yet another happy row m030 convert

I finally (after 11k on the stock, US non-sport suspension) got the ROW M030 installed. Here are a few random thoughts: - lower than I expected. the car feels lower from the driver's seat, to the point where I raised my seat a bit last night for better visibility. Aesthetically, though, great improvement, although this was lower priority to me than improved handling. - steering is heavier, but I think this has more to do with the greater negative camber I'm running. - front end is *planted*. this is the single biggest difference in feel. No more bobbing around corners, over bumps, or on accel/decel. The front is very nicely snubbed. - ride quality has changed, but it's not at all harsh. The cycle of the movements is shortened, but it's not objectionable. Overall, the car feels more "in control" - rear end is still planted. I was a bit concerned about oversteer w/this setup, but I think it's still slightly biased towards understeer; kicking the tail out when provoked - I can still clear the big speedbumps at work, and can enter my driveway (primary reason I didn't go X74) - shocks and springs feel perfectly matched f&r. the car moves as more of a single piece. You have much less sensation of the front and rear doing their own thing. That's about it. I took the car out after lunch and flogged it hard. I'm not worthy. What an amazing total package of a car.

You need to take it out to Pacific Raceways! On Wed (Sept 1st), Cris' German Auto has a track day with Proformance; it will be pretty much all Porsches...

Don't I wish. Weekdays are tough for me. I'm hoping to do the Audi club day on the 12th at Bremerton.

stiles_s - congratulations! While I'm waiting for Gert to get new stock of X74 (due the end of this month), which I more or less plan to get, I'm still a little worried about ride height and wondering if I could be happy with ROW M030. After talking to Gert and doing my research, I am convinced I would be happiest with X74, except for the nagging issue of riding a little too low for L.A. streets. (I fully understand PSS9 but would prefer X74.) I don't like the stock suspension, find it mushy, and don't like the front end bobbing and the rolling. I want a much more planted feeling and don't mind a harsher ride to get it. I assume you may have been after the same thing I am. While I realize this is highly subjective, do you feel the ROW M030 made a "significant" difference and might be enough for what I am looking for?

For me, it had to be OEM (I've messed with too many aftermarket suspensions), and I wanted the following: - decrease understeer - tighten up / "snub" the front end - lose a little of the "US" 4x4 wheel gap - maintain the practical nature of the car (drive it anywhere) I'm really happy w/the ROW 030. It feels "right", and I'm left with enough ground clearance to navigate speed bumps, parking garages, etc. My car is my daily driver for the near-term, and I can't afford to lose the practical nature of the cars. The front end is very nicely snubbed, and the rebound damping is most noticeable (the car doesn't "rise" off of bumps nearly as much as the stock setup). It still has a *little* bobbing in the front end, but I think this is as much a trait of the rear weight bias as a flaw in the suspension tuning. Plus, X74 is only a shock+spring swap away if at some point in the future I want a harder core setup (and the car is relegated to weekend duty).

I would love to indulge in some suspension mods, but road clearance is paramount for me. Any way gain some of those great improvements you described without lowering the ride height? My road going up to my house is two strips of asphalt with mystery grass in the center. I keep it under control, but with hard rainstorms there is the occasional surprise rock hiding in the grass. I am so careful now, but I can't imagine lowering the car any. My nerves would give out for sure for fear of damaging my car...

Stevo - You can put on USA spec M030 and you won't lower your car at all. Or you could go with PSS9 which has adjustable height. The ROW spec M030 is popular because it drops the car a little (20mm front, 10mm rear, though this apparently varies and might be less).

isn't it 20mm from row, or 30mm from US? Mine, after the suspension, is about 26 1/4 in front, and 26 in the rear. Down about an inch.

stiles_s: Who installed it? Thanks.

stiles_s: I think ROW stock height is 10mm lower than USA, so you may be right, but I am not completely sure. Gert's site just says it drops 20/10mm, but I don't know if he is starting with ROW or USA spec. Gert did tell me that ROW M030 can vary and you might not end up dropping height much at all. If it's 30mm, then that pushes me towards X74 (40mm front), which is only 10mm more (although I guess that could make a big difference on bump stops, speed bumps, etc.) Anyone with better info please feel free to correct me.

A local shop called Fordahl Motorsports. I was going to do it myself, but chickened out They did a great job. I jacked it up and checked.

I did some research and measured by 04 Targa. There is an exhaustive PCA article comparing USA stock / USA 030 / ROW 030 PCA Article PCA seems to confirm that ROW 030 should drop the car 20mm front, 10mm rear from USA stock (see table 1 in article). In Table 3, the USA 030 specs to a 26.57" (675mm) front and rear height (pavement to fender lip through centerline of wheel); the ROW 030 here is only 12-13mm lower (front and rear). Don't completely understand these differences. My still stock Targa measured about 26 5/8" front and rear on the right (which sounds about where they should be), left front 26", left rear 26 1/4". I guess my fat carcass is doing its job on the driver side springs already, after 4,500 miles! But based on these measurements and the specs in the PCA article, its hard to see how you (stiles_s) could have dropped a full inch (20mm = about 3/4"), since your current ride height seems a half inch or less from where stock is supposed to be. I did get the impression from Gert that ROW 030 was somewhat unpredictable and that if I wanted to lower my car, I might even end up disappointed. EDIT: Table 10 in the PCA article shows 2002 C2 Std heights at 27 and 27 1/8 front, and 26 5/8 and 26 3/4 rear, compared to 26 1/4 and 26 1/8 front and 26 and 26 rear for ROW 030. So stiles_s, your measurements sound about right. I have no idea what will happen with my car since it seems to be riding a little low already.

IIRC I was at close to 27" F&R before the ROW030. The car is visibly much lower now... Also keep in mind that the PCA article was re: the Gen1 996 (different suspension kit), and I'm running well worn 285/30s in the rear, and I have a nearly empty tank of gas up front. Oh, and I have the lightweight roof (coupe)

There is no ride height difference between US standard and US M030 suspension.

Mine dropped from 26 3/4 all around to 26 up front and 26 1/4 rear. Pretty much exactly as expected.

Thanks for the input, guys. I'll check it out and see what I might be able to do with it.

Steve, my driveway has about a half a mile of recycled asphalt (a step up from gravel). I was very apprehensive about doing the RoW M030. It's one of the best mods I've done. The small amount of lowering that occurs has a minimal effect on clearance.

Hi guys looks like my next mod will be row M030 ! can anyone tell me where can i find them .....[ or only @ carenwal ?].............any other sponsers ? is pricing the same with most of porsche dealers/sponsers ? or .... does anyone know where can i find row M030 for the best price ?

996shane: Gert at Carnewal has RoW M030 for 995 Euro (about $1,200), including shipping. Don't know about local sources. Make sure you get the entire kit including heavier stabilizers (included with Carnewal's kit) - someone on the board recently got only the shocks not the whole kit. Suggest you also take a close look at X74 - see reviews on Carnewal's site here: X74 Reviews Gert is getting a new shipment any day and says he will put a much better price on it than the 1,995 Euro price that shows on his website. Despite my slight concern re ride height, I'm still 95% decided to go with X74.

I'm at 25.75 in the front and 25.875 in the rear. However, I only swapped springs as 030 is standard on the 40th (I know most of you know this) and I had heard the shocks are valved the same.

The shocks are not valved the same between US030 and RoW030. The sway bars are the same though.

Pete, Thanks for the correction. I wonder if this could be why I am lower? This Sunday will be the first time I will have a chance to rip it up, so I am anxious to test the handling differences with my ex 986S.

Tnx jcnesq can you guys post some pics of your row M030 [ befor and after ] or what you have . tnx shane

I posted some before and after pics here: https://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum/152581-another-40th-row030-conversion.html

Thanks, Rob. I would love to play with some suspension mods. I feel badly about driving my beautiful car up this crappy road every time I take her out, and I wonder how many Porsche enthusiasts would scoff at my disregard, hehe. But I have become quite the expert at taking her up the road easy without incident. I continue to upgrade the road, so perhaps someday I'll be able to have a C4S or TT or ?? with some form of an aero kit. At this point, I'm afraid it would sustain some serious damage.

How about the ROW normal suspension? Is that different than US standard susp? I wonder if ROW have better dynamics than US spec. std? And, is it available?