OT: 2004 Wagons: Saab 9-5 Wagon, Audi A6 Avant, Audi Allroad, VW Passat 4motion

I'm looking at these wagons and would appreciate any first-hand experience and feedback. So far, the 2004 Saab 9-5 wagon is at the top, but I do want the AWD systems the germans have to offer. Main concerns are: safety, reliability, handling Thanks!

I drove the Saab 9-5 wagon about 2 years ago and I do not think much has changed since then and the A6 coupe and wagon along with the Volvo V70 Wagon and of those three cars I would go Audi, Volvo and then Saab. This probably is not allot of help but all 3 cars were nice the Audi was just a step above the Volvo and the Saab seemed dated to me. This is of course IMHO and each individual will rate what is more or less important and come up with another conclusion so I would say go drive them all and pick what best meets your decision criteria.

My current winter car is an '05 Allroad 2.7 TT 6 speed. Car is suprisingly quick for its weight as long as you are going in a straight line. Handling is not one of its finer points. Between high weight, high unsprung weight and wierdness of air suspension, it likes to understeer. This might get better with new tires. BTW this thing goes through tires. 18k and almost ready for new ones. The OEM tires suck. As per reliability, if you want that, stick with a regular A6 avant. I hear that the air bags in the Allroad suspension typically start to develop leaks with age, and expensive to replace. Summary, even with the shortcomings, this is the best "SUV" like car I have ever owned, I would highly recomend regular A6 avant for simpler, higher reliability and better handling. And the 2.7 TT is chipable to over 300 HP.

I almost bought an A6 Avant in 2001, but bought the Passat V6 4Motion instead. Drove it for 80K miles with minimal problems (catalytic converters, front lower control arms) never even had to do a brake job. Though the gas mileage was not very good at about 20-22 MPG. I replaced it with a 2005 Subaru Legacy GT wagon (2.5L Turbo) and at 43K miles I am still pleased. It is quicker and corners better than the Passat. The turbo lag takes some getting used to, but I can get 25 MPG on long trips, thought only 20 in town. The oversize sunroof is nice and the seats are more confortable than my C4S on long trips. It is not as solid as the German cars, and the climate control system is not as good, but it is not bad for the price. And when the boost kicks in, it is darn quick for a wagon.

I just sold my 2001 Audi allroad 2.7L biturbo tiptronic. It was a pretty decent ride. If it wasn't a tip I probably would not have replaced it (with the 996 and a minivan). The 2.7L came stock with 250 hp which increased to about 320 hp w/ a GIAC chip. You can get even more swapping out the turbos and modding the exhaust. The body roll also improved with H-Sport antiroll bars. I would NOT recommend getting the 2.7L w/ a tip, there is an annoying throttle lag from a standing start. The 2.7L manual 6 sp and 4.2L tips do not have this problem. I like the Audi Quattro systems, sure they understeer, but the bad weather traction is rock solid.

I am on the 3rd audi. What can I say... love them. Selling one as we speak (deal should be done by this Thrs pending funds). 2003 A6 Avant. Tip, Xenons, Bose, 6cd in dash, integrated rear sunshades, Htd Seats, Platinum Silver/Dark Charcoal Leather, 35K miles. Still under warranty until June and then CPO warranty takes over for 2 yrs/100k miles. Car has hardly a scratch or ding. Going practically tradein at $19,999. I am in the DC metro area if interested. A6 Avant Ad

objectively. I like the a6 avant, the allroad and the Passat. The a6's have a lot of room in the back, check the specs.. I like the sportiness of the allroad but without a waranty would be wary of the air suspension along with other items (check the audi forums). Hands down, the audis have one of the nicest interiors and it holds up extremely well. Our previous A6 had 100K and looked like new.

I love wagons, I think they're the perfect daily driver. I was looking at '02+ 5 series wagons with 5 speed tranny, and ended up buying a nearly perfect 1995 525iT with 70k miles (I've always loved the e34 body style). My concern with the A6 is that it just looks a little dowdy. I never considered the Saab, and although I like the Allroad in theory, we just don't need it's capabilities in SoCal. I'd sell my mothers ashes for a 2004 M5 Wagon... (and she's not even dead). That would be the PERFECT ride.

+1 on the M5 wagon. Damn you bmw. And on top of that Audi is not bringing us the S6 Avant. arrrgh

Sorry OT as BMW is not in your shortlist; unfortunately the new M5 touring is not foreseen for the North American market but it looks cool! If you don't buy a >06 model from Audi, then the quattro technology is based on front wheel drive which would be a handling concern for me. Only BMW and Mercedes have X-Drive resp. 4-matric that is rear wheel based, so my choice would be 530xi touring.

We've had 4 Audi A6 Avants and have really loved them all. Now that the kids are finishing college, wife bought herself a 328xi sedan and is lovin' it. I've had a number of other Audis and have had pretty good experiences with them. I wouldn't touch a Saab personally - just think they're trouble.

Thanks for all the feedback, guys. It sounds like we have some wagon fans on here! I failed to mention previously that I want to spend < $20k, ideally in the $17-$18k range. It sounds like the Audi A6 is the way to go given all the features I want, but my other half likes the rarity of the Saab 9-5 wagon and its sporty styling - it's also less expensive. Although the Allroad is fun, the potential repairs will probably keep me away. Paul 996, I would be calling you if the interior color was tan. Nice looking car though. So far, I've driven the Saab and a fwd Passat - will test the A6 next and try to make a decision in a month or so. If any more Saab owners are out there, please chime in! Thanks again.

it may be a bit smallish for your requirements, but we have a bmw E46 325it (rwd, manual tranny) and love the car. it actually has about an inch more rear leg room than the sedan, and due to the wagon body, increased torsional stiffness compared to its sedan/coupe siblings. plus, bmw resale value is hard to beat. CPO, even better. good luck.

sm -- You've got some good thoughts here already. You can find nice E39 wagons (3 series may be too small for your needs, but a great ride) in this price range. Also, you might want to check out the Subie Forrester XT (turbo). Someone mentioned the Legacy; the Forrester, if you can get past the looks, has the WRX engine, AWD, decent handling and a deceptively large cargo area. And, you can get the oversized moonroof. When we lived in Boston, we were Saab loyalists. I like the 9-5 wagon, but really wish that they would bring back the five door sedan. Other than the Mazda5, the Panamera is the only car on the horizon that offers car handling and wagon utility. I really wish all the manufacturers would ditch this crossover garbage and give us the five door saloon that Europe has enjoyed for many years. Then, again, there are probably not enough of us to reward their decision. And, for the record, I'm with Paul...I would ABSOLUTELY buy the new M5 wagon if BMW allowed us Yanks a crack at it. -- M

SM.. last thing.. there is a world of difference in the a6 when you go from the 2.8 to the 3.0. the 2.8 tips were major pigs. The 3.0 tip with sport mode is not too shabby. The 3.2 is even better as is the 4.2 but likely out of the price point you want. Good luck. !!

MB made the E series AMG in a wagon.

go with the s4 avant, nice v8 and audi's are awsome

M - Did the Saab not having AWD ever become a problem for you in New England? I hear you about the Subies, but if the wife doesn't like it, I can't buy it. Besides, I think the Audis are more structurally solid.

sm -- Nope. With the FWD and good snows (Blizzaks is what I used on both the 9000 and my 900 SPG), they were a blast to drive in the snow. Now...that view is based on pre-GM information from 10 yrs ago. You might pose the same question on saabnet.com. On the Subie, if you like it, you might stress the safety and reliability to your bride. The Audi Allroad with the 2.7 turbo is a sweet ride, but I have two friends that had miserable reliability experiences with them. If you can deal with the smaller space, in my view the BMW 3 series wagon is the sharpest looking and handling of all of the ones mentioned above. And, just for kicks, you should have a look at the Mazda5 series...solid car with a bunch of variations that might work for you -- wagon, 5 door and mini-van. Best of luck with your search. -- M

Yeah, you can get a nice 5 series wagon for <20K - I'd end the search right there. Saab's are too weird - they don't even put the ignition switch in the right place!

That's a funny statement Nutbeem! Especially as it comes from a Porsche owner. Where is the right place for the ignition switch?