02 996 smooth shfiting

OK....it had been 6 months and I though I will get use to it but still having problem shifting smooth from 1st to 2nd and from 4th to 5th. Whats up with that?? Is not me cause I don't have the same problem with my Saab Viggen. Any suggestions or wisdom. Thanks

Do you have a short shifter or is it stock? Sounds like you might need to adjust the screw that pertains to the vertical shifts? Sounds like it might be a 1/4 or 1/2 turn too tight? Does it feel stiff when you shift? J

Stock shifter...not the shifter but more like the clutch and gas combo. It seems like too little gas on the clutch release from 1st to 2nd...but it never seems to be consistant and that is why I can't get use to it. Could it be the clutch? but it only happens in 1st to 2nd and 4th to 5th. What RPM do you shift at, maybe I need to rev it more??

i got the B&M unit and it's smooth as butta

To shift smoothly in a p-car, you have to make it a deliberate 3 step movement. 1- pull/push it out of the gear, 2- pause in neutral, 3- pull/push into the next gear. Driving casually: I shift at 4000 rpm. Playing hard: redline baby!

4000 rpm! Wow...casual driving I shift around 2500 - 3000rpm. aggressive...yeh 7000. I'll give it a try with the 3 step movement...been driving stick for over 10 years, this is gonna be interesting.

Jake, be careful about lugging these engines. They do NOT like it at all. You may also have an issue with your Dual Mass Flywheel. Kinda depends on what exactly you have going on. I know that changing the clutch fork (which your 02 probably already has) to the new style and changing to a single mass light weight flywheel has *significantly* improved the clutch feel and driveability of my 99. I highly recommend the LWF over the DMF.

With my short shifter....I have NO PROBLEM shifting fast from 1 to 2 in once fast movement. An entire world of difference compared to my 915 tranny. It really feels like a sports car should. No pausing necessary on my 996. J

True the short shifter does make a huge difference, but as he stated also, it doesnt sould like an up top issue.... Sounds like possible clutch issues..

I drove most part of my life stick shifts and the 996 is the first car where I was never able to make my shifting perfect and smooth. Yes the short shifter helps but the gap between 1 and 3 is still larger in the 996 gearbox than it should be. Rear engine cars have obvioulsy more issues with the transmission than front engine cars due to less available space for the parts. The clutch: It's almost impossible to feel the clutch release point of the pedal with the strong stock clutch release spring mounted. I did the removal last weekend (see this link: Clutch pedal release spring ) and do now feel exactly where the clutch grips. This made my shifting not only much smoother but also faster.

still not sure what you're talking about... i used to have an s2000 and the 996 unit with B&M while not as short is just as pleasureable to shift as the excellent honda unit.

I'm fairly new to p-cars as well and I have been shifting in stop and go traffic between 2000-3000 and often let it drop down to about 1200 RPM before downshifting. This doesn't sound like a good thing. What kind of problems are caused by lugging?

That sounds fine. Lugging is opening the throttle too much (1/3 maybe) at low RPM (2200 maybe), especially uphill.

Yes, is more the clutch than the shifter. For some reason the gas and clutch release combo it hard to be precise between 1st and 2nd??? I notice that from 4th to 5th is jerky if not over 140km before shifting...am I crazy or is that normal to shift from 4th to 5th at 140km?

maybe you can meet another 996 owner so you can compare cars. They are not hondas, but they are really not that bad to shift. It is fun to stall the car in front of a group of friends too. Not.

Absolutely not! My morning commute takes me along a route where I routinely get up to 120 kph (about 75mph) , and I'm always wondering when I'll be able to go fast enough to get it into 6th. At that speed, either 4th or 5th works fine. If I need to really move, it's a downshift into 3rd.

Shift at 2,500 - 3,000? Man, I'm surprised you don't stall it! Just kidding! Let those ponies stretch their legs a bit! Shift at 4,500 - 5,000.

Yeh , I know, but sometimes in traffic that how I shift. I'm getting about 13L /100km in city driving...not bad. Trust me when I'm on the hwy and country road I let it rip.

I think it sounds like you just need to learn how to rev match on the upshift.. downshift no doubt too.

That is my point Ben...from 1st to 2nd the rev match is never consistant. sometimes i need to put more gas and sometimes I need to release clutch faster. Makes it hard not to jerk the car.

it's always a different right depending on driving situation? sometimes i drive off more aggressively or i'm slowing down or etc etc.... the 1-2 shift is the jerkiest for sure, but you should still be able to rev match it close enough to not have to feel compelled to post about it u know what i'm saying?

I know what you're feeling. I've had 2 964's and a 944 and all shift easier/smoother than the 996. That G50 is smooth as silk...

Please explain this to me Ben. I have zero idea what you mean.

I have a problem when revving in the 5k range, going from 2nd to 3rd, seems like I hit a wall when I shift, and often wind up either grinding the gear, or jamming it into 5th in a panic. Going at a slower 3k shift, no problem finding 3rd gear. Clutch, or tranny problem? New thread perhaps?

abrupt choppy shifting from a stand still usually comes from not giving the car enough throttle. Car aint going nowhere until you lift off the throttle. I always tend to lean on the throttle a bit and think of the throttle as the 'release lever' which you learn to modulate for smooth rolling starts.

The Porsche shifter, like many, is self centering. As such, you should never really go straight from one gear to another, which increases the chances of mis-shifts. Rather, you go from one gear, to neutral, to the other gear. You can do this very quickly, but there is a difference, and it is much safer. It is why gated shifters work so well. If you do this, you will never be lost when shifting.

I go straight from 1 to 2nd without going into the center (neutral) and it shifts fine. 5th to 6th as well. not sure what your'e getting at. you jus gotta be good at shifting/rev matching on teh up and down shift.

I am not saying that you cannot go straight from one gear to another. I am saying that it is safer to get into the habit of going to neutral every time. It just doesn't work if you go to neutral sometimes and not others. You really either have to do it always or never. Great habit to get into. Explain to me "how" you you rev match on the way up. I rev match every time on the way down, but I don't know how you would do that on the way up. What do you mean?

Rev matching is for the down shift. You don't need to do it on the up shift, since when you get to the rev you want to shift at, and get off the throttle to shift, the engine slows down, which is perfect since the gear you are going into is shorter and requires less revs. Vroooom / gas off/ clutch in / shift / clutch out / gas on! If you can't up-shift, then you can't drive a stick!

you can certainly rev match on both the up and down shift just that on the up shift u don't really think about it since not everyone drives "sporty" and thinks to drop from 6th to 3rd to do that hwy WOT pull. and people rare skip an upshift (bad habit if you do). say you shift from 2nd to 3rd. u time it so when you're going into third, the engine/tranny speeds match. surprised u don't know about this.

i guess we're splittin hairs about the definition of "rev match" you don't have to manipulate the throttle to rev match to me and to others i've spoken with in the past (guys who drive sports cars, track cars blah blah). you're still matching the revs on an upshift "rev match" because if you do it too soon or too early, you feel it and it's not so smooth. P.S. you certainly wouldn't want to "double clutch" on an upshift

Still not getting your drift. When you upshift, whether you are high enough in the rev band that you need/want to upshift, or whether you are rapidly accelerating, there really shouldn't be any "timing" problems that would require explicit rev matching on the way up. Rev matching on the way down is important to prevent, primarily, the tires from chirping and destabilizing the car. Revs on the way up are, largely I would think, irrevelvant because you could not chirp the tires. At most, you would just lug the engine. However, you would have to be a real dolt, or just not know how to drive a standard, to shift your car on the way up in a way that would lug the engine. You make it sound like there is some specific technique required to "rev match" on the way up. I don't know it. Fill me in.

Here is what I have noticed since I got my Porsche...which I drive mostly in heavy OC to LA traffice... If I'm rolling along in 1st and let the RPM's "slowly" get up to say 4K then decide it's time to upshift to 2nd, if I... push in on the clutch/let off the gas (RPM's drop) shift to second/let out the clutch It's jerky and I slow down because at 4K in 1st is about 2.5K in second (roughly) but the engine is at 1K. I THINK that is what Ben is talking about in his upshift rev matching. Of course this has nothing to do with actually shifting from gear to gear issues that I think this thread started off about.

i mean the author isn't clear about "shifting smooth" on his 1-2 shift. it's def going to be diff in the 911 than the saab, but again, it's so basic shifting behavior no one thinks that it is a technique or way of doing things to rev match on the upshift. you are doing it. not all people do it. believe me. they let the clutch do the work and to me that's not good technique. so to avoid the jerkiness that you so well described, vrinner, is what i'm talking about avoiding by rev matching on the upshift. you are matching the revs to make sure you're smooth on that 1-2 shift by timing it right via experience/feel/technique however u want to call it. rev matching occurs on both the upshift and downshift. the downshift requires an extra step (throttle blip).

OK, ben, to me, that is NOT rev matching on the way up. That is just shifting at a high enough RPM with proper technique. That's it. To me, rev matching means doing something specific to manipulate the rpms during shifting. On the way down, for every shift, I am decelerating (usually under braking, but not necessarily), I disengage the clutch, shift to neutral before shifting to new gear (this happens so fast the passenger wouldn't notice it -- it just means shifting like you have a shift gate), blipping the throttle, and then engaging the clutch rapidly imediately thereafter. Since I do this for every downshift on street or track, it has become second nature and I rarely, if ever, chirp the tires.

I kind of do exactly what Ben is talking about. I shift wicked fast. When I am upshifting, my RPMs drop at a very quick speed, if I don't shift wicked fast the RPMs will be too low for the next highest gear. (Granted I am very precise in where I put the stick so there are no shifting problems. I never ever ever go to neutral first for an upshift. If I wasn't exactly precise with my shifting, all would go wrong.) It is rev matching in the sense that I have to shift at a certain speed to match the RPMs of the engine to the gear, otherwise it is not smooth with dropping the clutch. If I drop the clutch after the RPMs have gone below the speed of the gears it is not smooth. End of story.

And nothing is sweater then a nice double clutched downshift. Somehow I think my pedals are off for the imfamous heal toe delivery.

I find this is WAY more necessary when the A/C is compressor is on! Try doing the 1-2 shift with the climate control in the oFF mode. Much smoother! The compressor drags the engine speed down, so when you let of the gas, it goes all the way down to zero quickly, as opposed to slow and steady when the A/C is off.

Yes...its more complex when the AC is on. I find it shifts much smoother when you do it fast....gas and clutch combo.

I experience NONE of these "issues." Do you guys have lightweight flywheels? Sounds like something is wrong with your car or your shift technique (meant as a serious comment not an insult).

For me, there is just a slightly different technique needed when the a/c is on. Stock flywheel and clutch.

Strange. I can't even notice any difference between when the a/c is on or off, and I certainly don't vary techinque. I was thinking about this last night and wondering whether maybe I just wait longer to shift, but I don't even experience the problem when I am warming the car up, at which point I shift at 4K (the only time I shift at 4K).

not sure why others are picking up what i'm laying down yet TD you're not... i think we could be in the clear if we drove in a car together to explain to each other what we're talking about. haha like that'll ever happen. i know what andy's saying about it being more "complex" when the ac is on since you're not getting as much power than with the ac off since the ac unit is puttin more drag as they say on the engine. the revs do fall quicker and you simply compensate for it by shifting faster to rev match on the upshift. on the downshift, i rarely outright WOT when i have the ac on anyways since i'm probably just cruising and not intersted in any fancy driving. i don't like driving spiritedly with the ac on. just habit/pref. but honestly, it's much less noticeable in the 911 than any other car i've owned which isn't too long of a list (S2000, E46 M3). the S2000 was very noticeable. M3, slightly less. 911, even additionally slightly less. sometimes, my 911 feels stronger with the ac on so i know my **** dyno is a bit off kilter.

I suspect that if you are having problems it is because you either are shift at too low of an engine speed or taking your sweet time completing the shift. The proper way to upshift is at a speed that meets the proper engine speed of the next gear. So if you shift at 4000 rpm from 1st into second, the shift should be completed by the time the engine speed drops to 2200 rpm.

Exactly, and since the engine speed falls faster with the a/c on, you have to compensate by giving it a little more gas to keep the engine speed at 2200 rpm, for example.

errr.. you just complete the shift a bit quicker than with ac off... not sure why you'd give it gas on an upshift

I should have said, I get on the gas a little sooner in the process.

Thanks for all the feedback and input...it seems like the 996 likes to be driven hard which is what I did today. Fast gas and clutch combo while reving beyond 4000rpm from first to 2nd... smooth like slik. I guess the harder you drive, the less jerky. Too bad I can't drive like this all the time. LOL

Just make sure you give the tranny time to warm up before fast shifting. It takes about twice as long as the engine to warm up.