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YOUR RESEARCHAir Box (why cap it?)
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15+ pages of the orange cap mod obsession
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First it was the 15+ pages of the orange cap mod obsession then, and now it's gonna be the resonator delete obsession.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
It was a little loose so I cleanly wrapped it with electrical tap a few times to take the minimal slack I had and tightened the clamp.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed · Original poster
Then used a PVC fitting with a shoulder that luckily fit perfect within the recess and attached the stock hose to it.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
I read another thread where they used a set of stacking cups found here
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As we speak, my damn interior lights won't go off (likely a microswitch on the door latch assembly-thank Cap'n Obvious).
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Suggestion
I also think I saw a DIY about replacing your oil pan with a broiler pan, but I don't really want to spend the $$$ on the duct tape (might as well buy a 997 if I was going to do that).
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***Read all posts, as a step was added to cap off the PVC from the inside to avoid any unmetered air getting passed the MAFS***
So I have been watching these threads on orange cap mods and the likes to enhance the sound of your car from the inside. And was wondering why everyone is quick to not utilize the area to allow more air flow.
This is what I did, didn't drive or start the car yet but logic would tell you more air is better. I removed the resonator entirely (3 screws from inside the air box top). Then used a PVC fitting with a shoulder that luckily fit perfect within the recess and attached the stock hose to it. It was a little loose so I cleanly wrapped it with electrical tap a few times to take the minimal slack I had and tightened the clamp. This should allow more air to flow and create the sound everyone is after. Looking for some thoughts/opinions from the experienced 996 guys to tell me if this makes sense.
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I don't understand why everyone caps it. More/freer air should give slightly better throttle response. And losing the resonator which is designed to quiet the air flow should give the same sound as capping it. I am hoping to get the car out in a little while and see what it does.
Perhaps there's concern about drawing in warmer, less dense air directly from the engine compartment? Personally, I don't think it would be an issue, but just my guess
The intake tube is the same diameter before and after the junction with the resonator pipe. I don't believe that the volume of air moving through the intake is going to change, regardless of whether the resonator pipe is left in place or is eliminated.
I don't think he's considering pulling unfiltered air through the resonator pipe - he's just leaving it connected so it pulls air from the airbox without having the resonance chamber in place.
Excatly why I asked about the PVC bit having a hole in it.
If it has, go back to the airbox, and put the resonator plate back in. As it is now, the intake system will draw unmeasured* air in the system, trigging at best a Check Engine Light, and if you drive fast like that, a lean fuelling and overadvanced ignition!
*unmeasured : not measured by the MAFS
I'm following now, threads are easier to follow on my computer than my phone.
I'm curious to hear a sound clip of this set-up, I've been contemplating the orange cap mod myself
I guess what I don't know is if the resonance chamber is sealed, or if it draws air from the airbox. If the former, then Mark's configuration would be allowing unmetered air into the intake.
Is the chamber sealed, or does it pull air from the airbox? It looks sealed, in which case connecting it up to the intake would make the car run somewhat more lean.
And there you have it, exactly why I posted here and waited to drive the car. It would be un-metered air. That's my bad and me not able to get away from the carburated mentality. Good thing is the PVC piece is threaded on the side inside the airbox. So all I need to do is screw a cap on it and done.
That said, the easiset way to do it is this one :
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsc...mple-free.html
I've done it on Monday. 10 minutes including washing my hands...
Noise is now great. There is a deep growl aroung 2500 RPM, and an ever more powerful one around 5000 RPM. The rest of the engine range is also more present. Excellent value mod!!!
Fab
With the resonator out there is more volume for air. I now capped the PVC piece to block off un-metered air. More air volume, stock look and the sound everybody loves.
Totally off topic - if you haven't read much about Rasputin, it's worth your time to do so. Rasputin makes modern con-men like Bernie Madoff look like rank amateurs.
(note that I'm referring to the historical Rasputin, not the 996-owning Rasputin whose reputation I cannot speak to.)
OK so here is the right way to do what the OP intended
- take a piece of PVC
- glue a cap on one end
- remove the resonator from the inbox
- slide the piece of PVC from the inside so that the cap is inside the airbox
- you're done
I just did something similar to this last night. I read another thread where they used a set of stacking cups found here
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00005C5H4/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00005C5H4/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
The yellow cup is the perfect size, though there are some small holes in the bottom. I put a few layers of aluminum tape in the inside to seal those holes. Then I removed the resonator, and grabbed the o-ring that was on the resonator and put it on the yellow cup. I then put the cup through the hole the resonator was in, and clamped the hose back on. Completely stock look.
Definitely a better sound, and there does seem to be a better throttle response. FYI - this is no different than the fabspeed mod
http://www.fabspeed.com/996-carrera-...r-upgrade-kit/
and they claim a 12 whp gain.
The Rasputin I refer too is not the one you mention, but is multiple :
- he is the rather mysterious episodic "friend" of Corto Maltese in the famous comic by Hugo Pratt (Google it if you don't know it)
- one of my mother's dogs, when I was a kid, was called Raspoutine
- it's also a wink at my now deceased Russian grand mother.
Fabrice
OMG. First it was the 15+ pages of the orange cap mod obsession then, and now it's gonna be the resonator delete obsession.
You guys know that you can buy the Fabspeed cap that bolts on from underneath by itself, right?
What's up with all these cheap mods lately? Well that's all for now, I gotta head over to Home Depot...
I don't think it is necessary to take the resonator off, as it does not affect the air flow between the airbox inlet and outlet. That way, one doesn't even have to open the airbox to perform the oil bottle cap hack.
DIY as linked in my post : 10 min + $0
Any oil bottle cap will do - I really took the first one I found in my garage. Perfect tight fit!
Seat of the pants feel with the resonator delete is a better throttle response (imo). Also the fabspeed mod is a resonator delete and they claim 12hp gain.
I'm sorry.... what "assumptions" did I make? I'm describing the feel of my car (not an assumption). It is also a fact (not assumption) that the fabspeed upgrade removes the resonator and does not just cap it. As for the dyno runs that show a 12hp gain, that is also not an assumption as they have the runs to prove it... now if you believe the validity of those dyno results or not is a different story, and I would not argue if you said that those gains are suspect.
I hear ya, but this is what happens when a 996 can be bought for $20K. It's only a matter of time before we read the "Curb Feeler" mod and the "How do you like my flame decal" thread.
I doubt it has to do with the price paid for the car and more to do with enjoying the car and what makes it tick. Speaking for myself I like taking things apart and finding ways to make them better. Doesn't matter if it's a $1K beater, a $35K 996, or a $75K Ferrari. It's an even better feeling when you do it yourself and not just buy a ready made product......just say'in.
I get that and I also subscribe to the fact that its your car...do what you want with it.
I'm just agreeing with Alpine that lately there a lot of threads about cheap mods.
When I glued my new gauge rings on to my instrument cluster my wife looked at me and said, "Really, your gonna glue **** onto a Porsche?". I told her heck yeah, and did it. It looks great, but when you think about it, glueing stuff onto a car that cost $85k out the door is kinda silly. So is using the orange cap off a shaving cream can. So is sticking PVC pipe on your air box.
Too bad my wheels don't have spokes. If I they did all I would need is a playing card and a clothespin.
But then again, I splurged and spent $275 on Fister D's.
Ummmm.... I didn't say I felt increased horse power, I said better throttle response.
Probably because the resonator is downstream of the filter. When you remove it, you add an extra L or so of filtered air so that when you open the throttle, there is more air ready to enter the engine that doesn't see the pressure drop across the filter (total guess).
Either way, I'm happy with it, and it only cost me $5, and that's all that really matters.
Well at least we know now you are no better than the rest of us that are smart enough not to spend 100's of dollars on something that can be made for 5 and not even be seen.
I have both mods (FisterD & intake tube/cap) my point is I neither One adds horsepower or makes your throttle response better, fast, or anything else. They both make the car "sound" better. That is 100% ALL they do. No freaking way taking a resonator out is going to add HP if it could the WTF was my OEM x51 package +/- $13k and adds "at" best 25hp?
Nothing wrong with wanting to make care sound better it really is too bland from factory. However, everyone please stop trying to convince yourself otherwise if you really want more HP / torque sell the n/a and buy a Turbo it's really that simple. Oh, and the better "throttle" response is your right foot. Car sounds more aggressive YOU drive more aggressive.
And since you haven't done the resonator delete yourself, only the cap, and (presumably) have no first hand experience with this, your basis for this statement is.....?
You do realize that we are not just talking about capping the resonator, but removing it from the air box altogether right?
My opinion is that it won't make any difference in torque/power or throttle response. The effect is only aural. And in this matter, it works great.
Fabrice
(ex-petrol engine engineer)
Anyone doing an intake modification and expecting real power will be very disappointed. Most OEM intakes are better designed than their aftermarket counterparts and don't pose any flow restriction. If you do it, do it for the sound. In that department my EvoMS V-flow intake was worth every penny.
I disagree
It's a scientific fact that cooler air brings more oxygen into the combustion chamber ( think free inter cooler) or how your car is crisper on a cool autumn morning vs a hot summer day. it's denser air which is a direct translation to more power. That's what these kits do. The expensive ones with fit and polish and r&d and Dyno sheets... And the Home Depot mods too, all do the same simple thing.
It's more than Aural.
All I can say is that I have done the cheap mod, and the subtle throttle response difference seems to be primarily noticeable during city driving. Seems to jump a bit quicker when I step on the gas... I am not an automotive engineer (though I am an engineer), so can only speculate on why that is.
If people prefer to listen to "experts" theorize on why it shouldn't improve performance but never actually tried it themselves vs people who have done it and noticed a difference, and professional tuners that claim improvements backed by dyno results, then by all means, don't do it.
I don't actually disagree that a "ram air" type effect might produce marginally more HP if the engine was starved of air, taking in hot engine compartment air or restricted by the OEM intake. However, I just do not think any of those are the case with a n/a 996 and actually the OEM intake does seem like a pretty well thought out device diverting cold air from spoiler. in any case the point is the mathematically miniscule gain could hardly be "noticeable" in the car so really can't we just accept that we do these mods just for the sound
Warm air factory intakes are cars from the 80's. Most if not all decent cars from the 90's on up have some sort of ducting or snorkel bringing in outside air.
People often reverse this these days with aftermarket open air elements with no heat shielding.
So the cold air issue of a stock intake is really a moot point.
I removed the resonator from my airbox as well, except instead of using a piece of PVC, I just cut the part of the resonator off that sticks out of the air box, since it seals perfectly. Then I put a Gillette cap over that.
It definitely adds horsepower, I regularly walk all over Vipers and Lambos with just this mod. Minimum 100hp added.
no need to replace the radiator... just take the front bumper off and replace with some chain link fence (plasti-dipped so it looks cool)... allows much more air into the radiator, and drops the weight of the car significantly.
I also think I saw a DIY about replacing your oil pan with a broiler pan, but I don't really want to spend the $$$ on the duct tape (might as well buy a 997 if I was going to do that).
I have removed my resonator, and this mod will increace the flow inside the airbox.
Why? Well, if you look the resonator chamber location, youll see that it's very close to the filter element.
When airflow goes past the camber, it must make 2 sharp 90deg turns.
First when flow comes thru the filter and second when it goes over the chambers edge.
Now everyone that have studied flow, fluid's or gas, knows that the bend's are bad for the flow.
When you remove the resonator, you remove the second bend and make the first one to have much larger radius.
Basic flow dynamics say's that this will increace the flow and pressure drop.
How much it will make more hp? Depends what other supporting mods you have. But my guess is no more than 5hp.
More flow doesn't necessarily equal more power. If your stock airbox poses a restriction then yes, but there's nothing to suggest that it does. Providing the capability of the airbox to flow more air than the engine needs does not buy you anything.
Correct and when you remove the elbow..or cap mod ..you loose the third sharp bend and even more reduce turbulence, which the factory engineers put in with the resonator to also reduce external noise emissions.
A final step in the CAI mod is to use the correct smooth not ribbed, hose to the intake for smooth airflow.
The airbox does not work as a duct, with a strong air flow, but more as a plenum with relatively still air. Hence the air horn shape for the outlet tube.
I agree. On stock car this mod will be acoustic betterment
However, if you have full exhaust etc. there would be a increace in power.
IMO
Not sure what you are saying? The air mass won't have much time to wait in the airbox when engine needs ~10m3 air/min at 7k rpm.
speed rII,
For a given air flow, air velocity is in inverse proportion to the cross section. Now, have a look in the ratio of cross sections between the MAFS duct and the air filter... So, yes, the air flow is comparatively still in the airbox.
Fabrice
Funny how people spend(or waste) lots of time thinking and arguing over a potential few horses. Already going on page 6 on this matter that's been discussed several times in the past with the same results. I can always count on Rennlist to either rehash something or make a big deal out of nothing.
Now I need to start another thread to discuss the new LED sidemarkers and analyze how and why they are superior and figure out if I should get the CREE version/multiple LED version/SMD, etc...
BTW, the sugar cured will play havoc with your MAF. Better stay with the smoked.
This is the next best thing to Unicorn semen if you can't find any. Just add a little to your oil to prevent any IMS damage. The Nano particles will make it's way past the IMS seals and will make sure all the ***** are lubricated. Added benefit is that it will give you that extra .00420 you were looking for.
Someone with a bit of good sense should understand that new members on this forum would like to discuss some topics that have probably already been discussed in the last 12 years of existence of the 996 3.6. I did a search, that returned nothing in term of dedicated thread as I didn't know it was called the "cap mod"...
What I don't understand is why some people waste so much resources to polute a thread where others try to genuinely contribute by sharing views and experience.
Fab
Because Rennlist.
If you're not polluting, you're not adhering to Rennlist policy.
If you want logic, unpolluted, civilized responses, that is what RennTech is for.
There is far too much stress owning these cars not to inject a little (very little) humor from time to time.
As we speak, my damn interior lights won't go off (likely a microswitch on the door latch assembly-thank Cap'n Obvious).
Now, back on topic, are there any other TPM's* I can use to pump up my HP?
*Toiletry Packaging Modifications
All I have to say is I regret starting this thread to be honest. I had seen the cap threads before but never found anyone doing it while trying to keep the factory look (factory tube) with the removal of the resonator. So that is how this whole thing started. With the exception of a few elitist's here who seem to think they are better and wiser than everyone else these forums are very useful and enlightening.
I am new to Porsche but far from new from the hobby car world and this is a hobby car, not a DD. For the one that mentioned something about this is what happens when the price drops to $20k, I paid well north of that for my single owner low mileage car. For me this is not about how much this car or any of my cars cost but about working on them, driving them, enjoying them and trying to have some good conversation about them.
Geez Mark. Lighten up a little will ya? We all enjoy our cars and we enjoy the conversations on RL. Sometimes those conversations just take a sideways turn. Just roll with it.
BTW...your car looks great!
Qualitative: "feels like...", "seems like more/less...", "appears to be more/less..."
Quantitative: Dyno tests before and after, sound decibel meter, etc.
Just saying.
Can someone explain why capping the air path out of the resonator increases the sound? It seems counter-intuitive to me. I'm not doubting that it works, just trying to understand why.
Has anyone seen any adverse effects from this?
For real horsepower gains, everyone knows you need to add more cowbell.
The resonator is an Helmotz resonator, that reduces certain acoustic wavelenghts in the intake system. The volume of the resonator is associated with these wavelengths. It sounds like the wavelengths they wanted to reduce are linked to 2500 and 5000 RPM engine speeds. By capping the resonator, you withdraw the Helmoltz volume from the acoustic characteristics of the system, and these wavelenths are again fully heard.
I just did this mod on my 2000 C2 Cab with Hardtop and Fister D's. I went for a spirited drive (briefly over 6000 rpm) and didn't notice any difference in sound.
I was hoping for improvement, but it was pretty much what I expected.
Was gonna get the Evoms but ordered the silicone tube on eBay for $28 and heading to lowes for the cap.. My brother mentioned that this might mess with the air / fuel ratio?
Currently stock with fister d's
The cap is merely to prevent debris from getting into the resonator chamber(which is sealed off from the rest of the Airbox). Technically you don't even need to cap it if you have aftermarket hose and you'll be
fine. People hose clamp this to death thinking there is some vacuum or something.
This is a source reference. Confirm exact model applicability in the original material.
