Carrera 2 vs. C4S?

Hello. I'm in the market for a 996 and was wondering what the differences between a 2002 C2 and 2002 C4S are outside of the differences I'm aware of: 4wd vs. 2wd, different sheet metal, wheel/tire size. Are there any other material differences? I'm primary focused on mechanical/performance differences. Different brakes? etc..... I'm trying to figure out whether the differences are worth the extra cost of a C4S to me. Another question I have (particularly for those folks that have driven both) which car is 'more fun' to drive. I figure that adding 4wd and wider tires in the rear can only dampen (read - more understeer) the driving experience and accelerate tire wear, etc... to the extent I take the car to the occasional track day (when I'm not hustling my spec miata around). Thoughts? Thanks. -Stephen

i have driven both and no doubt the c2 is more fun to drive. It feels lighter and more easily tossed about etc... The C4S looks better but no where near as fun to drive. If you live in a bad weather area, the C4s might be the way to go. They are both great cars, either way you will enjoy the experience! My C2 is my first Porsche and I love it!

C4S has a different chassis, suspension, wheels and brakes, which are all the same as a turbo...infact only the motor and the turbos are unique to the turbo. C4S is definitely the best bargain if you appreciate the extra options it has. Also, I found the C4S a better drive, but going by previous threads...most C2 owners prefer theirs and most C4S owners prefer the AWD, so it is subjective. I absolutely love my 03 C4S.

i agree with jeeva. moneywise C4S is abargain, you get everything but the turbo engine from the turbo. parts numbers i.e parts are identical on both cars. but C4s is for sure heavier than C2 with the same engine. having in mind that Cw of C4s is 0.34 Vs 0.30 to the C2 you can fine out wich one is faster in straight line. of course C4S is a 4-wheels drive and C2 a 2 wheel drive with all the pros and cons of each

Your preference will depend on how your mood welcomes each car at a given time. Find it difficult - pointless? - to reduce the comparison to better/worse, rather the C2 and C4S simply have different delivery routes for permagrin.

http://www.theracesite.com/index.cfm...m_article=4045

Forget about whether the C2 or the C4 is the better BARGAIN.. Drive both and get the one that feels right for you. It doesn't matter what the bargain is if you are not driving the car you enjoy.

Thanks for the feedback. I hope to test drive both of them next week back to back. Probably also take a spin in a 997 as well. Pretty nice selection of pre-owned cars in the NY/NJ/CT area to choose from and I figure the end of the year is as good as time as any to make a deal. For the most part I've been a BMW guy historically (M3 lease ends in 2 months) but did own a '91 964 C2 for all of 8 months in '98 (driving enjoyment couldn't keep up with '91 M3 I also owned at the time) so I sold it when winter came (and incidently when the dual mass flywheel failed...). I got Porsches on my mind again and think I'm ready for another go.

I have had 2 C2's although they were 2000 and 2001 models. But after driving the C4S I could not wait to get into one. The 4 feels more connected to the road. It pulls the front through low speed corner acceleration. (High speed as well but I have not the ability to test and comment on this) In addition while you focus on the performance, the full leather and standard PSM are great as well. The car has no rattles or noise which I (maybe incorrectly) attribute to the interior being tighter and better built due to the hand work. While sraight line numbers are a bit slower per the factory,Ii suspect that an average driver can drive the 4 faster around corners and a track due the suspension and the securtiy offered via 4wheel drive. I personally, and this is what I think you are asking, I like the C4S better in every way. Is is more car and the options taken individually and added to the C2 would make the C4S a bargain I think. That said, there's no bad Porsche and I like em all! Bill

I totally agree with this post. When I started looking I thought that I was going to end up with a C2 convertible - I came away with a C4S coupe and I love it. Personally the C4S 'felt' faster to me than any of the C2s that I drove. I also liked the feel of it better but I agree that it does feel heavier than the C2. My last car was Toyota Spyder which is incrediblly light and I loved that so I was surprised by my decision too. Bottom line - take em out and see which one you like...it's the only way. Barry

i have been lucky enough to own both. without question the c4s is the car for me. the car is better in so many ways. but, as has been pointed out drive both and pick which is best for you.

Nah...LAJ...You're right. The C4S is the better car

You get what you pay for.

I think the above posters have made good points in favor the C4S. It should be pointed out, though, that much of what they like has to do with the turbo suspension, brakes, etc., rather than just 4WD. I like those things, too, but much prefer the driving experience of the C2. A couple of weekends ago I did some spirited driving on country roads with a friend who has an '02 C4 Cab. We swapped back and forth a few times, and were both amazed how much more responsive the steering feel is in a C2. For me, much of what I've loved about my 3 Porsches is that "spot-on, put it right where you want it right now" steering feel. To me that experience is diluted with the heavier (and heavier steering feel) of the 4WD cars. Not that they aren't very competent. Again, it's just a matter of personal preference, but to me the benefits of the C4S are the brakes and suspension, not the 4WD (provided one doesn't do a lot of driving in inclement weather).

Caf, what you were feeling must be unique to the cab., the C4S coupe definitely has a much better steering precision(edit: compared to a cab. C2=C4S), as I have said before, if I have to pick the one reason why love these cars so much, it's there wonderful steering precision.

Yeah, the cab must have a lot to do with that. The C4 Cab is obviously the slowest, least respoinsive 996 of all. I have a '99 C2...but can't offer a comparison to AWD. The only other car I've ever owned was an '89 Mazda 626 so yes, compared to that, the C2 feels like it was built by God himself. I do think it's cool how the C4 has all the Turbo equipment on it though.

I'll hide behind Paul Frere's opinion on this one: To paraphrase: the C4S is a late model marketing exercise that's about fashion rather than performance. Same idea as the "turbo look" cars from the previous generations. Beautiful and impressive cars, to be sure. I'll take my 911 2wd and as light as possible, thanks. Thus, my dream upgrade is a GT3, not a Turbo. That said, I thought long and hard about buying a C4S (instead of my C2) just because I think it'll suffer lower depreciation.

You are right - Paul Frere did say soemthing to that effect. However one also gets the feeling that he laments the fact that they had to swtich to water cooling (although he admits that it was necessary). Regarding the all show no go thought though my understanding is that the C4S runs the Nordschleife ring faster than a C2 (8:16 vs 8:18) dispite the extra weight and drag so I don't think that holds water do you? Barry

Yeah, AWD and bigger brakes definitely makes me think of a car going faster, not slower!

With wider tires, a stock sport suspension and bigger brakes, I'm not surprised that the C4s ekes out a quicker lap than a base C2. My guess is that a mere mortal driver could turn significantly faster times in a C4s compared to a C2. It's an amazing car. I love the way they look. FWIW, the C2 shows significant improvements in laptimes when you check the row M030 option box, and as far as I know the car tested above didn't have the sport suspension. The "performance enhancements" of the C4s just barely offset the 281lbs of extra weight and the extra drag of the widebody. I don't argue that the C4s turns a faster lap than a C2. What I argue is the thought that the C4s is a "performance" option. I personally believe that a lightly optioned C2 with 030 would turn a quicker time. Think about this: if it was a performance option, why: - didn't it come with hollow spoke wheels rather than the heavy solid spokes, and - wasn't the GT3 based on the C4s?

Hey stiles_s, You must have a ball driving your car..just looked up where you are in Washington.

Hi. The C4S parts are designed for the turbo's torque/power....so it is likely to be more overbuilt if anything, and thus more reliable. This was what a dealer person said to me, fwiw. I have a 993 C4 and love it. I think the awd is a safety issue in my case....I am sure an expert driver would be fine with 2wd, but I want every bit of help just in case. Plus, I cannot afford to srub off my tires too fast, as a 2wd allows. Experts might be able to discuss the reliability issue, but I like the C4S's looks better too. JB

My '04 C4S Cab may be the 'slowest' Porsche, however, we are splitting hairs. The car is more than fast enough to get you killed or in trouble. So unless you are a professional driver on a track it's not worth arguing about. The car is beautiful and handles amazingly, put the top down going 30mph and the speed seems even faster - like being on a motorcycle. The car is so much more stable and mechanically sound then my 2001 C4. A little heavier but sexy as all hell and can run with the best of them.

I think one should also consider the difference in oversteer between the C2 and the C4. My guess for the 4wheel drive was because PAG had to make higher horsepower cars to compete. A two wheel drive turbo could be suicide for the general public. Making the drive avail in the 996 engine may have been marketing. I'm getting one, because my daughter drives mine and I have concerns: even tho' she's a great driver - ask her she'll tell you. Just my .02

I see it this way... I like to think that I am a 'better than average' driver (yeah...yeah... I know that everyone thinks that but at least I was a motorcycle instructor and I have raced karts, cars, and off road motorcycles.) However, I also know that I am not a driving God like some folks out there. As such I like the fact that my car is easier to drive fast for the average person. If the C2 were a couple of seconds faster in the hands of Micheal Schumacher - so what? He is not my chauffer. I get the same thing with my motorcycle. Compared to a lot of bikes out there it is pretty slow but just try to follow me down a twisty backroad in the NE area (complete with gravel and road heaves) and I think you will see that I need to expend a lot less energy. In fact one of my favourite passtimes is luring people on sportbikes to follow me down some of the gnarly roads in Harriman State park - it's great fun! Ultimately though, this is all a B.S. topic because what it really comes down to is - do you have fun in your car? I would still have a LOT of fun in a C2, I just happen to prefer the C4S, particularly as I use it as a daily driver including the winter.

-- agreed. They're all amazing cars, we're lucky that they build variants that appeal to different tastes! Carbonissimo: You must be kidding about the roads up here. Most of the time it's rain, gridlock and potholes . Unfortunately traffic really sucks. The good news is that there are some great twisties about 15min away when I can get away on the weekends.

Roger that on the twisties 15 mins away. That's what I was referring to!

C4 has sexier look, better traction (AWD & std PSM), but will cost more in gas and maintenance. C2 is more tossible and will be found easier in used market in case you are buying used. In my mind, buy C4 if you live in 4 season weather and plan to drive winters. Buy C4 if you want the better look and don't mind the extra cost. Buy C2 if otherwise. As far as performance, I doubt if you'll shave that much more time on track in a C4S if you are a skill driver, which you should be if you track.

After driving to work this morning with light snow on the ground and temps in the 8f range (about �13c for our European brethren) I feel pretty happy with my choice of the C4S (with snow tires�)

While I own a turbo, I still consider the C4S the best value out there. I agree with most of the other posts regarding steering feel. I have always hated front wheel drive cars and awd, while much better, still "feels" much different than a rwd car. I was initially concerned when I found the same feel to my turbo's steering. However, now that I'm completely used to the car I can assure you that the awd ultimately handles just as precisely as the lighter feeling rwd cars.

Funny i drove the c4s 3 days ago, and it felt heavy and slower............I love the looks but if i couldnt buy the turbo, i wouldnt want to look like one! Both GREAT cars but its one that fits you , and your style of driving, if you like to drift coming out of the corning .....do not get the c4..just my 2 cents