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YOUR RESEARCHHow About These 19" Wheels from Wheel Dynamics?
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Use 14mm h&r spacers and bolts
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I used 14mm H&R spacers and bolts for two seasons of competition without issue.
Leading evidence: 'Use 14mm h&r spacers and bolts' (no explicit attributable resolution; this is a reported action or suggestion). Across 1 matching discussions, The most frequently discussed action is 'Replace rear' (1 discussions). For that action, 0 discussions report a resolution and 0 report an unsuccessful attempt. No action has an explicit, attributable resolution report under the current rules. These are forum reports and suggestions, not a confirmed diagnosis.
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I have also used H&R 14mm and RUF 23mm spacers for my RUF wheels on the street for years without issue.
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Rear tires are USED Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 295/30ZR19.
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BTW - I used WD for my take off 19"s - great shop and great guys to work with.
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Suggestion · Original poster
Are you running any positive camber (just looks a little like that from the pic, obviously that could just be suspension reacting to an unlevel street, or my eyes playing tricks on me) ?
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Suggestion
If you have to use spacers or want too, then I would only recommend using the correct spacers that support the wheel (in that they have the hub centering piece, hub-centric is what I believe it is called, as in the factory hub - it's not the bolts/studs that center the wheel on the hub), I would not trust spacers that rely on alignment of the wheel using just the bolts/studs.
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Suggestion
If you have to use spacers or want too, then I would only recommend using the correct spacers that support the wheel (in that they have the hub centering piece, hub-centric is what I believe it is called, as in the factory hub - it's not the bolts/studs that center the wheel on the hub), I would not trust spacers that rely on alignment of the wheel using just the bolts/studs.
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I'm buying an '02 C2 NB for Los Angeles this week, and a friend found what seems like the wheels I want on Ebay from a seller located in LA:
http://tinyurl.com/2dplvh
"Wheels are 19x8 et 57mm and 19x11 et 67mm"
"Tires are new Toyo T1R in 235/35/19 and 315/25/19 for the 996 or we can change the rear for the 997 to 295/30/19"
Seems like these guys are some kind of dealer, but I'm curious if anyone knows of them, likes them, and moreover if they actually have a shop out there (I don't want to order off of ebay, and I'll be in LA for a couple of months anyway)
Also, from what I read here on rennlist (you guys are amazing) it seems I can fit 11 inch wide rears with a 67mm offset under a narrowbody with no rub on the 315/25s, but I was hoping someone could confirm that it would be far enough inside the plumb line that if I ever reduced the ride height in the future it would still fit (just H&R or equiv. drop kit, not coilovers). At 57mm up front do I still need a 5mm spacer? What if I eventually dropped the ride height a little?
I am guessing these wheels are replicas, and I am thinking an OEM takeoff would be the better bet, so if anyone has a solid source of inexpensive takeoffs in greater LA/OC, heck even SFO/Sacramento as I'm heading up that way for a week as well, I'd be greatly, greatly appreciative. (wheel enhancement wants 3300 for just the oem wheels, so figure 4500 all in + mount/balance/tax, way too much given the value of the vehicle I'm putting them on)
But say I can't find takeoffs for close money, are Wheel Dynamics' replica wheels reasonably well made or are they going to bend the first time they roll over an expansion joint or pothole? Mind you I'm not that worried about the unsprung weight unless it would wear down the suspension items, as this car is pure street, my e55 replacement.
Sorry for the long post!
HT
HT - yes, those wheels are replicas. A few guys here have purchased some wheels from Wheels Dynamics and as I recall, they were satisfied with teh transaction.
You probably want to add a 7mm spacer to the front wheels, which would then retain the same offset an OEM 8" 996 wheel. The rear wheels (11" with 67mm offset) will give you 15mm LESS clearence in the inside of the wheel and EXTEND the outside of the wheel by 11mm compared to a 10" with 65mm offset OEM wheel. There "should" not be a rubbing issue if you were to lower the car.
Just to be sure, you should take a couple of minutes and measure the available space on your current wheels using a plumb line. Here is a link to a post which should help with the measurements.
Measuring avaliable wheel space
Hope this helps.
I bought the same tire wheel combo off them a year ago and VERY satisfied with them. Great guys to deal with and very helpful. And they have a great product in their rims. Not a problem with them at all.
Purchased my wheels from them 2 months ago. They delivered the wheels (no extra charge) to my tire guy in Torrance the next day however they forgot the center caps. After informing them of the situation they overnighted the caps. Great guys to deal with. Quality wheels at a great price. Originals would cost you thousands more. The $$ you save can be spent on other mods.....
It depends how quickly you need them, I bought the same OEM rims (sans tires) on ebay for about 1200 in perfect shape. So the deals can be had but it takes patience.
I think I'm going to wait it out until the 1st week of January and if I can't find takeoffs for less than 2500 for wheels and tires I'll go these replicas.
JP, do you know whether or not they have a retail shop I can walk into? Otherwise please do shoot me your guy in Torrance's details, I stay out in West LA when I'm there but I'd rather not pay West LA "baller" prices for fitment.
Tim, that's a great diagram, thanks so much. As soon as I take delivery I'll measure as illustrated. I am a little concerned about the spacer thing, some people say 5mm, 7mm, but if the rears are 15mm too wide should I be adding even more to the front so that everything wears normally?
BTW where did you get the silver/chrome Carrera script on the rear of your car? I'm going black car and now that I've decided to go silver wheels I think I will be going silver emblem.
996CABOVA, very nice look on your car, convinced me this would work.
Did you lower or is that the standard ride height on those wheels? (I wouldn't lower if they fill out like that).
Did you add a spacer to the front wheels? Are you running any positive camber (just looks a little like that from the pic, obviously that could just be suspension reacting to an unlevel street, or my eyes playing tricks on me) ?
How are those Toyos on road noise, comfort, tread life? (compared w/ previous-gen AMG pretty much any modern tire has way more than enough grip for the sort of traffic we have here in Manhattan and surrounding) Would you buy them again?
Am I being a total jackass asking all these little questions? Please stop me if it's getting annoying, I 'm just so happy you have the same wheels AND tires on the narrowbody, makes my decision that much easier.
So finally, how was your tire wear with the setup you have, pretty even?
Benjamin, saw pics of your car while searching for info on lowering, that is cleeeeaaan.
So I've never had to run spacers before on any of my cars, what is the primary criticism of spacers, I mean in a nutshell? Wobble? Shimmy? Wheels coming off?
Also I did speak with Wheel Dynamics just now, they have a shop in town, say spacers not needed but can provide for 40 bucks/set 7mm, will mount/balance/align, won't charge me tax since I'm an out of state billing address. Sounds like a done deal if no takeoffs show up on ebay between now and then.
Carlos and Rolland there are great to deal with. They have a shop about a mile from my office here where I picked up my wheels from on Washington Blvd. They even arranged to have them painted flat black for me so all I had to do was pick them up and put on the car.
A little heavy for track use, but for a daily driver wheel, they work great.
hahaha
well i pulled the trigger and put down the deposit, booked travel, flying out next Thursday to settle up, take delivery and blast out past the Joshua Tree to LA to do wheels on Friday at Wheel Dynamics, and then enjoy a couple of months in la la land. I figure I'll have to make s decision on spacers by then.
Congrat's...keep us posted.
In regards to spacers, I am just one of those individuals that will buy wheels that have the correct offset so that you do not need to add additional items (spacers) to make the wheels fit correctly within the wheel well. To me it is not a safe thing to do, that is extend your wheel out from the hub using longer bolts/studs and a spacer...some will say I shouldn't be so worried, but if there is a correct way to do it then that is the best way IMHO. However the after-market wheels that do not require spacers are usually the more expensive ones where they are more custom made to your application (i.e. O.Z., Fikse, BBS). If you have to use spacers or want too, then I would only recommend using the correct spacers that support the wheel (in that they have the hub centering piece, hub-centric is what I believe it is called, as in the factory hub - it's not the bolts/studs that center the wheel on the hub), I would not trust spacers that rely on alignment of the wheel using just the bolts/studs. So get the correct spacers for the car. I know several people that use spacers that are on this forum and have never had a problem with them. They can chime in on what spacers are best for you to use.
Porsche makes 5mm and I think 17mm spacers for a number of wheel fitments. I think some 19" wheel options on the 997 C4S have both of them. I used 14mm H&R spacers and bolts for two seasons of competition without issue. I have also used H&R 14mm and RUF 23mm spacers for my RUF wheels on the street for years without issue.
For the street, you would probably be fine with any reputable, high quality spacers and bolts -- but do your homework about proper bolt lengths and torque specs. Even though I never had a problem, I didn't really like using spacers on the track -- so I eventually ordered a couple sets CCW's for track work. I don't think twice about running them on the street though if everything is right.
There are many custom spacer makers out there which could be good or bad -- and a lot of cheap crap out there too. I would say Porsche, H&R or RUF would be good places to look for offset help because they have the time and money to engineer everything properly -- the last thing they want to do is hurt somebody in a Porsche.
Adding 7mm for the fronts will keep the outside of the "new" wheels in the same location (relative to the fender) as your current 8" wheels with 50mm offset. You could actually add a 15mm spacer to the front would extend the front wheels 8mm father out than current.
I got my brushed aluminum Carrera logo from Eric at BumperPlugs.com. I think it was $20. To remove your current logo, it would be best if you heat it up with a hair dryer to soften the adhesive. Then use dental floss to "cut" through the adhesive tape. You can use 3M adhesive remover, or a similar product, to remove the residual adhesive.
I may roll the dice here and just directly fit on the fronts. I don't know if this sounds like stupid logic, but I think I'm not afraid of 7mm, i mean that's a hair over a quarter inch, that has to be within tolerance for an 8 inch wheel, 3.44% error? Conversely it's not that much of a spacer to worry about either.
That is a great price on the logo, and bumperplugs seems to have all sorts of useful stuff! Picked up a bottle of Rejex, which I've seen work wonders on boats and planes, and a pair of clear side markers, I mean sh*t while I'm at it I figure I might as well.
I thought the same - ended up fitting 15mm H&R spacers in the end - much better look, and the handling was way better.
BTW - I used WD for my take off 19"s - great shop and great guys to work with.
Before spacers:
After Spacers:
I can't argue with better handling, and I can always go back later if necessary. did you get the spacers from WD as well?
[QUOTE=cdodkin;4891225]I thought the same - ended up fitting 15mm H&R spacers in the end - much better look, and the handling was way better.
BTW - I used WD for my take off 19"s - great shop and great guys to work with.
After Spacers:
OK, some takeoffs came up on ebay, offsets are different (I'm assuming these are off a widebody 997)
wheels fit?
http://tinyurl.com/32skox
"4 Like New Factory OEM Porsche 997 Carrera Classic wheels with Used Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 Tires; The front wheels are 19x8.5 Parts #997.362.156.03 with an offset of ET51 and the rear wheels are19x11 Parts #997.362.162.08 with an offset of ET57"
"Front tires are USED Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 235/35ZR19. These tires have about 8/32 tread depth or 80% treadleft.. Rear tires are USED Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 295/30ZR19. These tires have about 7/32 tread depth or 70% treadleft"
I am guessing the rears will be too tall, but I'm not that good at aspect ratio calculations, and I'm not sure I want to take anyone's word for 70% tread left on ebay, esp. from orlando, and I guess it's not THAAAT good of a deal (not the 1200 number at least!)
If you buy spacers that TUV approved you don't have to worry about safety, because id the germans approve it is super safe!! Don't forget there are road without speedlimits in Germany and TUV makes sure nothing happens even at 200MPH.
The OEM wheels you are looking at are very nice, but the reads may not fit. The front wheels will EXTEND 5mm more that your curent wheels (not a problem) but the rears will EXTEND 21mm which most likely could be a problem.
there's nothing inherently wrong with spacers... it's just that i find them to be extraneous, a band-aid for wheels that don't truly fit the car.
people will say race teams run them... they're a damn race team, you drive a street car with street wheels. people say even porsche runs them. porsche wouldn't if they could hand the cost down to the customer to get proper fitting wheels and their contraints are much more limiting than the aftermarket. no OEM wheels look better than an aftermarket offering so long ast he aftermarket wheel is built by a quality firm.
i only choose to spend my hard earned $ on wheels that fit:
-even when lowered, full lock, under compression the wheels should NOT rub
-wheels should push out to the edges as far as possible while still meeting bullet point above
-wheels should be as wide as possible within the physical constraints of the chassis/panels
so spacers help to push the wheels out and make it look better, but why bother if you can get proper wheels that do all that without having to use this bandaid?
people usually choose to pick these wheels taht require spacers because they don't take the time to research properly because they're too busy, ignorant, on a pretty tight budget whatever.
but then they come online and say oh it's awesome, it's great... for someone like me, that's not the whole story and they're doing a disservice to others by propagating misinformation.
good luck
htny... The reason why I had the wheels delivered from Wheel Dynamics to my tire guy is because I've been doing business with my guy for years and he always takes care of me. His name is Kevin and he's the manager at Americas Tire Co.. They're located on Torrance Blvd about 1.5 miles east of Hawthorne. His telephone number is [phone removed]. Great service and super fast. Tell him JP sent you.
Spacers were H&R brand - (TUV approved) and came from Automotion
http://www.automotion.com/productpag...cid=22&sid=321
On the car here:
You'll need to buy longer wheel bolts from them as well, to allow the wheels to bolt in place through the new spacers - DON'T USE THE ORIGINAL BOLTS _ THEY ARE TOO SHORT!
Ben - you're full of BS
If you want the 19" 997 rims on a 996, as I did, then spacers are the only option, and have zero negative effect on the handling or ride.
I understand that you personally have had some traumatic experience in your past that leads you to be an E-hole over this - but actual experience, and plenty of it around this forum, leads me to believe that you're in a very small minority.
So shizzle m' fizzle - dem spacers is to kool for you fool!
After a lot of reading, I think the problem is I'm trying to put 997 wheels on a 996. Looking at everything out there, the OEMs needs spacers, the replicas need spacers, etc. Since this really is just a part time, west coast car for me, I really am not planning on pouring money into it, but I do love a decent set of wheels. I guess when I get to LA next week I'll see what fits in forged, make a game time decision.
Don't let Ben pi$$ on your parade - he has spacer issues.....
996 with 19" and H&R 15mm up front actually handles better than stock 996 rims - and I've done plenty of miles to prove it.
H&R spacers are hub centric and therefore there is no wobble or alignment issue.
Just torque up as normal with the new longer bolts, and check again after a few hundred miles.
And if 15mm wider, which are the correct bolts (I have so many of these fitments in my head right now that I rolled them into an ROE calculation on a conference call earlier without realizing it, this pre-purchase obsession is bad for business!)
Yep - so no alignment issues
Also have a nice little locking screw to keep them in place while fitting the wheel.
Quality product.
View of spacer through the wheel:
WHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA oh man wahahahhahahhah
thing is you picked the least attractive 997 wheels ... and yea, they're for the 997 ... yea... 996? so you have these metal extra things and... extra special bolts...
nice photos bud
