in anything other than clear warm weather. I like the AWD, as the car does seem to handle better. I've had it on the track (DE at Willow Springs) and it felt great having the front end help pull around the turns. I'm strictly a novice track driver, but I can sure feel the difference, whether driving on the track or just agressive cornering on the street. I used to think owning an AWD car in Southern California was silly (assuming no use in snow or off road), but in the last three years, in addition to the 993TT I've bought an A6 Quattro, and A4 Quattro, and a Lexus RX300 AWD. Now I'm sold on AWD, even if the cars never see snow or off road use.

Palting you really aren't being fair with your comparison. That is the same as saying that the M3 CSL is faster/better track car than the GT3. The M3 CSL, with slicks beat the GT3 with Z rated tires on the TRACK. OH WOW. That result means nothing until you re-test with the GT3 with slicks on. Likewise, the tests with the C2 on the ring were done without the M030 suspension. The C4S already comes equipped with a sports suspension. In order to do a fair comparison one would need to equip the C2 with the M030, 18" wheels, etc. That would make the comparison apples and apples, not apples and oranges. Additionally the C4S wasn't that much faster than a non-sports suspension C2. One would have to wonder whether the C2 with sports suspension isn't actually faster? The minor track size difference of the two cars (C2 with 18's) isn't going to create a whole ton of time. The uprated brakes on the C4S are needed to overcome its greater weight, and probably only have minimal carry over benefit. They are both great cars, but I honestly can't see how anyone can explain that a heavier car with more body weight, more panels, etc. with the EXACT same engine is truly going to perform better. It boils down to AWD versus RWD, and that issue is for someone else to take up as I've had and liked both.

The rear weight bias in the 911 screams for AWD. After losing the back end in my old 911 a few times I swore my next one would be a C4. There nothing like powering through a corner and felling like your on rails. It can actually inspire too much confidence, w/ the S03s on the roads near my house I've had PSM save me a few times here lately.

I have to agree with you that a C2 with sport suspensions is going to be faster than the 200lbs heavier C4S with the same engine around the ring, but you are not being fair in your comparison either since you are comparing them driven by profesional drivers under the optimal conditions of the track. The comparison should be between a C2 and a C4S driven by regular driver (the poster of the thread) in southern california streets. Is he going to be able to exploit the C2 in the southern califronia streets to such point that he will get a noticeable performance increase over the C4S? most likely not, and most probably the other way around in almost all circumstances, the advantages of AWD will allow a regular driver to be faster AND SAFER (dry or wet) in souther california streets. Of course if you were in Europe you could get the best of both worlds, for the price of a C4S you can buy a C4 (100lbs lighter than the C4S) with X-51 powerkit and sportsuspensions, that would be much faster than the C4S and still have AWD unlike the C2 BTW Adam, were did you get the M3CSL track lap times? What that at nurburgring? I been wanting to know those for a while and can't find them. Last news I had is that they couldn't beat the 8min mark they promised at the ring (GT3's is 7:54 now)...maybe thats why they now put on slicks

Sober now. It looks like Carlos beat me to the retort I wanted to give about the fairness of the comparison that I made. And he did so better than I could have. Lets go back to the original question: Thiere was also the question regarding occasional use driving up to the skiing mountains. There is an advantage of the AWD over 2WD in slippery surfaces. However, the consensus, as I read it from the posts, is that this is not the cost effective advantage or reason for getting the C4S over the C2. You should either not use either car and keep the SUV for use in snow, or use either car with caution, chains, and snow tires and be prepared to have the car trashed. Does the question then go back to simply which car to get for SW Cal? If so, my previous comparisons and statements will hold. Stock car vs stock car, equivalent drivers, the C4S will beat the C2 all day long on a road course. You say they are not equivalent cars. Ok, then. Would you recommend that Titan buy the C2, order the car with the optional 18" wheels or get aftermarket wheels with the proper offsets and spacers that will allow him to get tires that are eqivalent to the C4S's tires, then get aftermarket ROW 030 for reasons mentioned by Carlos, then get aftermarket TT/C4S or Brembro brakes, ? Or, would you recommend that he simply get the C4S and be ready to rock and roll right out of the box? The appropriate recommendation is pretty obvious to me. How about a third option? The GT3. True, there is no PSM, no AWD, and I don't even know if it comes with AC or radio. But, performancewise, it gets eveything else that the C4S already has, and a significant amount more. So much so that it beats the TT and performs closer to the GT2 level. Don't get me wrong. I love the performance of the C4S, but I am still somewhat peeved that the GT3 was NEVER available here in the US, then all of a sudden was available 1 (one) year after I got the C4S.

I personally think the C2 with the optional 18" wheels (285 width), standard offset, and US M030 suspension with a skilled and knowledgable track driver in non-slippery conditions will still beat the C4S with a comparably skilled driver. Now back in the real world, exactly what real life conditions is he going to get into in good weather, in which the AWD feature is truly going to make a difference? The only situation I can think of is in saving his *** in a dangerous swerving situation. As long as it isn't raining outside, there is no close to U.S. legal driving in which one will need AWD to help him or her out on the street. On the street AWD serves two purposes, bad condition driving becomes much easier (though I have to wonder how much with the Porsche AWD system and with the tires the vehicle is equipped with) and in accident avoidance maneuvers (PSM is a great help for the RWD car though). On the other hand move over to the track and I agree with you that short of an excellent driver, the C4S will probably be coming in ahead of the C2 with your average amateur weekend racer. The AWD vehicle will be easier to drive faster, but I think it's also easier to push an AWD vehicle beyond its limit/your limit without realizing it and thus have a problem. Finally, on the other hand I still believe that with both cars driver by a professional driver the C2 (18" wheel option/M030 option [US or ROW]) would beat the C4S.

Even a C4S Vs C2+ROW M030+18"+ Offset spacers+TT brakes is not a fair comparison either... Since we're modifying the C2 that much, why not add 200lbs weightlifting plates under the seats as well... Then it would be equivalent to a C4. But all this is silly. The question was should he get a C2 or C4. and a synopsis of all that was said seems to be (I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong): Unless you are a very highly skilled driver who would spend time and money to modify his car, and track it regularly, you are better off (ie you will be faster and safer) in a C4 (S or Cab debate is an other topic)

Actually the 18" Carrera wheels are lighter than the 17" wheels I heard, and the M030 suspension should be neglibably different weight. Therefore, I'm not sure where you feel that all this weight is added. Also C4C_Leon, not once did I even suggest adding ONE aftermarket option. I wouldn't add TT brakes as there is no need in the lighter C2, nor would I add wheel offsets. Therefore, I don't see where you get this crazy weight gain from. Either way I'm done with this topic. Personally, I'd say drive both cars, get the one you enjoy more. Rain or shine, you'll be happier if you own the vehicle that makes you the happiest from destination to destination.

You know guys, if we really stop think about it, you come to realize that the differences are there but they are not that big between them if you step back and compare to other cars, so really you can't go wrong with either...

Think the AWD and it's ability to carve out a corner would make a difference? At this point. it doesn't really matter. They are both great cars, and there are really no "equivalent" drivers. Even the same driver can do better or worse in one lap compared to another. That's why we have DE's and race tracks. Its a non-competitive venue, its a blast, and we can all have fun. So, Titan, go get your Porsche, and one of these days we will have a blast together at Laguna Seca. Better than skiing the mountains (Uh-oh, I think I started another war ).Maybe we will met Dirk and AdamB there. BTW, I just won our local autocross series and won me a set of tires

I wish I could be there! Gonna miss the historics/pebble again this year. I'd love to hammer around laguna seca with you and your C4S. That's kind of my old stomping grounds (pun intended) - worked in silicon valley, went to driving school (BB) at sears point or whatever it's called these days in mid-80's, did the bay area autocross scene on weekends w/ my Datsun 2000, then my RX7 (that's what it is, it's mazda raceway or something), blah blah blah. P.S. Grew up in Tahoe, skiing 5x/week since I was about 4' tall, raced in HS, instructor for 4-1/2 years...maybe I'll meet you there sometime (<> <>)! Cheers, -DT

Although all these comments have validity they really don't mean a thing. It's a personal preference..... He needs to drive both and then decide for himself.

That's true, Lance, but that takes all the fun out of it. I like seeing palting get all worked up! (Damn I crack myself up) -DT

Heh-heh, you should have seen me frothing at the mouth when you complained about my C2 crack with the mini-cooper, Dirk . Now, that crack was funny.

For your purposes, get the 4.

I'll show you a crack, palting! (Incidentally, congrats on the series win - that's got to be a competitive class. Man I sure could've used free tires back then - was broke as hell!) -DT

ROFLMAO!!!

Thanks guys... This sure is an interesting debate, C2 V C4S. It's fun and informative reading the diverse view points. However, correct me if I am wrong, all it appears to be is which model is better with a professional driver at the wheel in extreme or race situations. Correct me if I am wrong, but the C4S is a loaded version of the C2 with minor structural differences. AW or PCM isn't found on the majority of race cars and I see a 12-15k basic difference in sticker. Again, what is the "VALUE" that lies in the 12k-15k difference? Will I ever put either to the real test...NO. Even if I drive it on the track for a day, I will not push either to their limits. Will I take a hair pin at 70-80mph, yes, regularly. Will I drive it over 120 mph, guaranteed. Will I push either to their limits on rain or snowy roads....absoluting not, yet I will always test my driving skills and enjoy a fish tail every now and then to get the blood flowing! :lol: This discussion has reminded me that the most important apect of driving any vehicle is my skill. Although I am not a professional, I am focued when I am behind the wheel and love every minute of it. It doesn't matter what vehicle I am driving. I look forward every moment driving, and I am predisposed to reacting at speed, under all conditions and without AW or PCM. That said, C2 with 18" wheels, my ability to manage adeneline and my driving skill.

"12k-15k difference?" Thats what AWD, turbo looks, turbo brakes and sportsupension with wider tires cost you if you want it. The C4S is a good deal pricewise if the extras that incorporates as standard is what you are looking for. If you are looking for shier performance then it may not be for you, you could get a 200lbs lighter C2 with sport-suspensions, 345HP powerkit, 18" wheels for less money, that will outperform a C4S, AWD or not AWD. Its too bad in the states you don't have the option of the C4 and you only get the C4S as an AWD option. Cause you could fit the powerkit, sport suspensions and 18" wheels on a C4 and still be in the same price range of the C4S and you would have more performance AND AWD For the use you are going to give the car, a C2 with PSM will do the job though AWD will still be better I think, because for that use it will not hinder your performance noticeably but will be safer, more grip and more noble. But since your only option if you want AWD is paying for all the other extras that come with the C4S also, it really depends if you are also looking for those extras in the car otherwise extra pricetag is not worth it for you, and become a little steep for you since all you want is the AWD and not the rest. What ever you do, get the RoWM030 sport suspensions, that is a must, I think everybody will agree on that

Huh? Not even a O30??? No test drive? Aaaah. I think I get it. Enjoy your C2, Titan. Post pics. Remember, no street racing. No better place to feel that adrenaline than at DE.

Hey Titan, I'd highly recommend getting PSM if you are getting a C2 (it really makes those rainy days not a headache). Also get the M030 suspension, it'll make those hairpins a true pleasure. At $700 for the M030 its basically a bargain for what you are getting, and amazingly one of the cheapest Porsche options available.

I really like the PSM for when I'm talking on my cellphone, reading my Tivo manual, and shaving while enjoying a tasty hot beverage sloshing from my dash-mounted cupholder. But it's sure fun to turn it off during those rare moments when I'm focused! -DT

LOL

Dirk, Don't forget that you are probably responding to a post here while using your wireless laptop sitting in the passenger seat! There are some other things you get with the C4S that you don't with the C2 like the Alcantara headliner and full leather (options of course), so if you are into stroking your headliner while talking on the phone, reading, shaving and responding to messages here, then the C4S might just be the car for you... I have an interesting proposition for those following this thread. Which would be faster around a track (assume Laguna Seca) between two 996's where the ONLY difference was AWD vs. RWD? Same driver, same suspension, same brakes, same tires, etc. etc. The only difference being AWD vs. RWD. Now we know that for that difference to exist there must be a weight difference but assume for Part 1 that the weight of both cars is also the same. What is the result for Part 1? Insert Answer Here: Part 2 - Same scenario as Part 1, but now the AWD car weighs more. If the answer to Part 1 is that the AWD car will be faster than the RWD car when all else is equal, what % of the overall vehicle weight can be added until the cars are equal? For example, would adding 50lbs to a 3000lb car make up the difference in the AWD advantage or would it take adding 200lbs? 500lbs? for a 3000lb car, in essence what percent of the overal weight draws them even? If your answer for Part 1 is that even if all things are equal the RWD is faster around the track, then ignore adding weight to the AWD car in part 2. Assignments due by 3rd period tomorrow. BEGIN!

My brain hurts just thinking about that homework assignment. Alcantara is standard on all 996's these days. My '02 C2 had partial graphite lthr, and my '03 C2 has full graphite. Soooo much nicer, and comes at a discount (sort of) when ordered with sports seats! I don't like stroking the headliner, I just like to look at it, or my little Michelin bobble-head...anything but looking at the road - that gets so tedious sometimes while driving. The C4S would have been a better choice for me because it does the driving for you...KIDDING!! BREATH, PALTING! -DT

Hmmmm, Part 1 = depends on the level of skill of the chosen driver... Part 2 = depends on the combination of the level of skill of the driver and amount of added weight... ... OK, here a straight foward guesstimate Part 1 = Average Porsche driver faster on AWD, Walter Rohl and such faster in RWD. Part 2 = AWD itself is only 100lbs aprox and that should still not change part 1 resuts since the C4 (not C4S) would prob still be faster with average driver but who knows were the turning point is... BTW Ghost Rider, you would have a black Gixxer and live in Sweden now would you?

Carlos, Please assume that the DRIVER is equal also for both Parts 1 and 2. I'm not going to take points off your homework, just going to hand it back to you and ask you to re-do it with the assumption that the driver is identical for each as well. No I don't live in Sweden, but I hear it is nice, and I don't have a black Gixxer, know where I can get one? Ok back to the homework assignment...