46 captured repliesDiscussion pagination complete · Source accounts, not a confirmed diagnosis
THIS DISCUSSION / SOURCE-DERIVED OVERVIEW
Discussion summary
YOUR RESEARCHUneven tail pipes
Reported or suspected cause
fairly simple
Reported cause
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1
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Read evidence and context
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Reported cause
Either issue is fairly simple to address, either tail pipe/exhaust clamps and new motor mounts.
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Suggestion
I agree when you loosen that clamp, you can spin the final tip of the system and tighten it but that doesn't adjust the height of the tail pipe, it only spins it.
Leading evidence: 'fairly simple' (1 discussions report identifying this cause; no attributable repair resolution). Across 1 matching discussions, the most frequently mentioned possible cause is 'fairly simple' (1 discussions; 1 report identifying it and 0 suggest it). The most frequently discussed action is 'Adjust height of the tail pipe' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
I needed to do this on my C4S when I installed my Fabspeed mufflers.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
When I recently replaced the motor mounts, they were out of alignment, so I loosened the clamps and rotated the tips until they were aligned again.
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Performed · outcome unconfirmed
I recently bought/used the $9 version and they worked perfectly.
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When I replaces my MM both tips raised approx 3/4", my original mounts (80,kms) were stretched I used RSS semi solids for replacement.
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Adjust height of the tail pipe
No successful repair reported for this finding.
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Reported fixes
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Unsuccessful attempts
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Discussions
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Discussions that contain suggestions
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Suggestion
I agree when you loosen that clamp, you can spin the final tip of the system and tighten it but that doesn't adjust the height of the tail pipe, it only spins it.
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Suggestion · Original poster
I haven't seen the mounts leaking, and as I said the dealer didn't say anything about them, although 2 years ago they 'recommended' that I replace them.
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Rennlist: 1 discussions
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Outcome without a verified action link
The only thing that will bring those tail pipes back to normal is a change of engine mounts.
A problem that plaques some of us, one of the tail pipes is lower or higher than the other depending on how you look at it.
Lots of people said that engine mount is the cause, however my dealer said that
"..found them out of adjustment, went to adjust but found the clamps and fastners (sic) are rusted and seized .... Advise replacement $258+tax"
I haven't got a clue what they were talking about, the SA obviously didn't know. I went looking at the part diagram, couldn't figure out which one was the tech talking about.
http://www.autoatlanta.com/porsche-p...section=202-01
Anyone can help?
They are NOT adjustable. (that's if they are the original exhaust pipes) Your dealer is full of ****. Trust me. I just had the mufflers off for doing my plugs. The 2 bolts either side holding a clamping sleeve between cats to the muffler under the rear bumper on yours have gone rusty, as mine had. Those DO NOT have to come off if you are doing your engine mounts. But do (along with 3 other bolts nearer the wheel arch) if removing the muffler for the plugs. You have to get a torsion bar on clamp sleeve bolts and break them off. Then buy 4 same bolts from any hardware store. New bolts or even new sleeve clamps (#29 on your posting) will do nothing to adjust your tail pipes. The only thing that will bring those tail pipes back to normal is a change of engine mounts.
IF you give the dealer your car, you can bet your **** that they will hit you with a further $500 (when they realize that the pipes are still the same with the new sleeve clamps and bolts) and they tell you that you need new engine mounts to rectify the droopy tail pipes.
I disagree with Hurdi. There is some adjustment in the clamping setup of the tailpipes, but you can do it yourself.
When I changed out my mufflers, I had to do a bit of adjustment, especially where the final clamp attaches the muffler to the tailpipe assembly. Loosen that clamp, and you can rotate the tailpipe assembly to line them up.
Here's some more info...
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-foru...to-fix-it.html
A picture would help. The issue actually could be both as expressed above...tailpipe clamp and motor mounts. We have no information to go on so either is a WAG. Would help to know, OE exhaust, mileage, location, salty roads, any other work done prior? Have you tried just grabbing the tailpipe in question and seeing if it moves a bit? Either issue is fairly simple to address, either tail pipe/exhaust clamps and new motor mounts. But if you are going to have a shop do it instead of DIY, better be ready for the parts/labor $....it is not a Honda or Toyota...but you already own a Porsche so you should know that.
OP... There is a fair bit (+-3") of adjustment in the muffler tips. This joint is like a ball in socket.
The clamp is #22 "pipe cover clip" in your attachment. If you plan on adjusting this, I recommend you by new clamps, they are awkward to get to and will probably be rusted.
Yes, replacing motor mounts can raise the tips up. When I replaces my MM both tips raised approx 3/4", my original mounts (80,kms) were stretched I used RSS semi solids for replacement.
Yes, there is definitely a little adjustment possible. When I removed my mufflers for the Fister D replacements, the clamps holding the tips to the mufflers were completely seized and rusted. Replaced them both ($30 for the pair from Pelican). When I recently replaced the motor mounts, they were out of alignment, so I loosened the clamps and rotated the tips until they were aligned again.
Yeah, this is totally doable in your driveway. Just give the clamps for the tips a solid coating of WD40 or something similar the night before to loosen up the rust. If they're really rusty, you may need to cut them off and replace them, though. I needed to do this on my C4S when I installed my Fabspeed mufflers.
They are adjustable, but you have to ask yourself why they are uneven. Are the tail pipes improperly aligned, or do you have a bad motor mount which is causing your engine to sag on one side?
They ARE. You are referencing to the wrong clamps.
You can also get these ones
http://www.evoms.com/Fabspeed_Exhaus...ab996mmqrc.htm
, I might do that next year.
Also available from Pelican Parts
http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/...EXHmuf_pg2.htm
Mine original clamps were pretty rusted out, needed torch, pneumatic impact driver, sledge hammer, ViseGrips, a LOT of PB Blaster to get them loose, I reused the circular clamps but got $5 worth of other hardware bits from auto parts store instead.
Her's some pix, so you can see how the tips are attached (sorry for the gigundo pix for the rest of you, but I wanted OP to be able to see the details):
Thanks for your replies guys.
I gave the opportunity for the dealer to mention engine mount, they didn't say anything. I wasn't trying to argue with them that it wasn't the engine mount. I kept quite and wanted to hear what they said.
Back to the $200 thing, this would be it, correct? Amazing it's only around $60 from Pelican ...
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/...2529%2520%2520
That particular exhaust clamp is pretty unusual, usually hard to find locally except at the Porsche dealer...
Pelican, in addition to a decent price on the OEM clamp, also has an aftermarket version of the clamp for $9 each. It is just an exhaust clamp. I recently bought/used the $9 version and they worked perfectly. Search for pelican part number 996-111-108-00-M127. They were in the process of changing aftermarket vendors for this clamp when I ordered, so you might have to call them...
$18 do-it-yourself (o.k., $22
shipped
) vs. $258 at the dealer? Exactly why some folks think the 996 is simple/inexpensive to maintain and others think it is a money pit!
Also... The MkII 996 (2002-2004) uses slightly different mufflers and tips than the earlier cars. That adjustment joint shown above is the same, but there is also a slight bit of adjustment at the tip itself that the MkI 996 (1999-2001) exhaust tips did not have...
I wouldn't call that an adjustment. I would call that a mis alignment so the tail pipes tips become higher/lower. We call that in the UK 'Gerry Rigging' to make things look ok. Then as the motor mounts sag more and you need more mis alignment. What do you do then? You replace the motor mounts. Then one tail pipe is higher than the other and you put the mis alignment method back to where it was before anything was touched and BINGO. I repeat, There is no adjustment. You are mis aligning the final part of the tail pipe. I agree when you loosen that clamp, you can spin the final tip of the system and tighten it but that doesn't adjust the height of the tail pipe, it only spins it. Anyway do as you want. If you want to skimp around the job in hand, start your unclamping and twisting. It makes more sense to replace the motor mounts IMHO. I think I did mention in my first posting " if it is the original exhaust system" or words to that effect. The original was set up at the Stuttgart Factory and sure as **** is ****, it didn't move on its own. The motor mounts got longer and the whole system is sagging. If yours is not the original, then disregard my comments.
Uneven muffler tips may signal that your motor mounts are going. When do nuts and bolts ever move around like that?
There is quality information if you sort through Hurdi's style of communication.
Boys, back to the original discussion ....
I think it's the original set up from factory, could be very well the mounts.
I haven't seen the mounts leaking, and as I said the dealer didn't say anything about them, although 2 years ago they 'recommended' that I replace them.
I don't know the base of their recommendation, maybe the the uneven tips?
I also heard other benefits of replacing the mounts, which I might do next year, first gotta buy them from the UK. They sell them here for $500 a piece.
I had this a few weeks ago and sorted it with new motor mounts which not only fixed this but made the car feel much better. Got them from pelican parts.
Cheers
It is always the mounts.
Pelican Parts sells them for $91.50 US. Your time and money is better invested swapping the mounts than tipping the tips. The next sign of the mounts deteriorating is bad shifting.
Pardon my intrusion as well, but couldnt this so-called tip misalignment be a sign of an impending IMSB CEF just around the corner? I would consider dropping the engine and trans for a thorough inspection. Was this helpful at all?
PB blaster and rattle gun.
If the exhaust or tips were ever changed, then it could be that the tips were just never aligned properly and need adjusting, but it doesn't sound like that is the case with your car.
I agree it's probably the motor mounts. Pretty easy to do, and you should be able to get them for
much
less than $1,000/pr, even in the UK.
Can you typically order stuff from the Amazon US web site? Here is a set of OEM (REIN/CRP) motor mounts for $87 each with free US shipping, not sure if they would ship them to you in the UK or what shipping would be. Whatever the shipping cost, it certainly is going to be much less than $500 each!
CRP 99337504906 Engine Mount : Amazon.com : Automotive
CRP 99337504906 Engine Mount : Amazon.com : Automotive
Here are instructions from the pelican parts board...
Link to motor mount replacement instructions
I had a tip that would move now and then. Drove me nuts. Got to the point I would kick it to get it sit right.....kinda like a family cat........I digress. Bought new Fabspeed spring clamps and love them. To get the old clamp off I had to pull the can and use a sawzall to cut it off. Good luck.
It's actually not. It just means that there is no rubber with fluid filled to absorb the engine vibration.
I did not notice much additional engine vibration with RS mounts. The shifting was much cleaner and precise. Just price the options out and see what makes sense.
Well hell... If you can't get them for *way* less than $1,000, I'll personally get them shipped over for you!
(PS: Best moto trip of my life started off near Wellington! Palmerston North actually...)
Glad they worked out for you and went to a good home!
In fact, I guess they returned home. My car has had a long journey amongst its history, and was first sold in Atlanta.
Here is an idea.....318 buys the clamps in the US and has them sent to a RLstr via ground UPS. That RLstr goes to a UPS/FedEx/DHL location and ships it to 318 with 318 paying the shipping cost via ppl to guy that sent them. Most of the sources we use for parts tack on a hefty shipping charge (I mean they inflate the shipping cost) to make more money. All duties would also be paid by 318.
If one of you guys lives close to Pelican or Suncoast go pick the darn part up and ship it yourself to 318. Let's help this brother out.
My old ones are in my basement. I swapped in RSS mounts. Here are the pics from the swap; if these look like they are still useable. I'll send them for shipping costs. They aren't new but they are taking up space on my workbench.
Thanks for the offer gents.
I did mention that I'll get them from the UK, specifically
http://www.design911.co.uk/?
I bought my low-temp thermostat from Pelican. There is always uncertainty on shipping when shopping at Amazon, except for books.
Although DTMiller's mounts still look usable.....
Thanks Cuda. However, I am far from being alone with my views on this subject as everything I read suggest bad mounts are the cause of sagging tail pipes.
