Sad news...My friends 3rd RMS...in an 04..

This RMS crap is very troubling....My friend called today to inform me that during the "oil consumption analysis" that the dealer has to do, his RMS began to leak again. Being my 1st P-car, I am very sad about the state of reliability in this engine. Don't you think they could have fixed this problem a year or 2 ago? I am far from an expert on engines but common sense tells me they are ignorant, stupid or just don't care across the pond..... Just my 02....I still love my car but would be scared to death to buy a new one at 80-90k........ Good luck to all with your engines!!! Robert

sorry to ask a dumb question, but what is an RMS?

Rear Main Seal leakage. Robert S- Does your friend drive his car regularly? Does he let the car idle to warm? 3rd RMS, damn that really suck.

He is a great driver and won our autocross class this year. He drives it hard but smart...

Porsche has got a problem on their hands. Luckily my car has been leak free as far as the RMS is concerned.

robert, weren't you the one that criticized me earlier for making up my story about having so many engine problems? change of heart? :>

Not the same

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Nah, Porsche fixed that

you should not have 3 RMS prob. either the mechnic is imcompetant or then engine is out of spec. the dealer has a "tool" that measures how out of round the connection is. if it's out of spec, you get a new motor (thats what happened with my 2002 c4s). after the engine replacement, it never had another prob. and yes, i drive the **** out of my cars both on and off track.

Mooty, How many RMS did you have before the engine change? I've had 2, and my crank measures .001.

Its going to be around 7 years now since they have not bothered with the RMS issue. Porsche will not fix or offer a solution it until its profitable for them to do so, right now they are not publicly pressured enough that it may reflect on sales or image to the point that its more profitable to fix it. They just rather keep selling new cars with the RMS flaw and pay for the repair costs for those that are still under warranty (less and less as time goes by) and after that its not their problem anymorenor its effect on the owner's resale either. Ironically Porsche's current attitude is helped by those 996/Boxster owners who don't want the issue to get to much publicity and downplay it so as not to hurt their car's resale. Ironic isn't it.

Robert- I can hear Sean's colorful ranting as I type... What? they have not fixed the oil seperator problem for his blue smoke bomber? Whats a warrantee good for jumping thru hoops?

Brian, he is going to raise some hell next week at Pioneer...I am sure you will get an earful at Quallcomm on Sat.!!! Nice x-mas present for him eh????????? Robert

Oh yeah, BOBPORSCHE996, Yes it was me and I still think your story was a little over the top. I am sure you have had troubles but I question anyone's sanity when the put 30k into a car within the time and miles you did. After the first one I would have sold it. After the 2nd one I would have not paid a penny. After your 3rd one I would have had the best lawyer so far up Porsche's *** that they would have had bumper plugs on their forehead!!! Robert

..yes my story is a little over the top and rare... but sadly it is indeed true.. as a fellow rennlister backed up, when he saw my vehicle at barrier porsche.. and confirmed with the tech about what has happened with my vehicle... as ridiculous as $47,000 in repairs in 1,100 miles sounds... it's all too true... i'm simply waiting for some lawyer to file a class action lawsuit against porsche for their negligence in admitting to the faults they know of within many of their out of spec engines to hopefully get some reimbursement in terms of selling my car after the first engine went bad, one must consider I put $15,000 into the car in modifications already... I didn't think the next engine would go on me 150 miles later... in terms of the third engine.. I have a two year warranty on it.. so the next one, porsche is paying for.. i think i've had about enough spending on this vehicle already... and with the $0 deductible extended warranty for the next couple of years... after the warranties are up... this car is going once, going twice, sold :> I suppose it will have to be a safety concern.. maybe one day.. someone with an rms problem, will have their engine run dry of oil, having the engine blow up on them on the freeway, causing a safety hazard and an accident and injuring them.. maybe then a lawyer will step in.. I would looove to be compensated for my costs :> but fighting porsche on my own.. no need to go deeper into costs, it's a futile battle.. my stress level has already reached a maximum with porsche... money is one thing, but court battles, which I have been through before are definately a pain in the ***... and I don't want to deal with it anymore, especially with a company the size of porsche... i just want my car back... (265 days in the shop and counting this year sofar.... sigh) the funny thing about the rms issue is how customer service reacts to it.. try calling porsche north america and mentioning it to them, and they will act like you are from another planet? "RMS? sorry sir, i've never heard of that.. contact your dealer, and they can help you.." ha, they have all been trained to act like they don't even know what it is... there's only so many years a company can behind deception before it blows up on them.. literally... their day will come.. until then we all just have to be patient... maybe one day compensation will come.. maybe not... just enjoy your cars, have some money stacked away in case of an emergency deca thousand dollar repair, and definately a warranty, and have fun is the best way to look at it... as I said before... just because one can afford the cost of ownership, doesn't mean one can afford the cost of maintaining one... especially with all the 99-00 models with such low prices.. which in one way is good.. as hopefully it will keep all the boy-racers and kids that can't afford these things and attempt to use them as their only daily driver from actually getting them and making them look like rice-mobiles... as they won't be able to afford all the cheap body kits due to maintenance costs and other such mods out that will probably flood the market now that the 99 is are the $35k range.. - bobporsche996

Bob, I ahope that someday Porsche pays the piper on this issue and that it wont take a tragic event to do so. I am running without a warranty now and am a bit scared. I could spend 2700 on an extended 2 year warranty but dont want to put more money into this depreciating asset than I already have. I'm off to the shop on monday to iagnose 2 fault codes and replace Coolant tank #2!!! Robert

Ok everyone...There are one hell of a bunch of smart people here at Rennlist and I'm sure a few of you are attorneys. If all of you keep expressing your anger but in the same breath also say "but I love this car..." PCNA and PAG are not going to officially address this issue ever. Luckily I have not had an RMS leak...yet. But those of you who have had 2 or more and are driving the same car, shame on you. Don't get me wrong, I REALLY feel for you, I know, I am suing Audi and I will take them to my grave for their wrong doings. Be a MAN, or WOMAN, and go after them.

unfortunately if it was only that easy... lawsuits, (which I have been involved in way too many) against big corporations will last years upon years.. until a resolution is resolved... it's extremely stressful, and with all the paperwork, discovery, depositions, and so on... it can be rest assured porsche will bombard the first person or law firm that even attempts to tarnish their image with so much cost and paperwork, that it will be a full time job just to open the mail sent their way. i'm sure their lawyers have already been advised on exactly what and how to proceed such an occurence occur, and although I would love to see a court case against porsche for their shady tactics, I also pity the lawyer or law firm that attempts to take on such a large company... it's ironic, now that they have all this money, thanks to the money we've thrown at them at the past few years with all these new models and so on, they also most likely have the legal funds to throw at anyone that comes there way.... either way, even if a suit is filed, it wouldn't be years, until anyone sees a dime or any type of reimbursement... best thing you can do is enjoy the car i've realized, and pay the price of admission to the porsche club... until then, i'll just be happy when my replacement tranny gets installed... finally got off the slow boat from china.. (and if my third engine blows up, my second tranny, second flywheel, starter, radiator, coolant tank, and so on... of the fun experiences i've encountered in the past 1,100 miles, i'll let porsche pay for it this time... pfft...) until then... i'm keeping the top down and driving as fast as I can when I can... still in the shop :I - bobporsche996 - hoping to reach 1,200 miles of enjoyment by the end of the year

i am sorry to hear that so many people are troubled by RMS. i think PCNA needs to do something about this. also, sometimes dealer makes a difference. my car didn't have a drop of oil on the floor, it was in for an oil change. they notice some wet spots on the RMS ansd half shaft. i got a call from my service advisor and was advised a new engine will be installed. they fixed the rms first and told me to drive it and assured me no prob at all. they oredered the motor which arrived 2 weeks later and took two days to install. that was it.

it's not such a big deal, if anything, it's great to have a new engine installed, when porsche pays for it under warranty, as in your case and the many others... but when you have to fork out $15,000+ for something that isn't your fault.. that's when one becomes a bit upset.. and when it happens twice in a month.. .. that's when it becomes more than upsetting... hell if porsche paid for my engines, I would be loving them right now.. but unfortunately they aren't too receptive to out of warranty customers.. to say the least.

Is this still really happening?

Damn guys................you want to resolve the RMS and other problems...............STOP buying the cars. Hit them in the pocket book where it hurts. This is the first time that I thank GOD I have my car on a lease. I am looking to buy a vehicle after the expiry of that lease and I for one have no intention of buying Porsche until this RMS problem is resolved. I have never seen any other sport car chat forum where an issue like RMS is such a constant topic. If there are any Porsche representatives that read this...............get you act together, I for one will take a back seat on the bus for making any more purchases. Even if this problem is resolved, I will have to think twice about purchasing a vehicle where the manufacturers knows there is a problem but has not admited to it or gone public with some kind of resolution. We are not purchasing a pintos here, these are expensive cars and should not be having these consistent on going problems. Hell I'm even hearing RMS problems in the 997 and that model just came out. Subdue your emotions and love for these cars.............use your heads not your hearts. I for one have learned this lesson well. Cheers and safe driving.

Correction: We have got a problem on our hands. Porsche are leaving owners out to dry with this RMS issue. If your car is in warranty then that's fine but some day it wont be and you will sell it and the problem moves on to some other poor b&astard and Porsche will take the "go fish" attitude. I know you have all heard it before but I am on my 6th RMS, the 1st reported at 27,000 miles and only weeks out of warranty. Now after 5 replacement seals they say I need a new engine (like Duh!). But guess who has to pay for it. The problem is going to get worse as time goes on and these cars get older. You'll see more and more 996 and Boxsters with this complaint. But here's the worst , quote from this months (January 2005) edition of GT Purely Porsche Page 54: The all aluminium 3.6 litre enigine in the 997 Carrera is taken straight from the previous generation 996, but has been fitted with a new, freer breaking air-filter resulting in an additional 5hp being squeezed from the water cooled engine. Well woopy freakin doo to 5hp. But the main issue here is that the 997 folks can look forward to the same RMS problem. Proof that Porsche don't give a toss about the RMS problem and proof that they have failed to acknowledge it! Go figure!

Couldn't agree more Wormdoggy. GET TOUGH PEOPLE !!

Quite frankly, I don't give a hoot if you have warranty or not . The fact of the matter is this is not a minor defect that is covered under warranty. This is a serious mechanical flaw and should be dealt with and admition of guilt by the manufacturers. Have you guys read the 997 forum. There is a topic there where someone 997 has been in the shop 7 times. There is also some action going on there. I for one would be willing to place money in trust with a legal professional to have this matter looked into. Maybe a fund should be started. Pennies add up to large dollars. Think about it. Lets not be so complacent. Cheers and safe driving.

Wormdoggy, Well said again, but like all other threads this will fall by the wayside and slip into cyberspace only to be brought up here and there for a little bit. I've been suing Audi for 2 years now over various issues and every now and then I visit audiworld and see an occasional post regarding the basis of my suit and it is hot for a week or so then just simply vanishes. Threads should be renamed tempvents.

Personally, I think the best thing is to get PCNA to join hands with PCGB and fight it on the front line. Come on you guys rember Omaha? PCGB have been very active on this vis the Boxster RMS survey which concuded that of 1000 Boxster owners surveyed, 650 responded and 33% of them have had RMS and/or engine failures. They are currently carrying out a similar survey with 996 owners. What you guys need to do is put pressure on PCNA to do the same and then join up (communicate) with PCGB to demand a feasible solution for this problem both for in-warranty and out-of warrnty owners and to acknowledge the problem. The USA is the biggest market for PAG and until you guys pull your fingers out and start showing them that litigeous US might instead of just blabbing out smoke and mirrors, they will will just laugh at us for ever more.

Porsche will get whats coming to them if they do not correct this problem soon. The wrong person will have a major problem and go to the news with their clout or money and start up a discussion that Porsche never thought could go there on a national basis. I have heard of 4 Cayenne buyers that have all kinds of electrical problems....So much for all that research and developement............... I know no car is going to be 100% trouble free but this RMS issue is very scary to me.... Send all your prayers to the poor out of warranty souls like me!

Is it just the standard motors, or do the turbo engines have this same problem???

RMS problems do happen on all cars (not just Porsche) including the turbo but rarely. The RMS issue on the 996 C2/C4 & Boxster engines is a latent manufacturing flaw. It's failure on these engines is imminent.

I had 4 leaks this year. The dealer guys replaced it with a one day turn around and a loaner. When the 4 leaked I got and repacement motor. No fuss from Porsche. Yes they know that I track it once a month and autocross as well. They did not care. the replacement runs great!!!!!